Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
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personally, i enjoy your posts, and i think i made it perfectly clear that i thought of you to be the most knowledgable here.
you made a claim about Royal Purple to be bogus (just a descrption now), and i posted a reply asking you to provide some facts. what's the harm in that. i do not use RP, but have friends that do. if there is something that i can pass on to them from what i read in here, then it has to be more than my saying, " RP is bogus and don't use it, cause brorjace says so", now can i?
i really appreciate your last post and thanks for the follow up.
Still, i bet with synthetic and a good filter, it's reasonable to double the interval on almost any newer car.
dave
Seelig, that post #2344 did have kindof a zing to it..
Everybody on here either has their own or someone elses experience that we are all relating in these posts, we should all keep in mind that these manufactures very rarely actually tell us anything factual, they just try to sell the product using flashy colors and fancy advertisements.
All these posts should give us some different views and make us think about things we may not have thought of before,,,,and then we make our own mind up and do what we want anyway,,,with a little new reason maybe.
I know from my own experience that as the years have gone by these products have sometimes tried to live off of past traditional performance and sometimes they have nothing in common with what actually made them famous,,it is good to re-evaluate every now and then. Some of these products are not easily available to all of us and the difference in quality may be marginal for that amount of trouble...
now let's continue dinner, who's next
As far as oil color, anybody who uses castrol GTX ever notice some bottles are a lot darker than others (talking about same wt oil...) and they all get black after a while anyway right?
seelig, when I read your post it appeared to me to be sarcastic. If I am mistaken, then I'm sorry.
Dave, I agree with you about the cost benefit analysis favoring merely dumping in conventional oil at a $1.25 per quart as opposed to fixing the seals ... but it's an annoyance and I know some that would rather have something 'fixed' if they could. Saturn will be looking at my friend's car soon. It'll be interesting to see what they say and how they treat him. Oh, and I'll check out that URL, thanks.
Oh, and while you were using Mobil 1, you were probably saving $15+ on fuel each year so that helped offset a least a little bit its higher cost. >;^)
armtdm, I'm not surprised Amsoil and most other synthetic producers oils will be able to pass the newer SL standard. I thought I stumbled across the SL standard and how it differed from SJ. From what little I remember, the testing got tougher but there were no specific requirements like reducing certain additives which happened when they went to SJ. If someone has a URL with the direct comparison, feel free to post it here.
As for Europeans and cars, where do I begin? I remember reading in Road & Track years ago that Europeans don't get nearly the life out of an engine that Americans do. The article suggested that few of their typical engines make it past 100,000 miles without rebuilding and they blamed this on the fact that Europeans wind up their little 4 cylinders to the top of the RPM band to get any speed out of their cars while Americans gently cruised in their torque-filled V-8s. "Don't lug that engine, boy!" I guess is a common statement from driving instructors 'across-the-pond'. At least it used to be.
But maybe it has something to do with the oil as well? North America and Europe have different standards for motor oils and I know very little about them but a friend of mine who operated a local speed-shop-supply store used to brag about the European oils like Agip forming much less ash under extreme conditions. That was about 10 years ago.
Personally, I think politics has a lot to do with what the European motoring public has been told. They have to import nearly 100% of their oil and so the government wants the populace to make the most of it and has a harder time disposing of the waste because of the dense populations. So, long drain intervals are encouraged ... even if their engine durability suffers as a result.
I know that if I had a really expensive car like a Porsche I'd go no longer than 5,000 miles before oil & filter changes ... and that would be using synthetic, of course. >;^)
Anyone know for a fact that these European cars have higher-than-typical oil capacities? Can someone cite an example or two?
--- Bror Jace
"Thank you for your concern as to the variation of color in your Castrol GTX 5W-30 motor oil.
High quality API SH/SJ motor oils can vary significantly in color. Castrol GTX grades can vary from light yellow to golden amber to dark brown. Such color differences can be observed both within a given grade as well as among different grades. This is a result of the specific additive and base oils utilized in the formulation. Castrol products are formulated with a number of specialized additives, each designed to perform a specific function.
In order to meet customer demand for Castrol motor oil products throughout the country, a number of different additive sources are utilized. Each additive is carefully chosen and rigidly controlled to assure that the maximum level of performance and protection demanded by our customers is maintained. However, depending upon the source, the final color of the product can be different.
Color variation is no cause for performance concern. It is important to recognize that, regardless of the produced color, each given formulation is designed to provide the same high level of engine performance and maximum protection. In every grade, Castrol GTX and Heavy Duty are at the forefront of lubrication technology, providing maximum protection for your engine.
I hope that this has answered your concerns, and if I can be of any further assistance please let me know. We value your patronage.
Sincerely, Carolyn Weir, Consumer Relations Coordinator"
I accept the above explanation as regards the oil's adherance to specifications but suspect they are purchasing their additive packages in fairly small quantities on a competitive bid basis. Among the few brands that I routinely see, Castrol's color variation is by far the greatest.
thx
Good morning y'all
Rando
lay a clean paper towel down on a flat place and press the side of the dipstick on it, you'll see the oil on the towel easy enough.
I try not to infer too much from oil color variations, especially when shelling out the big bucks for Redline Synthetic Oil, which varies considerably from product to product and weight to weight. I haven't used Redline long enough to see numerous batches of the exact same product.
Now, what about the color variations in windshield wiper fluid? Do the gallons with the deeper blue protect against freezing better than the lighter (more watered down?) ones? >;^)
--- Bror Jace
How about the Porsche 911? The oil capacity is about 12 quarts. I would consider that unusually high and a reason for prescribing very long intervals between oil changes.
I didn't notice any smell, actually any oil that does have a strong smell has some component that is obviously volatile, the fact that it has a strong odor means that it evaporates pretty easily, that's why you smell it. That oil in a hot engine would vaporize more of that component quicker in a hot engine and after the service life that component would be at a reduced level than at the beginning...maybe not a huge detail, but that's why we are here huh? Heavy duty (heavy weight) gear lubricants usually are heavy on that smell too, they usually don't exist in the extremely high heat areas so the problem is not as much an issue ..
Remember how pcv valves used to get gunked up routinely? They do a lot better now because oils don't vaporize as bad as they used too.
BrorJace, the windshield solvent uses methanol which is clear, I think they just use the blue so you can see the level in the tank, but I bet if one brand is blue'er than the one next to it the darker one sells more!
Everybody up for some football?.....I have no idea what happened to Auburn either...they just choked I guess!
Rando
Rando, that's good reasoning ... anything you can smell at room temperature is volatile and will deteriorate quickly inside a crankcase. But what about the sulphur componds in gear oils? I just think they are stinky by nature. >;^)
I was just sort of kidding about the windshield anti-freeze. This far north I use the -34F yellow Prestone stuff. Let's hope the anti-freeze compounds in that stuff is methanol ... and not some other common yellow liquid that resist freezing. >;^)
--- Bror Jace
How do say that name of yours? This far north?
I'm in NC, not too hot in summer, not to cold in winter,,,how far north are you????
Sounds like using thin oil IS a legit question for you....he he
see ya
Rando
In keeping with the points that you and Bror Jace made, this implies lower volatility for the Mobil-1, providing a good-ole-boy indicator of the advantage of synthetic oil. Shall we call this the "huff-test" for comparison of motor oils?
In order to satisfy both viscosity and volatility requirements for SAE 5W-30, a new Group II+ base oil was used to formulate this product. Furthermore, due to the higher fuel economy hurdle required for GF-3, viscosity grades SAE 5W-30 and 10W-30 required the use of a friction modifier, an additional component, as part of their additive package.
As
Most notable are the improvements in fuel economy, oil consumption/emissions system protection, oxidation control and high temperature piston deposits.
Product Formulation
I'm going to start using oil analysis to see what's going on internally in a '98 Lexus LS400 and a '01 RX300. I've visited the Titan Lab and Blackstone vendor sites on the web...can you knowledgeable posters offer some additional analysis vendors for me to check? Are they all charging $25-30 per analysis?
In advance, thanks for your help.
IWITTORF, Do you live in a very cold area? The 5w30 possibly is too thin for any moderate temp area , you may want to move up a little in the viscosity world. Maybe at least 10w30..(technically only thicker at startup) The magnet on the drain plug could collect metal for quite a while which looks bad but is really just helping you out..These days the mfg'rs are really trying to get the mileage ratings up which means using thinner oils which give less resistance to flow, but they also don't protect metal as well ...
You are still under warranty so I would do as they say, but I personally use as thick an oil as I can , according to the book,.. as soon as warranty is up and a few miles on the engine..I start thickening up (probably just lost a few friends there..)
Check some of the other topics as far as that engine and you may read some other peoples experience with it..
And what is "friction modifier" anyway???
Rando, it's pronounced: "Brr + Ore Jay + ssss". Actually I think that's the way it's pronounced. It's the name of a fighter pilot from a novel. >;^)
Iwittorf, the fact that your engine has signs of sludge after only 22,000 miles is definitely not encouraging. You said it's a 5.3L ... but is that diesel or gas? I'm not familiar with that line of trucks. I'm reluctant to blame Mobil 1 ... especially since your drain interval is reasonable ... but if your motor takes diesel, all bets are off. Fuel fouling and other concerns become primary and the additive package in Mobil 1 might be marginal. I had heard that Mobil 1 was only for 'light duty' diesel engines so you might be better off with Chevron Delo 400, Shell Rotella and/or Mobil Delvac. All these oils are currently equivalent to a synthetic blend, anyways.
I believe a 'friction modifier' is any compound that alters the friction coefficient of any substance it is added to. While most lubricants try to be as slippery as possibly, some components like limited-slip rear ends and synchronized transmissions NEED some friction to work properly. Most of the ones I know about INCREASE friction ... but I suppose some compounds like ZDDP and others might decrease the friction coefficient. You'd think everyone would put these in their oils, don't you? Maybe they do ... to one extent or another.
Finally, as for the 'huff-test' I save that for Westley's Black Magic rubber and vinyl dressing. >;^)
--- Bror Jace
I noticed my truck manual said NOT to use the friction modifier for the locking diff, but other years models DO use it, I have a 99 ZR2
Bottgers, motor oil has detergents to suspend any carbon/sludge that is present in the oil path so if there is "stuff" in there it should be holding it and getting darker as time goes by. If this is your first oil change then the motor actually should run a little dirty and then clean up shortly after the rings seat and valve guides seal up, then after time you probably start building up crud in the pan bottom and then the oil starts getting darker quicker normally anyway.
Your honda probably is a cleaner engine than some others though anyway so your oil may stay clean longer due to that.My chev truck, the oil gets dark way before 3000 miles (not chunky! just dark, sometimes I pour some in a mayo jar to see how thick it is at oil change time). You're using synthetic which should have a better cleaning effect than conventional oil anyway
see y'all in a bit.
"Fact: The experts we spoke with agree that it's fine to switch to synthetic oil at any time, even after more than 100,000 miles. "A good synthetic is designed to swell seals at the same rate as mineral-based oil," says Bill Maxwell of Mobil. He adds, however, that not all early synthetic oils were seal-compatible. He believes those oils are off the market today. Synthetic oil with no ester component will cause seals to shrink, while an all-ester synthetic (often used in jet engines) will overswell seals. So don't pour jet oil in your Trans Am"
BTW - this is not a slam, but it has kept me from switching to Red Line for now.
Happy Turkey!!
see y'all,
Rando
Why don't you send that quote to Redline and see what they say? Tell them that you've been reluctant to switch to their oils for that very reason and then post any response you get from them here on this board. >:^D
--- Bror Jace
zr2rando Well I do live in N.E. Wash but this has been going on during the summer with temp in 80s-90s so that might be something to think about during the hot times I am going to change in about a week and the weather has been cooler for the last couple months so will see what happens then I will post what I find at that time.
brorjace-It is a gas one.
Thanks to all for the information and ideas Happy thanksgiving
But most of the 5W20s out there right now are at least a synthetic blend ... even if they don't say so on the label. Many companies have said they're working on a 5W20 weight (either conventional, synthetic or a blend) but so far all we have available is Motorcraft, Honda (the two mfrs recommending this ultra-thin stuff for their cars) and Pennzoil.
--- Bror Jace
Is the Valvoline oil available at NAPA an Ashland oil in a NAPA bottle or honest-to-goodness Valvoline All-Climate?
I'm not sure there's a difference but I thought I'd ask anyway.
--- Bror Jace
Thanks.
AH! The line between conventional and synthetic blurs again.
I prefer to dump both the oil and filter together at slightly shorter intervals. If I was going to go 10,000 miles on the same oil, I'd probably work regular oil testing into that schedule.
--- Bror Jace