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Comments
We took the car in shortly after my last post and had service bulletin computer updates done to the vehicle..(Service Bulletin # 11-104-11)
IT DID ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! a weak Band-Aid at best...
Subaru should be absolutely embarrassed with the way they have handled this...
DO NOT BUY A SUBARU...Nice car on the outside...pretty sketchy underneath IMO. This was a brand new purchase...our first and OUR LAST vehicle from Subaru.
Lesson learned...I'll stick with the Honda's and Toyota's (and other divisions of those companies) I've had in the past and will avoid Subaru like the plague...
I've got no issue with a company admitting there is a problem and making the effort to solve it, but Subaru seems more apt to want to brush this under the rug in spite of the fact that this is more common than you like to think with others posting on the chat boards...
Hi y'all. I have a 95 automatic AWD subaru legacy wagon and I'm having problems with what I think might be my transmission. We recently had a little snow storm up here in Portland, OR, so while driving I often had to shift into 1st, 2nd or 3rd gear just to get going and to slow down. No problems and no unusual noises at that point or even before. After doing this for a couple of days, I got into my car to drive it to work. Started it up, put it in drive and nothing but engine revving, no movement but a slight rock when I initially put it in drive. I checked all gears and no movement. I checked in again over the course of a few days and still the same thing with some whistling noise (like release air from a balloon while pinching the top) when I release my foot from the gas. Well now, I get into it yesterday and it's driving fine. I did hear a slight knocking noise when I put it in reverse and drive, but this stopped after the car warmed up for a bit. Today, I drove it around the neighborhood and it seems to be fine. I have checked the trans oil and that is low, so I will top that off today. But any thoughts on what the problem might be before I take it to a mechanic? I like to be educated so any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance!
How low is "a bit low?" Nothing you describe really stands out with an obvious cause aside from the possibility that your transmission may not be building pressure due to fluid level or... ? When is the last time your transmission fluid/filter were changed? How many miles on the car?
I also have problem with my 2012 legacy 3.6 R
Aside from the hesitation from reverse to drive, thug/clunking sound, the more serious Is that the car seems to have a mind of its own. After hard acceleration, the car would like to take off like a jet. I have to apply the brakes really hard to slow it down. The last time it happened, I burned my pads - smelly - just like driving with the parking brakes engaged. It is scary. Serious safety issue. I'm bringing it to the dealer on Thursday for them to check. Very disappointed with my purchase. I bought my 3.6 because its fun, but, with the transmission acting like that, it is not safe. Is it too much to ask to have fun and safe at the same time?
Three months ago, we purchased a 2014 Outback and have an issue with the CVT. At in-town driving speeds of 30-45 mph, you can hear the engine wrap up (2200 rpm) as if it needs to shift and can't. When I move the selector to "M", it is indeed laboring at "3" or "4" with an up arrow indicating that it can that it can be paddled up. When I do that there is an immediate easing of the engine (1200 rpm) and the car seems to "relax", only to rev up again when the selector is moved back to "D." This happens about 50% of the time and has resulted in gas mileage of 16.9 - 19.1 mpg. I have taken it to two dealers and neither could find anything wrong and of course, it did not show the problem when they drove it. My thought is that whatever part of the car's computer that tells it to shift only works intermittently. One of the dealers said that the CVT doesn't shift like regular transmissions (I know this, just traded in a Legacy and it didn't have this issue) and that it is operating at its optimum condition. I told him it can't be operating at "optimum condition" when the engine is laboring like this. I drove a manual transmission for years and this is the sound and rpms that told me I needed to shift to a higher gear. He shrugged and said they can't replace a part that doesn't show up as defective on their scope. I'm worried it will keep getting worse and the problem won't be diagnosed until after the warranty period is over and I'm disgusted at the lousy gas mileage. Any ideas? Thanks.
2011 3.6R Outback, coming off lease in April. Same auto-tranny clunking as described throughout this, and multiple forums. 2 different dealers giving me the old "that's odd..I've never heard of this problem before" look..one said the engine needed to be warmed up before driving. LOL... Uhm, this is Los Angeles, not Michigan, dipstick. No new Subaru for me.
The new 3.6R Outbacks will have the CVT transmission, not the five speed auto with issues. The CVT solves the problems.
what about jrb123's CVT tranny issues on his '14 Outback?
Actually, the description by jrb123 sounds like 'normal' cold-temp operation. The CVT will force the engine to stay near 2000 RPM until FULLY warmed up. (purposefully stay in lower gearing) Some folks have reported this CVT behavior continues for some time even after the blue 'cold engine' lite extinguishes.
I have noticed my subie behaving in this way for many miles of driving after a cold start and am not concerned at all about it. After fully warming up, the CVT shifts to high gear normally.
Thru experimentation, some Subie CVT drivers have determined that this behavior can be circumvented by moving the lever to 'manual' mode, turning off the blower, or turning the heater down. Some people think the onboard computer is trying to protect the transmission. Other folks think that emission-controls are trying get the engine up-to-temp as fast as possible.
I know on my manual transmission vehicles, I never EVER use high-gear until the engine-temp guage is fully up to normal operating point. In my mind, the CVT is emulating a properly-driven manual transmission.
Of course, jrb123 does not describe the specific conditions under which he encounters this CVT behavior so we cannot make conclusive determination if his is a real problem.
Good point, peebles.
People need to realize that a CVT is not the same device as a TCT (torque converter transmission). They perform the same task, but they do it differently. Expecting a vehicle to behave exactly the same way with both transmission types is like sitting in a car with a manual transmission without a gear selected, hitting the accelerator, and expecting it will go: You're bound for disappointment!
A problem is most likely present if, after developing expectations through experience, your vehicle behaves differently than it has in the past.
Sounds like learning to drive a CVT is a bit akin to learning how to use ABS brakes.
I am still learning how to drive a CVT. Since the programming leans towards maximizing MPG, I find it tricky to maintain constant roadspeed on undulating roads (virtually every Vermont road). The slightest rise in the road is detected and it downshifts and slows down... then, when the road heads downhill, the speed gets away from me.
Back in my MANUAL transmission, on the very same roads, (and same engine!), I can maintain roadspeed within 2 MPH without ever looking at the speedometer.
I think some of it is the SOUND of the engine. Obviously with the manual xmission, it is perfectly linear with roadspeed. With the CVT, the engine-sound has absolutely no correlation to the roadspeed.
I have a 2002 Subaru Legacy GT /w a manual transmission that over the past month has started to show a slight and now more pronounced clicking noise.
The noise itself is best described as a slight ticking sound, kinda of like when we used to put baseball cards in the spokes of our bicycle wheels. The ticking speeds up and slows with the speed of the car.
This noise is coming from the center of the engine bay (not either side) and I have checked the boots on the CV joints, so I am going to rule that out.
The noise only appears when I am accelerating, and is especially noticeable in 1st gear at slow speeds and accelerating out of a stop. I suspect the noise is still there at higher speeds, but is drowned out by engine and road noise.
The noise does NOT appear when simply revving the engine RPM's with the clutch in.
The gear oil was low and has been filled.
I cannot figure out the problem
I suspect a bearing. You say that it is not coming from either side, yet it does not appear to be (from your description) something you can replicate when the vehicle is not in motion?
If it really is mid-vehicle, then your rear drive shaft carrier may be the culprit. Otherwise, it could be a wheel bearing. If it is a bearing in the drive shaft (or even in the transmission housing), they do tend to make more noise when in high-torque situations.
@bpeebles, I appreciate the info. The behavior has mostly disappeared with warmer weather. My commute to work is only 4 miles so perhaps the engine would not be totally warmed up by the time I arrived this winter. But it sometimes performed that way (running at over 22,000 rpms) for as long as 45 minutes on longer trips...or it would be working fine but after a stop light, would start the revving-up process again. The behavior was pretty erratic so I couldn't pin it on a specific circumstance. The Legacy that we traded in for this Outback also had a CVT and it never had this problem. I guess my biggest gripe is the poor gas mileage (which doesn't come close to what is listed on the sticker, city or highway) and I can't help but think that the revving engine business has something to do with it. We like the Subaru brand (this is our 3rd) but probably wouldn't have purchased this one knowing how bad the mpg was going to be--we trusted the sticker and the dealer claims!
jrb123 - Re mpg: Your 4 mile commute doesn't give the engine enough time to warm up, so few gas/diesel powered cars would give you good mpg. The engine never gets to the point of being really efficient.
@bpeebles
You seem to be quite knowledgeable about CVT. I just bought a 2014 Outback. I have noticed (intermittently) that the car seems to shake/studder around 20mph. I have driven a manual trans in the past and that used to happen with that vehicle if I shifted to quickly (or not smoothly enough) into 2nd. I do notice that this tends to happen first thing in the morning or after the car has been sitting for a while. BUT -- this is summer (Maryland). Do I really need to warm up my car for 5+ minutes every day? Won't that mess with my mileage? I don't have a temp gauge on my dash, just a blue light comes on when I start the car. I warm it up enough for the revving to go down on its own to 1000.... I have an appt with my dealer, but I have little confidence in them right now... Do you think it is as simple as it needing to warm up even in the summer? I figured with a 2014 car, I could drive it as soon as it started - I thought new technology made the idea of warming up a car obsolete. Am I wrong? (I don't know much about cars, obviously!)
Thanks for any help!!
All you have to do is start the engine and drive it gently until the blue lite goes out. The computer will properly manage engine RPM (keep RPM a tad higher during warmup)
If you feel that there is something amiss with the way it drives, perhaps there is a something to it and your dealer may find it.
there are two metal tubes the restrict how much the filter can move, hence why i cant remove it. im not sure one is for the dipstick, but to remove the filter it looks i may have to remove at least one of the tubes. what i am unsure about is how to properly remove them. would the shop manual cover something as specific as thant?
ryan
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Ryan:
To which filter are you referring?
I would also think that the fluid would show such high wear as well, such as heavy browning (should be a rich red color) or a burnt smell. If the fluid has not been changed on the car (at least once), then the rest of the transmission could be suffering undue wear, but, no, a failed torque converter does not, by itself, lend an indication to the health of the transmission. The quoted price doesn't sound unreasonable given the price of the part or the amount of labor that goes into the install.
It is possible that the other problems you're having, such as hesitating and flickering lights, is a symptom of this communication error. You may also notice that dash gauges and lights are not giving reasonable signals, such as fuel on empty for a time, the high temperature light/needle on or pegged, all sorts of odd things.
It could be an intermittent issue: It may work perfectly for a time with simple on/off cycle or disconnecting then reconnecting the battery, or it may be DOA until it is repaired if it is being caused by a bad control unit or a corroded/loose connector somewhere.
I would suggest a specialized service center look at it.
And, if your car is so essential to your livelihood, consider strongly the idea of confining the animals to a region of the vehicle that is less essential to its function.
When my wife and I had a 1996 Outback, two dogs, and no human pups, we would often travel with the back seats folded down to give the dogs the range of the full cargo area. To keep them back there, we took one of those wire cube shelving systems (the type with 18" square sides with approximately 2" mesh and the plastic corner connectors) and zip-tied it together in a 2 units x 4 units pattern, then used small bungies to connect it to the seat clips at the bottom and the hand grips at the top. Worked beautifully and was easy to remove and store when not needed.
Thank you
Also, after you add a couple quarts, start the car and, with your foot on the brake, slowly shift through the gears. You want reverse, neutral, forward, neutral, reverse, then park. Turn off the car, and add more. At this point, you should be able to get it onto the dipstick. Then, repeat the prior process, turn the car off again, and check the dipstick again, then top off as necessary.
I should note that it is a good idea to replace the exterior filter, which should be mounted partway up the side of the transmission. This filter should be a spin-on type and the same as the engine oil filter. I change mine once a year, but the internal filter can go much longer.
And, if you want clean fluid in the transmission, then you need to flush it by pulling the outgoing transmission radiator line (located in the lower front left corner of the engine bay at the base of the radiator). You just add a couple of clear plastic hoses: One from the line to an empty bucket, and the other attached to the radiator nipple from a new gallon of ATF. When you start the car and put it in gear, the fluid will flow into the bucket and draw from the gallon container. Shut off the car when the container is near empty, insert the hose in a new one, and repeat until the fluid leaving the line goes from dark to bright red. At that point, all the fluid (or nearly all) in your transmission is new. Put the line back in place, clamp it down, and check the dipstick to top off the fluid.
For the owner, it is worth noting that the transmission dipstick should be located on the left side of the transmission near the firewall (driver side). The center differential dipstick, which is much shorter and located very low in the compartment, is on the right side just behind the engine (passenger side). Do NOT confuse the two... different mechanicals, different types of oil....