Interesting...Bob will recall that Dave Sullivan asked us what we thought about CVTs back in 2006 when the Tribeca debuted.
It's not a bad idea. They've been slow as molasses to get the 5 speeds spread throughout the lineup, and the transmission itself is an older design. Sportshift also has been very slow to trickle down the lineup.
I do wonder how the constant rpm will sound like on a boxer engine, which already has a characteristic sound.
"I do wonder how the constant rpm will sound like on a boxer engine, which already has a characteristic sound."
!!
So do I.
The new engine in the Tribeca has a pretty low-rpm torque peak, right? I guess if Subaru could engineer the other engines that way, they wouldn't have to rev much if someone floored it with the CVT.
Me, I really dislike CVTs. I see the financial sense of them for the manufacturer, but I don't think they do much for the consumer. The speedboat or slipping clutch effect is particularly annoying.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I'm not crazy about the drivetrain feel in the Murano, for instance, but it does make sense from an efficiency standpoint. I bet they could make it both faster and more frugal.
Basically, a CVT is without a doubt an upgrade from a 4 speed with no Sportshift, which much of the lineup has.
5 speed Sportshift is a tough call, I think I'd choose the Sportshift over a CVT in that case.
Me, I really dislike CVTs. I see the financial sense of them for the manufacturer, but I don't think they do much for the consumer. The speedboat or slipping clutch effect is particularly annoying.
They get better fuel mileage and improve accelleration, both of which benefit the consumer.
My concern is how will they do under heavy duty usage, such as towing?
I'd like to see the range of gearing, from lowest to highest.
I see a potential for them to offer a lower "first" gear and a taller cruising gear. Especially for models with the 3.6l H6. It has enough torque that they could gear it real tall for the highway (under light loads).
I would imagine CVT would probably work very well with diesels and gasoline turbos. As those have narrow powerband, they require lots of shifting in manuals and more gears in autos to be efficient.
I drove Nissan Versa CVT - it was a strange experience, but quite allright.
If they can bump fuel economy by 10% by using CVTs, and another 10% with direct injection, that means in the next several years the models making 29MPG HWY now will be at 35MPG. Pretty substantial difference. This will really help them meet CAFE requirements and restore their "green" image. One of the few complaints you hear about Subarus is fuel economy (rear seat room & lack of options being the others that come to mind offhand), so I'm glad to see them addressing it. They said recently that one of their new goals was to be a leader in adopting "green" technology... looks like they're acting quickly.
I haven't heard about any, but it may be due to diesels being big in Europe, where most people still prefer manual transmissions - so CVT is not a priority there.
CVT is a niche today, but with Nissan's and all hybrids' push it may be no more very soon. Several mfr. tried before and failed, but this one seems to be for real.
I know, but I would hardly call Audi a volume player that would "unniche" the niche. It is really Nissan and Toyota's hybrids that can make this happen.
Just put on a set of JDM STI Forged Alloy BBS 17x8 wheels with 5x100 bolt pattern and Subaru friendly +53mm offset, onto my new REX, shod with Michelin Pilot Sport A/S tires in the 225-45ZR17 size. My car feels a lot more planted and the grip difference can be clearly felt.
Please note that these are not the 17x7.5" BBS wheels of the 04 STI, available in the 5x100 bolt pattern and the same +53 offset....these are wider than those.
Sienna has a lot of things over the Odyssey that are important, most I didn't realize when I bought, this is LE3 vs. Ody EX:
* 3rd row power vented windows (Ody does not even open) * trans oil cooler standard (Ody extra $$$ towing package) * 2nd row tumbles forward (Ody has to be removed) * plays MP3s and WMAs * includes roof rack cross bars (already used them, too) * steering wheel telescopes
juice: Little I can add to this except to say that I had the opportunity to be a passenger in a new Sienna for the first time last week. I don't know what trim level it was but it must've been at the higher end as it had leather seating; however its overhead entertainment system was aftermarket. That said, I came away fairly impressed; I felt as though I was inside a small corporate jet, alhough I had a hard time adjusting the armrest on the captain's chair to a height that was comfortable for me. I can't imagine what it must be like to drive - similar in feel to my wife's Pilot without the body roll from the higher CoG, I suppose.
The one thing is does best is coddle everyone in comfort, tons of elbow room and very good comfort.
The 2007 models dropped the adjustable armrests. Now they just go to one height and stay there.
How's it handle? Um, let's talk about how nicely it rides again...
Seriously, it's very soft, leans a lot.
I don't think this could be my primary driver. It's just too cushy. But remember, I commute in the Miata. The van is more the kids' car, I just happen to be the one driving, but they're always in it.
In summary, it's great to ride in it, not much fun to drive. I'm perfectly fine with that, given its mission - transporting 5 people and a cat (I mean DOG!) plus all else in total comfort for long hauls.
We stock a full complement of snacks and water bottles, too.
One complaint - for all the dozens of cup holders this van has, I wish there was a large, covered console. I'd happily give us the pass-through for a place to store the DVD headphones.
I am thinking its more like most CVTs tend to fall apart under high loads and diesel produce looots of torque. Clearly Subie is aware of that and will do the marraige right. But given what I have seen of CVTs in non-econoboxes I will believe the benefits when I see them.
One complaint - for all the dozens of cup holders this van has, I wish there was a large, covered console. I'd happily give us the pass-through for a place to store the DVD headphones.
The Ramada has HUGE consoles in the front and center rows between the buckets. In the 2nd row it's actually removable and you could put 3 2-liter bottles standing up in it. I have about 20 DVDs in the 2nd row one!
It's possible - don't know about it enought to say one way or another. It looks that Nissan is getting it close to making it right, as its 3.5l has quite a bit of torque and is mated with CVTs in several applications already (Maxima, Altima, Murano) - so based on that I would expect small 4-cylinder turbodiesel (similar torque to 6-cyl DOHC) with CVT should not be very far away in makings.
Center consoles is one thing SUVs and crossovers do better. The Tribeca included. It has a 2 tier storage under the dual arm rests.
The van has an uncovered tray with 4 cupholders and a small compartment. I may shop around for a big console to replace it. My wife never uses the pass-through.
I built a huge console from mahogany for my '69 Econoline. It has about 4 cu ft of storage inside, with a 3" lip above the lid for placing stuff on top and preventing it from sliding off. Works very well for its intended application, but definitely kills the pass-through. :P
I should make something similar (though smaller) for the Caravan.
2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
Not a bad idea, though I doubt I could get the fit and finish to a level I'd find acceptable.
I like the 4 cup holders, but the middle part is just a tray, and things slide off. There is a small covered bin, but it's small. I with it were at least twice as big.
It does have 2 glove boxes so I made room in there for the 2 headphones, at least for now.
If I actually have some time after winter strikes again, I will make one for the Caravan and take some pictures for you. It will be good practice, though a long ways off (probably November/December).
2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
Providing that engine to Toyota could be a good revenue source for Subaru. Drop the top, add Subaru AWD, and I'd buy it. I'd be REALLY happy if it had a certain star cluster on the hood. (Scrambler concept, anyone? Didn't Toyota pledge to have hybrid versions of every car in the lineup?)
I checked out the '08 Impreza yesterday in person, and can it be? Does it not have a coolant temp gauge on the dash? Is Subaru really succumbing to this trend just like Volvo, VW, and other German makes? :-(
Apart from that, I like the look of the new model a lot more than the old, so I am glad I didn't leap into a leftover '07 WRX last week.
And it seems not much else has changed, including the price, so good. Except for the double wishbones at the rear, of course. And frames, finally, for the windows. It would be nice to see standard alloys and a 6-speaker stereo (and keyless entry? Or is it already standard? I couldn't find it on the window sticker of the 2.5i I looked at) on the base model 2.5s now, with a consequent base price increase to around $19,5. I think it would be good for the model's image and wouldn't hurt sales.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I would like to see it come here with optional, not standard, AWD, and the 1.5L engine the Boon has. Slot that in below the Impreza, draw in some sales. Go head to head with the Suzuki SX4. Maybe Subaru could revamp its old 1.8L H-4 from the mid-90s Impreza for use in a new car model?
MT is announcing that Toyota will bring out a Yaris Sport hatch for the '08 MY. The Accent SE is already out there, as is the Fit. There's a little mini-segment growing down around the $14-15K price point, which Subaru could compete in.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I would snap up an AWD Justy in a heartbeat if it could break into low 30s for mpg city. FWD only? Maybe, but it would have to beat Nissan and Toyota first.
2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
Comments
It's not a bad idea. They've been slow as molasses to get the 5 speeds spread throughout the lineup, and the transmission itself is an older design. Sportshift also has been very slow to trickle down the lineup.
I do wonder how the constant rpm will sound like on a boxer engine, which already has a characteristic sound.
Bob
!!
So do I.
The new engine in the Tribeca has a pretty low-rpm torque peak, right? I guess if Subaru could engineer the other engines that way, they wouldn't have to rev much if someone floored it with the CVT.
Me, I really dislike CVTs. I see the financial sense of them for the manufacturer, but I don't think they do much for the consumer. The speedboat or slipping clutch effect is particularly annoying.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Basically, a CVT is without a doubt an upgrade from a 4 speed with no Sportshift, which much of the lineup has.
5 speed Sportshift is a tough call, I think I'd choose the Sportshift over a CVT in that case.
They get better fuel mileage and improve accelleration, both of which benefit the consumer.
My concern is how will they do under heavy duty usage, such as towing?
Bob
I see a potential for them to offer a lower "first" gear and a taller cruising gear. Especially for models with the 3.6l H6. It has enough torque that they could gear it real tall for the highway (under light loads).
I drove Nissan Versa CVT - it was a strange experience, but quite allright.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
2018 430i Gran Coupe
2018 430i Gran Coupe
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Please note that these are not the 17x7.5" BBS wheels of the 04 STI, available in the 5x100 bolt pattern and the same +53 offset....these are wider than those.
-mike
* 3rd row power vented windows (Ody does not even open)
* trans oil cooler standard (Ody extra $$$ towing package)
* 2nd row tumbles forward (Ody has to be removed)
* plays MP3s and WMAs
* includes roof rack cross bars (already used them, too)
* steering wheel telescopes
juice: Little I can add to this except to say that I had the opportunity to be a passenger in a new Sienna for the first time last week. I don't know what trim level it was but it must've been at the higher end as it had leather seating; however its overhead entertainment system was aftermarket. That said, I came away fairly impressed; I felt as though I was inside a small corporate jet, alhough I had a hard time adjusting the armrest on the captain's chair to a height that was comfortable for me. I can't imagine what it must be like to drive - similar in feel to my wife's Pilot without the body roll from the higher CoG, I suppose.
Ed
The 2007 models dropped the adjustable armrests. Now they just go to one height and stay there.
How's it handle? Um, let's talk about how nicely it rides again...
Seriously, it's very soft, leans a lot.
I don't think this could be my primary driver. It's just too cushy. But remember, I commute in the Miata. The van is more the kids' car, I just happen to be the one driving, but they're always in it.
In summary, it's great to ride in it, not much fun to drive. I'm perfectly fine with that, given its mission - transporting 5 people and a cat (I mean DOG!) plus all else in total comfort for long hauls.
-mike
One complaint - for all the dozens of cup holders this van has, I wish there was a large, covered console. I'd happily give us the pass-through for a place to store the DVD headphones.
I may rig a box there somehow.
The Ramada has HUGE consoles in the front and center rows between the buckets. In the 2nd row it's actually removable and you could put 3 2-liter bottles standing up in it. I have about 20 DVDs in the 2nd row one!
-mike
You drive a hotel? No wonder it's got so much room! :P
2018 430i Gran Coupe
The van has an uncovered tray with 4 cupholders and a small compartment. I may shop around for a big console to replace it. My wife never uses the pass-through.
I should make something similar (though smaller) for the Caravan.
I like the 4 cup holders, but the middle part is just a tray, and things slide off. There is a small covered bin, but it's small. I with it were at least twice as big.
It does have 2 glove boxes so I made room in there for the 2 headphones, at least for now.
we'll see outside of $$$ if and how this helps Subaru
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/toyota-fuji-heavy-may-jointly/story.aspx?g- - uid=%7B64460E35%2D2370%2D45E1%2D9CC0%2D983FD4E211BF%7D
Bob
Y2m converts to just under $17K - not much of a sports car IMHO.
Apart from that, I like the look of the new model a lot more than the old, so I am glad I didn't leap into a leftover '07 WRX last week.
And it seems not much else has changed, including the price, so good. Except for the double wishbones at the rear, of course. And frames, finally, for the windows. It would be nice to see standard alloys and a 6-speaker stereo (and keyless entry? Or is it already standard? I couldn't find it on the window sticker of the 2.5i I looked at) on the base model 2.5s now, with a consequent base price increase to around $19,5. I think it would be good for the model's image and wouldn't hurt sales.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
-mike
Bob
2018 430i Gran Coupe
The 08s look ok but I still think my bugeye is best!
from the article:
It's basically a facelifted Daihatsu Boon (small picture). Daihatsu is a subsiduary of Toyota.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
MT is announcing that Toyota will bring out a Yaris Sport hatch for the '08 MY. The Accent SE is already out there, as is the Fit. There's a little mini-segment growing down around the $14-15K price point, which Subaru could compete in.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Bob
B9SC by Scion, perhaps? Scion sB, for SuBaru?
2.0l with 150hp is fine, keep it light and make it a 2 seat roadster.
I am ALL OVER it.
-mike
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I remember seeing one with 150hp from a 2.0l.
That engine would seem a natural fit if they decide to bring that $17k sports car to the US. I bet it would cost $23k by the time it got here, though.