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Chrysler PT Cruiser (2005 and earlier)
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Comments
But I do need to be comfortable, which is why I would welcome any comments about the comfort of the driver's seat in the PT Cruiser.
As for the seats in a PT I would have to say they are more comfortable than one would expect for this size car. The seating position is more like a chair and I think you legs are allowed a more natural seating position. I had a Prelude and while the seats were comfortable the seating position was not. Unless you like sitting on the floor at home with your feet almost straight out in front of you. The preludes seating position allowed for a lower car over all and was fine for short trips of up to an hour. The PT allows for longer drives with a bit more comfort in my opinion. This driving position is a bit like the one that all the SUV drivers claim has made them consider a SUV over a traditional Sedan or Wagon. Try it for yourself.
Auto upholsterers who have tried to improve my seat, with some success, say that they are seeing more models of cars, including luxury cars like Mercedes, Lexus, and Jaguar, coming in for seat fixes. They blame this on the fact that virtually all cars now use preformed foam seats with a minimum of structure and few if any springs. This results in an unforgiving seat, where seats on older cars had more give and could therefore accommodate a wider range of backs. Certainly I never had this kind of problem with older cars (I got my license in 1951).
Anyway, I am looking forward to testing a PT Cruiser and, if I like it, trying if at all possible to rent one for at least a week. Thanks again for your comments.
As for Japanese vs. American cars I will have to favor the Japanese. I have owned over 50 cars Of all descriptions and from Europe, Japan and the U.S. My favorites are the Miata and Lexus LS400, both '90 models.
We also have a Acura 3.2 TL now (the wifes car) and it beats the PT not only in the acceleration dept. but also in fuel economy.
Lee
I can attest that the front seat is comfortable for someone over 6' also. I am 6'3" and have found the seat to be very comfortable. I also adjusted the front as I would sit in it and the back seat was also comfortable. I love my PTs
I'm waiting to see one with the chrome package and hope the wait won't be too long!
1) Reliability -- I know that it got perfect scores in year one from Consumer Reports, but I was wondering about long-term reliability of the PT Cruiser and Chrysler products as a whole. As someone who is approaching this car as an 8-10 year investment, I was hoping that someone could allay my concerns about buying American generally and Chrysler specifically.
2) Safety -- As the primary driver, I am concerned with the two star safety rating. I do realize that these results reflect one test from 2001, and I have read salient posts about the relative value of defensive driving. I was just wondering if anyone had heard of improved results from the 2002 model or modifications for the upcoming 2003 models to improve driver safety.
3) Power -- I test drove a 2002 Limited edition with a 5-speed and found plenty of pickup for city driving. I did not, however, have the opportunity to take it on the highway for passing or to drive with a cab full of passengers or cargo. I was hoping for some feedback from owners about the car's performance under such circumstances. Also, does anyone know if there is any truth to the rumors that, in addition to the new turbo model, the 150 hp models will have a boost in torque in 2003?
4) Competition -- While I don't think that there is any car in its class that competes with its style, new crossover 4-door hatchbacks / sportwagons like the Matrix / Vibe, the Focus ZX5, and the Protege5 do offer similar utility for similar dollars. Some people in this thread have mentioned such vehicles, and I was wondering if anyone had extensively driven and compared such vehicles.
Thanks to all who have posted and who continue to post for helping other potential PT owners be more informed ones.
Pat
My family members and friends who months ago said "You want one of THOSE? Those are so ugly!" etc etc...**hearse comments** are now WANTING one.
Heh. Copycats. --cheribaybee
The PT Cruiser seats and driver leg and foot room is superior to the Town & Country. I like the firm seat comfort of the PT Cruiser and would really like a PT Cruiser for local driving with the T&C for long road trips.
Test drove the PT Cruiser and was pleasantly surprised at the performance from that little 4 cyl engine with 4 speed automatic. However, the PT Cruiser is affected much more by wind than is the larger T&C.
Also saw a non-turbo Limited. The bumper colors now match the color of the car. That's the only exterior difference that I noticed.
Pat
One follow-up question: aside from the turbo, does anyone know of any changes being made to the 2003 Cruiser? I heard a rumor of a bump in torque for the base engine and was wondering if anyone could confirm. I was also hoping that something could be done to improve the two-star driver crash rating from 2001.
Pat
Pat
The sales person at the dealership you visited probably won't be a salesperson for very long if he/she doesn't know that the PT Turbos are already out. He/she may not have any on the lot, but I've seen them at the dealerships. Go back and tell that sales person you're going to buy one at one of their competitors since his/her dealership won't have any until the end of the year.
I love the style, seat comfort and utility of the PT Cruiser but could not give up the nice, quiet V6 of our DC minivan with separately controlled temperature for driver and front passenger, complete overhead console with compass/outside temperature and trip computer when it is impractical for us to own 2 vehicles.
One thing I will say in Chrysler's favor: they seem to be listening to their constituents. Last year, they moved the rear window controls and altered the rear headrests. This year, they've added body-colored bumpers and the cue-ball automatic as well as an optional upgrade in engine. They seem intent on catering their product to its intended audience, and that is a good thing for consumers.
Pat
Note to hardoo....yes, they are out and they are for sale.
First, this is the very first time I had driven or been in any Cruiser. This is a very nice piece. Built exteremely well with high quality materials. Felt very solid...that bank vault feel you get with Benzes is prevalent throughout.
The one I tested was an automatic (neet ball shifter with "autostick". Very quick with little turbo lag. No torque steer that I could detect. Motor has a nice muted "snarly sound" when reved. I couldn't hear any turbo whine, but I had the A/C cranked up full. Maybe with the A/C off, I would have heard it. Handling is probably the best FWD handling I've ever experienced (and that includes Acura FWD cars and the 300M). Suspension/ride was very forgiving but kept all wheels planted on the road regardless of road condition. I can't imagine another car this stylish, this quick, this versatile on the market today. High praise for this unit. Drove a regular Cruiser to compare. Huge difference in acceleration and feel. The suspension changes and turbo engine turn this car into something closer to a roadster than a runabout. Won't confuse it with a Miata, but it rides tons better than one, too and seems to be a couple of steps above the typical competition like Matrix, Vibe Protege wagon, VW Passat Wagon, etc. by any measure.
Now the bad news. This thing was priced at $27,900. OK, if they move a bit on the price, I would "pull the trigger" on it. When it got down to negotiating, salesperson said that these cars were so "hot" that they were going at MSRP. I politely thanked him for his time and said I didn't think we could deal. That's when the "games" began.
Salesman: If I could get some money off sticker would you be willing to deal?
Me: I tought you said these were so hot that it was MSRP or nothing?
Salesman: Well, I like you and think you're someone I could deal with?
Me (not aloud, but thinking it): "yea...right!"
Me: Go ahead
I know that there is roughly about a $1,500 delta between invoice and MSRP, probably more since invoice prices for the Turbo PT aren't out yet. I figured if I could split the difference, I would be OK. I'm thinking something in the neighborhood of $27,000-$27,200 (I would have jumped all over anything under $27,000.
The problem, at $28,000 you can get some nice SUVs with V6 engines and equipped about the same way with even more room. Or, you can get a leftover '02 Acura TL, maybe even a TL-S, or a discounted 300M that are just as fast or faster. Or, you can get something sylish like a Mini-Cooper for much less. Or you can get a new V6 '03 totally loaded Accord/Camry/Grand Prix/Maxima for even less. Taken from that perspective, it's not nearly as compelling of a buy.
Salesman came bakc with $100 off MSRP. I again thank him and get ready to leave. He stops me and asks me what I'm driving now. I've had a '94 Saturn that I use as a "back-up" car that has 90,000 miles but runs well and has been well taken care of. Salesman asks if I want to trade it. I say "sure,if the price is right". I'm now figuring they will try to build some of the profit from the PT Turbo by giving me a couple hundred over trade-in value for the Saturn (which is about $1,800 according to KBB, "the Black Book" and NADA.
So now I'm thinking $27,400 for the PT Turbo and $2,000 for the trade. Salesman comes back with $1,000 for my trade and $200 off MSRP for the PT Turbo. An hour has gone by, and we're still $1,200-$1,300 off from making a deal. I walk while the salesman is still asking what if he did "X" whould I buy if I did "Y".
This is a very nice car. If you can get one at $1,000 off MSRP it would be a good deal. As it stands, there are other more compelling vehicles at or below what the PT Turbo offers regardless of what you're looking for...style (Mini Cooper), room (SUVs), handling & speed (Maxima, GP, Accord/Camry, etc.).
Maybe I'll wait 2-3 months or just buy something else entirely.
BTW--this salesman didn't even tell me his name or offer me a card/brochure or thank me for my time.
How sleazy!!!!!!!!
TO reassess my post above, at $24,900, the Turbo PT Cruiser is an excellent value.
Pat
Early reports on the turbo state that it's one sweet driver.
The real MSRP on the ones I saw included probably every option available...leather, sunroof, autostick, etc. The only thing missing were the optional "flames, woody treatment, etc.". They all should be priced at $24,900 on the MSRP, not the $27,900 sticker that the sleazy dealer showed me.
I'll probably wait for a few months and see if Chrysler is going to do rebates on these like they are on the 2002 versions. I'll wait until this time next year, if need be. Won't know until invoice pricing is out, but I suspect that if there's $1,300 play between invoice and MSRP on the '02 Limited's, then it shouldn't be too far a stretch thinking there's $1,500 difference between MSRP and invoice on an '03 PT Turbo.
Pat
Here in Austin I've seen many Dealers with "Market Adjustment" adds. But never a sticker swap. That is SLEAZY!
U.S. brands have always been negotiable (except for low production specialty cars like the new Thunderbird).
txyank...the '03 Cruisers look better than previous editions IMHO. If the Turbo Cruiser didn't drive so well, and I wasn't so impressed with it, I'd probably not look at them again after the dealer's shenanigans. They are very good cars, however and I'm willing to wait until I get the deal I want.
Pat
I think i'll wait til the 2004 comes out; by that time the excitement will have died down a bit.
Perhaps then i can pull off another great invoice deal.
The most fun of them all, however was the Subaru WRX. WOW! That's about the only way to describe it. It's priced $2k-$3k above the rest (about the same as a PT Turbo loaded up, comparing MSRP to MSRP...low 20s). I couldn't get past the "cafe racer" look of it. The paint seemed really thin as were the body panels. They cut some definite corners in the details (no paint on some of the door jambs or under the hood/trunk, seats felt thin, swtiches were notchy feeling). But "bang for the buck" really can't be beat.
Last dealership I stopped at was another Chrysler dealer. It was late...about 8:30 p.m. They had the candy apple red color on the floor with black leather and sunroof. It was stunning looking, to say the least. It had 7 miles on it. Sales guys were obviously ready to go home as they looked beat (it's been super hot for the last couple of weeks in my burg...I can only imagine what it was like "pounding the black asphalt" all day). What ended up being the Sales Manager approached me asking me if I was interested in the Turbo (here we go again...). I said yes but would come back when they (and I) had more time. He said, "you're here now, take it for a drive around the block. If you like it, it's the end of the day, I think we can work a deal if it's fair to both of us". Well, I figured it can't hurt. Pulled it out of the showroom. I drove it for about 20 minutes and still liked it best out of everything I had driven. Came back at 9:15 p.m. Only two people left at the dealership was the Sales Manager (who introduced himself as such when I walked in) and the finance lady.
He said make a reasonable offer and lets go home. I said I had a trade. Showed him my '94 Saturn I use as a 2nd car. He started it up. Drove it around the parking lot and said, "it seems to run good". I had all the service receipts with me and showed them to him. He offered me $300 over the best offer I had since I have been shopping (that was also $300 over KBB value). Offered me $550 over invoice (what I assume was invoice since I had to take the sheet he showed me as fact) on the Turbo Cruiser. Besides, the price looked real close to what I had figured it would be. Sounded fair, so I bought it and it's parked in my garage right now.
Finance lady asked me if I wanted extended warranty. I only had to use one "no" and we were trading titles and signing mileage statements.
Didn't get out of the dealership until 10:30 p.m. Sales Manager actually washed and dried it for me by hand and filled it with a full tank of Premium since the "lot tech" had also left for the day, too. Wonder who gets the commission on that sale?
Now the addiction begins. It starts with the fuzzy dice that seem just so right, hanging from the mirror. Then.....
Congrats!
I agree with you on the Subaru. It offers something like 224 hp with AWD, and Subaru is right up there with Toyota in terms of reliability. You can even get it in wagon form if you're looking for competitive utility. I just can't get past the looks.
So it comes down to the Turbo. I'd be interested in hearing the invoice price as well as the impact this purchase has had upon your insurance and your gas budget. Any ammo I can use against the wife would be much appreciated.
Finally, I'll leave off by saying that I would have waited for the stick. But I'm just saying that because I'm jealous. :-)
Pat
To everyone - For those interested, look for a direct link to our PT Cruiser Turbo discussion in the helpful Links on the left side of the page. Happy motoring. ;-)
Revka
Host
Hatchbacks & Wagons Boards
Since first seeing and sitting inside the PT Cruiser, I have wanted one. We finally test drove an automatic and was surprised at the acceleration with 3 adults and 2 children aboard. However, it was a windy day and the PT was buffeted much greater than our 2002 T&C eL on the same road (I-15) just prior to and just after the test drive of the PT Cruiser.
If I could talk my wife into having 2 vehicles I would buy the PT....but with only one, the T&C is a wiser choice.
Checked a number of dealers and found many have several. Some dealers (SoCal) are marking them up well over factory sticker while other are selling at factory sticker, with at least one selling them below factory sticker - with no add-ons.
Chrome accents package and Woody package not available on PT GT.
Noted the wheels do not have an outer lip to attach wheel weights.
Ordered one.
Hardoo, I indeed have a wife. That's how this whole thing started she needed a new car and thought the PT was "cute". I ended up buying it for myself and she took over my 300M. That's another long story, too. If interested I posted more details in the Maintenance and Repair Thread in the Zaino Part II topic.
Using my guesstimate on invoice price (about $1,500-$1,700 below MSRP), I would say that invoice on mine was about $24,200-$24,400. Dealer gave up all but $550 of the "over invoice" profit. OF course, dealer still makes the holdback, too.
Mine is equiped with every option available, including $200 extra for the "inferno red pearlcoat", leather, side airbags, sunroof, heated seats, etc. Maybe the only thing I could have got were the dealer installed options like custon graphics or a CD changer.
This includes numbers for the Turbo!
A PT GT Turbo "Loaded" with the 2CR package is $23,738 invoice, $25,450 MSRP in Michigan.
Enjoy
I want to get a recumbent bike and want to carry it inside if I could.
TIA Frank
Also, does it need premimum fuel?