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Comments
Craig
Bob
At a minimum I'll upload some highlights at night from the hotel. Post and share pics, stuff like that.
-juice
I believe most hotels now a days provide high speed access. I remember at the Marriot, when I was in AZ, they offered high speed internet access.
-Dave
-juice
-Dave
Steve - good luck on Gotcha Day. Have a safe trip!
Ed - Hope everything is/has gone well!
Mark
What a nice way to go into Thanksgiving week...
Plenty to give thanks for here.
-juice, bob: Is the emphasis to be comments on new models, desires for future models or some combination of these and other topics ?
We've provided tons of feedback via the Suggestions for Subaru forum. (I'm still 'jonesin' for a 7-passenger Subaru ala the MPV, as discussed at length before...)
-brianV
paisan's top 10 list:
* H12 diesel with 600 lb-ft
* 700 lb-ft for the next model year
* 800 lb-ft the year after that
* class III towing for his race car trailer
* 15mpg while towing
* did I mention torque?
* all the content of his SVX
* seats that fit someone "paisan sized"
* a TOD-like display for VTD AWD on all Subies
* oh, and more torque
-juice
I'm curious about what the Crew, collectively, thinks of hybrids, diesels, CVTs, VTD vs. plain AWD, things like that. Subaru is small so we know they can't do it all. What single new technology would we like them to focus on the most?
Also, what new product would we like to see? A B11S-like super coupe? A B9 Scrambler roadster? A minicar slotted below the Impreza? A full-size sedan? Bob's back-to-basics off roader? What if we had to choose only one?
I want the roadster, but I recognize I may be in the minority.
Finally, what about content, what is most important? Cruise with an on button on the stalk? Lit buttons everywhere? Express up/down windows? DVD players? Navigation? HIDs? All these things come up, but again which are most important?
Think about these things, we don't necessarily have to answer now. In fact I think we'll take a week for each of those questions, and poll everyone. Then maybe chart and rank our desires. Sound like a plan?
-juice
• Coat-'n-tails? (as in being anointed by the Queen)
• IBMish suit? (most likely, but not much fun)
• Perverbial dark blue blazer/gray slacks/tie? (for cocktails?)
• Business casual? (shirt/tie, no jacket, no class)
• Casual? (no tie, but at least shower ahead of time)
• Shorts? (could be chilly in Detroit in January)
• Speedo? (definitely chilly in Detroit in January)
* Neked (aka: naked; most definitely chilly in Detroit in January)
Bob
-juice
They just came out with a dual 1.8GHz model that is $500 cheaper than the dual 2GHz model. It looks like the best deal to me, and that extra $500 can go towards a 20" LCD (also a great product).
I've been angling for a G5 of my own at work, but haven't been able to pull it off yet. Hopefully sometime in the spring.
Craig
I think somebody needs to take a long hard look at the Baja and either address the many issues and shortcomings, or can it. I'm sure it absorbs a lot of resources that could be put towards other vehicles, like an STi Legacy for instance.
I would love to see more applications of the H6, especially with a manual transmission. As I've mentioned before, I get the same or better gas mileage with my H6 Outback compared to my previous H4 Outback. Given the extra power and refinement, I really think upgrading to the H6 is a no brainer (other than pricing considerations). If they can make it cost effective, the H6 should be used more across the board.
Paint on the Impreza lineup is horrible, you just look at it and it chips or scratches. This could be improved a whole lot. I'd gladly pay more for my car if the paint were more durable (and the per car cost would likely be cheap).
The US WRX should be getting standard 17" wheels and tires like the rest of the world.
That's all I can think of right now....
Craig
We could talk about the next Baja, if there will even be one. Again, that's something we should look at. Few, if any, of the regulars among Subaru Crew members bought a Baja. It might even hurt our credibility to focus on a product that flopped on the market.
It's 2005, there is a turbo in every model available. The new Legacy and 7 seater are here. They're past planning stages already. Now what?
-juice
Bob
Just an initial response to your questions:
-Hybrid AWD vehicle. The success of the Prius shows that this is the way for manufacturers to go for an environmentally friendly vehicle.
-I'd love for a roadster (B9) to come out, but figure Subaru will probably go with the B11S sedan instead. It's more in line with what peolpe want.
-I used to be one of those pushing for an in-car Navigation system, but with all the handheld units available I'd rather see Subaru focus elsewhere. Possibly Air bags/curtains all around for safety.
I think you will have to set up a poll site, otherwise you and Bob are going to flooded with suggestions.
Mark
BTW-most hotels now have the fast internet access Dave mentioned in the rooms.
I'm talking about the new crossover, and any other future product; and not just for "looks," but for possible features and content.
Bob
If so, then perhaps there are opportunities for Subaru to be had, but they have to execute correctly.
I dunno.
They went out on a limb with the styling, targeting a price point that was way high with all the content, neutered the engine and killed the real Switchback, making the bed too small to be usable. Oh, and the payload weight limit is laughable. What did they expect to happen ?
I mean hindsight, and all that, but can they really claim to be surprised ? They all but abandoned the concept car, which a lot of people were pumped about.
Make a Baja Sport with the real Switchback, 200hp, a 1200# weight limit and sell it for $18k real-world, and you will move enough of them to make it interesting.
Add an upscale model with 240hp and some additional content (5 seat for starters) for $23k, and you have yourself a nice little franchise.
-brianV
- get variable valve timing on all models first. it's well established and has large benefits for emissions, economy, and performance. current cam-phasing vvt should be upgraded to a technology that allows for variable lift as well.
car line:
- I have no idea what they can build that will sell. Perhaps a budget, sporty small coupe. It's a big market and a reasonable competitor would move a LOT of units. Dominating the market would be really tough though. And it would be tempting to compete on price by ditching AWD from the lowest trim... which I don't know if that is a great idea for the brand image.
Content:
- Express up/down windows on both front doors are a no-brainer. Remembering to offer LIGHTLY contented models with the toplevel powertrain is KEY. This is not Audi, this is not BMW. This is Subaru, and some consumers will want no frills with the best powertrain.
-c
But I don't think ditching AWD would be a good idea at all for a low end smaller than impreza car. It'd be removing one of the pillars that subie is based on.
Here's my 2-cents:
Everybody wants to buy a japanese car because they're reliable and typically get good gas mileage.
Subaru has some good engines, but I think the cars are generally too heavy. Look at the 2.5 l impreza: it shouldn't take a 165 hp engine to make that compact car mildly exciting. Subaru should be able to do it with a N/A 2.0. This concept applies down the line with the other models.
Why are subies heavy? Because of the AWD system and heavy gauge structural steel for safety. I realize that the new legacy/Outback have reduced weight by some 30%. Good! Do more of it! Can the AWD system be made lighter? And can the car's structure contain more aluminum, or some other metal with a high strength to wt ratio? With a lighter car, it'll feel alot more sporty and get better mileage. Also make the AWD system have a rear bias. Models with an automatic tranny drive almost like FWD, unless slippage is occurring.
And as you said some time ago--more differentiation between Legacy and Outback. Make the Outback more off-road ready. Maybe think about an active chassis similar to Volvo. Onroad and Offroad settings which change the ground clearance significantly. Oh and before Bob says it--More towing. And dual-range tranny and self-leveling suspension. Or, get rid of the Outback all together and use the forester for this.
Oh and don't forget Direct Injection from Isuzu for across the board.
Whew!
Eric
AVCS, then double AVCS. Lots of merit in these because you're talking about improving your engines in the volume sellers. Kia's new engines are getting it, can you believe that?
Direct Injection, I like it. Maybe as a general request for more efficiencies.
Should there be a WRX coupe? B11S would be a low volume halo car, an SVX replacement. What about a volume segment coupe?
Light content with the powerful engine, Amen to that. My top personal pick. Gimme an XT with unpainted bumpers and no climate control.
Sorry, I won't even suggest dropping AWD. Not in this market. In extremely fuel economy sensitive markets, sure.
Another point: No Traviqs. In other words, absolutely zero tolerance for rebadged GM cars. I shiver at the thought.
Weight loss is already something they're working on. The Forester was 80 lbs lighter, the Legacy lost even more weight. They should continue that, sure. The Impreza was the last car they intro'd that was heavier than its predecessor.
I see subtle hints at making VTD more widely available.
Differentiate the Outback, definitely. Right now the entire OTFC (On the Fence Club) is cross shopping several Subies. Let's have them appeal to a wider variety of folks. I like the WRX, Forester XT, and Legacy GT, but I can only buy one of them, right?
I'll leave the towing and payload stuff up to Bob, you can bet that will be covered (have we discussed anything else lately?). :-)
Dual range and adjustable suspension. We've got quite a list to sort through. I don't think we can hit them with all of this, so the polls should help us narrow it down a little.
-juice
Give me some time, I'll chart out a few general questions and maybe bring up one per week. I'll give people a chance to "nominate" entries, so we don't overlook something.
-juice
I think taking the Impreza slightly upmarket would be desirable too, with a version of the very promising 2.5t. The car needs some major interior help if it wants to keep pace with current offerings from Acura and the upcoming R32. I see that the new Leg will get passat-like lighted switchgear, go ahead and cut production costs of it by providing it everywhere. The Legacy looks to be a big leap ahead in interior style and design; Forester could use more, and Impreza needs it badly. Think A5 Golf/Bora for those that have already seen it. Or upcoming S40.
At that point it is not unreasonable to slide a small hatch underneath. Heck, they'll need it when the Colt kicks WRC bootay next season. Add to the mix the upcoming LWB 7 seater and either a roadster or the B11, and you have an attractive lineup that captures buyers from college graduation to retirement.
-loosh
Just remember, VW sells 5 times as many Jettas as compared to Golfs. At current Impreza sales levels, that would amount to...a hatch as popular as the Baja. ;-)
We can poll that, too. Maybe ask what bodystyle should Subaru do next, off the Impreza platform. Coupe? Hatch? Roadster? Maybe even a tall microvan thingy?
-juice
The news of juice and Bob going to Detroit courtesy of Subaru is great. Such a small gesture is generating such buzz among a loyal owner community. You can't get better bang-for-the-buck than this!
Juice -- I'm going to send you a check for a deposit on a Legacy GT wagon. :-)
Paint: Actually, it's a Forester/Impreza thing. You should see the front edge of my hood. It's pockmarked beyond any touchup paint. I think the Legacys must be painted here in the US as they don't seem to suffer the same fate.
Colin: Express windows up and down on both front doors -- YES! That's one small but often used feature on my wife's Jetta that I wished Subaru would put on their vehicles. Why have this feature on the passenger side too? It makes it so easy to roll or down all windows with one hand. Pull up on the front switches, get them going and them hold the rears. It's one of those small things that mean a lot.
Ken
No requests for a passenger eject seat? What about amphicars?
-juice
Patti
1) Would love to see an AWD hybrid in the line up. I'm still not getting anywhere near the mileage I hear reported by some.
2) I would like an option of a good sounding quality sound system - factory installed. (Yes, I know you can get quality systems for cheaper in the aftermarket, but some customers would prefer not having some installer yanking the interior of their brand new car apart.)
3) Sportshift as mentioned by others on this board.
Ron
VTD standard on all ATs
AT = 5sp sportshift
MT = 6sp
full size spares standard in all models
standard integrated boost gauge into existing gauge cluster on models with turboooooo
optional trip computer thing on all models
-Brian
I am on board with most of the suggestions above. I think diesel technology should be mentioned as well. Unless you see hybrids taking on this role of economy without the loss of get up and go. I know I'll be taking a mpg hit when I get my Legacy next spring.
-Ian
It was kind of reassuring to see that so many Alaskans are Sube owners.
Ron
-Dennis
Subaru has 6% market share in Alaska, vs. 1.1% in all of the US.
Some preliminary info I have so far:
Tuesday, January 6th - Dinner, Guest speakers
Wednesday, January 7th - The Auto Show
I expect there will be a Q&A session, at least. The day of the 7th is open to interpretation, because the public auto show is not until the 10th. I imagine Bob and I will be crawling all over (and under) the GT.
-juice
2) safety, great crash scores and bumper bash scores by IIHS ( forget the us gov scores ).
3) awd, subaru is known for its great awd and continuing to offer it in all lines make a great statement by subaru in the belief of awd.
4) value, low cost for a great feature set. dont try to compete against audi/bmw, grab the 'lower end'. make sure the options are great not cheapo. like the optional forester sunroof is incredible.
5) powerful engines, if i had only the NA engine i would not have gotten past the above 4, nothing worse than a slow car ( someone referenced those low end jags with nice features that are dogs ).
these 5 things sold me on the forester and will continue to hold me as a subaru customer. i will live with the rest of my complaint list but those 5 are show stoppers.
next my list of wishes...
The bun warmers felt good here this morning cruising on errands.
Steve, Host
-- Two Chiefs Penetrate Great Wall of Fuji --
Washington, D.C., November 11, 2003 -- The Edmunds.com Subaru Crew, the coolest Subaru club in the world, announce the escape from the dungeon by two of its crew chiefs.
Apple Juice AJ the Heavy Weight Lover, aka "juice", clawed his way out in his 1998 Forester Project 2.5RS, aka "Sandy", with Subaru's standard AWD and a lot of throttle. He commented that he got 25.875 mpg while doing so.
"It was great", said juice. "With regular fuel, too."
Bob "need a nickname" Holland designed a quick costume that he used a camoflage to sneak by the FHI Imperial Guard. He had been locked up because he discovered that, in actuality, all American Subarus were rated to tow the same 1800kg as the UK models, without trailer brakes, and that SoA lawyers lowered the rating because they "though it would be funny".
He refused to comment except to say that the colors of the steep dungeon walls clashed with the rest of SoA headquarters design. He also offered to redesign it.
For more information on the Subaru Crew, visit our site at http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/
About Edmunds.com Subaru Crew, Not Yet Incorporated.
The Subaru Crew is a member-owned club hosted by our wonderful Edmunds.com Town Hall Hosts. Headquartered in CyberSpace, the Crew enjoys several hundred members and recently hosted a record 39 member live chat.
That and it adds some coherency with the other forums I sometimes frequent. Sorry Hosts I meant to say I only post here, ever, honest. ;-)
Hope you like the new name.
-Ian
p.s. ROTFLMAO! Juice that's hilarious. Very well done indeed.
Cheers Pat.
Not balanced you say? Well riddle me this: why is the engine in the front of the car--OK OK easy to access.
Maybe for performance models or across the board--whatever you guys feel--put the engine behind the front wheels for more of a 50/50 weight distribution. Others already do it--Acura NSX, Infiniti G35, Honda S2000 etc.
Otherwise keep the 50/50 AWD split but move the engine more midship.
Maybe move it for STI models and/or the B11S...
Thoughts?
Eric
When I bought my OB, I thought I wouldn't be using the seat heaters much. Boy, was I wrong!
Now, I can't imagine NOT having them.
Ron
Bob
-Loosh
who still thinks Hot Hatches are awesome.
Patti
Cheers!
Paul
Patti