Lease Questions - Ask Here

CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hello ilan. While consumers can get out of a four year lease a year or two before its scheduled end date, it will be very very expensive to do so. The small difference between the payment for a three year or thirty-nine month lease of a vehicle and a four year lease of a vehicle will definitely almost always be more than offset by the thousands of dollars that it will cost you to get out of a lease a year or two prior to its scheduled termination date. Banks are very smart. If there was a way for consumers to pull one over on them like this, they certainly would have closed the loophole a long time ago.

All three of the cars that you mentioned are very nice. If I was in the market for one, I personally would probably go with the Subaru first (I am in an area of the country that makes AWD a desirable option. Having said this, the Saab 9-2X also comes with AWD and it has an amazing lease program available on it right now. It will definitely be the best deal out of the three cars that you are interested in (though in my opinion it is also the ugliest).

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

You're welcome, luis_r_h. Since you are relatively new to leasing, you should check out the following informative articles that are available here at Edmunds.com on this subject: 10 Steps to Leasing a New Car and Calculate Your Own Lease Payment.

Let's calculate a sample lease payment on the van that you are considering so that you have something to compare to the payments that you are being quoted. I will base this sample payment on the assumption that you will not be putting any money down. I always advise consumers against making capitalized cost reductions on leased vehicles for two main reasons. The first is if your leased vehicle is totaled in an accident or stolen and never recovered during your term, your insurance company pays off the bank that you were leasing it through and your down payment will just disappear. Also, cap cost reductions do not reduce the lease-end purchase prices of vehicles. That means if you were to buy your leased Odyssey at the end of its contract, its price would be exactly the same, regardless of whether you had put $3,200 down or had made no down payment at all.

OK, now for the payment. According to my calculations, if you were to lease a 2005 Honda Odyssey EX-L without the rear entertainment or navigation systems, with an MSRP of $32,410 and a selling price of $500 below that, $31,910 (you may be able to negotiate more of a discount or less of one depending upon the competition in your area) through American Honda Finance Corp. right now for 3 years with 12,000 miles per (a typical lease length and mileage allowance), your zero down, pre-tax monthly payment should be right around $442.

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hcombs · December 2004

Thanks for getting back to me. I'm close to closing a deal. However, it would be $1000 down plus the first months payment and license. 48 month lease, 15K miles, wheel locks and tint. I emailed your prices to the dealer, so we'll see. But reading some of the other posts (what people paid), I'm still getting a pretty good deal. What do you think?

CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Congratulations on your new car, Sandy. Thanks for taking the time to come back and let us all know how everything turned out. Enjoy!

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

To a certain extent you are right, teasip. The problem with getting out of leased vehicles well before their scheduled end dates is more often than not they cost more to purchase than any dealer will give you for them as a trade. Furthermore, many banks require consumers to make all, or at least a significant portion of, the remaining lease payments that they are contractually obligated to pay even if they get out of their lease early. Getting the dealer that you get your next vehicle from to pay off your existing lease will work in many cases, but it will severely hamper your ability to get a good price on your next vehicle.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hello becks. I would be more than happy to give you my opinion on this lease. However, in order for me to do so I need you to tell me this car's full MSRP. This is an important number for two reasons. The first is that it is necessary to calculate a lease payment on it. The second reason is that it helps to tell what sort of a discount you are being given on this car.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hi lanks. I would be more than happy to calculate a sample lease payment that you can compare to the payment that you have been quoted on the car that you are interested in. However, in order for me to do so, I need to know its selling price. This is an extremely important number for you as a consumer to know anyhow because the selling prices of leased vehicles can and should be negotiated, just as if you were paying cash. You are much more likely to get a good deal if you negotiate an attractive selling price on the vehicle that you want and then have the dealer work up a lease payment based upon it. Let me know the selling price and I will let you know what the payment should be.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Welcome back, ewegleitner. Thanks for helping the economy by considering purchasing another new vehicle

. Let's take a look at the deal that you were quoted. It looks as though you are getting a discount of $1,225 on this car. I am not all that familiar with what the market is like for it right now, but you may be able to get an idea by stopping by the "Infiniti G35 Sedan" discussion that appears in the "Prices Paid" Forum. Using the prices that you were quoted, I estimate that a 39 month, 15,000 miles per year lease of a 2005 G35 sedan RWD through Infiniti Financial Services would have a zero down, pre-tax monthly payment of around $480. So the, $489 per month including taxes that you were quoted looks about right to me, assuming this selling price.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hi Matt. General Motors did not make any enhancements to its incentives on Cadillac models for its Red Tag Sales Event. It did increase its cash bonuses for 2005 Pontiac Grand Prix models that are financed or leased through GMAC in certain regions though. If you let me know what state you are in, I can tell you exactly what the enhancement to this model was in your area.

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gmeow · December 2004

Hi,

I have receive the following quote.

2005 MB C240 4Matic

MSRP: $37460

MF: 0.00175

Residual: 58%

Out the door cost $5000 including:

- $3800 Cap cost reduction (I know it's not good to pay down but I really rather have low monthly)

- $895 acq fee ($100 more then MB listed)

- $300 doc fee/registration fee

$350/mo including tax., 1st month waived.

I think this is a great deal for the 4Matic. Any thoughts?

Kirstie_H · December 2004

Just to head off the next question... what's the lease term - 36 months? (that's what it looks like) Annual mileage allowance?

luis_r_h · December 2004

Thanks, Car_Man. I have had the Honda Dealer come back saying I would need 1998.00 for drive off and that my payments would be 499.

He is saying the he is going with Honda America, saying the residual % is 64% and that the money factor is .260.

Should I go through Honda America directly to get a better deal. I did the reading you suggested - Thanks, it helped a lot. Will credit unions and bank be a better bet - My credit score is A+.

thanks again.

ewegleitner · December 2004

Thanks Car_Man! Now I just need to negotiate the price of the car...have a good holidays if I'm not back by then

njl · December 2004

Car_Man...

Could you please provide me the residual and money factor for a 2005 Cadillac DeVille and 2005 Cadillac DeVille DTS in Northern NJ.

Thanks

CSF · December 2004

Hey Car_Man,

I really appreciate all the help you provide here on this forum. We are still trying to make up our minds between the Honda Accord v6 w/Navi, the Acura TL w/Navi & the Acura MDX w/Navi.

I have a question about your reply #15310 to the other forum member who's also interested in the MDX w/Navi.

You estimated for him $482/mo with 15,000 miles and 0 down for 48 months.

Here on the Edmunds incentives page, they are listing the special on the MDX w/Navi as $489 for 42 months and this is with only 12,000 miles and a required $999 downpayment. I like your figures much better!

Are there newer Acura incentives out there than are reflected on the Edmunds incentives page? If so, did they include the TL in their incentives this time -- and what would the monthly payments be on a TL w/Navi with MSRP of $35,470 and a selling price of $35,470 (Edmunds TMV is MSRP for this vehicle in my zip code). 12,000 miles and would go 36, 42, or 48 depending on the best monthly payment.

Thanks again for all you do,

csf

gmeow · December 2004

Thanks for the reminder!! Totally fogotten those details..

Lease term is 39 mo.

Mileage 12,000

Thanks!

lanks · December 2004

hey sorry about that, the selling price is 21,175

davepro · December 2004

Any suggestions on a good lease number for one of these. I'd like it from 2-4 years and pay no more than 350. Doable? Thanks.

davepro · December 2004

Should I negotiate a price first when leasing?

teasip · December 2004

I've been interested in the RX330 for $499/mo. for 48 mos. through Lexus but haven't been able to find anyone interested in my '01 Sport Trac (co-workers, family, etc.). The lease special ends Thursday and I'm wondering if Lexus will be offering any new specials to replace this one?

hcombs · December 2004

I just bought the MDX Touring with the Naviagtion package (I'm the MDX poster that Car man did a sample lease for). Out of pocket expenses were $1750 and a monthly payment of $485 with 15K miles per year. I also got the wheel locks, tint, cargo liner and weather mats thrown in. I think I got a pretty good deal considering that when I first started pricing the MDX with the salesman I bought from, it was $2000 down and $579 a month. I LOVE this SUV. I just picked it up tonight.

apothny · December 2004

So....My 2002 Saab 9-3 lease is up on January 18th and can be purchased for 15,727.20 plus taxes and fees. Consiering the car has only 17,000 miles after 35 months i kinda think it might be a good deal.

Ok long story short,,,I haxe my eye on a Chili Red 2005 9-3 Arc with auto and moonroof. My brother on the underhand is expectng a child early next year and want to get a safe car...

Assuming I purchase my 2002 in order to sellit to my brother without any profit would I be entitled to any additional incentive on my 2005? My dealer who I trust completely must be getting some kind of commission for selling my lease end on top of a 2005.

I haven't metioned this to the dealer yet....but figured it wouldnt hurt to ask. Any insight Car-man??

toky · December 2004

Hi Car-man,

I am also looking to lease an 6-speed '04 or '05 RX-8 in NJ. The RX-8 I have in mind has a MSRP of $33,964 and Invoice of $31,130.

Wondering what incentives and rebates are currently available?

Looking for a 30 month lease with 0 down and most likely wanting to purchase after (of course depends how much I like the car after 30 months).

What is the price difference between 12K/yr and 15K/yr?

What is the current money factor and risidual value?

Currently, all I know is that there is a $1500 cash back on '04s; a $500 cash back for recent graduates; and a $500 cash back for return customers at my dealership in Wayne, NJ.

I've saw the other incentives (up to $4500) they had a while ago from past posts, and am wondering if they have something like that now for the '04s, since the '05s are out.

Or should I wait until there are better deals?

Thanks in advance!

Joel

CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Thanks for the additional information, massjake. Let's work up a sample lease payment on this truck and see what we come up with. According to my calculations, if you were to lease a 2005 Honda Pilot LX with an MSRP of $27,856 and a selling price of $24,032 through American Honda Finance Corp. right now for 3 years with 12,000 miles per, your zero down, pre-tax monthly payment should be around $250. So as you can see, something definitely does not add up here. Even if I was to take the security deposit waiver into account, it still would only increase the monthly payment to around $254.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Greetings hcombs. You were able to negotiate a selling price of dealer invoice for an Acura MDX, huh? That certainly is an aggressive price for one, especially during the winter. I would be more than happy to calculate a sample lease payment on this truck for you, however in order for me to do so I need you to tell me what this its MSRP is. Let me know and I will let you know.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hi bmw4me2. I am not familiar with the specific advertised lease payment that you mentioned in your post. However, I would be more than happy to tell you what sort of incentives are available on this car and to calculate a sample lease payment on it for you if you would like. In order for me to come up with a sample payment, I need you to tell me the exact MSRP and selling price of the vehicle that you are interested in. If you don't know its selling price yet, just tell me its invoice price (this info is available here at Edmunds.com) and we can come up with an approximate selling price for you.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hi mss1. Vehicles' residual values are based upon a percentage of their full MSRPs, including destination charges, plus the MSRPs of any options that may be residualized. With Saabs, I believe that every factory option may be added to your vehicle's MSRP for the purpose of calculating its residual value, but aftermarket options probably can not be. If you were to lease a 2005 Saab 9-3 Arc Sedan through Saab Financial Services Corp. right now for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00070 and 49%, respectively. The numbers for an otherwise identical lease of a 2005 Saab 9-3 Aero Sedan should be .00122 and 49%. Saab is currently providing $2,500 lease cash and another $500 to $750 loyalty cash (this varies by region) on these cars.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hi chubby4. I believe that Mercedes-Benz Credit Corp.'s current base lease money factor for the 2005 C230 Sport Sedan is .00200 for leases up 4 years in long. Unless you are having this car's lease security deposit or lease acquisition fee waived the dealer that you are working with is likely marking up the money factor. Mercedes-Benz is waiving the first month's lease payment on this car.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

You're very welcome, hpowders.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Thanks for the additional information, cove148, but you still never told me what car this is. This is a very important thing to know. If you could, please consolidate all of the information about this lease into one post and I will be more than happy to give you my opinion of this deal.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Don't worry about it, denverg35. OK, according to the latest information that I have seen, if you were to lease a 2005 Volvo XC90 T6 through Volvo Finance right now for 39 months with 15,000 miles per year, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00159 and 56%. The numbers would be very similar for a 42 month lease of this vehicle, .00159 and 54%.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hello dragonslayer. You're in luck, Saab recently enhanced its lease program on its convertible models. Your post contained all of the necessary information for my to give you my opinion of this deal, except for the length of this lease. Let me know how long this lease is for and I will tell you what I think of it.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hi neilb. Consumers are always free to lease whatever vehicle they are interested in without making any sort of capitalized cost reduction. I haven't seen a lease program in years where the lack of a down payment had any impact upon the vehicle's lease money factor. If you were to lease a 2005 Honda Accord LX V6 Sedan through American Honda Finance Corp. right now for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00155 and 51%, respectively. While not making a down payment will not have any impact upon this money factor, you will have to pay a security deposit and AHFC's lease acquisition fee of $595 (this fee is higher in New York) to take advantage of it.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hey denverg35. Here you go. If you were to lease a 2005 Audi A4 1.8T Quattro Sedan through Audi Financial Services right now for 42 months with 12,000 miles per year, its base lease money factor and residual value should be around .00049 and 51%. The numbers for an otherwise identical lease of a 2005 Audi A4 3.0 Quattro Sedan should be .00010 and 47%.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

You're welcome, hcombs. I always advise consumers against making any sort of down payment when leasing. I do so for two main reasons. The first is if your vehicle is totaled in an accident or stolen during your lease, your insurance company pays off the bank that you were leasing it through and your down payment essentially disappears. The second main reason is that down payments on leased vehicles do nothing to reduce their lease-end purchase prices. So your lease-end purchase option price for this MDX would be exactly the same, regardless of whether you had put $1,000 down, or had made absolutely no down payment at all.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hi gmeow. The lease money factor that you were quoted is exactly the same as Mercedes-Benz Credit Corp.'s base money factor for this car. This is a very good thing because it means that the dealer that you are working with is not trying to mark-up its base money factor to add additional back-end profit to your deal. Having said this, it does appear as though they are marking-up MBC's acquisition fee of $795 by $100. This is not necessarily a problem, as long as you know that they are doing so and take it into account when evaluating your overall deal.

I definitely would not make a $3,800 capitalized cost reduction on any lease, but as long as you understand the reasons why doing so is not a good idea, you certainly are free to make any sort of down payment that you would like.

You never mentioned the selling price of the car that you are interested in leasing. This is an important number for you as a consumer to know for two reasons. First, the selling prices of leased vehicles can be negotiated, just as if you were paying cash for them. Without knowing the price of the car that you want to lease you don't know how good a price you are getting it for. The second reason is that one needs the selling price of a vehicle that they want to lease is that it is necessary to calculate its lease payment. I would be more than happy to work up a sample lease payment on the car that you are interested in for you if you let me know what its selling price is.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

You're welcome, luis_r_h. American Honda Finance Corp. does not deal with the public directly. It only writes lease and finance contracts on vehicles through Honda and Acura dealers.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

No problem, ewegleitner. Happy holidays to you as well and good luck in your negotiations!

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hey njl. I would be more than happy to give you an idea of what this car's lease program is currently like. However, in order for me to do so, I need you to tell me how long you want to lease it for and how many miles per year you need to be able to drive it.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

You're very welcome, CSF. Vehicles exact lease payments will vary depending upon how long one leases them for, how many miles per year one is allowed to drive, and their selling prices. This is why the lease payment that I worked up for someone in this forum earlier is not exactly the same as the lease payment that Acura is advertising on this truck right now.

Acura still is not providing any sort of lease support on the TL. If you were to lease a 2005 Acura TL w/Navi with an MSRP of $35,470 and a selling price of $35,470 (I will use the TMV to calculate this payment, but I definitely think that you will be able to get a discount on this car if you shop around) through American Honda Finance Corp. right now for 36 months with 12,000 miles per year, its zero down, pre-tax monthly payment should be right around $537. The payment for an otherwise identical 39 month lease should be around $531. The payment for an otherwise identical 48 month lease should be around $482.

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njl · December 2004

Of course Car_man...you'd think I'd have learned by now.

36 months

15K miles/year

Thanks

hpowders · December 2004

Hey Car_Man. Would you please provide me with mf and residual for a 2005 Acura MDX Touring for 3 years, 36,000 miles.

Thank you.

gmeow · December 2004

Hi Car man, thanks so much for your insight. The selling price was never really mentioned when we first negotiate the car. And I didn't know this is the first thing I should do until I have done some more research in Edmunds!

Having said that, I think they are using some where around $35500 as the selling price. We got kinda confuse with all the numbers flying ihe air (I am a totaly newbie here..). I thought the invoice is around $34600 and a grant above is not too bad. And $350/mo. including tax is what I can live with even with the helfty down.

Are the maths done right here?

Thanks!!

Rickster · December 2004

Thank you Car_man. It sounds like the bank is offering the better deal in terms of a monthly rate. Do you know if the upfront bank fee or disposition fees are negotiable? I'm being told they are not.

saaber1 · December 2004

i am in the process of wanting to lease this car. here are the details of the car:

MSRP of 36,240

Selling price of 28,538

12K miles per year

36 month lease

can you tell me what the lease rate should be along with the money factor and the residual value when the lease expires. also, i live in NYC where we unfortunately have the balloon lease. if you don't give me the monthly lease rate with the tax included, do i add the tax to the monthly rate or is it on the selling price of the car?

thanks many in advance.

corvette · December 2004

>>> i am in the process of wanting to lease this car. <<< I love the way you phrased that!

bravest086 · December 2004

Hi Carman! In the NYC/Long Island area, dealers are offering the 2005 SR5 4Runner (with an MSRP of $31,928 which includes destination charge) for $299 per month...36 months.

You have to put down $1869 plus tax, title, etc. I forgot to ask, but I'm sure it is for 12k miles.

I spoke with one dealer and he said this is it, no negotiating and that it is the offer coming from Toyota and they cannot do anything to the price. Is this accurate information?

And does this sound like a fair deal? I'm new here, so I don't know if I can haggle a better deal, can I?

If you need to know, I will be turning the car in after the lease is up, so I'm not sure if the residual value is of a concern here.

I apologize for information you may have covered previously. I appreciate any advice you can give to me about this vehicle and the lease in question.

Thank you,

Bravest

CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Thanks for the additional information, lanks. Let me see if I have this right. In separate earlier posts you stated that this car has an MSRP of $21,075 and a selling price of $21,175. How is its selling price higher than its full MSRP? Something does not seem right here. Does the selling price include tax? If so, what is its pre-tax selling price.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Hi davepro. You definitely should negotiate the selling price of the vehicle that you are interested in leasing prior to having the dealer calculate your lease payment on it.

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CarMan@Edmunds · December 2004

Lexus is providing lease support on the 2005 RX 330 through its "December to Remember" sales event. This program is not scheduled to expire on Thursday, but rather is scheduled to run unchanged through January 3rd.

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