you are correct, rather than "assume," it may be worth a phone call, or, heaven forbid, read your contract (..:):):)...) just to be absolutely sure that you ARE covered...I would hate for your vehicle to be stolen or totalled and find out the hard way you do NOT have GAP...
I've read the entire thread and still have questions. Hoping some experienced soul here can guide me.
First, someone upthread said something to the effect of "...since most of us would have difficulty coming up with $3-10K in one day..." Is that really how it would work in the case of insurance payout on a totaled car that's less than what's owed on the note? Meaning, I'm sure the insurance company pays out the settlement amount directly to the lienholder, but then does the lienholder demand immediate payment on the difference? I guess they do, but surely people just pay that out when they can't do otherwise, taking the hit to their credit, correct?
Asking the question because on my last new car purchase, which was zero down, I paid $6K below sticker but rolled in $5500 negative equity from my previous note, basically financing the sticker price. Obviously knowing I was immediately upside down on this quickly depreciating American car, I searched in vain for GAP coverage. I was unable to find any company to purchase GAP coverage through at the time. I financed the car through my credit union but they didn't offer it, my insurance company (State Farm) didn't offer it either, and I couldn't find any independent companies at the time willing to provide me with coverage. So I went without it, hoping for the best. Here I am almost 3 years later, still upside down some on the note, and was involved in a 3-car collision last week. It's looking like the car is going to be totaled out.
What this will do is put me in the unfortunate position of again having to finance something with zero down, and I definitely don't want to chance finding myself in the same position again! If anyone has ANY recommendations for reputable companies that will provide GAP insurance, any info would definitely be appreciated!
(As an aside, does anyone think I can/should get the negative equity on the wrecked car [probably +/- $2k] rolled into the new note, or should I just keep that separate and make payments on it until it's paid?)
Is that really how it would work in the case of insurance payout on a totaled car that's less than what's owed on the note?
Yes, the reason being is that in order for your insurance company to complete the claim and sell your totaled car for salvage they have to have the title. In order to get the title the loan has to be paid in full.
There are exceptions to every rule and you may be able to make payment arrangements with them. But then hope it does not create a problem when you go to finance you new car. Basically you would still have an open auto wanting to add another one and you would have to budget for that.
There is also the possibility of rolling the deficiency into your new loan, once again you would have to qualify for it. You can still purchase GAP from a dealer at time of sale even if you are not financing with them. It really is no different then buying a warranty from them if you are not financing with them. They just include the cost in OTD price and list your CU as lien holder on the GAP Contract.
"Meaning, I'm sure the insurance company pays out the settlement amount directly to the lienholder, but then does the lienholder demand immediate payment on the difference?"
Yes, they will not let you continue to make payments, you must come up with the difference immediately, or 30 days, so they can sell the salvage title...
It is my experience that most folks would have serious difficulty cutting a check for say, $7-10 grand that quickly...considering that GAP, even if purchased thru the dealer who charges more, would still only be $10 monthly if $500 premium, which covers you for at least 3 of a 5 year loan and probably 5 of a 6-7 year loan...
If you put down at least 25% or finance under 3 years, GAP probably not necessary, since your loan balance and value of car probably amortize at the same rate, i.e. you probably owe what the car is worth if totaled, so your regular insurance would pay out enough to pay off your note...
considering that GAP, even if purchased thru the dealer who charges more
Marsh, the dealer does not always charge more. We have Customers who are Agents for Farm Bureau and they buy our GAP because it cost less and because it is a Insurance Policy and not a Waiver Addendum. Ours also covers the deductible up to $1000 theres is $500, and ours covers 3 payments while the claim is being processed where with theres you have to continue to make payments on a car you are not driving while they process the claim.
So, though you are correct in that you can find a cheaper (not less expensive but cheaper) policy keep in mind it is cheaper for a reason.
good to know...I happen to buy all my Gap policies thru the dealer and roll it into the payment, but many posters on this topic have stated that they can get it much cheaper thru their own auto ins agent...
wherever they get it, it will be cheaper than paying out the $7-10K if the car is totalled in the first year or two, when the depreciation is the max but the amortization on the loan is the min...:):):)
USAA charges $170 as a one time fee for GAP insurance. My dealer wanted $700, but they ended upmatching USAA when I told them - lol
GAP was important to me, because I financed the whole value of the car. I used my trade to pay-off my other car loan (we have three cars), so rather then having two smaller loans, I have one bigger one. As a result, GAP seemed like a must have for me.
That is not correct. My Gap insurance does....and all gap insurance issued by USAA does for people who finance through them.
Keep in mind, banks have rules about how much you can borrow on a car in the first place. Some banks limit loans to 80% of MSRP while others (like USAA) will loan up to 120% of MSRP. USAA charges $170 for gap insurance (at least that is what I was quotted) but the amount may vary for the borrower depending on the situation.
I have a question. Can you tell me what USAA stands for and if you can, can you please give me there phone number.? I have been looking high and low for a company to give me GAP and I am having a hard time trying to find one. Thanks for your help Nan
Thanks so much for getting back to me so fast. I really appreciated it. I guess that leaves me out, because I do not have anyone in the military. My father was along time ago and I guess that doesnt mean that will help me. Have a great day Nan
Thanks so much for getting back to me so fast. I really appreciated it. I guess that leaves me out, because I do not have anyone in the military. My father was along time ago and I guess that doesnt mean that will help me. Have a great day Nan
There is a trick to get to USAA. You can open an accoutn with Pentagon Credit Union and it will automatically qualify you for USAA, if I understand it correctly.
Maybe I did not understand the question, or for that matter your response - lol
So, I will try to respond differently. If a bank gives you a car loan for $33k and the car is destroyed, but it is only worth $25k and you have GAP, they will pay-off the entire loan.
I am so sorry to bother you but I need to find out if you have the phone number for Safeco? Do you have to have a policy with them or can you just have them for GAP?
Thanks for your help. I am really appreciative. Nan
Oh I C. How are the rates? I might as well call them because my insurance company does not carry GAP. Do you have Safeco's phone number? Thanks again for your time Nan
Safeco is a national insurance company, easily found by doing a Google search. Try their website for an office near you at www.safeco.com.
As far as their rates, they were less expensive for me than when I had State Farm but not quite as low as Geico. However, Geico doesn't offer GAP but now I don't need that coverage.
I have GEICO and even though they are cheap they do not offer the GAP insurance for a vehicle that was preowned. So as much as I like them I do have to find a company that has GAP.
Right now I dont need GAP, but you never know what every day will be. Thanks for your information. Nan
Yes, I said that Geico doesn't offer GAP. That's why I mentioned Safeco and listed their website so you can find the phone number of a Safeco agent near you.
Safeco saved me over $600/yr from what I was paying with State Farm. Geico now saves me even more than Safeco. With my huge discount off the MSRP and trade-in, I'm easily below the point in my loan where GAP could be of any use.
your own vehicle. Sometimes, financially, torching and burning your vehicle is the best option (at least financially) because you wasted money on GAP and perhaps purchased something that depreciates like a rock and paid too much for it in the first place. I think GAP encourages and tempts people to torch their own vehicles and commit insurance fraud.
'21 BMW X3 M40i, '15 Audi S4, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
something CAN be abused does not mean it should not be available...for the majority of us who would not even think of torching the vehicle, GAP works for us...what is wrong with that???
4 Month old car just totaled. I'm not at fault but the "other guy" had no insurance/license etc.
I have GAP provided by BMWFS and I also pay for it to my insurance company. I will hear from the Total Loss department Monday I suppose.
The lease payoff amount as of today is $44,000
The actual cash value is probably $41,000
My concern is this: The $44,000 lease payoff amount includes nearly $2,000 in origination and MACO fees which I rolled into the lease instead of paying up front. The "car portion" of the payoff is only $42,000.
When settling, will GAP pay up to and only the $42,000 that is "car" and I will then have to come out of pocket to pay the remaining $2,000 of the payoff amount which is not "car"?
Also when settling should I be happy if they just pay off the lease payoff, or should I ask them to make me whole by giving me an additional amount to cover new drive-offs as well as the $700 more the lease will cost me given the money factor has gone up from the lease deal I wrote? Will insurance companies negotiate this with me and pay me if I ask/demand/threaten? Will they subrogate that amount on my behalf in the claim, or do I go after the guy who hit me for it in small claims?
GAP insurance should make no distinction on what is involved in the payoff of the lease..
Plus, you didn't really pay MACO fees.. Your dealer might have itemized it that way, but MACO fees are paid by the dealer, on their invoice.. The only real fees, are those that are paid to someone else by the dealer on your behalf. This would include the acquisition fee (remitted to the lender), and any governmental fee required by your state or locality. Even a document fee is just a way for the dealer to add to your price (or to make your selling price seem lower).
Not that any of that last paragraph matters, in answering your question. No matter what goes into the CAP cost of the lease, the GAP insurance makes the lender/leasing company whole, so you don't have to. It doesn't matter how you got to that number.
If you wish to recover any other costs (such as start-up costs for your lease), I'd guess your only avenue would be to sue the person at-fault. I think that would take more effort and money, than you could possibly hope to recover, though.
understand the desire to sue the other guy, one must look at the probability of collection...if he has a regular job that he intends to keep, you may have a chance at garnishment...
It is amazing how many people who commit these infractions never have a regular job, then maybe that is simply indicative of their personality type...the same guy who can't hold a job may not have car insurance and may not even have a regular place to live, which is really just one simple syndrome of itself, the unstable person...
Maybe the uninsured should spend 30 days in jail for being uninsured, but, sadly, I myself have said that jail space needs to be held for those who commit serious crimes, but, maybe some minimum security space could be found in the middle of the Mojave desert...the old Georgia chain gangs come back to my mind...where is Cool Hand Luke when I need him???
What we have here is a failure to communicate...:):):):):)
Amen to that...I say, send all 12 million back tomorrow...oh, they can't find them???...check any construction site or crop field...if 12 million of us told the IRS we weren't going to pay our taxes, they would round us up in less than a week, find jail cells and incarcerate us indefinitely...
Well, pretend that they are 12 million tax scofflaws, which they are, anyway (Fair Tax, anyone???) and send them back to the Hinterlands...then fine all the employers who hire them, because if they can't find work they will not stay...and, if they turn to a life of crime, send in the vigilantes...
Huh, and here I thought you were looking for Cool Hand Luke.
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
Hello! Some different Gap companies do offer $1000-2000 toward your next vehicle purchase if you go back to the same dealer in which you bought the vehicle from and if it was a Credit Union whom you purchased the GAP from they may offer it if you finance again with them. The best way to find out is to read your policy. The GAP that i offer my clients does not have the $1000 toward the next car but does pay the insurance company deductible up to $1000.00.
I am astounded at how much less my auto insurance would be w/ GEICO versus current insurer, Chubb. I have 5 drivers, 3 vehicles and 3 of the drivers are"youthful",ie: under 21. I have compared all the data,the only items I can't figure out are: 1) Reparation Benefit ($100K) on chubb versus Bodily Injury and Property Damage (500/500/100) on GICO Are these comparable items? 2) Agreed value_ Chubb lists values and GEICO says use Kelly Blue Book Any ideas?
I switched to Geico several months ago from Safeco. The change is saving me around $200/yr for the same coverage. Safeco had been saving me $600/yr from my old company State Farm.
I haven't had to deal with anyone at Geico except for the sales people, so I couldn't say how well their claims process is.
Geico does not offer GAP insurance, which Safeco did. My loan balance is below the KBB value of the car now so that's not a problem.
I have a leased vehicle (Lexus). A few years ago my wife got into a bad accident. The vehicle was taken in to be fixed and it took quite some time. The fixing of the vehicle was done in stages. At the last stage of fixing the vehicle it was determined that the vehicle was totaled but completely rebuilt and given back to us. Allstate made this determination/decision at the beginning. I have 12 months remaining on the lease. The car has a lot of problems with little things (windows not working, CD not playing). I know that this vehicle is a SALVAGE TITLE and I have to turn it back in. At the beginning, I negotiated a good lease and the residual value would have been very good. My question is will GAP Insurance protect me when I go to turn this vehicle in or am I'm screwed. I want to turn this vehicle in and walk away. I reside in California. Any input, I would be grateful! Thanks in advance.
GAP pays the bank off when the car is totaled. Since you still have your car, GAP doesn't come into play.
A Salvage title is only issued whent he car is totaled AND the bank is payed off. Since you are still in your lease, a salvage title cannot be issued. Sounds to me like the damage was enough to total the car, but for whatever reason, your ins co decided to repair it anyway. Sometimes, other damage is discovered during the repair process that increases the total repair cost. Even if Allstate wanted to total it, the would still have had to pay off the car( GAP amount not withstanding) AND pay the bodyshop for whatever work they performed. They probably decided it was cheaper just to fix the car.
Comments
First, someone upthread said something to the effect of "...since most of us would have difficulty coming up with $3-10K in one day..." Is that really how it would work in the case of insurance payout on a totaled car that's less than what's owed on the note? Meaning, I'm sure the insurance company pays out the settlement amount directly to the lienholder, but then does the lienholder demand immediate payment on the difference? I guess they do, but surely people just pay that out when they can't do otherwise, taking the hit to their credit, correct?
Asking the question because on my last new car purchase, which was zero down, I paid $6K below sticker but rolled in $5500 negative equity from my previous note, basically financing the sticker price. Obviously knowing I was immediately upside down on this quickly depreciating American car, I searched in vain for GAP coverage. I was unable to find any company to purchase GAP coverage through at the time. I financed the car through my credit union but they didn't offer it, my insurance company (State Farm) didn't offer it either, and I couldn't find any independent companies at the time willing to provide me with coverage. So I went without it, hoping for the best. Here I am almost 3 years later, still upside down some on the note, and was involved in a 3-car collision last week. It's looking like the car is going to be totaled out.
What this will do is put me in the unfortunate position of again having to finance something with zero down, and I definitely don't want to chance finding myself in the same position again! If anyone has ANY recommendations for reputable companies that will provide GAP insurance, any info would definitely be appreciated!
(As an aside, does anyone think I can/should get the negative equity on the wrecked car [probably +/- $2k] rolled into the new note, or should I just keep that separate and make payments on it until it's paid?)
My insurance agent added it for me when I was with Safeco. The cost was a lot less than GAP insurance through the dealer finance company.
Yes, the reason being is that in order for your insurance company to complete the claim and sell your totaled car for salvage they have to have the title. In order to get the title the loan has to be paid in full.
There are exceptions to every rule and you may be able to make payment arrangements with them. But then hope it does not create a problem when you go to finance you new car. Basically you would still have an open auto wanting to add another one and you would have to budget for that.
There is also the possibility of rolling the deficiency into your new loan, once again you would have to qualify for it.
You can still purchase GAP from a dealer at time of sale even if you are not financing with them. It really is no different then buying a warranty from them if you are not financing with them. They just include the cost in OTD price and list your CU as lien holder on the GAP Contract.
Yes, they will not let you continue to make payments, you must come up with the difference immediately, or 30 days, so they can sell the salvage title...
It is my experience that most folks would have serious difficulty cutting a check for say, $7-10 grand that quickly...considering that GAP, even if purchased thru the dealer who charges more, would still only be $10 monthly if $500 premium, which covers you for at least 3 of a 5 year loan and probably 5 of a 6-7 year loan...
If you put down at least 25% or finance under 3 years, GAP probably not necessary, since your loan balance and value of car probably amortize at the same rate, i.e. you probably owe what the car is worth if totaled, so your regular insurance would pay out enough to pay off your note...
Marsh, the dealer does not always charge more. We have Customers who are Agents for Farm Bureau and they buy our GAP because it cost less and because it is a Insurance Policy and not a Waiver Addendum. Ours also covers the deductible up to $1000 theres is $500, and ours covers 3 payments while the claim is being processed where with theres you have to continue to make payments on a car you are not driving while they process the claim.
So, though you are correct in that you can find a cheaper (not less expensive but cheaper) policy keep in mind it is cheaper for a reason.
wherever they get it, it will be cheaper than paying out the $7-10K if the car is totalled in the first year or two, when the depreciation is the max but the amortization on the loan is the min...:):):)
GAP was important to me, because I financed the whole value of the car. I used my trade to pay-off my other car loan (we have three cars), so rather then having two smaller loans, I have one bigger one. As a result, GAP seemed like a must have for me.
Keep in mind, banks have rules about how much you can borrow on a car in the first place. Some banks limit loans to 80% of MSRP while others (like USAA) will loan up to 120% of MSRP. USAA charges $170 for gap insurance (at least that is what I was quotted) but the amount may vary for the borrower depending on the situation.
US Banks gap insurance works the same way too.
Yes it is correct, I think you misunderstood the question the other posters asked.
The question was:
Is the Gap going to pay $25,000 PLUS the $8000????
The GAP does not pay $33K. It pays the difference after the insurance company settles, based on the coverage.
I have a question. Can you tell me what USAA stands for and if you can, can you please give me there phone number.? I have been looking high and low for a company to give me GAP and I am having a hard time trying to find one.
Thanks for your help
Nan
Thanks so much for getting back to me so fast. I really appreciated it. I guess that leaves me out, because I do not have anyone in the military. My father was along time ago and I guess that doesnt mean that will help me.
Have a great day
Nan
Did you try Safeco? I had GAP with them before I switched to another company.
Thanks so much for getting back to me so fast. I really appreciated it. I guess that leaves me out, because I do not have anyone in the military. My father was along time ago and I guess that doesnt mean that will help me.
Have a great day
Nan
There is a trick to get to USAA. You can open an accoutn with Pentagon Credit Union and it will automatically qualify you for USAA, if I understand it correctly.
I really need to get the GAP Insurance because I think that it is important so you are covered in case of anything.
Thanks for your quick reply
Nan
nkmonty1@bellsouth.net
If not I will do this just to get my Auto Insurance with them. They have great rates
PFCU title
So, I will try to respond differently. If a bank gives you a car loan for $33k and the car is destroyed, but it is only worth $25k and you have GAP, they will pay-off the entire loan.
I am so sorry to bother you but I need to find out if you have the phone number for Safeco? Do you have to have a policy with them or can you just have them for GAP?
Thanks for your help. I am really appreciative.
Nan
Oh I C. How are the rates? I might as well call them because my insurance company does not carry GAP. Do you have Safeco's phone number?
Thanks again for your time
Nan
Safeco is a national insurance company, easily found by doing a Google search. Try their website for an office near you at www.safeco.com.
As far as their rates, they were less expensive for me than when I had State Farm but not quite as low as Geico. However, Geico doesn't offer GAP but now I don't need that coverage.
I have GEICO and even though they are cheap they do not offer the GAP insurance for a vehicle that was preowned. So as much as I like them I do have to find a company that has GAP.
Right now I dont need GAP, but you never know what every day will be.
Thanks for your information.
Nan
Safeco saved me over $600/yr from what I was paying with State Farm. Geico now saves me even more than Safeco. With my huge discount off the MSRP and trade-in, I'm easily below the point in my loan where GAP could be of any use.
4 Month old car just totaled. I'm not at fault but the "other guy" had no insurance/license etc.
I have GAP provided by BMWFS and I also pay for it to my insurance company. I will hear from the Total Loss department Monday I suppose.
The lease payoff amount as of today is $44,000
The actual cash value is probably $41,000
My concern is this: The $44,000 lease payoff amount includes nearly $2,000 in origination and MACO fees which I rolled into the lease instead of paying up front. The "car portion" of the payoff is only $42,000.
When settling, will GAP pay up to and only the $42,000 that is "car" and I will then have to come out of pocket to pay the remaining $2,000 of the payoff amount which is not "car"?
Also when settling should I be happy if they just pay off the lease payoff, or should I ask them to make me whole by giving me an additional amount to cover new drive-offs as well as the $700 more the lease will cost me given the money factor has gone up from the lease deal I wrote? Will insurance companies negotiate this with me and pay me if I ask/demand/threaten? Will they subrogate that amount on my behalf in the claim, or do I go after the guy who hit me for it in small claims?
Thanks
Plus, you didn't really pay MACO fees.. Your dealer might have itemized it that way, but MACO fees are paid by the dealer, on their invoice.. The only real fees, are those that are paid to someone else by the dealer on your behalf. This would include the acquisition fee (remitted to the lender), and any governmental fee required by your state or locality. Even a document fee is just a way for the dealer to add to your price (or to make your selling price seem lower).
Not that any of that last paragraph matters, in answering your question. No matter what goes into the CAP cost of the lease, the GAP insurance makes the lender/leasing company whole, so you don't have to. It doesn't matter how you got to that number.
If you wish to recover any other costs (such as start-up costs for your lease), I'd guess your only avenue would be to sue the person at-fault. I think that would take more effort and money, than you could possibly hope to recover, though.
regards,
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I'll just fight to keep my security deposit out of the settlement as well.
Besides security and 1st month payment; I only paid $411.00 at "inception".
Most of it CA registration I'm not getting half the value of.
I agree: to go after the guy is probably not practical... assuming he's still in the country.
It is amazing how many people who commit these infractions never have a regular job, then maybe that is simply indicative of their personality type...the same guy who can't hold a job may not have car insurance and may not even have a regular place to live, which is really just one simple syndrome of itself, the unstable person...
Maybe the uninsured should spend 30 days in jail for being uninsured, but, sadly, I myself have said that jail space needs to be held for those who commit serious crimes, but, maybe some minimum security space could be found in the middle of the Mojave desert...the old Georgia chain gangs come back to my mind...where is Cool Hand Luke when I need him???
What we have here is a failure to communicate...:):):):):)
Well, pretend that they are 12 million tax scofflaws, which they are, anyway (Fair Tax, anyone???) and send them back to the Hinterlands...then fine all the employers who hire them, because if they can't find work they will not stay...and, if they turn to a life of crime, send in the vigilantes...
Strong message to follow...
Please, let's not go there.
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Can you smell hard boiled eggs???...maybe I am just dreaming...
Some different Gap companies do offer $1000-2000 toward your next vehicle purchase if you go back to the same dealer in which you bought the vehicle from and if it was a Credit Union whom you purchased the GAP from they may offer it if you finance again with them. The best way to find out is to read your policy. The GAP that i offer my clients does not have the $1000 toward the next car but does pay the insurance company deductible up to $1000.00.
Anyone out there have an opinion on GEICO?
I am astounded at how much less my auto insurance would be w/ GEICO versus current insurer, Chubb. I have 5 drivers, 3 vehicles and 3 of the drivers are"youthful",ie: under 21. I have compared all the data,the only items I can't figure out are:
1) Reparation Benefit ($100K) on chubb versus Bodily Injury and Property Damage
(500/500/100) on GICO Are these comparable items?
2) Agreed value_ Chubb lists values and GEICO says use Kelly Blue Book
Any ideas?
I switched to Geico several months ago from Safeco. The change is saving me around $200/yr for the same coverage. Safeco had been saving me $600/yr from my old company State Farm.
I haven't had to deal with anyone at Geico except for the sales people, so I couldn't say how well their claims process is.
Geico does not offer GAP insurance, which Safeco did. My loan balance is below the KBB value of the car now so that's not a problem.
I have a leased vehicle (Lexus). A few years ago my wife got into a bad accident. The vehicle was taken in to be fixed and it took quite some time. The fixing of the vehicle was done in stages. At the last stage of fixing the vehicle it was determined that the vehicle was totaled but completely rebuilt and given back to us. Allstate made this determination/decision at the beginning. I have 12 months remaining on the lease. The car has a lot of problems with little things (windows not working, CD not playing). I know that this vehicle is a SALVAGE TITLE and I have to turn it back in. At the beginning, I negotiated a good lease and the residual value would have been very good. My question is will GAP Insurance protect me when I go to turn this vehicle in or am I'm screwed. I want to turn this vehicle in and walk away. I reside in California. Any input, I would be grateful! Thanks in advance.
Since you still have your car, GAP doesn't come into play.
A Salvage title is only issued whent he car is totaled AND the bank is payed off.
Since you are still in your lease, a salvage title cannot be issued.
Sounds to me like the damage was enough to total the car, but for whatever reason, your ins co decided to repair it anyway.
Sometimes, other damage is discovered during the repair process that increases the total repair cost.
Even if Allstate wanted to total it, the would still have had to pay off the car( GAP amount not withstanding) AND pay the bodyshop for whatever work they performed.
They probably decided it was cheaper just to fix the car.