Lease Questions - Ask Here

CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

Good morning, Richard. When General Motors introduced their current $2,002 bonus cash incentive program (which may be used on leases to reduce their capitalized cost) they basically did away with all of their supported lease rates except for on Cadillacs. So if you were to lease a 2002 Buick Rendevous through General Motors Acceptance Corp. right now, you would have to use a 36 month lease rate of 6.5% and a 15,000 miles per residual value of around 51%. In some parts of the country, General Motors is offering an additional $500 lease cash on this model that may be combined with the $2,002 bonus cash.

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eaweg · January 2002

Car_Man,

Oh ye of great lease wisdom...
I remember reading (and hearing) that as each month passes the residual value of the car decreases (logically so)...BMW is offering great lease deals now, but because I have a wedding in three months I cannot take advantage at this point in time. When May/June comes around I will be ready but obviously the residual value will be a lot less, therefore, the deal not as good...how do auto manufacturers make the lease attractive then? Do they lower the money factor? Also, how much do(es) the extra security deposit(s)lower the money factor? THANKS in advance.

jim52 · January 2002

Thanks for all of the info. I was actually referring to the 530 lease info posted on Edmunds. Edmunds lists the cap cost equal to the MSRP. Is the real cap cost equal to the MSRP minus the 2,500 DP minus 475 as in the X5 lease you mentioned above. That would get the payment I calculate close the $459 a month listed on Edmunds. Let me know.

seqlady · January 2002

Using your figures for the A4 1.8T, assuming a cap cost of 27,759 (which is $1100 over invoice), money factor of .00225, residual 53%, 4-yr. lease, 12K miles, zero down, I come up with a payment of about $400/month including tax (9%). Does this sound right to you? Also, do you think offering $1100 over invoice as the purchase price is a fair offer? Thanks so much for all your help. What an invaluable service you provide!

icdchess · January 2002

Hi Car_Man...
You have been a pillar of knowledge for me in the past. I come here and read your stuff even when I am not in the market for a car (I guess I need to see a shrink). Here's a weird one for you. I am considering returning my Jaguar S-Type 4.0 to the dealer with 16 months left (on a 36 month lease) and leasing a new X-Type 3.0 in its place. Is there ANY way you can figure out what monthly lease payments I would be paying if I gave you all the figures that you need, or am I at the mercy of my dealer with whom I have not broached the subject? Thanks for any light you can shine on this issue.
Steve

sarny · January 2002

Hi,
Are there still available lease specials on the 2002 IS300 manual? If so, what are the details?
Thank you very much,
Dave

annmd · January 2002

bluewolf · January 2002

I'm confused on VW money factor. You said .0020 for 36mos, but Scott Shapiro who works for Edmunds says it's .0025 for January '02 on a 36 month lease.

Aside from that, I'm looking at an '02 VW GTI 5-spd, 12k miles/yr for 36 mos. My price on the car with the options I want is $18775, and MSRP is $19960. I'd likely put $500 - $1000 down.
Residual Value according to VW is 59% @ 36 mos on a 12k/yr lease.

If I do the calculations myself, it looks like I should get a payment of $260/mo with $1k down including my tax of 7.75%.

Question: Do dealers have a hard time with educated potential customers who come into the dealership and want a bottom line lease like I've calculated here? The dealer tried to sell me a leftover '01 with a lower residual for a higher payment and longer term. So he must have TONS of profit baked into that one. Considering I bought from this dealer less than a year ago I was disappointed by this offer and am considering another dealer 10 miles further away.

Thanks again.

CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

Hello Squeke. My bad, sorry about providing you the quattro numbers instead of the 2WD numbers. Their lease programs are slightly different. If you were to lease a 2002 A4 3.0L 2WD through Audi Financial Services prior to February 3rd, you should be able to use their 48 month 12,000 miles per year base lease money factor and residual value of .00235 and 50%, respectively.

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CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

Yes, markhampton, the capitalized cost that I posted for the sample X5 lease does take the $2,500 down payment into account. You are absolutely right, this lease is actually based on a selling price of only $475 below full MSRP. It looks to me as though you've got this lease all figured out.

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CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

Hi SilverCrown. Yes, Volkswagen is providing special lease money factors on the 2002 Passat right now. If you were to lease a 2002 Passat GLX Sedan through VW Credit this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, the base lease money factor and residual value should be .00205 and 53%, respectively. The numbers for an identical lease of a 2002 VW Passat GLX with 4 Motion would be .00210 and 55%. The 4 year numbers for the 2002 Passat GLX Sedan should be .00230 and 46% and for the 2002 Passat GLX Sedan with 4 Motion should be .00240 and 48%. The 12,000 miles per year residual values for both of these cars are 2% higher than the ones that I just mentioned.

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CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

"Oh ye of great lease wisdom..." I like it, I like it

. You are absolutely correct. As time passes, vehicles residual values naturally fall. This may or may not actually happen on a monthly basis though. It all depends upon how often the bank that you are interested in leasing through issues a new lease program. In this particular case, BMW's lease program usually lasts for two months. They are not expected to publish new residual values for their models until March 1st. Manufacturers often increase the lease support that they are providing on their vehicles (either in the form of reduced money factors or lease cash) in an effort counteract the natural decline in vehicles' residual values and maintain similar lease price points. Of course, manufacturers will probably not provide any sort of increased support on models that are in high demand or low supply, like the Honda Odyssey for instance. As far as multiple security deposits on BMWs go, I do not know the exact reduction in the lease money factor that each additional deposit provides. You will need to check with BMW Financial Services directly or your dealership to find out the exact number.

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Squeke · January 2002

Thanks Car_Man. I just talked with the dealer and they are claiming Audi Financial has .00295 MF. Then it came down to .00280 since i am a current Audi owner. This was on the 3.0 A4 2WD '02. Something seems odd. All your Audi related postings are lower than what they're claiming is the Audi Financial rate in a general sense. But i can't figure our how the dealer would be served by trying to use a higher MF. Any insight?

Squeke

silvercrown · January 2002

This is good news for prospective VW buyers. How long will these special rates last?

skobola · January 2002

I have just ordered a 2002 BMW 325i for 3 yrs/30k miles for $395/mo + tax with .0023 MF and 63% residual with $600 inception total (1st + tag). I also intend to do multiple security deposits when the car arrives, and this will reduce the MF for .0001 for each SD; BMW FS allows a maximum of 9 additional sec. deposits. I heard that some dealers may calculate a total reduction of .0001 x 10 deposits = .001 as they allow the obligatory sec. deposit to be counted as well, but all 4 dealers that I dealt with in Miami area allowed only up to 9 deposits total, and therefore a max. reduction of .0009. This will make a reduction of price equal to a 44% return on deposited money in 3 years.

mg330ci · January 2002

Dear Car_Man

I believe reading in Edmunds (although I cannot find it any more), that the current money factor on 2002 BMW 3 series (330Ci) for a 36m/36k miles until feb 28 is 0.00205 (4.92%). (0 down, 62% residual)

A dealer is quoting me 0.0025 (6%) as BMW FS best.

Could you confirm this?

Also, is there any way to negotiate the outrageous $525 acquisition fee and $325 disposition fee! as well as the security deposit when dealing with BMW FS?

Thanks

CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

Jim, although I do not have the actual numbers in front of me right now, I believe that the capitalized cost of 530 lease that BMW is currently advertising works exactly the same as the X5 lease that I talked about earlier. If I am not mistaken, this car has a cap cost of $475 below its full MSRP as well.

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CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

Seqlady, I don't know what the exact full MSRP of the car that you are interested in is, so I can't double check your calculations. However, the payment that you arrived at certainly sounds as though it is about right. As far as the price goes, $1,100 over invoice sounds reasonable to me, but you may have difficulty getting dealerships to go this low. The A4 has been fairly popular ever since Audi introduced the new redesigned version of it (and rightfully so, I think that they did an outstanding job with it). Give it a shot and see what happens.

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CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

Thanks for the kind words, Steve. I certainly can calculate how much money per month it will cost you to lease a new X-Type. However, getting out of your current lease complicates the situation a little bit. In order to do so, you are going to have to either sell the car yourself or trade it in to the dealership that you are working with. This requires you to call Jaguar Credit, or whichever bank you are leasing it through, to find out exactly how much money it would cost you to buy out your lease at this time. The difference between this price and the allowance that the dealership is willing to give you for it will either be subtracted from the capitalized cost of your new lease (if owe less than they are giving you) or added to your cap cost (if you owe more than they are willing to give you). Of course, you may also pay for the difference between the payoff and trade-in allowance out of your own pocket.

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CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

Dave, yes Lexus is offering special lease money factors on the 2002 IS 300 for 39 month terms at this time. The exact money factors that are available vary depending upon whether you are getting the IS 300 E-Shift, IS 300 with manual transmission, or IS 300 SportCross. I would be more than happy to give you an idea of what the money factor should be like for the exact car that you are interested in right now if you tell me which one you are getting. Talk to you soon.

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CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

You're welcome, annmd. I am glad that I was able to help you out.

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CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

You're welcome, bluewolf. I don't know why we are coming up with different numbers. However, I have seen Volkswagen Credit's actual program bulletins. This month's program specifically states that the 2002 VW GTI GLS has a 36 month base lease money factor of .00200 and a 12,000 miles per year residual value of 59%. As far as dealerships having a problem with educated consumers goes, some will and some won't. This is why it is important to comparison shop at a couple of locations. By doing so, you are almost assured of finding a dealership that is willing to work with you.

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CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

No problem, Squeke. It is interesting that the dealership that you are working with is telling you that Audi will provide loyal consumers with a lower lease money factor than non-returning consumers. I say this because the only sort of loyalty program that Audi is running at this time is a cash program that provides $400 cash on 4-cylinder models, $600 on 6-cylinder models, & $800 on 8-cylinder models. They are not providing any sort of reduced money factors for loyal customers that I am aware of. It definitely sounds to me as though the dealership that you are working with is attempting to mark up Audi Financial Services' base lease money factor of .00225 for 36 months on this car. The best way for you to see if the dealership that you are working with is telling you the truth is to comparison shop at a couple of dealerships in your area.

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CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

You're welcome, silvercrown. Volkswagen almost always issues a new lease program each month. Their current money factors and residual values are only scheduled to run through January 31st. Even though the current program is scheduled to expire at the end of this month, I don't personally anticipate them making any major revisions to their February program.

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Squeke · January 2002

The dealer did offer the $600 for the loyalty program also. I tried calling Audi Financial directly, but they wouldn't provide any assistance or data. I'll try another dealer. Where does your data come from Car Man? You've been a great help. I trust you and this site more than the dealers!

Squeke

CarMan@Edmunds · January 2002

Mg330ci, I just double checked the base lease money factor that BMW Financial Services is currently offering on the 2002 330Ci for you and it is still .00205 for 36 month terms as I indicated in my earlier post. This is a national lease program that is scheduled to run through the end of February, so if the dealership that you are working with is telling you a higher factor they are likely trying to mark it up to bake additional profit into your deal or you do not qualify for BMW's lowest money factor. I am sorry to say that BMW Financial Services charges a $595 acquisition fee on all of their leases and I really don't think that they would be willing to waive it for you. You may however be able to get them to waive your lease disposition fee if you end up leasing another vehicle through them.

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jim52 · January 2002

How were you able to lease with only $600 total at inception. Did you get out of paying the bank fee? If so, how?

alsobig · January 2002

Hello CAR MAN,
I have signed a lease contract with for last week and drove a way in a new truck all happy as can be. Yesterday I received a call from the salesman saying there was a problem with the paper work and they wanted me to come in and resign a new lease...? They said they miss quoted me the wrong figures and my payment would be more money a month. I am happy with the way every thing is now. Do they have any right to change my lease after I have already signed it. It has been 7 days since the signing. I heard there was something about a 3 day law or something to that affect....But not in NH.......

Very concerned;
Alsobig

sarny · January 2002

Thanks for the help, I would like to get a 2002 IS300 5 speed. If this matters, I want as options, leather interior, sunroof, and the spoiler.

Thanks again,
Dave

richard103 · January 2002

Thanks for your reply regarding the Rendevous lease.

I've been quoted a 50% residual and 7.5% rate on a 36-mo./15k-mi per year lease (in contrast to your reply of 51%/6.5%, respectively).

The dealer told me that this was for a GMAC lease; do you think that he's trying to "mark-up" the lease factors in order to increase profit?

In fairness to the dealer, he's offered me a "$150-over-invoice" deal, and has mentioned the $500 GMAC lease cash, as well.

benji123 · January 2002

Car_man,

I've been scrolling back through lots of posts looking for various combinations of lease rates, money factors, and residuals, and thought I would just ask for the most up-to-date information. I know its a lot of info to look up, but when you have a chance, could you please find the following info?

1. 2002 Toyota RAV4 Auto 2WD - 36 Months/12,000 per year

2. 2002 Subaru WRX Wagon Auto - 36 Months/12,000 per year

3. 2002 Mazda Tribute ES-V6 2WD - 36 Months/12,000 per year

4. 2002 Ford Escape XLT Premium 2WD - 36 Months/12,000 per year

5. 2002 Lexus IS300 SportCross - 36 Months/12,000 per year

mg330ci · January 2002

Thanks for your prompt reply Car_Man.

How can I obtain a printout of the BMF FS Money Factor to show my dealership that I have proof of what I am saying (based on the information you are kindly giving us here). Right now, they argue that my information is incorrect.

If I proof they are wrong, and thus, have being lying to me, I will take my business elsewhere or and/or buy a different car.

Where did honest people go?

ARE YOU READING WHAT I AM SEING BMW!
ARE YOU AN HONORABLE COMPANY!
IF YOU HAVE A NATIONAL LEASE PROGRAM, WHY DON'T YOU PUBLISH IT!
WHY DO YOU HIDE THIS OBSCURE NUMBERS FROM YOU CUSTOMERS! (called BMW FS, they referred me back to the dealer, is this top secret information?)

Anyway, maybe I should not lease a car from this people.

Thanks Car_Man, I need this weapon to fight this battle on even grounds (or so they will make me believe)

Squeke · January 2002

I'm having the same problems as you are mg33ci on a new Audi. Dealers MF's don't match CarMans. I trust this site much more than the dealer. I also tried Audi Financial, but they referred me to the dealer. I've told the dealer i want to see the paperwork straight from Audi tonight. I get no response from other dealerships in the area. I to can't understand the need to keep the numbers from customers. If you call a bank about a mortgage, they give you their current rates.

Squeke

seqlady · January 2002

OK, we offered the 1100 over invoice and they came back with 1440 over. They insist, however, that we must pay a $490 bank fee (does this sound bogus or is it standard?). Also, they will not allow any sort of trade-in number on our returned vehicle even though the residuary is a good $3,000+ under the retail value. Dealership claims they will not keep it to resell, but just turn it in for auction. The mileage on this car is WAY under the allowed amount. Thinking of going with the 48 month lease since the warranty will last that long. What's your opinion of this deal, Carman (or should I say ?). Thanks

parnola · January 2002

Hi Carman,

I was at a Jeep dealer today and was quoted a money factor of .0038 for a 2002 JGC Limited V8. This sounded absordly high to me. Can you tell me what Chrysler's money rate and residual are on this vehicle right now? Looking at 3-year/12k lease.

Also, if you have the same info for the Lexus RX 300 4WD over the same terms, I'd appreciate it.

Thanks!

Pat

parnola · January 2002

Carman - I failed to mention that I'm in Dayton, OH. I believe some of Chrysler's deals are regional.

Thanks,

Pat

skobola · January 2002

Jim, I paid only 1st and tag&title. The rest was included in the Cap. Per my calculation, $395 puts the car to be sold at $28,195, while its MSRP is $28,220. This cap price still left about $2,300 above the invoice, so I guess that they swallowed the fees, and sold me the car for whatever was left. I still believe that elsewhere I could get the car for $1,500 atop the invoice, but they are selling them so well in Miami that any discounts are difficult to get. Also, they did not charge me some fees as I am a repeat BMW customer, I already have a 99 323i which lease will expire in April (when I hope I will get the ordered 325i).

vlbray · February 2002

Hi Carman,
Do you know Money Factor & Residual Value for Acura TL type S?

Thank you

pgl1 · February 2002

Carman: In early January you gave me some much needed and helpful advice re: buying out a '99 Intrigue. I wanted to let you know that things turned out well, and I was able to negotiate a buyout price that was somewhat less than private party value which was very satisfactory to me due to the car's excellent condition and the consequent avoidance of excess mileage fees.

I tried to negotiate with GMAC directly to no avail. All of the telephone numbers I got for district/regional personnel from the GM switchboard were wrong. Although I eventually managed to get past the 'nice folks' at customer service and actually did reach the business office in East Hanover, NJ which handled my payments, insurance requirements, etc. and spoke to the person who was actually responsible for lease returns and deciding the buyout price, she refused to negotiate with me. Even though she admitted the accuracy of my estimate of the wholesale value and the fact that GMAC would never realize half the residual amount at auction, her line was simply: we will not negotiate you; you can either buy out at the residual or go to a dealer.

Despite having to go through a dealer, it all ended well, and I really appreciate your help.

filter1 · February 2002

Alsobig,

I'm quite certain that you do not have to go back and sign another lease with higher payments. Sit tight and DO NOT go back to the dealership yet! Post some more information on what they've said to you, how/if they've threatened you to go back, or if there have been any updates.

SOMEONE PLEASE HELP HIM OUT!

It sounds like the dealership is trying to rip him off, and I hope we can prevent that from happening, at least until Car_Man gets back.

Mike

eroder · February 2002

I am looking to lease a newer used car, such as a 1998, 1999,or 2000 Infinity G20. Is leasing a used car an option? Where would I go to pre-qualify for this type of lease or are there subsidized leases for used autos?

How heavily is credit weighed in the lease terms provided to lease a car? I don't have great credit but leasing is the right option for my situation. Any help is appreciated.

markhampton · February 2002

Well we're going to shop for cars today. I want to test-drive the Passat 4Motion, but the wife is enamored with the Jag X-Type (you know, the Taurus with the Leopard on the hood).

What are this-months residuals residuals and MF for:

VW Passat GLS 4Motion - 36 months - 12k/year MSRP $29,995
Jag X-Type 2.5 Auto - 36 months - 12k/Year MSRP $34,370

automind · February 2002

car_man, thanks for all the great info that you provide on this site. My question involves the Audi A6 2.7t, Audi Allroad, Audi S6, the BMW 525ia touring and 540ia touring. Can you provide the current money factors and residuals for the above vehicles. 15K/yr, 36mo. By the way, what is the charge for being over on the miles? (.15/mi or .20/mi)? Thanks!

silvercrown · February 2002

Hi Car_man,

I have a friend who is interested in leasing a Saturn L300 sedan with all the bells and whistles. What is the money factor and residuals for a 36 month lease with 12k and 15k miles per year? Also, are there any special incentives for Saturn? Such as the $2002 cash back for certain GM products? I know that sometimes GM has special programs but exempts Saturn from them.

Thanks so much.

beach15 · February 2002

I'd like to know the following money factors and residuals based on 3 years & 15k miles a year for the following SUV's:
2002 Buick Rendezvous CXL AWD
2002 GMC Envoy
2002 GMC Yukon 2wd
2002 Olds Bravada
2002 Chevrolet Trailblazer

By the way, were in southern Delaware, zip code 19966.

Thanks

beach15 · February 2002

Also, any info. yet on a 2003 Cadillac CTS lease? It would be a 3year 15k lease if possible. What are the numbers?

silvercrown · February 2002

Another request for you Car_man. My friend who is looking at the Saturn L Series is also considering both the Hyundai Sonata and Santa Fe. What are the money factors and residuals for both of these vehicles for a 36 month lease for 12k and 15k miles per year? Also, does Hyundai have any special incentives or anything on these two vehicles?

Thanks again.

CarMan@Edmunds · February 2002

Hi Alsobig. It's interesting that your salesperson is trying to get you to come in and sign new lease papers. If I was in your situation, I would be very hesitant to sign a new lease agreement. If you feel compelled to do
so, you might want to have the dealership that you are working with mail you a copy of the new contract so that you can carefully review it prior to signing. By doing so, you will be able to make sure that they are not giving you a worse deal. Be very careful that they don't try to pull one over on you.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2002

Good morning, Dave. Thanks for the additional information. The latest Lexus lease program expired on February 28th. I have not had an opportunity to take a look at their February program yet, but suspect I will some time later on this week. Please feel free to check back with me then for more information on this car's lease new program. Talk to you soon.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2002

Richard, I am almost positive that the dealership that you are working with is trying to mark up this vehicle's lease rate on you. That is unless you don't qualify for GMAC's best credit tier. The 6.5% rate is basically available on all General Motors vehicles leased through GMAC (excluding Cadillac and Saturn) through 2/28/02. You are definitely getting an excellent price on the Rendezvous though, especially if they are giving you $150 over invoice and then subtracting the lease cash. They probably figured that they can prevent you from shopping around by quoting you an outstanding price for the model that you are interested in and then make up some of the profit on the back end of your deal.

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