Has Chrysler Reliability Improved?

fastdriver · March 2000

pjyoung-

I don't recall EVER being jumped on for expressing MY views about what I went through with MY car and the people that I had to deal with these past 21 months.

The ONLY negative thing that I recall is a post in my guestbook on my webpage from a mechanic in FL who works for a Lincoln/Mercury dealer and drives Chrysler products and has never had any problems with them. Good for him. I'm happy his Chryslers are fine. MINE wasn't! He said that he feels sorry for the DEALERS who had to put up with ME!!! LOL................................. He has NO clue! Those dealers NEVER saw my bad side which surprises even me! Sometimes it doesn't take much to put this Italian temper into gear! THEY should thank THEIR lucky stars because they could have found this car right back on their showroom floor!

Let me go one step further and say that I wouldn't care if someone did jump on me. I KNOW what I experienced with my 300. It would NEVER have stopped me from posting even if someone didn't like what I had to say! I learned a lot from the topics in Edmunds and received an enormous amount of help from others there via private e-mail and telephone calls. In addition, I would hope that in some small way I have helped others or directed them to a source where they could resolve their problems.

My biggest problem was NOT the car, but the people I had to deal with. I stated that several times after I solved my "Jersey Barrier loving" car with Goodyear. In the 10 1/2 months that they were trying to resolve the alignment problem, they NEVER once EVER even MENTIONED the word TIRES! Not the dealer, not the factory reps, not "customer service"! All they EVER tried to do was convince me that "they all do that" or it's a "characteristic" of the car! I still feel though that I should not have been at the dealer as much as I was during the first year! For a car in this price range, that is their "flagship" car, I should have only been back to them for routine maintenance. Some slip through the cracks. I think mine FELL through the cracks! LOL......

Recently, I read an article in the Detroit newspaper about the PT Cruiser and how Chrysler had some models out for the public and media to drive to see if there were any kinks that had to be worked out before they went into full production. Interesting. I think they should have done that with the more expensive LH models instead of relying solely on the "CATIA" computer to find these kinks- ie road noise, inaccurate shift line-up and whatever else is quite evident. WE should not have become the testers AFTER we paid for these cars. Then again, I'm an idealist and think everyone does what's right! I think Chrysler could have saved a ton of money IF they did some of these things ahead of time. The Jeep owners are having a ton of problems as are the minivan owners and their transmissions. Now I read yesterday that there may be another BIG recall of the minivans, including the 2001 models for a problem with their fuel lines.

People can say what they want about what I post, but there was not ONE problem that I had that was NOT a legitimate one no matter WHAT they tried to convince me of. I was right about every single thing that I complained about! I'm FAR from a mechanic. Just a lifetime of new cars and life experience have given me the insight into how I should expect a car to operate!

OK- I'm off my soapbox now. Wait- one more thing that confuses me. In the April issue of Consumer Reports, they give the 300 the thumbs up and say the Intrepid has improved. Yet the LHS and Concorde are NOT recommended???? HOW does this happen? All these cars are made in the SAME plant, on the SAME assembly line, by the SAME people, using the SAME parts? Am I the ONLY one who is confused or am I missing something here?

fastdriver

fastdriver · March 2000

intrigue2-

In addition to pro Chrysler owners/salesmen, you forgot STOCKHOLDERS!! Did they make out as well as the Chrysler workers with their $8,100 bonuses?
;-))

fastdriver

windowphobe6 · March 2000

Pages 32 and 33 of the same issue of CR explain much. The 300M and the Intrepid are just slightly below the dead-average line, and Concorde and LHS a tick or two below them. But to qualify as "average" in CU's estimation, a car need only finish within 20 percentage points either side of that dead-average line, which qualifies the Dodge and the M, but which the other two cars missed. (Ford's Crown Vic/Grand Marquis twins finished above the line, but not 20 points above, so they're just as "average" as the Intrepid despite recording a score about 25% better.)

abbyb · March 2000

I love mine! I haven't had any problems at all! My 300 has 15,000 miles that were put on in less then 2 months in less then perfect driving conditions. I haven't had any repairs besides oil changes. Just thought I'd give the other side of the story!

As far as reliability goes I have a 1997 Toyota Camry that everyone raves about. Well, I have had transmission problems, strut problems and electrical problems with my "reliable" car. Just an FYI for people in the market.

solara11 · March 2000

I just unloaded a 1997 Dodge Avenger with 35k. Tis car loved the dealer, often staying for up to a week at a time. Although Mitsubishi Motors built the car, it is still in essense, a Chrysler design and product. It made the Chrysler mating call, when it came to a stop, that ratcheting noise. When up closed the hood, the washer nozzles popped out every time. A little glue would have fixed that. The steering wheel vibrated at any speed, something that was "normal". My new Solara has no vibration, and I even have to look at the tach, or give it gas in park to make sure it is running. The brakes made a variety of sounds, all nornal for semi mettalic brakes, but not on any other car. The battery was not covered under warrenty at the dealer, but eventually Chrysler sent me a check in an effort to maintain good PR. You do not a get a loaner car, without the extended service plan, when the car stays at the dealer for a week. Chevy gave me one the 2 times I needed one, no fusing about you didn't purchase the extendedwarrenty. The car came with one, and was still covered under it. I couldn't unload this car fast enough. I love my 2000 Solara, even with a few minor probs. Got a loaner car when I went in for an alarm to be installed, no questions, or games. I even got continental breakfastin the very clen waiting room.

rascal8 · March 2000

I believe the Chrysler Corp. business strategy is to produce average to below average quality cars and market the living crap out of them. I cannot watch one television program on any station without seeing an annoying Chrysler commercial and that actor-turned-pitchman blabbing about "the most reliable cars and minivans on the planet". Their advertising budget must be extraordinary. A few car companies, not just Chrysler, believe that slick advertising and rebates will sell cars and to hell with the quality. For the most part they are right - American consumers generally buy whatever is hyped the most. It's a shame.

pjyoung · March 2000

But what kind of car do you drive?

fish8 · April 2000

rascal8 drives a 2000 Toyota Celica. Thats what his profile says. Nice car rascal!!!!

edwardh1 · April 2000

I think he is right - numbers I saw showed Dodge spending the most on advertising.
GM has the same approach thats why they hired the "brand managers" , i e non car people to hype the product. And their market share continues to slide down, meanwhile the Japanese work on the product and gain a few per cent each year, but it adds up.

Wonder how many people GM drove off permanently by the Junk cars they have made over the years - Corvair oil leaks, the Vega, the Chevette, any Trans Am, etc. Nevermind all the GM managers make big money even tho the products give trouble.

clunker96 · April 2000

yes i think that chrysler reliability has gone
up my aunt had an 84 chrysler le barron convertible and that thing was in the
shop frequently and now i currently own
a 1996 cirrus and not a problem yet!!!!
anyone with problems please e-mail me

rdeschene · April 2000

A good place to start would be the CAA Autopinion and Consumers Reports car buyer's guides. Both present their information in a similar fashion, so it's often interesting to contrast the two. I often find Consumers Reports "recommended and not recommended models" to not be supported by their own data, so you have to look at the individual categories for each vehicle and come to your own decision.

indydriver · April 2000

about my all Chry-co garage. I've been buying automobiles for 25 years. Like many in my generation, I bought nothing but Japanese in my twenties and early thirties. In 1988, my employer, a division of a 100 year old American tire manufacturer, was bought out by a Japanese company. In late 1989, I bought my first American made car of anykind, a 1990 Chry-co minivan, not because it was American but because it was the best product on the market for my needs. I still own it with 130K miles. I did have one major claim, a blown tranny, fortunately at 68,500 miles in the days of the 7/70. Nothing but routine since. After another ten years of working for the [non-permissible content removed]-Am company, seeing millions invested in state-of-the-art manufacturing capital and people getting used up and discarded like old tools, I left to work for a privately held, American owned company. Believe me when I tell you that every single dollar of profit went to Tokyo. Those profits were inflated by denying employees merit pay raises in exchange for "gain sharing" and other benefit compromises. To make a long story short, I laughed at the "Buy American" mentality as union hysteria until my experience of seeing Japanese management first hand for ten years. They truly do not care about the people in this country building and buying their products. Everyone should really think about what happens when they buy an import. Not sure what I'm going to do now that the Germans own Chrysler.

taffy2 · April 2000

indydriver,

it's the domestic manufacturers who should think about the what happens when a customer buy's foreign. usually they're gone for good,and the blame can't be leveled at the consumer or the foreign competitors, but at the domestic big three,now two since daimler bought chrysler.
you should not have had a transmission problem, regardless of the mileage and the warranty. the big three gave up market share, it's up to them to produce the quality products to win it back.

edwardh1 · April 2000

I think most of the GM problems result from their desire for short term profits so this year's retiring executive making 10 mil a year can get a big bonus - result is they produce junk (Vegas, Chevettes, Trans Ams, mid 80s Oldsmobiles etc), and lose market share every year.

indydriver · April 2000

taffy2 and edwardh1: I know where you're coming from--I was there myself in the 70's and 80's when the diff in quality was really w i d e! You have to admit, domestic quality has gotten a lot better in the last decade. I'm not being critical of import owners and I understand that, at the end of the day, you have to do what you think is best for your own situation. Just thought everyone would appreciate a glimpse into what's happening behind the curtain of domestic Japanese industry.

lindeman1 · April 2000

I sincerely hope Daimler has a positive influence on the quality at Chrysler. With terrific styling and feautures, it's a shame that so many of their models suffer horrendous quality and reliability problems (check the minivan posts in this site as an example). One of their biggest embarassments should be that piece of crap 4 speed auto. that they've been building for over 10 years. It's one of the worst ever made and STILL fails regularly even on the new models (had 3 of them in my 1991 Voyager-also suspension, a/c and exhaust problems-3.3 engine was great though...) A complete redesign was in order years ago...I know more than a few people who won't buy another Chrysler product due to transmission experience alone. This is total disregard for their consuming public and will hurt their image even after the problems are "fixed". Come on, Chrysler...we know that you can build beautiful, well-designed cars. We just want some reassurance that the reliability matches the looks.

carleton1 · May 2000

BUT...none of the many owners of DC minivans that I personally know has had any problems. On the other hand, the problem ratio of a company (that I will not name here...the problems may not be indicative of reliability of that brand as a whole), was very high. I got the Grand Caravan based on personal observation with reliability and
our Grand Caravan has been flawless in 13 months and 12,216 miles. I wish Chrysler would include all of the nice features of the Caravan/Voyager/ Town & Country on their sedans (especially the new PT Cruiser).

carleton1 · May 2000

And here it is to save you some time:
#412 of 463: The Dreaded Clunk (reposer) Mon 08 May '00 (03:34 PM)

Quite a few posters have remarked upon the dreaded
"clunk" in their Ody's heard after going in
reverse (and sometimes when driving forward),
necessitating a new transmission. This problem is
distinct from the sloshing sound the gas tank makes which you just have to live with. Unfortunately, we have the clunk in our brand new GG EX, delivered last week with all of 5 miles on it. Unbelievable. Took it back to the dealer today, and after a quick test drive, they confirmed the problem and are ordering a brand new tranny for us. They knew the clunk well and were not surprised, saying it is a well documented problem at Honda and that they are replacing several trannys on new Odys. (In fact, one was being replaced while we were there).
I can't believe Honda is letting this problem
continue in April of 2000. I will never insult a
Dodge Caravan owner again.

fastdriver · May 2000

carleton1-

At least the Honda dealer recognizes it and is doing something about it ASAP. The Chrysler dealer would spend months denying it in the hopes that the customer would go away! It's only the persistent customers who win with Chrysler.

fastdriver

theliz · May 2000

The topic is about "DC improvement", but I see alot of post about 91, 94, 95, models. I have been all over the townhall and I have come to a conclusion: the 80's and even early 90's were not very good for any domestic maker. Things are very different today. If you think DC (and Ford too--but GM not so much) has not improved, then you have'nt driven one lately. I think DC has some of the best cars out there (and their trucks are great-- but Ford's are slightly better).

pat84 · May 2000

I traded in a 96 Dodge Caravan because of transmission problems that started at 72K miles. There are numerous web sites documenting Daimler- Chryslers approach to transmission problems. See:
http://www.badtrans.webprovider.com/index.htm
There is even a hidden warranty on Chrysler transmissions. Does anyone know if the 2001 DC minivans will have a totally new transmission ?

cdnpinhead · May 2000

The link to the "badtrans" site is a living ad for the power of the Internet. I just spent $2000 replacing the transmission in our '94 Caravan, and my mother-in-law has a '95 Intrepid that's (you guessed it) stuck in 2nd gear. The link indicates that any car that sticks in 2nd gear should be covered by a "hidden warranty", and that's going to save mom-in-law a bundle.

Thankyouthankyou.

And, oh yeah, my Eagle Vision has a leaking transmission and I'll be lucky to get $1.85 for it when I sell it (privately) as soon as my new Lincoln LS arrives.

Again, thanks for that link!

tekyle · May 2000

I finally filed a small claims case against DaimlerChrysler for the third repair on my transmission (A604 of course). With all the evidence and information I have compiled over the last 9 months there's absolutely no way I can lose. I'll post the results on my website, which was posted on message #86.

fastdriver · May 2000

This might answer this topic's question! LOL....
Take a look! Someone is listening!!

http://www.autoextremist.com/

fastdriver

carleton1 · May 2000

For its outstanding trend-setting styling.

fastdriver · May 2000

carleton1-

LOL!!!!!! Never heard of a Takuma! IF they spend enough advertising money, they COULD become Motor Trend Car of the Year too!!!!!

fastdriver

pat84 · May 2000

Interesting, that Daiwoo offers 100K mile warranties. I haven't seen any topics about their reliability improving.

iscotts · June 2000

Our 96 Neon had a slow oil leak - head gasket. Dealer also discovered rear main seal leak. All in all, quoted at over $900. The head gasket is a widely reported problem, so I called Chrysler to see if they would extend their warranty on our 56K 4.5 years-old Neon.

They agreed to pay for all repairs with a $100 deductable payable by us. I thought that this was a fantastic commitment by Chrysler. They stood behind their product, and with this kind of attitude I anticipate that they are working hard on quality improvement.

I may well buy a Chrysler product in future. I would check its reliability record first, like any other car.

fastdriver · June 2000

iscotts-

It might have had SOMETHING to do with this TSB issued in Sept. 99.

Service Bulletin Number: 090899
Bulletin Sequence Number: 790
Date of Bulletin: 9909
NHTSA Item Number: SB607916
Make: DODGE
Model: NEON
Year: 1996
Component: ENGINE:GASKETS:VALVE COVER
Summary: TECHNICAL SERVICE BULLETIN REGARDING MULTI-LAYER STEEL (MLS) HEAD GASKET
INSTALLATION PROCEDURES. *TT

fastdriver

chevyrog1 · June 2000

I hope the GC is better for you than what most people have experienced..I myslef bought an Impala for our family needs and am loving it more every day.

The bottom line is that GM has some of the most reliable pwertrains out there right now...
Why else would Honda ink a deal with them to exchange engines/trannys?

As fas as American owned car companies there are only 2 : GM and Ford 9 and if you are concerned about transmission problems that leaves you on ly one choice GM)

carleton1 · June 2000

I have been a VERY SATISFIED Chevy owner from 1963 when I got my first new car...a 1963 Chevy Impala Sport Coupe with 283 V8 and 3 Speed Manual.
Also had 1967 same but 327 and THM. Had a 72 Volvo
145S (big disappointment after 67 Impala), but after a few other vehicles, returned to 80 Impala 4 dr (3 children) with 4.4L V8. Power was limited
but gas mileage great. I have had great Chevys and a few not so good. My 87 R-10 has been mechanically perfect...paint peeled off hood and cab top. 91 Astro had digital instrumentation...a
real loser in that one area. Thougt we would try Grand Caravan so got a 1999 which has been perfect
and I like the dealer service even better than the
excellent service I had for the past 24 years from
the Chevy dealer. Venture did not have rear heater and cost more for less options than GC.

jbordova · June 2000

I am wondering what that noise is that chrysler transmissions make. On our Caravan and Sebring the transmission makes a "ratcheting" noise. I was just wondering what that is and why other cars don't do it?

2022 · June 2000

Chrysler improved, I think not. The 00 I own now isn't near as reliable as the 97 model. Numerous problems from electrial, transmission, radio speakers, window motors and much more

cdnpinhead · June 2000

Interesting.

You'd best steer clear of the 300M board, or they will seek you out and rip you limb from limb. Unencumbered by facts, they're convinced they're driving the best vehicles ever built. . .and haven't figured out (yet) why they're priced so much below the competition.

He who laughs last. . .laughs best.

I'm still trying to sell my '94 Eagle Vision which listed for close to $25K, and have lowered the price to $5500, so far. Haven't had even one call, except from agencies who tell me they're willing to try to sell it.

It's interesting that we just paid $3500 for an '89 Honda Accord with 145K miles on it (for the kids to drive), and it's obvious it's been in a wreck. If I'm lucky, I may get a thousand or so more for a Chrysler product with 50K fewer miles that's five years newer. Who says news doesn't travel fast?

pjyoung · June 2000

Traded my 93 T-bird for a 300M, which now has 10,000 miles and no rattles, problems, etc.

Best I could get for that T-bird was $3,500. Sorry pal, it ain't just Chryslers.

carleton1 · June 2000

And Judy W. new 91 Accord EX with electrical problems that required a costly repair every other
month. Or my niece Sue B. who got a new 88 Accord
and had the transmission go out when it was only 6
years old. Or my son in law Omar S.who bought an 84 Accord with a rebuild engine and transmission at 150 K miles. It has given him many problems...
and now with 176 K miles they can't drive it until another expensive repair or repairs...But the 78 Impala we gave our daughter when we got it used in 91 with 104 K, now has 186 K miles on original engine and transmission.
Chrysler does not have the most unreliable cars...Go read in the Odyssey Problems Forums to read the anguish of owners of the new 1999 and 2000 Odysseys. I do not read of nearly as many problems with the DC vans that outsell Odyssey 5 to 1.

carleton1 · June 2000

Her parents bought it new and get a new Honda Accord every 4 years or so. The Accord was well taken care of so Natalie was upset that they had $4000 in repairs (in 1998) and more major problems
developed...were told at least $3000 more...so Natalie got rid of it.
From what I have seen, people who own Honda Accords are not laughing last...many are crying about the many expensive repairs needed to keep their Honda Accords running.

cdnpinhead · June 2000

The point I was trying to make (not very successfully, apparently) was that the marketplace is speaking to me regarding the relative value of an Accord vs. Chrysler LH. My kid looked for over a month for a '89-'91 Accord for ~$4K, and every time he found one that fit the bill, it was sold the first day it was listed. It took a long time to find one at all, and at that we ended up with a less than stellar unit, with 140K+ miles on it.

Meanwhile, as I said in my original post, I'm trying to sell a '94 (5 years newer) car with leather, upgraded factory audio system, etc. etc. that sold for $5K more (than the Accord) new, and I can't get anyone to even look at it for $5500. Maybe if I go down to 5K or 4500?. . .which is remarkably close to what the better five year older Accords were selling for with 20 or 30,000 more miles on them.

It's the law of supply and demand in the free enterprise system. The public knows what they're willing to pay for these cars, tho there appear to be a lot of DC fans that haven't heard the message. . .yet.

pjyoung · June 2000

Was that it ain't just Chrysler that's got that problem. I traded a 93 T-Bird loaded with 75K and got less than I could have for my 87 Honda Accord with 137K miles on it. Is that a DC problem?

tboner1965 · June 2000

It is their reputation, (or lack of it) that contributes to the resale value. Given two vehicles in identical condition, equipment, mileage, age etc., the vehicle with the higher perceived reliability will probably be worth more.

I understand that supply and demand are also a consideration. The manufacturer has control over both supply and quality. So yes, they do heavily influence resale.

The addition of rebates for newer models influences both demand for new and used vehicles. High rebates on new vehicles are a strong disincentive to purchase a used like model.

Cheers,

TB

cdnpinhead · June 2000

I agree that there are a lot of cars that don't command the kind of resale value Honda (& a Mazda Miata I sold once, by the way) does, but I'm not sure if your T-Bird made it onto Consumer Reports list of "Used Cars to Avoid." The LH cars are there, and I'm in the process of paying for it.

pjyoung · June 2000

ANY Ford (pre 1996) with a 3.8 liter engine should be on the Used cars to avoid list. Given that, someone who buys one relying on a CR list is waiting to be burned BAD. The T-bird may not have been on that list, but the dealers sure did know that it should be avoided.

carleton1 · June 2000

Honda Odyssey LX MSRP was $23,615 while GC SE was $23,455 (includes destination with standard equipment). My SE has $4035 of options. At MSRP, the Odyssey is easily the best buy and would have these items NOT standard on a GC SE: rear air conditioning, rear heater, deep tinted windows, power windows, power door locks, 2nd row separate seats (Ody can be either separate or bench).
Odyssey is the best buy unless one gets a very nice discount on other minivans. I mention the Edmunds data on value now of these 2 vans to dispel the myth that Honda, Toyota, etc. retain more value. A real comparison is using the prices actually paid for each...not the MSRP.

fish8 · June 2000

You can list all the examples of how Hondas are no better in reliability than Chryslers but for every Honda story there are literally 10 for Chrysler products. It is a know FACT, that Chrusler products are inferior to Hondas. ALL manufactures have there share of defective cars. Chrysler just has more. Do you read many car publications? If you do, this really should not be an issue.....its plain as day!!!!

carleton1 · June 2000

Notice all of the Odyssey problems that are now
being reported on the 1999 and 2000 Odyssey by the
current owners. There are not as many problems with the 1999 and 2000 DC vans being reported in the Town Hall by current owners even though DC vans greatly outsell Odyssey. Maybe Chrysler did have problems in the past...but it is now Honda owners who are suffering grief and trauma with many problems in 1999 and 2000 models.

fish8 · June 2000

If you are basing the quality or problems of a vehicle on this forum alone you obviously have not done any research. I think Edmunds is great, though people who tend to have excess problems with their cars also tend to post more.

Question: What percentage of Honda Odysseys make up the total output of Honda cars?

Answer: Not many. I am not sure of the exact numbers, but I know it is no where near the Accord or even the Civic sales. My point: The Odyssey is one new model that Honda is selling that seems to be having more problems than the other makes in their lineup.

Again, look at ANY publication and you will see that Hondas are more reliable that Chryslers. Period. Also, don't think I am bashing all americal cars. I have owned a Jeep :-( and currently own a Ford product.

If you are happy with your Chrysler product, I really am happy for you.

fish8 · June 2000

That should of said American, not Americal ;-)

pjyoung · June 2000

Look enough and you'll find almost every car bashed. Old Honda's may be more reliable than Chryslers, Fords or Chevy's but an old Honda also appears to be more reliable than a new Honda.

People are gonna bash Chrysler. I let them. I drive one, it's been problem free, and I'm happy. My aunt had a 98 Honda Accord, bought new, that was replaced under the lemon laws because it quit within the first month she had it and never restarted. Based on that, Chryslers more reliable.

You don't need to point me to any magazine so I can read about how Chrysler sucks. I would tend to discount it since, as I said, my experience proves differently.

One question though...If Chrysler sucks so bad, how come I see so dog-gone many of then on the road?

fastdriver · June 2000

pjyoung-

"One question though...If Chrysler sucks so bad,
how come I see so dog-gone many of then on the
road?"

Mmmmmmmmmmmm......0.9% financing for 60 months? high rebates? good looks? cheaper MSRP? Some possible answers- I guess.

fastdriver

carleton1 · June 2000

THE minivan with more comfort features than any other for the price paid. Many are repeat buyers. THE only minivan with Dual Zone Temperature
Control...a very nice feature usually only
available on the nicest luxury sedans.

Has Chrysler Reliability Improved?

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