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I found this on another Escape Message Board and if you're planning on joining the EAA to use the X Plan you might want to do it soon.
"Beginning, December 1, a significant change in the plan goes into effect that rewards loyal and sustaining membership of EAA. Only people who've been EAA members for one full year or more will be eligible for the plan. Those who were members on or before November 30, 2001, are still eligible to participate in the plan. In addition, the entire line of Jaguar vehicles will be included in the plan after December 1. If you have any questions, visit www.eaa.org or call 800-JOIN-EAA (564-6322)."
I checked the EAA website and did not see it there. Does anyone know if this is true?
lack of time, and the fact that the mudguards are black and the bumper material is gray,
as has been pointed out. However, it's not uncommon for other Trucks/SUV's that I've seen
with two-tone colored cladding to have black mudguards. So, I'll probably install the
mudguards on my Escapes bumpers. I did install the black rear bumper scuff strips which
are available, and they kind of add a contrast effect. Not so bad. I would tend to think that
that the mudguards and bumper strips should be the same color as the bumpers.
Again, as has been pointed out, this a utilitatian-looking vehicle. Maybe things shouldn't
match so much.
I was not able to seat my moonroof deflector properly when installing it and it cracked as
well. It was a Ford ( or approved ) accessory. I have not taken this item back to the dealer,
though I should. My favorite accessory are the thick rubber floor mats which actually cover
a substantial area of carpeting. These are worth the money.
Overall satisfaction is high for me, with the V6, no smells, no stalls, and with only a
slight thump noise immenating from the driver's door when going over bumpy roads.
I've got to research that one. Seems solid after 5.5K miles.
Thanks!
tidester
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SUVs
Unless I am missing something I thought the purpose of the cladding was to prevent what Mud Flaps(Guards)were originally suppose to do, prevent paint chips from occuring behind the wheels.
We did buy them for our 1995 Pontiac Gran Prix GT, but only because the tires protruded outside of the wheel wells and rocks actually were hitting the paint.
hckynut
The problem is that the cladding itself gets "chipped" and turns a dull color in chipped areas. After one winter on sanded roads, it looks rather worn, especially just in front of the rear tires (from grit flying up from the front tires).
I recommend a combination of mud flaps and the side step bars to reduce the "chipping" of the cladding.
good luck.
Also, I'm still at the stage of "waffling" between the Ford Escape and the Subaru Forester...anyone want to weigh in on that issue?
Thanks for any help!
For my part, I was ready to start to negotiate on the Escape last week when dealer dropped the bombshell that it was excluded from 0% financing. Later that evening I found this site. Had I seen it before, I'd have saved myself the trip. It is a shame I began checking out vehicles on the last day of October! And didn't make it to Ford Dealer till 11-6.
Hope others will talk to us....Question to anyone: Do I have it correct that Escapes now being built have a shorter shift lever and softer front seats? Did I glean that correctly from past posts? And that it is called Job 1? If so, those were the only two objections we had in the vehicle.
tidester
Host
SUVs
Anyone know for sure or has anyone seen this in the dealerships yet?
dchick//
I would highly recommend the Escape over the Forester, other than having more horsepower and being an over all better vehicle, cheaper parts and labor is also an issue. The Escape will definitely have a higher resale value. It also is more of a true SUV vs the Forrester being a glorified station wagon.
Do as you choose, but the Escape is a quality vehicle.
Does anyone know what Ford is financing the Escape's at right now. I know there is no incentive, but what is the standard rate?
thanks
A 3 year old Forester goes for 70%+ of original purchase price around here. A 3 year old Ford Taurus goes for about 40%.
"True SUV" depends on your definition. Many people view the Escape as a "glorified car" due to its complete lack of "real" 4x4 components (low range, skid plates, decent suspension etc).
The Forester has a much better 4x4 system than the Escape
The Forester gets better mpg and will out handle an Escape and does not nearly have the problems that the Escape has.
Having said all of that, the Escape is a better looking vehicle IMHO.
I use the Taurus as a comparison to show that the Forester is miles ahead of another Ford product in resale value. I do not agree that the Escape will "definitely" have better resale than the Forester.
Also the Escape has the same engine as the Taurus.
I got rid of my Escape after 15,000 miles due to "unfixable" & "unfindable" problems.
I also was really disapointed with the 4x4 system. It sometimes made things worse. The Ford is not the only vehicle that suffers with a "delayed reactive" 4x4 system. The CRV is similar.
Neither will drive circles around the other.
Look at all of the cars that get along just fine in the winter even in new england.. Most of them are also just front wheel drive.. The Escape is even better because even the 4x2 has a little more ground clearance than most cars and mini-vans.
I also find it amusing that Subaru fans lurk here.
The Escape's system is rather simple and just reacts when the front tires start to "spin".
With the Escape's 4x4 system set to "on", it actually performed worse for me in the snow as the rear end became very loose around corners.
I only used it in the "on" positiion on straght ahead slippery & hilly sections after a while.
On snowy and icy roads, I would choose the Forester over the Escape (or CRV) any day.
The Escape IMHO, has more power and is better looking than the Forester.
1st gear is LOW and quick, rather like the early VW bug...and transition's not terribly smooth from 1st to 2nd... but, who's doing drag racing hole shots anyway? Gears 2,3,4, & 5 are strong for such a small engine, between 1800 and 4000/4500 rpm, where you're able to move right out decently for traffic merging once in 2nd gear. The quick steering on our Escape is VERY stable in cross winds and quick lane changes. Haven't had to do any emergency maneuvers. Thank God.
Took it into our irregular & hilly back yard on wet grass in 1st gear with no difficulties and no slipping or tipping, using only the AWD function. Didn't need the 4WD function even on 30 degree grade.
LOTS of room!!! Seats are decent on entry level vehicle, even for my bad back! I AM pleasantly surprised.
However, engine and road noise does interfere with audio & my ears above 60/65 mph. Given the present gearing ratios and the pep of this 2L engine, they could well have afforded to add a 6th gear on this baby for highway cruising. THAT would dramatically have reduced the 2L hum which tachs about 3grand @ 60, and 4grand @ 80mph. 60/65mph generates about all I can stand of decibels for more than five minutes. Hence, I find the engine noise level generated by the 4cyl tends to make me drive slower at highway speeds, even when conditions otherwise do not make it necessary. In that respect I would HOPE & EXPECT their 6cyl to be quieter, since it SHOULD tach at lower rpms. IF there is a noise reduction package GET IT!!!
Otherwise, we are VERY pleased with the Escape.
The Forester varies torque between the front and rear axles as needed and gives a more controlled ride in the slippery stuff.
I actually found that in snow & ice, the Escape 4x4 dial was better left on "Auto" rather then "On" for most driving. In "On" mode, the rear end would sometimes "kickout" on curves causing a slide (btw, I had studded winter tires). The "on" mode would work best for straight ahead slippery situations like steep hills in town.
My advice is if you can get by this winter, wait for the 2003 Forester as it will be a redesign (I don't like the looks of the current model).
The Forester is basically just a station wagon with the roof popped up. Fine if you want to drive a car that looks like a wagon, but not for any guy with any self respect. Yes, they run well, but so do Honda civics.
The Escapes are somewhat better looking, but still closer to the taurus wagon (its shared platform) than the Explorer. Plus, the seats were terribly uncomfortable, somewhat of a surprise since I'm not in the football player weight class.
Needless to say, I was not tempted to trade in my '97 Explorer for either of these two. I think I'll wait until it's time for a new Explorer.
The V6 is what absolutely hammers the Forester. The V6 just plain out powers the Forester. As far as handling the Escape also handles better in my opinion. As far as the 4x4 system on the Escape it has done just fine by me. I go up Fishing in the mountains and use logging/access roads to get into some lakes and the Escape has gotten me there just fine. Granted I am well aware its a car frame and is not to go into heavy 4x4 terrain. I don't need that type of suspension. Over 90 percent of my driving is done on ROADS... as is the majority of the populations... The 4x4 system is not as "sophisticated" as some has said, but it works. First snow of the season in my area and the Escape handled just fine... The Escape is superior to the Forester in handling, performance, towing, interior.. The V6 isn't that much more either....
As I mentioned earlier, the Escape's 4x4 system can cause more problems than benefits.
As far as crash tests go, the Escape scores worse than the Forester in the crash test that resembles most real world fatal accidents - the offset test. The other tests are closer.
I bought a 2001 Escape because I though it would do the job. I had to get rid of it.
What I do miss is its power, handling, room, utility and solid feel.
I do NOT miss its unexplainable miriad of problems, poor and inconsistent fuel mileage and borderline useless 4x4 system.
Ford needs to put more than just a "little" refinement and tweaking into this vehicle. With a lot of good automotive luck, the 2003 model may be ready for prime time.
good luck to all!
The person asking the question obviously is willing to settle with everything else about the vehicle, whether it be a Forester or Escape. I initially chose the Escape over the Forester for the same reason many others did: I find it a far more attractive and substantial looking vehicle than the Forester.
My mistake in assuming that it's weak 4x4 system would be good enough for my simple requirements of providing safe traction ON snow covered roads.
Never mind the CONTINUED problems with the Escape.
Yes, I truly hope that Ford gets it right soon as the Escape otherwise has got incredible potential.
good luck
The Forester is a nice vehicle but I feel the the Escape is the answer to the majority of the peoples wants.
I have looked at the crashtest data at several internet sites and they all point to the same thing. The Forester wins in offset only. Otherwise the Escape does better or they are even.
The Foresters weak point is its engine. The Escape will out tow, haul, acclerate and handle the Forester on pavement hands down. (with a V6). The Escape also offers more choices to people. Meaning you can have a v6 FWD/AWD or a 4cyl FWD/AWD. Does Subaru offer these choices?
As far as problems.. Please check the Yahoo Escape boards and the many other Escape boards around the net. There are plenty, if not a majority of Escape/Tribute owners with NO PROBLEMS. I am one of them too!
1. For real off-roading. We all agree on this. The Escape is not built to do it. The viscous coupling is especially bad and will burn up in a hurry if you over do it. Gravel roads are not over-doing it.
2. For providing responsive traction in bad conditions (snow,ice) ON-ROAD. As you say, it is not a true AWD system. Yes, the Escape can plow through a foot and a half of snow. But in 4 inches of fresh snow with ice underneath, the Escape does not nearly provide the overall stability a Subaru does.
Again, a poster asked which vehicle is better on snow covered roads. The fact that the Escape has more power, looks better, can tow more, meets 80% of people's needs, is better on 3 out of 7 crash tests, gets much worse gas mileage etc is all besides the point. The Subaru (and many other vehicles) have much better, and more stable "traction" systems for snow covered roads. period. Look for Ford to fix this in the next version of the Escape.
Take a look right here in your own backyard at Edmunds crashtests say different, Why? So do MSN crashtests..
I agree the Escape is not made to serious offroad. Its a car frame also. But neither is your Forester! I was in snow/ice conditions and my Escape has taken me up skiing and back 7 times now with not a problem. As far as MPG, you leave out the Escape has a V6! What about 4cyl vs 4cyl?
I am well aware that Subaru has been around the AWD market far longer than Ford. But the way you totally discount the Traction system on the Escape is ignorant. The system works...
You can not claim that the Escape has superior power & acceleration (V6) and then say it also offers good mpg (I4) because that is combining the qualities of 2 different vehicles.
By that logic we can say the Escape gets poor mp and is a dog because it only has 130HP.
Yes, the Escape will get you to the ski hill fine.
But, the proof in the pudding is that you can safely drive the Forester FASTER on the same slippery snow-covered roads than you can safely drive the Escape (assume they have the same model of tires).
That is an extra margin of safety that is important to many people even if you do not use it.
You should be careful in all your driving, but with the Escape you just have to be MORE careful and go slower on snow-covered roads than you otherwise would in a Subaru.
legroom!
I'm in immediate need to purchase a fully loaded SUV - tried out the Toyota RAV4 and Highlander. Even in the Highlander, my head was slightly bumping the moonroof. (Same in an Avalon - the new Camry was the best of all of them I sat in!)
Are there any decent decked out ($30-35K) small/medium SUVs that have decent headroom (and legroom)?
Side note: I had to special order a Nissan Maxima and waited 5 months to get it WITHOUT a moonroof - I would rather NOT go through that again. And I need to get my hands on a new SUV by the end of the year.
[Also, I am trading in a 2000 Toyota Land Cruiser - about $36K trade-in value.]
Bud Hinckley
As for the 4x4 system, I've had my escape up and down some pretty steap dirt hills, and have already had the tires up to the middle of the hubs in mud and streams. My wife thinks I'm crazy. But I've taken my escape on some of the older trails that I use to go on with my '97 Wrangler I had. The trails are very well suited for many different types of suv's (4x4) . I did notice that when in full time 4x4 on a hill the escape will drift back a slight bit before finally going. But I havn't needed any help from any of my friends to be pulled out of anything yet. I guess as long as your familiar with the trails/paths that your going to go on you should be okay, just don't drive like your playing some video game.
Odie
Hinkly - Sounds like you want an import.. Tried an Xterra? Otherwise a loaded Escape/Trib goes for about 25K.
canad - ok, lets stick with the V6. AS far as MPG. How can you say a V6 that puts out 201HP and 200 ft/lbs of torque and gets 23MPG HWY, 18 city is bad??? Your Forester doesn't do that much better when looking at the HP/Torque comparisons.
I do plenty of driving in the snow/ice. The Escape will get you where you want to go, period.
I also tow my two jet skiis, lets see a Forester do that!
I also fish in the mountains... no problems using the access/logging roads....
It has always bugged me that Ford can not explain its huge variances the mileage. And it is not just driving style.
If you are gettin 23mpg in an Escape you are doing great. I figure the overall average is closer to 20-21 mpg. The Edmunds test showed 16-18mpg average. I got 19.1 Highway mpg on mine and that's after 14,000 miles. A buddy gets 20mpg on his 265HP 5.4L F-150 4x4 Supercab. Go figure.
Anyway, Foresters get 26-30mpg - 30 to 50% better than the V6 Escape. And the spread is not all over the map like the Escape. Ford should get their act together and figure it out and fix it.
As well, I do not own a Forester. Don't like how they look. The Escape is much better looking. The Subaru is just better engineered than the Escape for lots of driving on snow-covered highways.
Lot's of Escapers are not happy with the mpg they are getting or all the problems they are having. I know of 3 in our area that had their engine replaced.
I had a bunch of problems that the dealer could not fix or explain so I got rid of it.
1. cheaper
2. gets better mileage
3. it has less things to go wrong (and they DO go wrong)
4. can actually be SAFER in some slippery ON-ROAD conditions (where the abrupt torque transfer of the 4WD causes a skid)
The 2Wd's downfall is that Ford has convinced the general public that the 4x4 system is good so the 2WD version has worse resale values.
Ford also does not sell the 2WD in Canada.