Jeep Wrangler

tidester · November 2001

sloth,

Maybe having a Wrangler can lead to a less stressful life!

I understand the experience can be very Zen! ;-)

tidester
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SUVs

tsjay · November 2001

As a matter of fact, I ordered my Thelma Jane on November 16th last year. Sales were so slow that the factory was caught right up with orders, so they had Thelma scheduled for production on the 28th. Unfortunately, business was so bad that they shut the plant down for the week in which Thelma was scheduled for build.

So, things were delayed for one week, and she was built on December 5th, exactly one week later than the originally scheduled date.

I was driving her on December 8th, since I am only 8 or 9 hours from Toledo, and they didn't have to use rail shipment.

There is an 800 number that you can call with your VON (Vehicle Order Number) or, if the VIN has already been assigned, you can use that in order to keep track of the status of your Jeep.

They will assign you an account number to refer to when you call after the first time, and you can just give them that number from then on.

I will see if I can find it for you, but maybe someone else has it handy. I think you can get it from the official Jeep web site (www.jeep.com).

Also, my dealer was a big help. The official stuff you get from the 800 number is a little bit "padded" so that people don't get disappointed if their Jeep is behind schedule. My dealer was able to get more realistic info when he called to check on it.

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

tsjay · November 2001

I owned a '99 Grand Cherokee and I now have a 2001 Wrangler. The Wrangler has been much more reliable than was the JGC.

If you go to the Grand Cherokee discussion, you will quickly see that almost all of the posts are negative, and a lot of people are having very serious problems with them.

Mine wasn't all that bad, but the brake rotors were a constant problem due to warping.

You hardly ever see any negative posts here in Wrangler IV. A few of us have had minor problems that were corrected in one visit to the dealer.

Hope this helps.

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

appstate88 · November 2001

Interesting question,
I'm not sure if Wranglers are that good, or if the type of person who buys one is more forgiving and maybe a bit quirky.

Here is a comparison

My Mom has a '97 GC. To her it's a nice luxury car that just happens to have 4 Wheel Drive. Dependability has been decent, but not spectacular. My feeling is if she had had real problems, she would have dropped the GC in a New York minute and bought an Explorer or better yet, a Buick.

My wife on the other hand...

She has a '98 Sahara with 50,000 miles. It's loud on the highway, and a little drafty in the Winter. It's hard as hell to get in the back seat and easy to get broken into. We have had to replace the rear axle, and Cruise Control (under Warranty) and the Radiator (Not under warranty-Ouch!). But you know what?

She still loves it, and wouldn't own anything else.

It's kind of like the old Beetle. It probably wasn't any more dependable than most other cars, and it was loud and oddly designed, but it was easy to fix and people had an emotional attachment to them.

It also may have to do with the fact that the Wrangler is truly an off road vehicle with all the good and bad that entails. I saw pics of my wife at the Jeep Jamboree in the NC Mountains last month (Wish I had been there, but I'm sitting in snowy Bosnia at the moment...!)and it looked like at least 80% of the vehicles were Wranglers. And she said the only Jeep that got stuck during their Trail ride was a GC!

So, go into your Wrangler Purchase with your eyes wide open, but be careful...

You'll get hooked!

tsjay · November 2001

Sloth, I really liked my '99 JGC Laredo, but I was disappointed with the reliability. I thought it was a crying shame that such a beautiful SUV like that had so many problems.

The GC's in my book have no competition in the "looks" department. They are by FAR the best looking SUV out there in my opinion. They are not only beautiful on the outside, but I really, really liked to interior also.

They have the best four wheel drive systems available among SUV's, and that's not just my opinion. The 4X4 magazines are just about unanimous on that issue.

The power was certainly adequate with the 4.0 L I-6 like I had, and they say that the V8 has awesome power for an SUV.

The ride and handling were great. The redesigned JGC's ('99's and up) have a much better ride than the older JGC's. They also have much more cargo room than the older ones.

I don't know what more you could ask for in an SUV (except reliability).

My main problem was brake rotors that kept warping, and this was so common that I thought EVERYONE who owned one had the problem. I did almost all highway driving and didn't even use the brakes all that much.

Many people were posting about other problems, although I didn't encounter them myself. There were SERIOUS drive train problems.

I liked mine so much that I would consider getting another one, despite the problems. I would hope that a lot of the things have been corrected for the 02's. (But I thought that would be the case for the 00's and the 01's, but that doesn't appear to be true)

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

twylie · November 2001

check out http://www.ewylie.com/jeep/ordering.htm I documented what I found out about tracking our Jeep once the order was placed. This info was accurate as of March. HTH.

-twylie

mtngal · November 2001

My '98 Wrangler has been very reliable. I won't say I don't have rattles - the back tailgate has a couple of screws that rattle loose all the time (that's what all those washboardy dirt roads do) and they hold the latch tight. So every so often I tighten them up with an alum wrench to keep the back tailgate from rattling. I've thought about locktight, but figure that there may be locktight on the other screws that don't come loose, and that there may be a reason why there isn't any on these 2.

Also last year I had the dash light problem - there is a TSB on it. At over 90,000 miles, my Wrangler is well beyond any warranty and the problem went away this summer, so I haven't done anything about it.

Another thing - I have a hole somewhere in the exhaust system. I'll have to get that fixed sometime this winter, since I'm sure it won't pass a smog test and it will need it this year for the first time, I think. But any car can get that, or it could have been caused from when I bottomed out going across a dry steam bed a while ago...

Other than that I have only done the usual maintenance, and had to replace the tires. Oh, and then the other guy's insurance paid for all the body damage caused in an accident when it was only about 6 months old. What really amazed me was that my husband managed to keep the wheels straight when we were climbing the wall next to the carpool lane on I405. I was looking down at that yellow line between the regular lanes and the carpool lanes coming up at me, and really thought we would roll, but we didn't. By the way, the other guy had to have his little pickup towed, and we drove away. Definitely a tough vehicle!

goducks1 · November 2001

The new Wranglers are getting good marks from JD Power and some of the other reliability sites. My '98 has had exactly one thing that needed to be fixed, the dash gauges shorted (there was a TSB about this) and were promptly fixed under warranty. Other than that, I knocked the toe-in out of alignment once off-road (my fault). Incidentally, the drivetrain problems that Grand Cherokees have had come almost exclusively from the new V8 with the full time 4wd. The base GCs that share the Wrangler drivetrain (4.0L and part-time 4wd) have not had these problems, though maybe they have had rotor problems like tsjay pointed out.

I'm not sure if owning a Jeep is Zen--it's a bit loud in there to meditate.

sfjeeps · November 2001

Boy, I leave for a while and war was declared. Now that we are all friends again I hope this will help some of the questions.

The in line will last a little longer because the pistions are going in straight up and down motion and the oiling is more even on all sides. The V motors will tend to have more oil on the bottom (gravity) and less on the top and the piston are always slightly "cocked" because the piston is at an angle and not straight in the bore. I know this is a very small amount but or time and a few billion RPMs over the years the effects will show up. The V engine piston will have more wear on one side before the other.

tidester · November 2001

sfjeeps,

the piston is at an angle and not straight in the bore

It would seem to me that the pistons fit rather snuggly in the cylinders and the "angling" should be pretty much the same for V as inline since both have the same rod configuration.

But then, after a few BILLION cycles ... who knows?

tidester
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SUVs

goducks1 · November 2001

Check out

http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/lancia/58/technical_school/engine/smooth1.htm

for information about the physics behind different engine setups (V4, I6, etc).

And when you get done, explain it to me. I'm still working through all of it (rather slowly, I'll add).

larry18 · November 2001

Thanks for all the information! I called DC with my VON. The operator told me that the ship date is 11/29/01 unless a QC issue arises. I was thinking January at the earliest. December would be great! The order was placed on 11/08/01. Now I have to get busy clearing out my workshop where I plan to park it at night. The operator said no case number is needed, just the VON. She suggested that I call back in a couple of weeks to double check. Maybe it will arrive before Christmas so I can put it under the tree!

larry18

tsjay · November 2001

I don't know where you live, but if you have to use rail shipment, my dealer says that to anyhwere in the U.S. from anywhere in the U.S. should be ten days or less.

So, if they make the 11/29 ship date, you ought to have the Jeep well before Christmas.

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

sloth501 · November 2001

Thank you for the quick replys on reliability and satisfaction. I drove 2 Wranglers today (auto & 5 speed). I have just about decided that I want the Wrangler over the GC and my wife isn't giving too much grief over the decision (although she does like the GC better...but she likes the lower cost). I now have to decide what transmission I want.

How does the automatic handle off road? I could tell the 5 speed was really set up for offroading with the shorter gear ratios. I used to own a Toyota Landcuiser so the short gear ratios won't be that big of a deal on pavement if I decide to go that route.

If 4 to 6 weeks typical for a Wrangler to be built and shipped? If that is the case, I may order a 5 speed with the cruise control since I can only find it locally with the auto transmission.

Thanks,
Gary

goducks1 · November 2001

I know that everyone has an opinion on this, and it's really just a personal decision, so I'll go first...get the 5-speed. The 3-speed auto has no overdrive and you will pay for that with consistently higher fuel bills (about 20% worse fuel efficiency from most people I've run into) and shorter engine life (since you will drive on the freeway with high RPMS on an engine that is not built for that). Plus a 3-speed automatic is a rip-off, pure and simple, quaint on a 1960s-eras Buick maybe but not appropriate on a new one.

I've also had both (my '94 was the automatic, my '98 has the 5-speed) and I am telling you unequivocally to go for the stick. As far as delivery, mine took 4 weeks from order to delivery, and I live on the west coast.

dwrangler · November 2001

Just a quick note to say hey. Sorry, but I'm a bit distracted...watching Garth on tv. And trying to do my homework...really I am tryin'.

Sloth,
I know that the wait must be killing you, but trust me I know that the last few months/weeks feel like hell...however my wait is definitely killing me. My wait will be a couple of years til I get my finances in order. Oh well, being human I do make mistakes but I really did it this time so my punishment is waiting a WHILE for my dream vehicle...a new Jeep Wrangler Sport or Sahara. But brother it will sure be worth the wait.

Take care and hug your Jeeps for me ;-)
dwrangler

mtngal · November 2001

Oh, one of our favorite topics! I love my 5 speed, and it is really good in stop and go traffic, since it is geared so low. Just put it in second and creep along...

larry18 · November 2001

If my jeep is shipped on the target date of 11/29/01 it will be three weeks from the day I placed the order. That counts the Thanksgiving holiday. I have been looking at wheels.com for assembly line information and wranglers are showing 6 to 8 weeks for production. The production line must be keeping pace with orders. I am still not sure of the time it takes for transit from the factory to Oklahoma where I live. I assume it will go by rail to Kansas City or Dallas before taking a transport truck.

Also, after driving both the five speed and auto my Wife and I decided that the five speed was the best way for us. I am also getting the cruise control.

larry18

sfjeeps · November 2001

I guess I should have used a better description for the pistons. The in line piston will travel straight in the bore at a 90 degree motion (up and down) in relation to the crank shaft where as the V motor the pistion will travel at angle less then 90 degrees in relation to the crank shaft. This slight difference will cause the rings to wear a little more on the lower side because gravity does affect everything (even pistons in motion). With advances in material and oil today there is almost no difference between the two for wear and peformance.

goducks1 · November 2001

What sfjeeps is saying is likely true, but I do think the bigger reason the I6 is such a durable engine is that the particular arrangement of an I6 doesn't require a balancer shaft or counterweights to correct the movement of the pistons, it's already balanced. Only a few other engines (notable boxers like on the Subies) have this characteristic. V6s, V8s, and boxers have to duplicate a lot of parts too (2 cylinder heads, etc).

I think the reason that the Jeep I6 is so torquey is not because it is an I6 but because it has a lot of displacement for a 6-cylinder engine. I would expect a 4.0L V8 would have more horsepower in comparison. The larger each cylinder, the bigger the bang, holding the compression ratio equal. You'll notice it's not an engine that winds up really quickly and that the torque comes on really low.

I am out of my element here, though, so I may be wrong. The article I listed above did help me understand quite a bit though.

stever · November 2001

Every Thursday, 6:00-7:00pmPT/9:00-10:00pmET

jacknimble · November 2001

I've had both, so I think it depends on the owner. If I had to drive my Jeep on the highway I would take the stick. Around town only, it would be the slushbox. Both are equal in my opinion on reliability.
In case you are wondering, the reason that the Wrangler only has a 3 speed auto is because there is not a 4 or 5 speed in the DC inventory that can fit because of the short driveshaft.
The stick is not a big deal - its smooth and torquey, and you can drive around town in 2nd and 4th with no problem.

goducks1 · November 2001

The long engine block of the I6 probably does make it hard to fit a 4-speed automatic in there, though it also may be DC being cheap, since they have a 3-speed auto in the Neon too and there isn't a space crunch from that engine. At any rate, we'll see when they put the new V6 into the Wrangler next year. I can't imagine that engine won't leave enough space for a 4-speed.

In the meantime, I just don't think an automatic transmission without an overdrive gear is acceptable. I don't want to drive on the highway at 3000 RPMs. I plan on getting at least 150K out of this engine, and hopefully closer to 200K (not unusual on a straight 6), and I am positive I could not do that if I ignored 5th gear on my stick and just drove in 4th exclusively, which has the same ratio (1:1) as the top gear on the automatic.

Beyond that, it's a personal choice. I think either transmission is fine off-road. I think a stick is more in keeping with a Wrangler's character, but some people may feel it is an annoyance in traffic, and I certainly can't argue with that approach. I just think it's essential that anyone who considers this particular automatic recognize what they are sacrificing in terms of engine life and gas bills.

markbuck · November 2001

Heard there was a plan for a 2003 Off Road Edition, with Dana 44's under both ends.

Anybody confirm or deny?

Also, when will the 4.0L be replaced by the new V-6?

tsjay · November 2001

It was one year ago today, Novemember 16, 2000, that the order was placed for my Thelma Jane.

She was "born" on December 5, 2000.

I picked her up late in the afternoon of December 8, 2000.

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

yellowman · November 2001

tsjay: Congrats on the one-year birthday!!

Larry18: Maybe twylie knows this, but there is a website where you can actually track the progress of the railcar that has your Jeep on it as it progresses across the country! When I was waiting for mine I would check it at least 2-3 times per day, the wait was killing me! I think the total time wound up being about 3 weeks from the order date. My boss was about to choke me because I kept screwing things up with my mind on the Jeep all the time! I also used to look at a promo picture of it every night before I went to bed. After 10,500 miles, I'm happy as can be with it!!

Getting a nice wax job on it tomorrow morning, can't wait. Also anxiously awaiting my next fillup to determine the effects of using Mobil 1. So far looks like it will definitely be an improvement.

yellowman

tidester · November 2001

tsjay,

It was one year ago today, Novemember 16, 2000, that the order was placed for my Thelma Jane.

Happy birthday, TJ and proud parents!

tidester
Host
SUVs

stever · November 2001

tluke · November 2001

markbuck, There is some limited information on the 2003's with some info on the Off Road Edition. You can find a link in message 4125. I've asked the same question myself here but nobody came forward with the scoop. Probably too soon. I'll be watching. tluke

tsjay · November 2001

today is not Thelma's birthday- just the day she was "conceived." Her birthday is December 5th.

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

larry18 · November 2001

Thanks Yellowman. Twylie (post #4161) gave a link to the codes used at DC to note the status of an order. There is also an 800 number listed for DC. I called and the operator said mine is scheduled for shipping 11/29/01. She said the VON is sufficient for tracking and to call back in a couple of weeks to make sure it is still on schedule. The rail website is at nscorp.com (Norfolk Southern). I will need the VIN before I can track the rail travel.

I looked at a program Sport in Branson, MO that had 6,000 miles and the underside was rusting around the frame and springs. Should I consider undercoating while it is new? I hope to keep the Jeep for a long time and don't want it to rust prematurely.

All this talk of how much everyone is enjoying their Jeep makes me more anxious to get mine home. At least the wait looks to be much shorter than I originally expected.

larry18

dwrangler · November 2001

Hello all,

Yellowman-
I understand your problem...staring at promo photos, but I stopped taking the brochure to work because my co-workers would just roll their eyes when they saw me looking over the brochure. But I still keep dreamin'...just don't daydream at work ;-)

Larry18-
I feel for ya. Saharagal was the same way I began to wonder if she'd make it through the wait. She did and I know you will to. Just make sure that you have the salesman take you picture as soon as you pick it up. The look you'll have on your face...something to have a photo of...you know...a kodak moment :-)

Saharagal,
Where ya been there gal? Check in at the chat (both of them) from time to time. Want to know what you're up to.

Tomster,
Make sure you throw Thelma a big birthday bash :-)

Jeepboy,
I guess I just missed you in the other room earlier

Well, gotta go.

Hug your Jeeps for me

dwrangler

yellowman · November 2001

Hey all

Well, some sort of bad news to report. About 2 hours ago I went downstairs to walk to the market and looked across the street at my Jeep and noticed there was a red light on inside. As I approached it, I realized the door was open and the dash lights were on. Evidently, someone had broken in and attempted to hot wire the thing. The plastic casing had been ripped off the ignition area and the metal exterior and a piece of plastic tubing were laying on the floor. There were scratches on the ignition chamber, and it was stuck between on and off. I put my key in and it wouldn't easily move, so at that point I went upstairs to call the police and my insurance company.

I tried starting it again, and this time it worked, but I discovered it was dying 2-3 seconds after startup - evidence that the sentry key system had worked. Boy am I glad I got that thing as an option - I'm convinced it saved my Jeep from being stolen. There was virtually no other damage and nothing missing from the Jeep, EXCEPT...I discovered a dent below the keyhole on the tailgate. This bums me out more than anything else, because it might require a brand new tailgate, or at least body work on the thing :-( Now, since filing the report and all, I've tried to start it again and I get the same thing - starts up for 2-3 seconds then dies. I'm sure this is the sentry key system at work, but my question is this - isn't it supposed to allow a clean startup after a certain amount of time? I'm going to try again tomorrow morning. Any advice on anything would be helpful at this point.

yellowman

p.s. - I'm taking it in on Monday morning at 7 a.m. to the Jeep dealership around the corner from me - fortunately that part is convenient and I know I'll have authorized people working on it.

p.p.s. - Any idea how much the ignition/sentry key part might be to repair? Basically it's just the plastic covering and metal end that are messed up - the actual key-turning mechanism seems to work fine.

tidester · November 2001

Well, then I take it back! ;-)

Remind us again on the 5^th!

tidester
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larry18 · November 2001

Bummer, Yellowman. At least the sentry worked.

davidb72 · November 2001

Try disconnecting the battery for a couple hours to let the sytem reset, then you may have better luck. Hope that works!

2001wrangler · November 2001

Hey everyone. It has been a long time since I posted anything on here, but I still see a few familar names around here.

Last week I went to my dealer because my gas cap had quit clicking when I would tighten it after refueling. Then last Saturday my check engine light came on. I took it back to the dealer this week and the new gas cap had been delivered and when they checked it with the computer it showed a fuel system leak. They replaced the cap and everything was fine. If anyone else has a gas cap which has 'lost it's click', get it replaced. I pretty well knew that was why the engine light was on, but it still made me nervous having that light on for the weekend!

yellowman · November 2001

Hey all

Well, I let the Jeep sit overnight and tried starting it again this morning...Same problem, it starts for 2-3 seconds and then (I assume) the sentry key system kicks in and it dies. I can only imagine the thief attempted to override the sentry key computer chip and in so doing jarred it enough that it's no longer recognizing my key. I've even tried using both keys I got when I picked up the Jeep, since each has its own 4-digit PIN code.

I must say, though, I would rather have this problem of not being able to drive for a couple days following an attempted theft than to have the system be more lenient with re-starts and have no Jeep!

Upon further inspection of the tailgate door, it looks like they jammed something into the keyhole and pressed down, thereby bending the keyhole so it's at about a 20 degree angle looking down and causing a concave dent below and convex dent above the keyhole. It actually doesn't look that bad and I can still lock and unlock the tailgate, but I'm still going to have it fixed. Anyone have any idea how much a tailgate costs to have replaced, and how long it might take for the dealer to do it?

Thanks for the sympathy, too. This board makes me feel a lot more comfortable about any situations arising with my Jeep.

yellowman

tsjay · November 2001

That really, really makes me mad that someone tried to steal your Jeep! That low life, yellow bellied, bottom feeding, scum sucking, you-know-what ought to be shot!

It's a shame when you work hard to be able to have a few nice things, and then someone who is too lazy to work for a living comes along and tries to steal something from you.

Glad they didn't succeed and hope you get everything fixed OK.

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

dwrangler · November 2001

Sorry to hear about the attempted theft yellowman. It really ticks me off that some low life thinks that he can do something like that. Well, hopefully he'll think twice about taking such a fine piece of machinery as the Jeep. I hope it doesn't take much to get it fixed. I would think since it was an attempted theft that the insurance would pay for most all of it, with the possible exception of the deductible of course. I hope to that the idiot that damaged your baby will get his just deserts REAL soon. Best of luck and let us know what happens.

dwranlger

dwrangler · November 2001

your Mud Hole Gang friends miss you...Where ya been boys? If I don't get to talk to any of the Mud Hole Gang or the rest of the Jeep owner's group...You all have a happy and safe thanksgiving. Don't eat too much and get a good nap in before you go Jeepin'

Take care and hug your Jeeps for me
;-)

dwrangler

tsjay · November 2001

I finally got around to removing those plastic end pieces on the front and back bumpers on Thelma Jane. She looks much better without them.

It was an easy thing to do. There are four torx head screws on each of the front corners and five on each of the back corners. I don't know the size of these screws, but they were one size smaller than the ones that hold the hard top down.

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

madman390 · November 2001

Hey all. Hope you had as nice a weekend as we did here in Colorado. The temps were in the 50s and 60s and I could have had the top down if I didn't have the kids in the back!

Anyway, I'm writing to ask for advice on cleaning the plastic windows in the soft top. I have the tinted soft top windows and I've been hesitant to clean them thoroughly for fear of scratching them. I rinse them with water, but it's not enough. I need to wash them, but how should I do it? Those of you with previous experience, please respond.

Thanks.

Madman

PS--I figured out why my web page was loading the pics so slowly and I'm working on revision 2. Please send any suggestions to:

domino_f15@hotmail.com

madman390 · November 2001

Tsjay--

You've got to post pics of the look minus the bumper caps. I've heard of others who've removed the caps for various reasons, but I've never seen what it looks like.

Madman

redkey1 · November 2001

Hello all. How bad is it to run w/o a spare tire cover? I have a dealer cover and want to ditch it but I like the look of the uncovered wheel plus I could better spend the $50 on something else.

I've heard it is better to keep it covered to protect it but the other 4 tires are open to the weather so I figure why not the spare.

Also, how often should the tires be rotated?

spyrodragon · November 2001

Yes it is better to keep a cover on the spare. No I don't have one because they don't make many for 33" tires... You'll be fine without one. The cover keeps the tire from dry rotting. The reason the other don't dryrot is because they are in use, as you drive they get worn. This keeps them from dry rotting... Rotate every 5K miles.

redkey1 · November 2001

When I rotate the tires should I rotate the spare in as well?

goducks1 · November 2001

You shouldn't rotate the spare in with the other tires, although it is tempting--otherwise you will always have a tire that is slightly bigger than the others when you drive, which is a no-no for alignment, differentials etc.

You don't have to spend $50 for a Mopar spare tire cover either--Bestop makes perfectly sized ones that are made of the same fabric as your soft top for ~$20. Go to quadratec.com or 4wd.com.

bamatazz · November 2001

I know..all of you are probably mad at me...
Do you really think I have forgotten about all you guys..
no way..
Well Tazz is running perfectly...just as the 1st day I bought him..he has 4700 miles on him now..
still looks brand new..
put the hard top back on a couple of weeks ago..
maybe Santa will bring me a Hoist for Christmas.
I hope All of you have a great Thanksgiving.
This year is seams we REALLY do have alot to be thankfull for!

Keep Jeepin
BAMATAZZ
ROllll Tideeee!!

dwrangler · November 2001

Well, we don't have to send out an apb for ya huh Bama? EEK I know Mizzou isn't doing well this year (as usual)...but the Rams are doin' just fine :-)

Hey if the Mud Hole Gang isn't too tired from eating all that turkey, maybe you can stop by the other room after the owners group chat. It's been too long.

And hey if anybody has posted any photos let me know I'd like to get some more inspiration for the day I can get mine. Thanks

Thelma? getting a little rough around the corners Tomster? What's next the tube bumpers? Are you trying to spoil her or what?

Won't have to worry about hiding the laptop this week. Mom and Dad are leaving for Florida to spend thanksgiving with my Uncle and his family. So I can talk without worry from Wednesday to Sunday night. Wahooo!

Well it's late and 7am comes early enough.

Hug your Jeeps for me ;-)

dwrangler

Jeep Wrangler

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