Subaru Crew - Future Models II

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Comments

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Gotcha, thanks for explaining.
  • jeffmcjeffmc Member Posts: 1,742
    I'd bet fifty bucks if Subaru brings a diesel to the US, it'll be clean Blue-tec style. They've filed for trademark on the name "BLUEBOXER". Subaru's calling the engine "SBTD" for Subaru Boxer Turbo Diesel.

    http://tarr.uspto.gov/servlet/tarr?regser=serial&entry=77143394
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    That's a catchy name, and would totally make sense.

    In fact, they should use that name for the model, like VW does with "TDI".
  • jeffmcjeffmc Member Posts: 1,742
    *shrug* Just think about calling the dealership and asking if they've got blue boxers. :D
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    What color are my boxers?

    NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS!

    Oh, you mean the CARS. Sorry 'bout that. :D
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    Don't know if this has been posted yet but Robert Cumberford in the October Automobile finds no redeeming design qualities in the new WRX.

    Discuss.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    No linky for the lazy?

    Subaru is darned if they do, darned if they don't.

    A hard core enthusiasts want them to keep it raw and edgy, and could care less about the more compact rear suspension or the rear leg room.

    The dash strokers found the old one too raw and unrefined, and likened it to a Kia.

    Subaru can't seem to please both, in fact it's probably not possible.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    No linky for the lazy?

    Here you go!! Automobile doesn't post the articles from the latest issue right away.

    http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?p=19251865
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I agree about the rims following the current trend. At NY, Bob and I walked around and must have seen a dozen cars with many thin spokes like that, from every maker. Subaru must have got the memo. :D

    Disagree about the steering wheel. 3 spokes is perfect.

    Now we know what Subaru meant by being more marketing focused vs. engineering focused.

    They upgraded things like the rear suspension to yeild a better ride with no sacrifice in handling, but enthusiasts just aren't going to appreciate that. They see the body roll is still excessive, never mind that the limits are now higher despite narrower tires.

    Also, I'm surprised there is so little talk about the window frames. The lack of them cheapened the feel of the outgoing model and turned a lot of people off. This will make it easier to sell the car to a lot of people, too. Again, more marketing focused, as the old pillars were already rigid.

    It's just a less extreme car. They think this will sell more cars, and they're probably right.
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    As I stated in my response over there, a few post down, I think Cumberford is correct on most (not all) counts. I also think a lot of his criticism about blandness could easily be corrected. For example:

    • Replace the 17" tires and wheels from that of the Legacy 3.0. Those are 215/45x18, and are high-performance all-season tires. The specB. has summer tires, which would be foolish to use on this car (maybe as an option, but not stock). The larger wheel/tire combo will go a long ways in terms of making the car look more aggressive.

    • The iffy grille is also an easy fix.

    • Same with the exhaust tip, an easy fix.

    Those three changes would make a world of difference.

    Some of his other comments, like the interior clock recess being a "dust collector," or the design of the rear quarter window, are just silly and have little or no merit.

    Bob
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Is that mesh grille a factory option? It did look better.

    I do see what he means about the grille sagging in to the bumper, though.

    The rims are fine, I actually like them. They remind me of some Infinitis.
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    It can be port-installed option, which is same as factory in case of Subarus. One delaer got their first units only with this grill. They knew what they were doing.

    You can also get it as an accessory - of course be prepared to pay more for it.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    No problemo - that's what Subaru Bucks were made for.
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,722
    I love the lack of door frames. It gives the car a "sportier" feel, in my opinion, as well as having just one less seal there to leak air and/or water. Oh, well. I guess I am one of "those people" who think cheap is a matter of how well it holds up over time versus appearance. But who am I not to judge the book by its cover? :P
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    I spend mine as they go on service. My last 60K cost me just couple hundred, not six (hint: spark plugs :cry: :mad: ). I need brake job soon - those will help, too. It also gives me freedom to look at other brands, as Subaru is showing me their finger repeatedly with their new "improved" lineups.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    It's cheap because regardless how much they try the door plastic rattle at closing when the window is down. Believe me - I know :cry:

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Actually I don't care for the sport grille. It looks like a cheap aftermarket unit, and not up to Subaru standards.

    As for the rims, they're okay but just don't have the presence that 18" rims have. That really is apparent with the STI test mule that's been shown. Those larger 18" wheels make a world of difference visually.

    Bob
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I think it needs fender flares. The WRC car looks fantastic.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Dunno about sportier, but frameless doors were light and left virtually no blind spots at all. Visibility in the Forester is fantastic, much better than in the new WRX or Tribeca.

    Doors are also light and easy to close.

    I can see, though, that from a mainstream consumer's perspective, they'd be more bothered by the rattle in the door when you slam it with the window half open.

    Nowadays it seems that windows are getting smaller, interiors cocoon and protect the occupants more, at least visually. We keep seeing windows getting smaller.
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    Well - I'm not saying the sport grille is fantastic or anything. However, almost anything looks better than standard "sebring" grille.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I like the sport grille, and would definitely be willing to pay extra to have it.
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Window seals have never been an issue on the frameless windows on subies. I had 2 XT6s which were coupes and frameless. When I got rid of both of them over 15 years old the original window seals were still sealing w/o issue. No noise or water leakage.

    -mike
  • jeffmcjeffmc Member Posts: 1,742
    This discussion should be taking place in the "2008 Subaru Impreza WRX" thread, as this is no longer a future model. I got all excited when I logged in & saw 17 new posts... thought we got some info about an upcoming Subie ('09 Forester? '09 WRX STI? Legacy Tuned By STI?).
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I have no issue with mine, but a shopper slams the doors and doesn't hear the satisfing thunk he wants to unless the windows are all the way up.

    Remember, it's marketing over engineering now.
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,722
    I liked the satisfying "thunk" of closing the doors with the windows all the way down. Granted, the glass (where did plastic come in??) would rattle if the windows were between one inch and 1/2 way down, but the only times my window was in that region was either on the way up, or the way down. I am a man of extremes. :P

    Yay for marketing! :sick:
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I may not like it, you may not like it, but Subaru is trying to appeal to a (mostly uninformed) average consumer, and little things like that, the lack of VSC, and other quirks turned them off in the past.

    I swear, I read the Automobile and Road & Track reviews at lunch today at a newsstand, and they basically argue that they wanted the car to stay ugly. I don't get that argument at all.
  • tifightertifighter Member Posts: 3,800
    And remember that every one hated the looks of the bugeye when it came out and preferred the original Impreza design. Not counting the WRX, I bet they sold a lot more of the standard 2002+ Imprezas than before...

    25 NX 450h+ / 24 Sienna Plat AWD / 23 Civic Type-R / 21 Boxster GTS 4.0

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Yeah, while the outrage over the 2008's looks got more press, I'd have to say the opinions on the 2002 were actually worse.

    Seems like whenever anyone doesn't like a Subaru's styling they automatically compare it to a Kia, even when no Kia looks anything like it! :D

    Any how, there was near-universal agreement that the GC8 Impreza was the best looking model ever, yet sales still doubled.
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    they basically argue that they wanted the car to stay ugly. I don't get that argument at all

    There are certain vehicles that each of us doesn't mind seeing. We wouldn't necessarily buy them (actually we wouldn't even think about buying), but we like seeing them around. Subaru is such a brand for many people, especially those in business of writing about cars.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    I loved bugeye and was really sorry to see it go in'04 :cry: . Then '06 look was really good in front - I think it was best looking Impreza grille. I guess Tribeca abomination was just too great to bear (even it was waaay more refined) so they had to scrap it, too. No we get Sebring front - definitely not an upgrade.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Understood, but it seems most of the poeple that think that way didn't own a WRX.
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,722
    Yep, there is no pleasing those with no interest in being pleased.

    I am more easy-going than that when it comes to style. I prefer function over form, so I can overlook quite a few styling quirks before my interest walks away. I certainly would not write off a Subaru just because framed windows were added. I may be disappointed, but it is my choice to feel that way.

    Today's cars are not fine wines to be savored; they are commodities to be used. If consumers want the cars to change, then they darn well need to be willing to accept change. "We want change!" "OMG! Why did you change it?!" Hahahah, it cracks me up. In the end, though, it is the sales numbers that provide the feedback to the manufacturer. :P
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • jeffmcjeffmc Member Posts: 1,742
    Apparently, Subaru has recently applied for trademark in several countries for the name "Exiga", which was a concept vehicle from 13 or 14 years ago. There were a couple different Exiga looks over the years. One was an incredibly angular wagon... sort of an XT look. A later iteration posted below seemed much more of a production-ready look... but it's still 10 years old, so a look would've changed since then.
    image
    Seems like Subaru may be selling a people-mover soon.
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,722
    Maybe they are going to turn it into a mini-van! I keep hoping...
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • movedormovedor Member Posts: 65
    Probably it will be a tribeca with sliding doors :-)
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    I rather see them mirror Audi's lineup in terms of their cars.

    A4 = Impreza
    A6 = Legacy
    A8 = ??

    I really think that Subaru needs a larger sedan vehicle. I'd love to see the next Legacy based off the tribecca wider/longer with a 3.6Turbo and 5MT or 6MT that would give the A6/S6 a run for it's money.

    -mike
  • volkovvolkov Member Posts: 1,306
    Probably it will be a tribeca with sliding doors :-)

    Hopefully a better 3rd row and a better price. Meet those two criteria and I'd buy it tomorrow.
    We can only get the Tribeca 3rd row in the top of the line model which clocks in at over $50k US and full of stuff I don't want.
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    I rather see them mirror Audi's lineup in terms of their cars.

    A4 = Impreza
    A6 = Legacy
    A8 = ??

    Not even close... Just looks at list of standard features and options and you see - not even close. Sizewise as well - isn't current A4 larger than Legacy?

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Well I think they just need to come out with something A6 size and powerwise, as for features, they don't need to necessarily have all the gee-jaws that the audis have but something size and performancewise they can match em.

    -mike
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    Perhaps, but Impreza is more of A3 now and Legacy may be considered a match (barely) to A4. So before they get into A8, let them develop A6 match.

    Featurewise - I agree there is no need for excess but they're still lagging behind best popular Japanese brands in both lower and higher end trims, let alone Germans. So let them fix that first before we start seriously talking about competition with Audi or BMW. That was the single biggest mistake Takenaka (was his name?) made when announced their upscale fiasco. It looked like they honestly thought that it was enough to throw nicer exterior, interior and big power to call yourself such. We all know where it ended up and everybody else thought. So as much as I would love to say Subaru is in the conversation, they're not - by a clear margin.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    I compare them to Audi in that there is no other AWD choice across the board with a GOOD AWD system and performance. Yeah you could throw out there the Tarus and a few other AWD options but really performance-wise the Audi line is the only one even remotely comprable to the Subies. The next legacy will be larger and hopefully in the A6 size range :)

    One can only hope!

    -mike
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    Actually - I don't. Larger Legacy will likely mean for me final departure, but lets wait and see first. I do actually like current Legacy size and charachteristics - it just falls short on some content (and did I mention no wagon? ;) ) - if they make it same size as Altima or Accord - well... It may still be OK, but job of making it nimble will be much tougher. And no - Impreza/WRX are not even close in replacing current Legacy. For more than just one reason.

    I'm under impression that they are not only not listening to me. It's much worse - they DO listed to make sure they'll do exactly oposite as I say :cry: :mad: :cry: :mad:

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • tifightertifighter Member Posts: 3,800
    Remember that Subaru, as a small company, focuses on platforms/models that sell world wide. The A6 would be considered a big car in all of Asia and most of Europe. While we complain that the Legacy is too small (I'd like a bigger one), it is probably the right size for the rest of the world. The big Accords and Camrys we have here sell here only; sure they export them to other countries, but they do not sell out there in any meaningful numbers. I think if they go bigger, it has to be a new model, but since Subie is small, a new model is a very expensive proposition.

    25 NX 450h+ / 24 Sienna Plat AWD / 23 Civic Type-R / 21 Boxster GTS 4.0

  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Well to be honest I know of at least 10-12 families who loved their 90s legacies who have left the Subaru family, not because they disliked the subies, but because they simply needed a larger sedan. They have moved to Camry, Accord, A6, Passat, etc. I don't care if it's a "new" model or the new legacy, they clearly need a larger vehicle. Hopefully and most likely the next legacy will be based on the tribecca platform which is wider and longer. :)

    -mike
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Actually - I don't. Larger Legacy will likely mean for me final departure, but lets wait and see first.

    Well then, you had better start looking, as I have it on good authority that the next Legacy will indeed be larger than the current one. It won't be as big as the huge '08 Accord, but it will definitely be bigger than the current car.

    Bob
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    That's what the CEO told us last year during the 48hrs as well. :)

    -mike
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    I guess if it's not too big, it may be OK. Like I said - I will keep my judgement until it comes.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I'd like to see that come here to compete with the successful Mazda4 and Kia Rondo. Note that neither offers AWD as of yet, so Subaru would the first.

    Honda is supposed to bring theirs, too.

    I like the boxy rear end and the proportions, but the fender flares are a bit overdone (remind me of the Ford Freestyle) and the headlights aren't as well executed as the Ford Fiesta's, for instance.

    Still, the proportions are just right.
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    What is Mazda4? Never heard of it. There is Mazda3, Mazda5, Mazda6...

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    5, I meant. Pardon the typo!
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