Lease Questions - Ask Here

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Hi pgullo. I have seen both Ford's and Honda's August lease programs. What exactly do you want to know about these two trucks? If you are interested in what their lease money factors and residual values should be like at this time, I am going to need a little more information from you, like the exact trim level of the vehicles that you want, how long you plan on leasing them for, and how many miles per year you will need. Once I have this additional information I will be able to help you out.

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hpowders · August 2002

Thanks Car Man. I was easily able to switch from 30,000 miles to 36,000 miles because as you said, no lease agreement was signed or delivery of the vehicle accepted. It is pretty late in the model year yet my 2002 325 had a 60% residual. About how much higher a residual would you think a new 2003 325 would command say in October or November when it first comes out? Also I do believe a significantly higher money factor would more than offset a higher residual for the 2003.
Thank you.
Howard

kotarak · August 2002

Car_Man, Thank you so much for the quick response. The vehicle is the 3.0 X5, and I can get a decent discount on a 2002 one($1,900 off) but if you suspect that the combination of money factor/residual on the upcoming 2003s would be more favorable I might wait.I am looking for the lowest pre-tax monthly payment, regardless of MF, MY or residualof the vehicle.

Thanks Car_Man

jpesci · August 2002

Car-Man,

Can you please give me the Residual and MF for the 2003 VW Passat and 2002/2003 Saab 9-3.

Term 24, 30 & 36 months
15K miles/year.

JP

saibalm · August 2002

Car_Man,
Need your help. I'm in the market for a new 2002 300M. Planning to lease it for 24 / 36 months.
Can you please help me with the following for a 12K mile/yr lease: Residual, Money Factor/Interest rate etc. for both, 24 and 36 months? Also, do you know any incentive/rebate applicable to lease right now ? Or may be coming in the near future? My zip code is 10952.
Bottom Line: How much per month should I consider as good deal with min / no down payment.

Everybody:
I live in NY but willing to travel to any NY, NJ, CT dealership. Can anybody please recommend any dealership / sale person's name ?

Thanks for all your help

jgwoods · August 2002

footie,

That was a mouthfull! And that was exactly what I was looking for. Thank you very much for putting time into that one! For anyone who needs info on leasing fees, post #4234 and #4235 are pretty good posts to read over. Again, thanks footie!

jgw

parker19 · August 2002

i saw the formulas for determing a lease ... how would that change if you paid the entire lease up front ... is this a good idea ... i am interested in an acura cl for 3 years(15,000 miles) ... what is a reasonable one price out the door figure?

thank you

darthken · August 2002

Hi CarMan,

Welcome back, and thanks for all of your help on this forum! I need to lease a vehicle by the first week of September, so will probably be shopping in late August. My first choice is a Honda CRV EX, but I am also considering a Nissan Altima 3.5SE.

Sounds like you have seen August lease programs for both Honda and Nissan, so could you post residuals and MFs for these 2 vehicles? 3yrs, 12k and 15k miles/yr.

Second, are there any acquisition, disposition or other fees?

Third, I would like to wait until the 2003s because of the higher residuals, but do you know when the 2003 CRV arrives? (I have heard the 2003 Altima will be in dealers Aug 15)

Lastly, do you think software such as the "LeaseWizard" program is worth buying?

Thanks in advance for all of your help!

karz10 · August 2002

thanks for confirming my suspicions, i never saw that in writing, i wasn't gonna go back there to even discuss leasing until i hear back from you on what the numbers should be, currently I'm looking at buying a used navigator, i understand that transaction, however should you have the time, I'm still interested to see what you find....thanks again

Karz

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

You're welcome, Howard. I am glad to see that you were able to switch mileage limits so easily. It is difficult to say exactly how much higher the residual values for a 2003 3-Series would be when they are introduced. However, if I had to make an educated guess I would say probably around 3% or so. Again that is just a rough estimate though.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

No problem, kotarak. Thanks for the additional information. According to my calculations, if you were to lease a 2002 BMW X5 3.0i (MSRP: $46,070 / Cap: $44,200) through BMW Financial Services right now for 3 years with 12,000 miles per, your zero down, pre-tax monthly lease payment should be right around $636 or so. It is difficult to say if it would be less expensive to lease the 2003 version of this truck when it is introduced, given its higher residual values. This will depend upon whether the lower discount that you are likely to receive on the 2003 and the likely higher lease money factor are enough to offset the difference in residuals. To me, the slight chance that the 2003 version of this truck would be a little less expensive isn't worth the wait.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Hi jpesci. In order for me to answer your questions, I am going to need a little more information from you. The lease programs for both of these models vary by trim level. In order for me to provide you with accurate information you need to tell me exactly which models you are interested in. Once I have that info I will be able to give you an idea of what their current lease programs should be like. Talk to you soon.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Hello saibalm. You are fortunate that you live in an area where Chrysler has a lot of lease support available on this car. According to the latest lease data that I have seen, if you were to lease a 2002 Chrysler 300M through Chrysler Financial in the New York area for 2 or 3 years, their base lease money factor should be .00010. The 2 and 3 year 12,000 miles per residual values for this car should be 47% and 42%, respectively. In addition, Chrysler is also providing $2,000 lease cash that may be used to reduce this car's capitalized cost in your area. I would be more than happy to calculate a sample lease payment on this car for you if you tell me the exact MSRP of the vehicle that you are interested in. It would also be helpful if you provided the Edmunds.com True Market Value price for the car that you give MSRP information for.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Hi parker19. Pre-paid leases are calculated just like regular leases are, with one exception. Most banks provide consumers with some sort of reduced lease money factor or lease rate in exchange for the pre-payment of their entire lease contract in advance. Some banks have much more attractive advance pay lease programs than others do. So essentially one would calculate the monthly lease payment for the vehicle that they are interested in, using the discounted money factor and then multiply their payment by the number of months that they are leasing for to come up with a total lease cost. Of course one could modify the normal lease payment calculation formula to come up with one that would eliminate the need to multiply your monthly payment by your term, but it is just simpler to come up with a regular payment and multiply it out. It is difficult to say what a good one pay lease price would be for this car without knowing its full MSRP, the price that you were able to negotiate, and the pre-payment discount provided by bank that you are leasing it through.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Thanks darthken. I am glad that you find this discussion so helpful. I have seen both Honda's and Nissan's lease programs for the month of August and would be more than happy to help you out. If you were to lease a 2002 Honda CR-V through American Honda Finance Corp. this month for 3 years, their base lease money factor should be .00230. I haven't actually seen if their residual values have changed this month, yet, but definitely will check today for you to see if they have. Check back with me tonight or tomorrow for this truck's exact resid.

As far as the 2002 Nissan Altima 3.5SE goes, if you were to lease one through Nissan Motor Acceptance Corp. for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, their base lease money factor and residual value should currently be .00226 and 50%, respectively. Their 3 year 12,000 miles per residual value would increase to 51%.

Nissan Motor Acceptance Corp. has a lease acquisition fee of $545, but I do not believe that they charge a disposition fee. American Honda Finance Corp. has a lease acquisition fee of $550 and I don't think that they have a disposition fee either.

I am sorry to say that I have not heard when the 2003 Honda CR-V is scheduled to arrive at dealers. Perhaps someone over on the SUV Message Board would know.

I personally wouldn't purchase any sort of lease software. It is very easy to calculate lease payments for vehicles if you follow the formula that is provided here at Edmunds.com exactly. You can even create an Excel spreadsheet that will do all of the work for you. Once you have the formula down, just check with me to find out accurate lease program details for your calculations.

Car_man

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parker19 · August 2002

I appreciate your quick response but I must confess that I am more confused than ever about leasing. You mention in another post about leasing from a bank. I thought when you lease a car you lease it from the dealer and that is your only option.

You mentioned you couldn't figure out an up front lease figure with certain numbers. I am looking to lease an '03 acura cl for 36 months at 15,000 miles .. msrp 29,000, negotiated price 28,000 ... i want to pay one lump sum

thank you for all your help

pgullo · August 2002

Hi Car man - Sorry about the lack of info in my last post. I am interested in the Explorer XLT with a V8, and the Odyssey EX (no Nav). I am looking for residuals and money factors for 36 months and 12K per year. Thanks for all your help!

saibalm · August 2002

Car Man,
Thanks for your help. Here is the MSRP and TMV info that I got from Edmunds.com

Invoice $27,216
MSRP $29,220
TMV $27,458
Can you please provide me an estimated lease payment per month for 24 and 36 mon lease for 12K mi/yr. Thanks again for your help

jpesci · August 2002

Car_man

Hope this is what you need to help.

9-5 Linear with the Premium package.

9-3 SE with automatic transmission.

I could really use a Cap to start for each, the MF and residual. I'd like to only go 36 months and need 15k miles per year and live in Nevada.

JP

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Parker19, individual dealerships never actually lease vehicles to consumers. Instead, they act as agents for banks who purchase the vehicles from them and then in turn lease them to consumers. This is how all leases work. The majority of leases go through banks that are affiliated with the manufacturer of the vehicle that you are interested in. For example, if you were going to lease a BMW, your dealership would sell it to BMW Financial Services who would in turn lease it to you. The dealership that you get your car from acts as an agent for the bank in the process. As far as the one pay lease that you are interested in goes, I can easily figure out the total cost to lease this car for the term and mileage that you mentioned. However, I do not know the lease money factor reduction that American Honda Finance Corp. provides consumers who pre-pay their leases. You are likely going to have to find this out from the dealership that you are working with. Doing so is very important, not only because it will allow me to calculate how much your lease should cost, but also to see if making all of your payments in advance is actually worth the savings that you would realize.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Thanks for the additional information, pgullo. Although Ford Motor Credit's lease rates for the 2002 Explorer may vary somewhat depending upon the part of the country that you are in, I believe that in most areas the 3 year 12,000 miles per lease rate and residual value for a 2002 Explorer 4-Door XLT 4WD should be around 3.0% and 40%, respectively. In addition to this lease rate, you should be able to use the $2,000 to $2,500 (varies by region) lease cash that Ford is providing on this truck to reduce its capitalized cost.

As far as the Honda Odyssey goes, not surprisingly they are not providing any sort of incentives or lease support on it at this time. So if you were to lease one through American Honda Finance Corp. right now you would have to use their standard lease money factors. The base standard 36 month factor should be .00230 and the 3 year 12,000 miles per residual value for a 2002 Odyssey EX without Navigation should be a solid 63%.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

You're welcome, saibalm. OK, using the numbers that you have provided me with, if you were to lease the 2002 Chrysler 300M that you are interested in at TMV through Chrysler Financial in the New York area right now for 2 years with 12,000 miles per, you should have a zero down, pre-tax monthly lease payment of right around $564. The 3 year 12,000 miles per payment would drop to $426. The good news is that even though the TMV for this car is slightly over dealer invoice, there is also $2,000 lease cash on this car that should enable you to lease one for at least $1,000 to $1,500 below invoice if you comparison shop a little bit. Reworking this deal with a cap cost of $1,500 below invoice would lower the 2 year payment to $491 and the 3 year payment to $377.

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gfelker · August 2002

Hi Car Man--
I think I have basically got the leasing thing figured out from reading this board. One question--I have heard that making a downpayment (with a trade-in or whatever) on your lease is a bad idea bc if you total the car of if it is stolen and not recovered, you loose your downpayment. I am not sure how this works-say you make a downpayment of 6K, 1 week later the car is totalled, the insurance co pays the lease company for the car, presumably some of that money should go to you as well, right? Could you help me understand this.
thanks
Mike

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Thanks for the additional info, JP. OK if you were to lease a 2002 Saab 9-5 Linear Sedan through Saab Financial Services Corp. during the month of August for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, you should be able to use their base lease money factor and residual value of .00018 and 42%, respectively. If you were to do an otherwise identical lease on a 2002 Saab 9-3 SE Sedan, the numbers should be .00117 and 45%, respectively. When negotiating a deal on these two cars, it is important to keep in mind that Saab is also providing a whopping $6,000 lease cash on the 2002 9-5 Linear Sedan and $3,000 on the 2002 9-3 SE Sedan that may be used to reduce their purchase prices (capitalized costs). It is difficult for me to say exactly what sort of capitalized cost you will be able to negotiate on these cars. I suggest that you look up their True Market Values here at Edmunds and then take the lease cash into account in order to arrive at a reasonable cap cost.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Mike, down payments on leased vehicles do nothing to establish equity in them. They basically serve to reduce the amount of interest that the lessee is going to pay over the length of their lease. If you made a significant down payment on a leased vehicle and it was totaled in an accident a week later, your insurance company would pay the bank that you were leasing the car through a settlement for its value and that would be the end of the story. The bank is not obligated to refund a dime of your down payment because you had not established any sort of equity in the vehicle. The entire settlement would go to them to offset the loss of the vehicle that they had paid for in full.

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gfelker · August 2002

thanks for the quick answer. A good reason to avoid downpayments on leases all together.

While I have you "on the line", so to speak, I am looking at an 02 Volvo S60 AWD, MSRP arround 36K or so, cap probably arround 34500, 36 mos, 12000K miles--do you know what the volvo finance residuals and money factor for august would be?

I realize that the differences in residual might make it a good deal to wait for the 03s, but not sure we can wait that long.
thanks
Mike

saibalm · August 2002

Car Man,
Thanks again. I still have a few questions. They are
1. The payments that you mentioned is pre-tax, right ? What if you include tax? Can you please provide me that. I know, I'm asking too much...but kind of confused while calculating the tax portion of it. I live in NY - 10952.

2. The money factor you said is .00010 what is the equiv. interest rate, if I convert

3. Can you please help me understanding why payments are higher 2 yr lease vs the 3 yr. It should be other way round because of less depritiation in 2 yr - what am I missing ?

Thanks for your time.

gremmit · August 2002

Hey CarMan,

I have read this board for some time and know that you always give great info. I have a question that I hope you can answer for me. I have a 2000 BMW 328i that I have financed through the BMW Owners Choice program. That contract is coming to an end in a few months and I really want to look at an M3. I was hoping that given the following info you might be able to give me a close figure on the monthly payment for an M3 lease. Price of $51,120, $3000 down, 36 months, 15K miles a year. Not sure what the current residual and money factor are. Any help you could give me would be very much appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Also, are you familiar with the BMW Owners Choice
financing, similar to the "Smart Buy"? I was wondering if there is an easy way to calculate payments under that financing program. I think under some circumstances the payment for that form of financing is less than a lease payment.

Are residuals typically higher at the beginning of a model year and less near the end of a model year?

Thanks for your help

iamaddman · August 2002

Hi Car Man,

Do you have any info on the GM Pull Ahead Program. I believe it ended on 7/31, but I was wondering if there is any chance it will be extended.

Also could you let me know what the money factor and residuals are on an olds silhouette.

2002 & 2003 FWD premiere 3yr/36K

Thanks

jgwoods · August 2002

Mike,

Rather than parting with a huge down payment (or any down payment!) another option would be to increase the security deposit or supply two security deposits. This either raises the residual or lowers the interest rate (not sure which one). But at least with this option you get the security deposit back at the end of the lease (with the stipulation that there is no damage to the car upon return).

jgwoods

darthken · August 2002

Hi CarMan,

Thanks for your response to my earlier post. Just checking back as you suggested to find out what the August AHFC residuals are for a 2002 CRV EX, 3yr lease at both 12k and 15k.

Also, the leasing program I was thinking about buying was the one at www.leasewizard.com. It's not just a lease calculator, but rather claims to show you the available lease terms (fees, MFs and residuals) from a variety of banks, not just the manufacturer's finance arm. So, while you are a great resource for the manufacturer's lease terms, perhaps an outside bank would have a better lease offer I should know about. Then if the dealer offers a lease from an outside bank - Chase, for example - I would know if additional profit was being baked into the terms. Do you think this sort of program is worth it?

Thanks again!

jpesci · August 2002

OK.

Then based on the info provided and lets say the cost for the car is invoice minus the whole 6k say 30k.

Sorry for all the additional questions, but this is the first time I've considered a lease and want to go and make the deal with all the facts.

viking89 · August 2002

I am looking at leasing a 2002 RSX. Are there any currnet lease specials going right now? I havent been able to find any. Also what is the usual money factor? Is it possible to get the lease financing through another institution? Thanks.

pgullo · August 2002

Hi carman - thank you for your invaluable assistance. I'm still shopping! Do you know the lease numbers for a awd 3.8 Chrysler Town & Country LXi and the 2002 4wd Trailblazer ext lt. I am looking for 36mos and 12k. I live in NY.

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

You're welcome, Mike. Volvo has some regional variation in their incentives this month, so in order for me to give you an accurate idea of what their lease program should be like for this car it would be a big help if you would tell me where you plan on leasing it. Once I have this additional information, I should be able to help you out. Talk to you soon.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

No problem, saibalm. Yes the sample lease payments that I calculated for you were indeed before tax. I really can not calculate sample lease payments that include tax for you because different parts of the country have different taxation policies for leased vehicles. I am not positive about how tax is calculated in your area.

As far as the money factor goes, a lease money factor of .00010 would be equivalent to an interest rate of approximately one quarter of one percent.

Shorter term leases almost always have higher monthly payments than long term leases do. This is because the largest portion of a vehicle's depreciation occurs during the first year of ownership. The longer your lease is, the longer you are able to spread out this massive initial depreciation hit.

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gfelker · August 2002

Thanks for the reply--on the volvo, I'm in North Carolina (Raleigh Durham area)

Thanks again
Mike

soylent · August 2002

Hi Car_man,

Appreciate all the info you provide on this board, its been really helpful to both myself and friends who are "in the market" this year. I have a test drive set up for Sunday. I need residual / money factor for:

2002 C320 Mercedes Sport Wagon Automatic
3/36
4/48

Los Angeles, Ca.

Thanks,

Brian

gperr · August 2002

Car_man,

Have you had an opportunity yet to see the August rates for the Infiniti G35 (leather)?

I am interested in 12K miles/year, 24, 27, 30, and 36 months.

Thanks again,

Gregg

CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Hi gremmit. Thanks for being such a loyal reader. Nice choice in cars with the M3. The new one is a rocket. As one might suspect, BMW is not providing any sort of lease support on the 2002 M3. So if you were to lease one through BMW Financial Services right now, you would have to use their base standard lease money factor of I believe .00275 for 36 month terms and their 3 year 15,000 miles per residual value of 58%. Since there is not much negotiation on this car, I will assume that the price of $51,120 that you posted is both its MSRP and selling price. If that is the case and you were to lease one right now through BMW FS for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, the zero down, pre-tax monthly lease payment should be right around a $819. A $3,000 down payment, which I don't personally recommend, would reduce your monthly payment to around $727. I am familiar with BMW's Owner's Choice balloon note program. However, I do not follow balloon note programs, so I really can't tell you exactly what sort of interest rates they are providing through it for this car right now. Vehicles' residual values definitely are higher at the beginning of the model year than at the end. Given the fact that there is absolutely no lease support and absolutely no price negotiation on the M3 right now, it likely would be less expensive to lease a 2003 M3 when it hits showrooms than the 2002 version, provided there is not much of a price difference between the two.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Hey iamaddman. I haven't seen anything that would indicate that GMAC's lease pull-ahead program was extended on August 1st. It certainly is possible that it was, but since I have not heard about it you will need to check with a dealer to find out for certain. As far as the Oldsmobile Silhouette goes, GMAC's lease program for this model varies by region. As a result, I am going to need you to tell me what state you are in in order for me to tell you what their lease rate and residual should be like. Talk to you soon.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Very good point, jgwoods. Many banks (unfortunately not all) do indeed allow consumers to put down additional security deposits on their vehicle in exchange for a reduction in the lease money factor that is used to calculate their monthly lease payment. In fact, many banks, like BMW Financial Services for instance, will allow lessees to make up to 9 additional security deposits, each one reducing the money factor by a certain amount. This is a great alternative to making a down payment if you have the cash, because if your vehicle is in pretty good shape and not over mileage at the end of your term, you get all of this money back.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Hi again darthken. I have gotten to take a look at the lease program that you are interested in. If you were to lease a 2002 Honda CR-V EX through American Honda Finance Corp. during August for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, their base lease money factor and residual value should be .00230 and 59%, respectively. The 3 year, 12,000 miles per residual value would increase to 61%.

As far as leasewizard goes, although it has been a while since I last played with it, my problem with it when I did is that they did not use banks' actual residual values when calculating sample lease payments, but rather just supplied the ALG (an independent company that calculates residuals for vehicles) residual value. Given the fact that banks' actual residual values are often different than ALG's, their calculations were sometimes off. I don't know how accurate their lease money factor data is, but I personally am fairly skeptical. If you do end up getting it, let me know and we can compare numbers to see how good their data is. That would be very interesting.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

OK, jpesci. Let's say that you were to lease a 2002 Saab 9-5 Linear (MSRP: $34,620 / Cap Cost: $32,594 invoice - $6,000 lease cash = $26,594) through their captive finance company for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, according to my calculations your zero down, pre-tax monthly lease payment should be right around $352. Please let me know if you would like me to calculate a sample payment for any other vehicles.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

Hi viking89. I would be more than happy to give you an idea of what the current lease program should be like for the 2002 Acura RSX, but first I am going to need some additional information from you first. How long do you plan on leasing this car for and how many miles per year do you want to be able to drive without having to pay a lease-end penalty? Unfortunately, Acura is not providing any sort of lease support on the RSX at this time, but American Honda Finance Corp.'s standard lease program is actually pretty good. I have heard that Acura dealerships have been running some of their leases through Chase right now. They seem to have a fairly aggressive program on Acuras at this time, but I only know AHFC's program details. Once you provide me with the additional information that I asked for, I will give you an idea of what Acura's program is like. Talk to you soon.

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CarMan@Edmunds · August 2002

No problem, pgullo. If you were to lease a 2002 Chrysler Town & Country LXi 2WD through Chrysler Financial in New York right now for 3 years with 12,000 miles per, their base lease money factor and residual value should be .00255 and 42%, respectively. When leasing this van, keep in mind that Chrysler is also providing $3,000 lease cash on it that may be used in conjunction with their special lease program.

As far as the 2003 Chevrolet Tahoe goes, if you were to lease one right now through General Motors Acceptance Corp. for 3 years with 12,000 miles per, their base lease rate and residual value should be 6.50% and I believe 55%, respectively.

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iamaddman · August 2002

Carman I live in the Chicago area. Could you please let me know what the residuals and money factors are for a 2002 & 2003 Silhouette premier FWD.

As long as you are checking on GM vehicles could you also please let me know what the residuals and money factors are on the 2003 Envoy SLE 4wd.

Thanks in advance for all of you help,

Adam

jpesci · August 2002

Thanks for all your help.

I'm still pursuing this one. Based on your experience and based on the fact these are slow movers is it reasonable to expect an invoice price and get the 6K money as well?

If I change direction I'll be sure to contact you for your good advice.

Thanks again
JP

force98 · August 2002

Hey Car_man,

I popped into my local Saab dealer this morning, and they told me the $6000 customer cash was only available for a purchase, not a lease. They believed only $3500 was available for lease.

Steve

remy725 · August 2002

Hi carman
Can you please give me the the MF and residual to lease 2002 Volvo Cross Country for 36 or 39 Months and 12k & 15K miles p/year.

Thanks
Remy

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