Lease Questions - Ask Here

ferris9 · May 2001

Car Man I am loking to purchase a Land Rover Discovery SE in California. MSRP is $37,995 and the salesman will sell the car for $35,375. I usually drive 13-15,000 miles a year. Do you have any information on 2 and 3 year residual values and money factors used by Land Rover? What would constitute a "good" lease on this vehicle? What type of money would I have to cough up to begin the lease? Also, LAnd Rover is offering 4.9% financing for 36 months. The only reason I would be hesitant to purchase is that I am a first time LR buyer and am slightly concerned with reliability and high cost of repairs after the warranty expires. Any thoughts on all of this? I appreciate your assistance.

dmitrip · May 2001

I am looking at a 2001 BMW 740i. I have two offers: one for a 36 month/15K lease with sales price of about 61K (about 3500 off MSRP) and residual of 57%; the other one for a 48 month/15 lease with sales price of about 55K, but residual of 40%. The lease factor is slightly lower on the 48 month, but not significantly. Also, the payment is slightly ($32/month) lower on a 48 month. I really don't want to keep the car for 4 years. I'm afraid to own it while it's out of warranty and free maintenance. The sales person with a 48 month lease is telling me that because the residual is so low, I'll be able to get out of this lease at 36 months and actually make 3-5K in the process.
Any thoughts on which deal I should go with?

jwilson1 · May 2001

This should probably go into 'Success Stories' or something, but since Car_Man was actually the mentor for my lease, I thought I should at least come here to say thanks. You've done one of the things I like best in a person, save me money ... lots of money.

Several months ago, about Feb. I asked for rates on the '01 Acura 3.5 RL. Of course Car_Man supplied them but also thought they might come down, given the declining interest rates. They did. At the same time I heard Honda was making some hp and suspension changes in the '02, due in early April, so I thought it might be worth waiting. It came out, I drove it, loved the changes, wanted it, got a price and a lease figure from the dealer, and came back here. Again, you gave rates and suggested waiting might be good as Saint Greenspan was again at work. Surprise, surprise, not only did AG lower rates, but Honda gave major support for its new model.

Several of us checked in here to ask what you thought of the program, and you pointed out something I simply hadn't thought of ... that Honda wasn't going to cut their dealers to the bone and that there might well be more room in the program than it seemed. Meanwhile, their rarest color came in -- inventory is in surprisingly short supply -- and I wanted to drive it.

Long story short, without me pushing too hard (it was after all obvious to everyone by this time that I really wanted the car) the dealer was willing to settle on a cap cost that was $900 lower than the advertised special. The net result is that I'm paying (tax included) $544 rather than the original monthly of $706 for 39 mos.

Thanks, Car_Man! If you happen to get marooned in NE at any point, I'd be more than happy to treat to a combination of fresh lobster and old wine. Let me know.

Take care.
Joe W.

mruck3 · May 2001

carman-
What would be a fair lease deal for a 2001 VW jetta wolfsburg with power sunroof, monsoon stereo, head side airbags, and NE emission? 12k/year, 36 months.

Invoice is about 19040, MSRP - 20940 (plus the 550 dest charge).
I am being quoted rates of 0.00299 and 0.00315.
Residual value about 59%

I have received 2 quotes so far: 323/month - 1422 at signing and 344 a month is 1220 at signing.
thanks.

tgif888 · May 2001

Congratulation on your new car.

With Car_Man info. I was able to buy an I30t below invoice.

Great job Car_Man.

sergeym · May 2001

The left front fender, the bumper cover and the hood of my 2 month old Acura TL-S have been damaged by some jerk trying to steal car's headlights. The repair cost is about $1,500. My dealer referred me to a body shop that seems to be decent and tells me that the car will be like new. What bothers me is that me, the body shop and my insurance company are the only parties involved. According to insurance company and the body shop the entire front end needs to be re-painted. The left fender has been damaged badly but there is only a very small area on the hood that is damaged and can be easily touched up. I know that any car with a paint job loses it's value. I called AHFC and told them what happened but they are not interested to be involved because damage is not as serious. Do I need to worry about DV. Should I insist on AHFC to approve the repair now? What about the rust warranty? Is it gone because the car has a paint job? This is my first lease and any help from your guys is very appreciated.

CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Tom, that is good news. I did not realize that BMW FS has a grace period associated with their lease program. Many banks do not. I still would not be surprised if their program on the 3-Series was enhanced when the current one ends. Only time will tell I guess.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Hi Ferris. Although I think that they have gotten somewhat better over the years, Land Rovers are notorious for needing frequent repair. Furthermore, fixing them is relatively expensive. If you aren't quite sure that you want to purchase one at this point, you can always lease the Discovery that you are interested in and if you like it, purchase it at lease-end. Much like their special financing program, Land Rover is offering supported lease money factors on the 2001 Discovery so it's not like you would be missing out on any special deal by leasing instead of financing. The 2 and 3 year lease money factor for a 2001 Discovery SE leased through Land Rover's official lease program should both be .00209 through July 2nd. This is equivalent to an interest rate of slightly over 5%, which isn't bad. The 2 and 3 year 15,000 miles per residual values for this model should be 57% and 50% respectively. According to my calculations, using the aforementioned lease program and the prices that you were quoted on this truck (which seem reasonable to me), if you were to lease one right now for 3 years with 15,000 miles per your should have an approximate zero-down pre-tax monthly lease payment of $569.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Dmitrip, I think that your instincts on these leases are correct. Even though the 48 month lease will provide you with a slightly lower lease payment, I definitely think that it is in your best interest to go with the 36 month term instead. By doing so, you will be completely covered by your vehicle's warranty for your entire lease and will not be left open to the possibility of having to make expensive repairs to your car on your own during the fourth year. Plus, as I am sure you are well aware, this is a relatively expensive car to lease. I usually feel as though locking yourself into such an expensive lease payment for a very long term like four years is a little risky because one never knows how their financial situation will change several years down the road. Northern California is loaded with low mileage expensive cars right now that were repossessed from dot com executives who couldn't keep up with their lease payments when their financial situations changed.

One more thing, I definitely think that you should do some comparison shopping at several different dealerships for your 740i. Rumor has it that there is a significant amount of Dealer Cash on this car. As a result, I think that you may be able to negotiate a lower price on one without too much difficulty.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

That's great Joe! Thanks for the kind words. It's always nice to have someone come back and let us know how everything turned out. Thanks for taking the time so share your success story. I am glad to see that everything has worked out so well for you. Enjoy your new car!

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Hi mruck3. The lease money factors that you are being quoted on this car are right on the money. VW Credit is offering .00299 for up to 39 month terms and .00315 for 48 month terms right now. However, I think that the residual value for a 3 year 12,000 miles per lease on this car is actually 60%. Typically Jettas, even the Wolfsburg, are selling for a couple of hundred dollars over invoice right now. Using this information, let's run a sample lease for you. If you were to lease a 2001 VW Jetta Wolfsburg with an MSRP of $21,490 ($20,940 + $550 destination) and a capitalized cost of $19,340 (dealer invoice of $19,040 + $300 - $0 down payment) for 36 months and with 12,000 miles per year your zero down, pre-tax monthly lease payment should be around $276. I don't know if the destination charge was included in the invoice price that you posted, if it was not then your payment should be more like $293 per month. Of course, your the availability of this car in your area will have an impact upon the price that you are able to negotiate on it, but I still think that it would be in your best interest to shop around at a few more dealers to see if you can get this car for a little less than what you have been quoted already. You shouldn't have any problem finding a number of VW dealerships in New Jersey.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

SergeyM, as long as they do a good job repairing your car you really don't have to worry about it having diminished value. That is one of the great things about leasing, the bank that you are leasing through has to assume all of the depreciation that occurs if your vehicle is in an accident. I really don't think that you have to worry about your car rusting either. How long are you leasing it for? Most new vehicles will not develop rust over a typical 3 year lease term even if they were in a serious accident.

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mruck3 · May 2001

Car_Man-
Thanks for your advice
-mruck3

landinggear · May 2001

What would a good rate be for a 2001 MB E320 with no up front payment? (Is this even possible?) I'm in New York City.

malik71829 · May 2001

car_man, I've been approved for a loan so I could buy out my 2001.5 passat lease. right now I'm paying 442.00/om for 48 mos. without putting anything down. that's high, I know. I didn't really do too much pricing homework because I just really wanted that car (since 98). anyway, I can borrow 25500 @ 7.29% and pay it off in 60 mo's at 508/mo. the way i figured it, i'm leasing the car for 4 yrs, but i can pay on it for 1 more year and have about 13000 show for it after the 60 mo's. here are my calculations:

PROPOSED FINANCE: 508.00x60=30480.00 with 13000.00 to show for
CURRENT LEASE: 442.00x48=21216.00 with nothing to show for, but saved 9264.00

in other words, i would spending an extra 9264.00 to get possibly 13000 for my car when i trade it in in 5 yrs. saving 3736.00 is a lot of money, but that's assuming i keep it for 5 yrs. i know me, i'll trade it in for something else in about 3 yrs. then it's like i'm paying this extra money for nothing.

i leased a honda civic for about 2.5 yrs and traded that in to get the passat with no problems.(not upside down, i actually made 1000.00) i don't forsee trading in the leased passat in about 2.5 yrs as well.

to lease, or not to lease. that is the question..........

CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Landinggear, you should be able to lease most vehicles without putting any money down. I believe that Mercedes-Benz Credit Corporation will allow leases without any down payment. Their lease money factor will vary depending upon the length of lease that you are interested in and your credit rating. The last that I heard, MBCC had a 3 year money factor of .00354 for their highest credit tier.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Malik71829, this is a tough question. I really think that this is really a matter of personal preference more than anything. At first glance, the terms of your lease really do not look very favorable to me. It is difficult for me to say what sort of interest rate you are paying on your Passat lease at this point, but I think that it is extremely likely that it is higher than the rate that you have been approved at to buy this car. If I was in your situation, I think that I would be leaning towards buying out the Passat and financing it at the 7.29% rate.

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akangl · May 2001

Carman.......could you tell me what the money factor and residual value is on a 2001 Ford Excursion for 24 months and 36 months? The truck we are looking at is a 2001 Ford Excursion Limited 4WD 7.3L diesel. Thanks.

michaellno · May 2001

I'm back. I was looking for information regarding Expedition leases a couple of months ago. Now, we seem to be in the market for a new '02 Explorer, Eddie Bauer edition. What are the lease rates and residual %'s for 36 and 48 month leases? Also, we're currently leasing through Ford, so is there any loyalty cash available?

Thanks in advance for your help.

malik71829 · May 2001

thank you car_man. i really value your opinoin. i'm currently financing the leaese at 9.6%. i think that i will go for the buyout. i figured that the more i pay a month, the less likely i'll be upside down on it. thanks again.

shaker58 · May 2001

saw ad on audi a6 2.7 seems like a great deal 499 1000 down and 1st payment plus taxes 39mth 10miles per yr

fuzzo · May 2001

Can someone tell me where I can get information about leasing terminology such has money factor etc. I am new to this and don't have much of an idea of how it works.

Thanks in advance

fuzzo · May 2001

The other question I had was:
Are there lease periods for 1 year etc? I have always seen 36 months and above

Thanks

sergeym · May 2001

Thanks Car_Man,

The lease is for 39 month. How can I tell if the shop did a good job. Should it look like the accident never happened? What should I look for when I get my car back? Should I insist on lessor (Honda Finance) to approve the repair?

bblaha · May 2001

http://www.edmunds.com/advice/leasing/articles/43093/article.html

jhankin · May 2001

Hi CarMan,

I'm looking either the Grand Cherokee 2WD Laredo or the Maxima GXE and SE. Could you tell me the money factor and residual values for the three, at 36 months/15K miles?

Could you also let me know if there are any special lease programs in New York metro area on either (even if they are only for different trims, like 4WD, Limited, GLE, 20th Anniversary Ed.), or if you anticipate any anytime soon, and when they will end?

Thanks,

John

s852 · May 2001

I found that web site based on a link here on the Edmunds site.
Some of the leases look interesting, (There was quote for a 2001 Accord EXV6 in CA for about $490 per month plus tax for 24 months and 15K miles per year if you had negotioated a selling price of $23200 (Carsdirect.com price in my area)) but I do not like several things about the leasecompare.com website.
The site is not very detailed in how the service works and they hide the names of the lease companies.
I guess you go to a dealer, negotiate a price, purchase the car through the dealer's temporary "either/or" contract and refinance it as a lease through leasecompare.com's referred lessor when they Fedex you the contract forms the next day. That is a guess since it doesn't explicitly say exactly how it works.
If there is a security deposit required in the lease payments quoted it just says "YES" instead of saying what the amount of the deposit would be.
It does not indicate whether or not gap insurance is included in the quotes or if that is extra cost.
They require a $49 processing fee to apply for credit and the credit card submission form is not SSL encrypted.
Has anyone tried the service?

dvaughan · May 2001

Can you tell me what the residual values would be for both the 2001 Acura 3.5RL and the Toyota Avalon XLS? (also 2000, if possible). I really would like to know. I used to be able to make a couple phone calls to get residual values. Now it seems they want to either sell you software or want to "link" you to a site that asks for everything under the sun before they will give you the time of day. Help!

curtnheidi · May 2001

Hi Car man,

I saw some pretty aggressive ads for the A6 this weekend. Here are the particulars:

A6 2.8 (Quattro,leather,Htd. seats,sunroof,bose)
$39,300 MSRP (don't know the sale price)
39 months/12K miles a year
$0 down
$459 month + tax and title

In contrast, this is only $29 more a month than the advertised A4 lease specials with the same lease terms. The A4's MSRP is $9285 less. How can this be?

Does Audi have a new program for the A6?

thanks,

Curt

fuzzo · May 2001

Hi,
I am interested in getting a 2002 Merc. benz C240. Could you tell me the money factor and residual values at 24 months/15K miles and 36 months/15K miles?

Thanks in advance

curtnheidi · May 2001

Greetings,

I just spoke with the Audi dealer and the A6 lease special also has 2 more attractive compenents:

>No Acquisition fee (normally $450)
>No Security Deposit (normally $495)

It sounds like these deals are only good till end of the week. The dealer also said the 2.7t is only $22 more per month and has more equipment.

Do you know what the MF and residual might be on these?

Best Regards,

Curt

CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Akangl, although Ford Motor Credit's lease program may vary slightly depending upon the part of the country that you are in, in most areas the 24 and 36 month lease rates for the 2001 Excursion are 4.0% and 8.0% respectively. The corresponding residual values for a 2001 Excursion Limited 4WD 7.3L diesel leased with 15,000 miles per year should be 53% and 46% respectively.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Welcome back, Michaell. Ford only provides support on 2 and 3 year leases, so if you decide to lease any of their products for 48 months you would have to use their standard lease rate, which usually is not very good. The last that I heard Ford Motor Credit's standard lease rate was around 10.4%, Ouch! The three year lease rate for a 2002 Explorer right now is a more reasonable 7.0%. This is enhanced to a great rate of 2.25% in certain areas, but I do not believe that the part of the country that you live in is one of them. Ford Motor Credit's 15,000 miles per year residual values for the 2002 Explorer Eddie Bauer with 4WD for 3 and 4 years are currently only 47% and 40% respectively. Ford definitely has loyalty cash available on the 2002 Explorer, ask your dealer for the exact details of the program but I believe that it provides loyal customers with something in the area of a $1,000 incentive.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Hi Fuzzo. The link that bblaha posted directs you to a great article on the topic of leasing. You should be able to answer many of your questions by reading it. I have posted links to that article and another one on leasing under the "Additional Resources" heading on the side of this screen. You may want to check them out. If you have any questions that you can not find answers to there, please feel free to ask me. I am always glad to help out.

In answer to the questions that you have asked already, a vehicle's lease money factor is essentially the interest rate that you are paying on it. The money factor always appears in the form of a five digit decimal, such as .00320. In order to convert a lease money factor into an approximate interest rate, multiply it by 2400. For example, the aforementioned lease money factor would be equivalent to an interest rate of about 7.68%.

In answer to your second question, yes most banks do allow consumers to lease vehicles for terms as short as 12 months. The problem with such short lease terms though is that they have very high monthly payments associated with them. The reason for this is that the largest chunk of a vehicle's depreciation occurs during the first month of ownership. By leasing a car for 3 years you are able to spread out the high rate of depreciation that it experiences in the beginning over a larger number of payments. However, if you only lease the car for 12 months you are spreading out the vehicle's depreciation over a much smaller number of payments and as a result they will be significantly higher.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

If you can't tell that your car has been in an accident without looking at it very closely, I don't think that you have anything to worry about. I personally don't think that you even have to mention the fact that your vehicle was in an accident to Honda Finance if they don't ask, but if you feel more comfortable doing so then you should. Honda Finance will not charge consumers for dings that are less than 1 1/2" in diameter as long as there are fewer than 4 dings on any one panel. If there are more than 4 panels on your vehicle with dings on them you may be charged for some excess wear and tear. They generally allow consumers to have up to two scratches per panel on their returned car, as long as they are no longer than 3". I have all of their other lease-end wear and tear guidelines if you would like, but I figured that these are the only ones that apply in your situation.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

John, here is the information that you are looking for. You are fortunate that you live in the New York area. That means that it is likely that you are eligible for Chrysler Financial's special regional lease program that they have on the 2001 Jeep Grand Cherokee. If you choose to lease a 2001 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo 2WD for 3 years with 15,000 miles per the special regional money factor should be .00275 and the residual value should be only 41%.

All 2001 Nissan Maximas lease through Nissan Motor Acceptance Corp. are eligible for a three year supported lease money factor of .00220. The corresponding 15,000 miles per year residual values for this car should be 49% for the GXE and 51% for the SE.

Remember that both the Grand Cherokee and the Maxima have lease cash available on them that will have an effect on the deal that you are able to negotiate.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Dvaughan, I would be happy to let you know what the residuals should be like for the cars that you are interested in, but it would be a big help if you could let me know the length of the lease that you are interested in and the number of miles per year that you want to be able to drive without penalty. These will have a significant effect upon these car's resids. Thanks.

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dysfunct9 · May 2001

Hi there! I am in the market for a new or late-model car and need the cheapest monthly payment possible on a 36 or 39 month lease. It has to be with $0 money down. The only requirements I need in the car are the following:

1. CD Player
2. Air Conditioning
3. Bumper to Bumper Warranty for at least 36 months of the lease.
4. Manual Transmission (negotiable)

Anyone have a suggestion? Know of any good lease deals on cheap cars? Hyundai? Honda? Kia? Anything!!!!!!

born2run · May 2001

Car Man

My 1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee Ltd lease is at end in one month, 30,000 miles. I might be interested in keeping the Jeep if I can negotiate the residual/purchase amount off of the $21,000 per my contract. I called Chrysler Financial to see if they were negotiatable & the guy said that they've been instructed to not negotiate the residual, that this would be "in violation of the lease contract". What gives?

jhankin · May 2001

Appreciate the info, CarMan. I checked the incentives/cash section, for the Grand Cherokee, it had 0.9% APR listed for 36 months under "2001 APR". Is the APR for purchasing or leasing?

For the Maxima, I looked under NY, NJ, and CT and could not find any incentives - could you let me know the amount of lease cash, and the trims it is available for?

Thanks again,

John

malik71829 · May 2001

hey car_man, i'm trying to buy out my lease but my new financer (is that a word?) said that in the state of texas, i have to pay the t.t.l. all over again. is this true? he said that if it was a "balloon payment type of lease," that i wouldn't have to. basically i have to pay it since i don't own the title. am i getting screwed?

why do i live in texas, car_man?? the only good thing about living here is that you can carry a concealed weapon, but i don't. i might when i go back to the dealership. haha.

fuzzo · May 2001

How easy is it to break out of a 24-36 month lease in after 12 months? What are the usual consequences?

CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Curt, I have seen the advertised 2001 A6 2.8T quattro Sedan lease that you are referring to. The version of the ad that I have seen does provide a monthly payment of $459 for 39 months, but with a $2,500 down payment and only 10,000 miles per year. In contrast, the only A4 advertised lease payment that I have seen this month offers a 2001 A4 1.8T quattro Sedan for $319 per month over 39 months with $2,500 down and 10,000 miles per year. Where did you see the ads that you are referring to?

In reference to your second post, yes around mid-month Audi introduced a new lease program that waives the security deposit and acquisition fees on all A6 models through the end of the month. The A6 2.7T is my favorite A6 variant and in my opinion is definitely the way to go with this car. If you decide to lease one for 36 months through Audi's captive finance company prior to the end of May, the lease money factor should be .00220 and the 12,000 miles per year residual value should be 56%.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Fuzzo, if you choose to lease a 2001 Mercedes-Benz C240 through Mercedes-Benz Credit Corp. right now the 2 and 3 year lease money factors should be .00384 and .00354 respectively. The corresponding 15,000 miles per year residual values for this car should be 75% and 67% respectively.

I definitely do not think that it is a good idea to enter into a 2 or 3 year lease on a vehicle if you only plan on keeping it for only twelve months. When you agree to lease a car or truck, you sign a legally binding contract to pay the bank that you are going through a specific amount of money over a certain period of time. They are going to want all of the money that you are obligated to pay them, unless you buy out your vehicle completely. This can be done after which you can trade it in or try to sell it on your own, however many lessees find that they are upside down on their vehicles when they try to break their contract. If they are upside down, it means that they owe more money for their vehicles than they are worth at that particular point. As a result they would stand to lose a decent chunk of change by trying to get out of their lease.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Born2run, some banks will negotiate lease-end purchase prices and others won't. If you really want to buy your Jeep at the end of its term, you may want to try them again or even ask to speak with someone above the individual who denies your initial request. It would not completely surprise me if Chrysler Financial decided to tighten up its policy on negotiating lease-end prices though. They have taken tremendous losses from overestimating vehicles' residual values over the past several years. A couple of quarters ago DaimlerChrysler had to take a tremendous charge against its earnings to cover their residual exposure. They may be trying to stop the bleeding.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

John, the special financing that you saw listed for the Jeep Grand Cherokee here at Edmunds is only for retail transactions and may not be used on leased vehicles.

Nissan currently has $500 Dealer Cash available on all 2001 Maxima trim levels. If I am not mistaken, I believe that this cash may be used in conjunction with their lease program.

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CarMan@Edmunds · May 2001

Malik71829, Texas has some strange tax laws. It would not surprise me at all if you did have to pay tax on your vehicle again when buying it out.

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curtnheidi · May 2001

Greetings,

I went to the audi dealer last night, and the salesman was very helpful. He actually gave me a printout of the invoice, capcost, MF, and residual. I will report this with the figures he gave me.

MSRP: 39300
CAP. Cost: 36604
Invoice: 35212

Residual: 57% or 22401
MF: .00140 (lower than the national ad!)
Term: 39 months
Mileage allowed: 12K a year or 39K

Base payment: 452.77
Payment + 5% Tax: 475.41
Due at Start: 475.41
38 payments remaining

I got this in writing. I guess it is quite different than the national ad I have also seen on other message boards.
The only downside was that I was quite disappointed by the A6 2.8 testdrive. After putting it through its paces, it seemed like a dog. Sure it was nice, but the A4 is actually my preference. The A4 1.8t doesn't have the power seats or dual climate control, but it is such a different driving experience. More fun, feels faster (more torque?), and it has the tiptronic controls on the steering wheel (why not the A6?!!!). It's lease is 430 base pmt.

2.8 with xenons premium package: 480.47 base pmt.
2.7t well loaded: 515.23 base pmt.

Regards,
Curt

kirby2010 · May 2001

I am launching a campaign to encourage everyone to carefully choose their leasing company. I have had a lot of problems with GE Capital. Since obtaining my car I have found out that my dealership, and many others, have dropped them due to poor service. In the latest instance my payment was incorrectly entered with the decimal point off by one place - $26.90 instead of the correct $269.00. As in the past I am now receiving regular, harassing phones calls from GE Capital as they ask for my help in straightening it out. Yesterday I was asked for a complete year of cancelled checks! Best advice I can offer - stay away from GE Capital.

shaker58 · May 2001

515 seems very low national ad is 499 1000down nicely loaded not fully I got a price of 620 with txes in at 8.5% sticler at 48000

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