Hey, there was a Japanese company displaying at the farm show here in CA, selling off-road small used trucks from Japan. Looks like Subaru has a model...
Can't find a single search result for "Mahoney" or "Subaru" or "WRX" on the carcrazycentral website. Also, one of the R&T forum posters mentioned the interview being on Youtube, but I could not find that interview there. On the other hand, the "SOABlog" forum poster on nabisco seems to check out as legit. It's interesting... was something removed from carcrazycentral and/or youtube? If so, because it was false info, or because it was true (and proprietary) info. Seems pretty weird that Tim Mahoney would let something deliberately "slip". Maybe it's all a red herring thrown out by SOA. :surprise:
one of the R&T forum posters mentioned the interview being on Youtube, but I could not find that interview there.
I was looking for it as well but I don't have enough time to 'research' for it. It was confirmed that the information about the 2010 WRX is legit. SOA has a reputation of tearing down sites with any factual information, as we've seen it done in Nabisco. I wouldn't be surprised if it's been removed, but the cat is out of the bag now. Damage control? Possibly.... SOA Blog is a legit employee of SOA, though I doubt with any power. If they were told to get on Nabisco and other sites to deny information and build a smoke screen, that's what they'll do. One thing I know is someone in SOA knows the truth on what happened... whether SOA Blog denies it or was told to deny it, it's still a lie. As a matter of fact, if you search on the N&R forum, SOA Blog has lied about something else, when questioned in that thread link Bob has in his blog.
Personally, SOA did this to themselves. How many people could've been in that event listening to that interview? Sorry, you can't cover the sky with your bare hand.
I agree - nobody would talk openly about the competition in such awe. More power in response to better styling is a stupid idea anyway - but saying it in open language would be a certifiable insanity.
Even the content - a power boost seems like common sense, by then the Legacy will move to a 3.6l H6.
By the way, I bet the power is the same as what the Legacy gets now, 243, not 260.
Look at this logically - the 3.6l makes 256hp. There is no way, no how, heeeeeeeck no they are not going to let the mid-line WRX have more power than the flagship Tribeca.
Anyone can pose as an executive.
Do you remember that prank where someone drove around in a fake "Blue Devil" Corvette, and it turned out to be a plain one with foam fender flares? Everyone fell for it.
People want to believe it, so they will. 260 sounds great.
The 2010 WRX will get the current Legacy GT engine, mark my words. 243hp, maybe a tweak to get it up a couple more than that. But it will not make more power than the 3.6l.
Well I expect that even the 3.6 will put out more power by 2010.
Juice I don't agree with you about SOA not allowing the WRX to have more power than the Tribeca. It's a completely different audience. Using your logic, the Tribeca should have more power than the STI.
A few points to be made:
• The Tribeca was rushed into an early mid-cycle refresh (2 years rather than the normal 3 years) because it was doing so poorly. I suspect the WRX will suffer the same fate. Yes, the Impreza is doing great in sales, but I suspect not so much so for the WRX. You've read the reviews. Most people are disappointed with it.
• What was posted in that R&T so-called interview, in terms of product upgrades, make so much sense that it hurts. The interview may well be fake, but I suspect—whoever this person is—has or had some access to some future WRX info. Maybe he heard heard from a friend who works at SOA, and thought this would be a good way to get the info out there? I would be very surprised if those upgrades do not happen.
The interview may well be fake, but I suspect—whoever this person is—has or had some access to some future WRX info.
Man, judging by their recent "achievements", you give way too much credit to their execs. I'm more inclined to think the interview was fake all the way - only a consumer would make so much sense, not koolaid drinking insider.
The SOA Blogger is legit. However I have, from high inside SOA, that it's been long in the making, that they plan to get more involved in forums, similar to the way Patti used to be involved here at Edmunds. SOA Blogger will also not be a single person but a team of SOA folks acting in an official capacity.
As for 3.6L power, it will have 300hp in 2010 in the Legacy, and I agree with Juice in that the WRX will get the current 2.5L Legacy motor setup.
We should all be very happy to see SOA Blogger out there, perhaps this will allow Patti to get back on here with us on Edmunds.
Until we have the details of what will be in the 2010 WRX in writing, everything out there is a rumor, up to and including my idea that the 3.6L will have 300hp in the 2010 Legacy, and as such anyone acting in an official SOA capacity will deny anything not published in official documents.
Given all these big Subie changes that are coming relatively soon in "car years", I really wonder if this is the time to get anything from the Impreza or Outback/Legacy lines.
I'm not thrilled about sinking a lot of bucks into an '08 outback or Impreza WRX only to see it get dramatically improved within 2 years. But yes, all the changes (save making the Outback even bigger) sound very worthwhile.
more and more power, how about stepping up the use of aluminum and employing a range of other methods to substantially reduce weight? It would be really nice if the weight of Impreza and WRX were well under 3000 pounds.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I think we will see weight reduction in future models to help meet the upcoming US fuel economy standards increase. I know Subaru's at least studying it, because I received a survey from them about it several months ago.
Seems like the next 5 years are going to bring a lot of changes to the vehicles offered in the US. Electrics, diesels, more hybrids, advanced materials. Exciting and interesting times. (To go off-topic a little, anyone see that "Loremo" car in the news? Going into production for sale in Europe next year and US possibly in 2010? 2.0 turbodiesel with emphasis on light weight & excellent aerodynamics, 2+2 seating, $22k base price, gets up to 150 MPG.)
So if we are willing to pay more for the cars, sure you can get an infinitely light car. Problem is things like aluminum have increased in raw material cost in the past year by A LOT.
Yup. In my survey, I indicated I was willing to pay more for lightweight materials, but it will be a hard thing every manufacturer will be looking at accomplishing to meet the new standards. In addition to drivetrain & aerodynamics, vehicles will simply have to shed the pounds somehow without decreasing safety or making vehicles unaffordable.
Well I expect that even the 3.6 will put out more power by 2010
I hope you're right, but I'll believe that when I see it. The 3.0l H6 came out with 212hp in 2001 and stayed that way for 4 model years, thru 2004. They finally beefed up power for 2005, and the 2008s still make that same power now. 5-6-7-8 is another 4 years and no power boost in sight, even now, so it'll probably go at least 5 years.
The 3.6l came out in 2008 - will it get more power in 2010? Just 2 years? It's still brand new. That would be a big surprise to me.
Using your logic, the Tribeca should have more power than the STI.
The STI is their in-house tuner car, so any normal rules do not apply. I did say their mid-line WRX would not beat the flagship. STI is a special exception.
I'd love to see a break down of Impreza sales to see if the WRX really is down.
As for the "make so much sense that it hurts" part, well, yes, but that's exactly why people want to believe it.
The WRX still has a 4EAT, don't you think that would be upgraded first? Subaru takes baby steps. A little at a time. I think a CVT will replace the 4EAT in 2009 or 2010. 2010 it will get the 243hp Legacy GT engine. The 2010 Legacy will go to the 3.6l from the Tribeca.
That keeps the hierarchy undisturbed, plus it meets the pattern of upgrades Subaru has done in the past - slow and deliberate.
I hope you're right, but I'll believe that when I see it. The 3.0l H6 came out with 212hp in 2001 and stayed that way for 4 model years, thru 2004. They finally beefed up power for 2005, and the 2008s still make that same power now. 5-6-7-8 is another 4 years and no power boost in sight, even now, so it'll probably go at least 5 years.
The 3.6l came out in 2008 - will it get more power in 2010? Just 2 years? It's still brand new. That would be a big surprise to me.
I've been told by a good source, the 3.6L was detuned to 250hp due to the 5EAT in the Tribeca not being able to handle the power. For the legacy they said it will have the 6MT and a new AT or CVT to handle the 300hp NA power.
The WRX still has a 4EAT, don't you think that would be upgraded first?
Not sure. Normally I would say yes, but so few WRX buyers opt for the automatic I'd probably be inclined to say a power boost first for this car.
The '09 Forester remains with the 4EAT, so that's not a good sign for the '09 WRX getting the 5EAT. If the '09 WRX remains with the 4EAT, then I see the '10 model getting both a tranny and engine upgrade.
I, too, think they'll stick w/their current auto trannies 'til the CVT debuts. Wonder how much the CVTs will be able to handle, power-wise. I think there'll be CVTs in all the standard models, same ol' 5-spd MTs in the base models, and the DSG in any STI or range-topping Legacy.
According to Wikipedia, the 2010 Outback will be based on the Exiga, which is supposed to go on sale in Japan sometime this year, maybe as early as this summer. This makes sense to me, as I had heard that the next Outback, unlike in the past, would differ quite a bit from the Legacy.
The latest Exiga concept was shown at the Tokyo show last fall. It looked like a tall Legacy wagon, but with seating for seven.
My guess is the 2010 Exigia-based Outback will still seat 5, at least until the Tribeca gets larger in 2011. It wouldn't surprise me if the the 2110 Tribeca comes only as a 7-passenger vehicle, simply because a 5-passenger Outback and a 5-passenger Tribeca would butt heads in the marketplace.
To me it it's a Mazda5 with AWD, and I don't think that's a bad thing. As I said before, if it met that functionality, we'd likely already have one. By that I mean adequate seating for 6, good fuel economy and economical pricing. The Tribeca ended up failing on a few of those requirements. There is actually better footwell and leg room in the Mazda than the B9 when one sits in it. Where would pricing be? Bridging between Leg and Outback? Mazda has the 5 and the CX-9, why couldn't Subaru have both the Exiga and Tribeca with 6/7 passenger configurations? Make the Exiga less luxury, smaller engine and less $$ and it would be in it's own niche too. Frustrating seeing the possible future options, but right now we are this close to getting the Highlander Hybrid. As a 3 row vehicle it has it's shortcomings too, but there is something to be said for driving around town with a family of 6 and getting almost double the fuel economy of the Tribeca. Expect we'll put down a deposit if the dealer can find $500-1000 of haggle room.
Bob, that's a wiki page that could have been created by anyone though.
I think it'll be larger than the exige though.
Interestingly, I looked into the A6 Avant, and there is no MT available in it. Heck the only MT enabled wagon in the mid-size range is the BMW 5 series wagon as far as I know. So an MT in the OB and/or Legacy wagon will make it unique.
Want to start a rolling brainstorm -- predict the 2005 Subaru lineup. Rules are: Make it a combination of your preference and prediction -- don't assume Subaru has unlimited $, even w/GM. Do assume Subaru wants to sell more cars, and that means reaching more market niches if not mainstream market, yet does not want to stray from core strengths. To stir it up, here's my lineup suggestion using existing platform lineup:
IMPREZA -- becomes sub-brand and expands ... 1.base model -- sedan and sta wgn., 2.5 engine but better mpg figures, price kept low to challenge Civic, Corolla, Protege, Focus it's a dealer advertising loss leader
2. Plus model -- same engine, 6 sp. manual, nicer insides including opt. leather, seat warmers, power driver seat, trip computer
3. WRX -- 6 sp. man., Recaro seats, possible Panoz model (appearance add-ons only), finds itself in buff book comparos with BMW 3-sries and winning handily. coupe returns
4. High-mileage hybrid-engine model? Only if GM pops for it.
FORESTER -- becomes sub-brand w/3 models 1. current model redesigned 2002/2003, bigger than current model or new Impreza (backseat woes solved) now called the Forester Sacajewea (can't spell it) after the FEMALE scout who led Lewis & Clark; breakthough name to aggressively appeal to female market (hey, it's a brainstorm, Okay? no bad ideas in a brainstorm)
2. STX pickup -- base modeal and LL Bean model with outdoor add-ons to execute Aztek concept the right way
3. Macho looking but slightly undersized minivan (a la new Mazda), but has the six cyl. to solve Mazda's problem, AWD of course, nicely tricked out to further eat away at big 3 minivans, handles well, accelerates well, designed for the soccer mom w/attitude who doesn't mind breaking a nail now and then, and the husband who feels embarrased in an Odyssey, Town and Country or other.
LEGACY -- fading, loss leader base sedan and wagon (blaah --stays in lineup only so dealers have newspaper ad price leader along with Impreza base)
OUTBACK -- expanded to three models 1. Outback Classic -- continuation of current wagon with current features, engine w/ more low-end torque, possible addition of nav. system, OnStar, smoother transmission thanks to GM; appeals to people whose previous car was Grand Cherokee or other landed gentry SUV, but now want something smaller, more manageable -- but still virile -- in their AARP years. 2. Outback Summit -- new, true SUV, built off Legacy platform but 4-6 inches longer, 1-2 inches wider and 3 inches higher with more macho look (Sub's version of Toyo Highlander)and the 6-cyl with hp. beef-up, hits the 20 mpg EPA city mark, auto. only of course. Possible name: Summit (used before, but don't forget, Plymouth once called their wagons "Suburbans" yet Chevy continues to succeed w/the name)
3. sedan -- I'm stumped -- more GT-like or more Outback like? Does it die -- if so, no Legacy sedan at all because Legacy base model sales won't fund cost of the sedan body. Sub. should not try the Accord/Camry/Taurus/Intrigue/etc. Hopefully learned its lesson in the mid 90s.
Bob, that's a wiki page that could have been created by anyone though.
True, but that doesn't discount the fact that I've heard that the next Outback will diverge somewhat more from the Legacy this time around. So, knowing that, and that Subaru is a master of of parts-bin usage, it makes sense (to me) that the Exiga—which also appears to be Legacy-based, would be the model from which it would develop from.
09 WRX will have the following 243+ hp stiffer suspension different wheels/tires sport grille standard redesigned sport body kit to look more agressive and sleek
on sale date: Sept 08
I called the engine first.
This strategy makes complete sense.
The current WRX is more of a GT anyway, Bob's made that point all along.
Add some flare from the STI to the WRX, and give it the Legacy engine.
They should even consider a tiny bit of cost cutting to bring down GT pricing, so it bridges the gap to the 2.5i.
Would not suprise me to see the GT be dead. We are just about 1 year out from the MY10 Legacy launch, so they can extend the 08MY and the 09 MY will be VERY short as is traditional for the Subarus on a bridge year.
the piece in the last Autoweek on the new diesel Outback - verrry interesting! It is rated 49 in the Euro cycle where the 2.5NA gets a rating of 32. I figure that will mean it makes high 30s, maybe 40, in everyday use. Now that's an Outback I could get interested in! But then they go on to say that with the extra bells and whistles they would need to add to make it EPA-compliant here, they would also probably add some power. I bet that means fuel economy will decrease. Why would they do that, why? It already has more than 250 lb-ft of torque - the thing will move out smartly without adding yet more power.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I think this is very exciting. Subaru ran an R1e test fleet with Tokyo Electric Power Co before deciding to sell it to the public in Japan (avail. in '09 if I remember correctly). Couple this with the Subaru's recent announcement that it wants to be the leading manufacturer of electric vehicles (http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/03/06/geneva-2008-subaru-wants-to-be-tops-in-e- vs/) and... I think the R1e, or more likely the larger G4e concept, could reach the US. I'd love to own one. :shades:
I don't think we'll see a Subaru electric in the US 'til the G4e is ready. I think R1e's going on sale to the public late '09 or early '10 in Japan, so if it came here at all, I'd expect it to be 2011 or 2012 at the earliest. Perhaps G4e would be ready by then anyway. The only thing that gets my hopes up for anything sooner is FHI President Ikuo Mori's statement earlier this month: "Subaru's goal is to become the leading brand in the electric vehicle market."
I wish they'd sell the R1e in select US metro areas in the interim... I think some US urbanites are ready, and it may also be a good way to make further inroads into trendy SoCal. The R1e is a pretty old design, bodywise, however. It's the last remaining model with the Tribeca-style "airplane fuselage/wings" grille, but it adds character to the R1e. I wouldn't be surprised to see an update on it before its public launch.
I hope it looks much more like the concept, which had a nice glass roof (important to add spacious interior feeling to a small car, and accents the vehicles swooping profile). For comparison, here's the R1: And here's the sporty-looking R1e concept, which I like much better:
No doubt the R1e concept looks much better the wimpy R1. Now, if they are serious about bringing R1e to US, they should get rid of the 2nd row seats. In such small vehicle (for US standards) it would be useles, except maybe for *small* kids.
Comments
http://www.minitruckdealer.com/stock_details.php?stock_no=144
I wonder where you get parts for these little trucks?
John
They can be found on the SOJ site.
http://www.subaru.jp/index.html
Bob
Bob
I was looking for it as well but I don't have enough time to 'research' for it. It was confirmed that the information about the 2010 WRX is legit. SOA has a reputation of tearing down sites with any factual information, as we've seen it done in Nabisco. I wouldn't be surprised if it's been removed, but the cat is out of the bag now. Damage control? Possibly.... SOA Blog is a legit employee of SOA, though I doubt with any power. If they were told to get on Nabisco and other sites to deny information and build a smoke screen, that's what they'll do. One thing I know is someone in SOA knows the truth on what happened... whether SOA Blog denies it or was told to deny it, it's still a lie. As a matter of fact, if you search on the N&R forum, SOA Blog has lied about something else, when questioned in that thread link Bob has in his blog.
Personally, SOA did this to themselves. How many people could've been in that event listening to that interview? Sorry, you can't cover the sky with your bare hand.
The interview as posted on R&T forums seems bogus to me. A CEO doesn't speak in that manner. Not even close.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
By the way, I bet the power is the same as what the Legacy gets now, 243, not 260.
Look at this logically - the 3.6l makes 256hp. There is no way, no how, heeeeeeeck no they are not going to let the mid-line WRX have more power than the flagship Tribeca.
Anyone can pose as an executive.
Do you remember that prank where someone drove around in a fake "Blue Devil" Corvette, and it turned out to be a plain one with foam fender flares? Everyone fell for it.
Link: http://www.autoblog.com/2006/12/01/report-blue-devil-prototype-faked-by-winding-- road/
People want to believe it, so they will. 260 sounds great.
The 2010 WRX will get the current Legacy GT engine, mark my words. 243hp, maybe a tweak to get it up a couple more than that. But it will not make more power than the 3.6l.
The funny thing is my wife is in PR.
I should team up with her. We could pitch to Subaru as our first client.
Juice I don't agree with you about SOA not allowing the WRX to have more power than the Tribeca. It's a completely different audience. Using your logic, the Tribeca should have more power than the STI.
A few points to be made:
• The Tribeca was rushed into an early mid-cycle refresh (2 years rather than the normal 3 years) because it was doing so poorly. I suspect the WRX will suffer the same fate. Yes, the Impreza is doing great in sales, but I suspect not so much so for the WRX. You've read the reviews. Most people are disappointed with it.
• What was posted in that R&T so-called interview, in terms of product upgrades, make so much sense that it hurts. The interview may well be fake, but I suspect—whoever this person is—has or had some access to some future WRX info. Maybe he heard heard from a friend who works at SOA, and thought this would be a good way to get the info out there? I would be very surprised if those upgrades do not happen.
Bob
Man, judging by their recent "achievements", you give way too much credit to their execs. I'm more inclined to think the interview was fake all the way - only a consumer would make so much sense, not koolaid drinking insider.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
As for 3.6L power, it will have 300hp in 2010 in the Legacy, and I agree with Juice in that the WRX will get the current 2.5L Legacy motor setup.
We should all be very happy to see SOA Blogger out there, perhaps this will allow Patti to get back on here with us on Edmunds.
Until we have the details of what will be in the 2010 WRX in writing, everything out there is a rumor, up to and including my idea that the 3.6L will have 300hp in the 2010 Legacy, and as such anyone acting in an official SOA capacity will deny anything not published in official documents.
-mike
Motorsports and Modifications Host
I'm not thrilled about sinking a lot of bucks into an '08 outback or Impreza WRX only to see it get dramatically improved within 2 years.
But yes, all the changes (save making the Outback even bigger) sound very worthwhile.
Hopefully all of Subaru's boxer engines will receive the direct injection treatment by then, eh?
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Seems like the next 5 years are going to bring a lot of changes to the vehicles offered in the US. Electrics, diesels, more hybrids, advanced materials. Exciting and interesting times. (To go off-topic a little, anyone see that "Loremo" car in the news? Going into production for sale in Europe next year and US possibly in 2010? 2.0 turbodiesel with emphasis on light weight & excellent aerodynamics, 2+2 seating, $22k base price, gets up to 150 MPG.)
So if we are willing to pay more for the cars, sure you can get an infinitely light car. Problem is things like aluminum have increased in raw material cost in the past year by A LOT.
-mike
Motorsports and Modifications Host
-mike
Motorsports and Modifications Host
I hope you're right, but I'll believe that when I see it. The 3.0l H6 came out with 212hp in 2001 and stayed that way for 4 model years, thru 2004. They finally beefed up power for 2005, and the 2008s still make that same power now. 5-6-7-8 is another 4 years and no power boost in sight, even now, so it'll probably go at least 5 years.
The 3.6l came out in 2008 - will it get more power in 2010? Just 2 years? It's still brand new. That would be a big surprise to me.
Using your logic, the Tribeca should have more power than the STI.
The STI is their in-house tuner car, so any normal rules do not apply. I did say their mid-line WRX would not beat the flagship. STI is a special exception.
I'd love to see a break down of Impreza sales to see if the WRX really is down.
As for the "make so much sense that it hurts" part, well, yes, but that's exactly why people want to believe it.
The WRX still has a 4EAT, don't you think that would be upgraded first? Subaru takes baby steps. A little at a time. I think a CVT will replace the 4EAT in 2009 or 2010. 2010 it will get the 243hp Legacy GT engine. The 2010 Legacy will go to the 3.6l from the Tribeca.
That keeps the hierarchy undisturbed, plus it meets the pattern of upgrades Subaru has done in the past - slow and deliberate.
Bob
The 3.6l came out in 2008 - will it get more power in 2010? Just 2 years? It's still brand new. That would be a big surprise to me.
I've been told by a good source, the 3.6L was detuned to 250hp due to the 5EAT in the Tribeca not being able to handle the power. For the legacy they said it will have the 6MT and a new AT or CVT to handle the 300hp NA power.
-mike
Not sure. Normally I would say yes, but so few WRX buyers opt for the automatic I'd probably be inclined to say a power boost first for this car.
The '09 Forester remains with the 4EAT, so that's not a good sign for the '09 WRX getting the 5EAT. If the '09 WRX remains with the 4EAT, then I see the '10 model getting both a tranny and engine upgrade.
Bob
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subaru_Exiga
http://blogs.edmunds.com/Straightline/.ee9fc5b
The latest Exiga concept was shown at the Tokyo show last fall. It looked like a tall Legacy wagon, but with seating for seven.
My guess is the 2010 Exigia-based Outback will still seat 5, at least until the Tribeca gets larger in 2011. It wouldn't surprise me if the the 2110 Tribeca comes only as a 7-passenger vehicle, simply because a 5-passenger Outback and a 5-passenger Tribeca would butt heads in the marketplace.
Bob
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Frustrating seeing the possible future options, but right now we are this close to getting the Highlander Hybrid. As a 3 row vehicle it has it's shortcomings too, but there is something to be said for driving around town with a family of 6 and getting almost double the fuel economy of the Tribeca. Expect we'll put down a deposit if the dealer can find $500-1000 of haggle room.
I think it'll be larger than the exige though.
Interestingly, I looked into the A6 Avant, and there is no MT available in it. Heck the only MT enabled wagon in the mid-size range is the BMW 5 series wagon as far as I know. So an MT in the OB and/or Legacy wagon will make it unique.
-mike
Motorsports and Modifications Host
In any vehicle, driving in the sand it messy. Your undercarriage will get filthy with salt and sand, so make sure you wash it thoroughly.
I had to do that twice!
IMPREZA -- becomes sub-brand and expands ...
1.base model -- sedan and sta wgn., 2.5 engine but better mpg figures, price kept low to challenge Civic, Corolla, Protege, Focus it's a dealer advertising loss leader
2. Plus model -- same engine, 6 sp. manual, nicer insides including opt. leather, seat warmers, power driver seat, trip computer
3. WRX -- 6 sp. man., Recaro seats, possible Panoz model (appearance add-ons only), finds itself in buff book comparos with BMW 3-sries and winning handily. coupe returns
4. High-mileage hybrid-engine model? Only if GM pops for it.
FORESTER -- becomes sub-brand w/3 models
1. current model redesigned 2002/2003, bigger than current model or new Impreza (backseat woes solved) now called the Forester Sacajewea (can't spell it) after the FEMALE scout who led Lewis & Clark; breakthough name to aggressively appeal to female market (hey, it's a brainstorm, Okay? no bad ideas in a brainstorm)
2. STX pickup -- base modeal and LL Bean model with outdoor add-ons to execute Aztek concept the right way
3. Macho looking but slightly undersized minivan (a la new Mazda), but has the six cyl. to solve Mazda's problem, AWD of course, nicely tricked out to further eat away at big 3 minivans, handles well, accelerates well, designed for the soccer mom w/attitude who doesn't mind breaking a nail now and then, and the husband who feels embarrased in an Odyssey, Town and Country or other.
LEGACY --
fading, loss leader base sedan and wagon (blaah --stays in lineup only so dealers have newspaper ad price leader along with Impreza base)
OUTBACK -- expanded to three models
1. Outback Classic -- continuation of current wagon with current features, engine w/ more low-end torque, possible addition of nav. system, OnStar, smoother transmission thanks to GM; appeals to people whose previous car was Grand Cherokee or other landed gentry SUV, but now want something smaller, more manageable -- but still virile -- in their AARP years.
2. Outback Summit -- new, true SUV, built off Legacy platform but 4-6 inches longer, 1-2 inches wider and 3 inches higher with more macho look (Sub's version of Toyo Highlander)and the 6-cyl with hp. beef-up, hits the 20 mpg EPA city mark, auto. only of course. Possible name: Summit (used before, but don't forget, Plymouth once called their wagons "Suburbans" yet Chevy continues to succeed w/the name)
3. sedan -- I'm stumped -- more GT-like or more Outback like? Does it die -- if so, no Legacy sedan at all because Legacy base model sales won't fund cost of the sedan body. Sub. should not try the Accord/Camry/Taurus/Intrigue/etc. Hopefully learned its lesson in the mid 90s.
True, but that doesn't discount the fact that I've heard that the next Outback will diverge somewhat more from the Legacy this time around. So, knowing that, and that Subaru is a master of of parts-bin usage, it makes sense (to me) that the Exiga—which also appears to be Legacy-based, would be the model from which it would develop from.
Bob
I agree that the OB will diverge from the legacy a bit this time around.
-mike
Motorsports and Modifications Host
Bob
2018 430i Gran Coupe
243+ hp
stiffer suspension
different wheels/tires
sport grille standard
redesigned sport body kit to look more agressive and sleek
on sale date: Sept 08
I called the engine first.
This strategy makes complete sense.
The current WRX is more of a GT anyway, Bob's made that point all along.
Add some flare from the STI to the WRX, and give it the Legacy engine.
They should even consider a tiny bit of cost cutting to bring down GT pricing, so it bridges the gap to the 2.5i.
-mike
Motorsports and Modifications Host
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Seriously, though, we are sort of expecting a million things to happen all in the same model year.
CVT, diesel, new Legacy, new Outback, new engines, etc.
http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/03/17/breaking-subaru-expanding-r1e-pilot-prog- ram-to-ny/
I think this is very exciting. Subaru ran an R1e test fleet with Tokyo Electric Power Co before deciding to sell it to the public in Japan (avail. in '09 if I remember correctly). Couple this with the Subaru's recent announcement that it wants to be the leading manufacturer of electric vehicles (http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/03/06/geneva-2008-subaru-wants-to-be-tops-in-e- vs/) and... I think the R1e, or more likely the larger G4e concept, could reach the US. I'd love to own one. :shades:
Call it R2D2, naturally.
I wish they'd sell the R1e in select US metro areas in the interim... I think some US urbanites are ready, and it may also be a good way to make further inroads into trendy SoCal. The R1e is a pretty old design, bodywise, however. It's the last remaining model with the Tribeca-style "airplane fuselage/wings" grille, but it adds character to the R1e. I wouldn't be surprised to see an update on it before its public launch.
I hope it looks much more like the concept, which had a nice glass roof (important to add spacious interior feeling to a small car, and accents the vehicles swooping profile). For comparison, here's the R1:
And here's the sporty-looking R1e concept, which I like much better:
Now, if they are serious about bringing R1e to US, they should get rid of the 2nd row seats. In such small vehicle (for US standards) it would be useles, except maybe for *small* kids.