I've been pretty happy with it. I confess that I don't meet the high standards of most here (I'm not that obsessive), but my cars are pretty darn good.
I like the fact that it is easy to apply, gives a good shine and is long lasting. One thing that I've noticed is that the car seems to stay cleaner - with wax you seem to get a static charge that makes dust stick to the finish.
I was impressed enough with Klasse to reorder when I finished my first bottle and I also decided to go ahead and try some of the highgloss sealant. I don't know that it's necessary as the all-in-one does pretty well, but we'll see.
I ordered by searching the net for the best price..
I have never used one. I have read the information in many posts though. What is the exact technique for using one? Do you use pressure?? How many times do you wipe it over the same area? Some use it for a final finish-after the wax. Do you wipe it off with a rag after the clay?? If thats the case do you go over the car after the clay wth say Final Inspection or something like that??
It is a lot easier to do than to describe. As you rub it over the surface with lots of lubricant, and without a lot of pressure, you feel the surface getting smoother. When it is really smooth, you can tell and you move on to another area. You will know exactly when you are done if you are doing it for smoothness. If you are doing it for overspray that shows, you can go for smoothness first then look and see if the spray is gone. If not, do it some more, but if the paint is smooth and you do it some more and it still doesn't come clean, then you might have to use something more aggressive like a glaze or light compound. The key to claying (in my limited experience) is the lubricant. Use lots of it. I like using the gloss spray that comes with Meguiars or Mothers, but some swear by a solution of diluted car wash. The advantage of the car wash is that afterward it is much easier to wash off, but when I tried it the clay seemed to stick too much and got smeary on the painted surface. When that happens you just have to keep doing the clay thing more lightly until the clay is cleaned off the surface, but it is a pain. The gloss spray seemed to me to keep this from happening as much.
I did take my last detail project a bit seriously. However, you only live once and I really enjoyed preparing my beloved 2000 Mazda PRO-ES for the Edmunds users Mid Atlantic Protege Picnic!
BTW, Autopia.com is a great place to do research, if you want to take your detail program and "Kick it Up a Little"!
The Klasse Web page, were you have purchased Klasse: All-In-One, lists $20.00 for 500 ml. I was never good in math. How does 500 ml compare to 16 oz?
Nonetheless, I purchased the Klasse: Concours Kit for $39.95. With the Autopia Klasse Concours Kit, you get a 16.9 oz bottle of both, 3-In-One and Sealant, and two micro-fiber applicators. Hope this helps. :-)
I was just reading some FAQ's on waxing and on one page it said that acrilyic/polymer "waxes" can cause "spider-webbing" of the paint because the acrilyics/polymers do not allow the paint to expand/contract naturally. Is this true? I just waxed with Nu-finish and I'm a little scared now because we get some pretty good temperature fluctuations here in Calgary during winter (ie. -20 degress C one day, +15 the next)because of the Chinooks. Thanks in advance.
1. Wash the car. Some use Dawn to help remove the prior wax coat. I haven't noticed much difference with that or regular car soap. The surface must be as spotless as possible. A little road tar can easily ruin a bar.
2. Break the bar in half. The boxes advertise that it can be used for 3 cars, but it is too small to use if only 1/3 is used. Flatten into a pancake that comfortably fits on your fingers. (A slightly smaller size makes it easier to find a clean surface.)
3. Spray the lubricant liberally on the surface. Honestly this varies depending on the condition of the paint. When I first did it I would go through a pint bottle. Now I can get 2 cars with the same amount. Spray the claybar itself also. You want a slippery surface. If you feel the slightest pull quickly spray more on the area. I use a rag to clean off the area where the clay stuck. It's the dull area. I literally have a spray bottle in one hand and the clay in the other at all times.
4. Use a circular motion. The pressure should be firm, but not too heavy. The bar should slide over the surface easily. Initially you will hear a light scraping sound like it's being sanded. As you go over the area it will go away. The first time I go over roughly an 18 inch square area. I then look at the clay. If it's black I fold it on itself until a clean surface appears. This can be done many times. Now for my twice annual clay bars I can go over much larger areas like half of the hood since it's so much cleaner.
5. After I've done an area the lubricant is cloudy. I wipe it off and feel the surface. If it isn't as smooth as glass, I re-spray and do it again. This takes a while the first time. Later sessions for my mid size cars take between 30 and 45 minutes if I hussle.
I never use a clay bar AFTER I wax. It is done before the glaze/wax.
Quite honestly, if the finish feels grainy at all I do a clay bar before I glaze, this helps minimize spider marks.
I thought I got good results with my car care before, but a clay bar adds another level of shine, minimizes scratches, and the surface feels mirror smooth after treatment. I will never be without it.
Excellent advice - I've clayed both my cars each spring for the past 2 years and it justs add an additional level of finish. The surface just gets so smooth.
One thing I do is lay down an old blanket around the area I am working in. That claybar gets pretty slick with all the lubricant. Nothing worse than dropping your clay and getting it all full of pebbles.
body shop has been gracious enough to buff out two teeny weeny scratches that were in my tailgate (didn't want them too though), and left the usual swirls. any ideas as to how to bring back the original finish?
robr2. the blanket's a good idea. I had to throw away a clay bar because when I dropped it, there was a lot of grit in it. Then I can let it fall with impunity.
Just keeping you updated. Two months ago I used Crisco on the black vinyl/plastic in the windshield wiper area of an '92 Corsica which was totally ugly with wax fading-whatever (it was a 1 on a scale of 1 to 10). It was actually closer to white than black. I went over it with Crisco Liquid and wiped it down afterward (it became a 9 or 10). A few days later I hit it with Vinylex. Tonite I wiped it with water and it is at least an 8-maybe still an 9. It is a true miracle!!! I highly recommend.
It apparently dissolves the damaged portion caused by the solvents/cleaners in the wax/polish. Obviously thats why peanut butter worked (thanks to Sal). I merely took it to the next level. he..he.. Probably wll soon be a new'Z' product contaning one of these oils : Z-Oil-O
Just answering to keep your post #1271 alive. With my limited knowledge I would just get the Meguiars Swirl Remover, followed by the Show Car Glaze or 3M Imperial Hand Glaze, followed by the #26 or 3M Perfect it. Thats just the stuff I use. I'm just a novce though. I'm sure mrdetailer, joe166, or bret can help you. I wonder if they removed the clear coat?? It seems If you have a scratch and buff it out you must be below theclear coat??? I'd like to know the answer here.
BTW my wife's friend has a scratch on her Toyota. How do those paint sticks work???
thanks for the help........doesn't look like it's gone through the clearcoat. the scratches were so slight that i wasn't even going to touch em. i ownly pointed them out to let them know how careless they had been, and i wanted it noted in case they needed to be buffed out and did go through. i'll give that stuff a try. [non-permissible content removed] a matter of fact, i told them not to touch the gate. guesss i should have kept my piehole shut.
...despite the rain that came down!!! I was doing the Meguiar's #7 Glaze followed by the #26 Wax (liquid). Just as I was finishing the #7, it started to rain!!! So I quickly finished that up and went inside. At that point it was about 8:30 PM (I was under a street light). I got up earlier than usual to finish in the morning. I sacrificed a couple of good bath towels to dry the car off and finished up with the #26. The car looks great now, but I have some advice for new users of the #26 (liquid):
The bottle doesn't state how long it takes to "dry to a haze". I found out the hard way that this is more in the 5-10 minute range as opposed to the 1-2 minute range.
Also, keep an extra towel unused. When you have finished waxing and buffing the whole car, use this extra towel to get any spots you missed. I noticed a big difference in the finish after doing this. This step removed a lot of the swirls and spots left in the wax layer after I first finished waxing and buffing.
I had more than one person suggest that I do a second coat of #26 about 2 weeks after doing the first layer with #26 liquid. This is still my plan, but how should I prep the car before I wax? Keep in mind I only have the Coin-Op to work with, as I live in an apartment. Should I just use the high pressure soap and then rinse? Or will that strip the first layer of wax? I kind of assumed that it wouldn't, but I thought I'd ask.
I haven't let mine on long enough to probably get the maximum effect. However I put a coat of the paste on once a month (overkill). Be careful with a towel-make sure it has absolutely no polyester!! Supposedly the liquid fills better, but I'm planning on using paste only. I don't have a buffer.
I disagree with the "two week waiting period". I think waiting overnight is fine. You are waiting for car wax to cure, not paint. Areas of high humidity or cold temps will cause a delay in wax cure times, just like it takes longer for paint to dry.
If your car is just dusty and not dirty, I'd clean it first with a product like Meguiar's Final Inspection or Quik Detailer. That will remove any dust, oils, fingerprints, and whatnot before you apply coat #2.
Towel Tip: go to an outlet mall and buy towels strictly for car care. if you wanna look cool, get them in black to match your car. Towels on sale from WalMart or similar are fine too if you have no outlet malls nearby. Wash the towels in light soap, no softener, no Cling Free's in the dryer.
Sam's club has some great "Luxury" car towels. They are the smaller size, but are 100% cotton and are very fluffy. And, Yes towels with even a little polyester scratch.
Waiting period between coats. OK, truth out, I don't want to wax again just one week after I've done the prior coat. But if I did I would certainly wait a while. If it is not completely cured then you are removing some of the prior coat as you apply the new one. I like to make sure that the vehicle has been out in the sun for a few days where the surface has had time to essentially bake the wax. Overnight, or a few hours later, unless it's had a chance to heat up will not be as durable in my experience.
I can't wait to get my buffer in the mail. I ordered a $29 Orbtal one from Harbor Freight just to see if I could do anything with it. I have a '92 Corsica and even if the buffer only lasts for one trip, I will have learned something.
Has anyone tried this professional line from 3M? Noticed it while surfing their website. Also, anyone know of a waterbased polish or glaze that can be washed off after application rather than buffed off. Malm's Formula 10 says it can be washed off, wondering if there are others.
That will at least put back a thin layer of wax back.
I have a friend who only uses automated car washes. Never waxes. (horrors) He always uses the wax. It looks better than I expected. Not great, but could be worse.
Yesterday, I spent three hours to clean the yellow Mazda Protege5 and remove the black paint spots falling from a truck 2 weeks ago with a cream product called "turtle-wax, bugs & tar remover". All the paint spots are gone! Here is how it works: after wasing and drying the car, pour the cream liquid on a cloth and apply it on the spots until the paint spots, tar, and dead bugs are removed. Clean the spots with clean and dry cloth. My car is shinny again!
I have tried the Perfect_It Show Car Glaze for light colored cars this weekend. It applied quickly and produced a very high gloss shine. It had less grit than other glazes It is exactly what I needed for my white car with the great finish.
The instructions recommended doing only a 2 X 2 foot square at one time. They are really correct. If you do too large of an area or wait too long is it a miserable cuss to remove. Not for Amateurs. If I hadn't have had a fair amount of experience I would have been major frustrated.
I REALLY liked the results however, so it's worth it for me. I had some small swirl marks from learning to use the buffers, and it buffed out a lot of them.
Give me the Imperial Hand Glaze for ease of use. And it looks almost as good.
The 3m website shows a new line of products for professional detailing. I'm just wondering if they are something different or the same products just bulk packaged for higher consumption rates. Couldn't find the MSDS sheets to compare.
Your concern about polymers sealing the paint so it can't breathe, i.e., expand or contract (causing spider-webbing) was discussed at length recently on the "forbidden" board. The consensus was that it's an old wive's tale -- the primary purpose of using a polymer or wax is to seal the paint so it's protected from the elements -- and paint really doesn't need to breathe (it doesn't have lungs or even gills!). So press on with your polymer and don't worry about temperature changes.
thank you for sharing the site........and to think i was just getting ready to try a certain product we all hear about....... looks like the P21S Concours is the one i'll try next. claimed to live up to it's promises. thx
Dave, they rated Zaino poorly and found good old Sal, nice but a little gruff, hehe! They also rated Klasse fairly low. I will spend some more time at this site. Nice job finding these guys!
You bet, a REAL eye opener. They just could not see the pay off to a very long and complicated application process. Apply Z lock, apply Z shine and wait... and wait some more..... and finally what? Spray on some Z enhancer? Then repeat, the process? Jeeesh, finally someone calling it what it really is, weak! I can't wait to try some of the other suggested high end products.
What kind of car wax is good and cheap that can be bought anywhere for removing water spots. (My automatic sprinkler comes on every day and half of the car gets all wet). My color of my car is metalic brown or tan colored. 1989 Honda Accord. Thanx
They pretty much duplicated my experiences with what they tried.. So that sort of helps me to beleive their tests.
I was all set to buy klasse. Now, i'm no longer so hot about it. So far, the cheap zymol ( zurtle wax ) has been the effective thing for me. The problem with this product seems to be longevity.
I do think they're doing exactly the right thing, doing one section of each on a large body panel.
I spoke to them over e-mail and they said they're doing a longevity test, and they're going to re-test the klasse and the Z.
Comments
BTW #26 Paste is on sale at Pep Boys... What a deal!! Even if you just use it on your shower.
Seriously, I'm very impressed. You've come a long way and it sounds like you're doing a great job with the Protege's.
Sounds like the folks on the Autopia boards have been offering you some great advice (as usual). Kepp up the great work.
- - Bret - -
-Larry
I like the fact that it is easy to apply, gives a good shine and is long lasting. One thing that I've noticed is that the car seems to stay cleaner - with wax you seem to get a static charge that makes dust stick to the finish.
I was impressed enough with Klasse to reorder when I finished my first bottle and I also decided to go ahead and try some of the highgloss sealant. I don't know that it's necessary as the all-in-one does pretty well, but we'll see.
I ordered by searching the net for the best price..
http://store.yahoo.com/klasseproductsdirect/klasalacpola.html
This is the best I've found, but I'd appreciate it if anybody knows of a place with a better price.
Thanks
Only kidding about the shower. :-}
-Larry
I did take my last detail project a bit seriously. However, you only live once and I really enjoyed preparing my beloved 2000 Mazda PRO-ES for the Edmunds users Mid Atlantic Protege Picnic!
BTW, Autopia.com is a great place to do research, if you want to take your detail program and "Kick it Up a Little"!
http://www.autopia-carcare.com/
Be Well;
Larry
Thanks,
Al
http://www.properautocare.com/index.html
The Klasse Web page, were you have purchased Klasse: All-In-One, lists $20.00 for 500 ml. I was never good in math. How does 500 ml compare to 16 oz?
Nonetheless, I purchased the Klasse: Concours Kit for $39.95. With the Autopia Klasse Concours Kit, you get a 16.9 oz bottle of both, 3-In-One and Sealant, and two micro-fiber applicators. Hope this helps. :-)
Respectfully,
Larry
http://www.properautocare.com/klasconkit.html
That kit listed above is a pretty good deal.
dave
-Larry
I just waxed with Nu-finish and I'm a little scared now because we get some pretty good temperature fluctuations here in Calgary during winter (ie. -20 degress C one day, +15 the next)because of the Chinooks.
Thanks in advance.
Protege_fan
2. Break the bar in half. The boxes advertise that it can be used for 3 cars, but it is too small to use if only 1/3 is used. Flatten into a pancake that comfortably fits on your fingers. (A slightly smaller size makes it easier to find a clean surface.)
3. Spray the lubricant liberally on the surface. Honestly this varies depending on the condition of the paint. When I first did it I would go through a pint bottle. Now I can get 2 cars with the same amount. Spray the claybar itself also. You want a slippery surface. If you feel the slightest pull quickly spray more on the area. I use a rag to clean off the area where the clay stuck. It's the dull area. I literally have a spray bottle in one hand and the clay in the other at all times.
4. Use a circular motion. The pressure should be firm, but not too heavy. The bar should slide over the surface easily. Initially you will hear a light scraping sound like it's being sanded. As you go over the area it will go away. The first time I go over roughly an 18 inch square area. I then look at the clay. If it's black I fold it on itself until a clean surface appears. This can be done many times. Now for my twice annual clay bars I can go over much larger areas like half of the hood since it's so much cleaner.
5. After I've done an area the lubricant is cloudy. I wipe it off and feel the surface. If it isn't as smooth as glass, I re-spray and do it again. This takes a while the first time. Later sessions for my mid size cars take between 30 and 45 minutes if I hussle.
I never use a clay bar AFTER I wax. It is done before the glaze/wax.
Quite honestly, if the finish feels grainy at all I do a clay bar before I glaze, this helps minimize spider marks.
I thought I got good results with my car care before, but a clay bar adds another level of shine, minimizes scratches, and the surface feels mirror smooth after treatment. I will never be without it.
One thing I do is lay down an old blanket around the area I am working in. That claybar gets pretty slick with all the lubricant. Nothing worse than dropping your clay and getting it all full of pebbles.
Al
robr2. the blanket's a good idea. I had to throw away a clay bar because when I dropped it, there was a lot of grit in it. Then I can let it fall with impunity.
BTW my wife's friend has a scratch on her Toyota. How do those paint sticks work???
The bottle doesn't state how long it takes to "dry to a haze". I found out the hard way that this is more in the 5-10 minute range as opposed to the 1-2 minute range.
Also, keep an extra towel unused. When you have finished waxing and buffing the whole car, use this extra towel to get any spots you missed. I noticed a big difference in the finish after doing this. This step removed a lot of the swirls and spots left in the wax layer after I first finished waxing and buffing.
If your car is just dusty and not dirty, I'd clean it first with a product like Meguiar's Final Inspection or Quik Detailer. That will remove any dust, oils, fingerprints, and whatnot before you apply coat #2.
Towel Tip: go to an outlet mall and buy towels strictly for car care. if you wanna look cool, get them in black to match your car. Towels on sale from WalMart or similar are fine too if you have no outlet malls nearby. Wash the towels in light soap, no softener, no Cling Free's in the dryer.
Waiting period between coats. OK, truth out, I don't want to wax again just one week after I've done the prior coat. But if I did I would certainly wait a while. If it is not completely cured then you are removing some of the prior coat as you apply the new one. I like to make sure that the vehicle has been out in the sun for a few days where the surface has had time to essentially bake the wax. Overnight, or a few hours later, unless it's had a chance to heat up will not be as durable in my experience.
-Larry
I have a friend who only uses automated car washes. Never waxes. (horrors) He always uses the wax. It looks better than I expected. Not great, but could be worse.
zoom-zoom,
Bruno
The instructions recommended doing only a 2 X 2 foot square at one time. They are really correct. If you do too large of an area or wait too long is it a miserable cuss to remove. Not for Amateurs. If I hadn't have had a fair amount of experience I would have been major frustrated.
I REALLY liked the results however, so it's worth it for me. I had some small swirl marks from learning to use the buffers, and it buffed out a lot of them.
Give me the Imperial Hand Glaze for ease of use. And it looks almost as good.
dave
I tried that once but the topic got closed.
looks like the P21S Concours is the one i'll try next. claimed to live up to it's promises.
thx
-Larry
-Larry
I was all set to buy klasse. Now, i'm no longer so hot about it. So far, the cheap zymol ( zurtle wax ) has been the effective thing for me. The problem with this product seems to be longevity.
I do think they're doing exactly the right thing, doing one section of each on a large body panel.
I spoke to them over e-mail and they said they're doing a longevity test, and they're going to re-test the klasse and the Z.
dave