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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    $600/month for a 60 month lease on an ES 300 with only 12,000 miles per year!!!! OUCH. At least this generous person is willing to give $500 of his own money to the foolish consumer who gets him out of this nightmare of a deal. Ha. It definitely pays to do some research prior to jumping into a lease on a new car or truck.

    Car_man
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  • akanglakangl Member Posts: 3,282
    I talked to VW Credit about my Jetta and the buy out price right now is $21,150. I figure if I wait until October it will be about $19,900 and then I can put $4000 down and finance $15,900. The only reason I leased the Jetta was because I could get the cheapest payment that way, I was $10,000 upside down in a 99 Nissan Quest SE. The lease was an easy way out of the $600 a month payment on the Quest. Live and learn I guess.
  • c240_sjc240_sj Member Posts: 5
    Car_man,

    Thanks for the info you had provided earlier. I leased a C240 36 Mos, 15 K/yr yesterday thru MBCC. Here are the numbers...

    Cap cost = 37490.00
    Residual = 25654.30
    Depreciation = 11835.70
    Rent charge = 8047.08

    Base monthly payment = 552.30
    Sales tax (6%) = 33.14
    Total monthly payment = 585.44
  • s852s852 Member Posts: 1,051
    That sounds pretty nice to me except that you did not give all the information in the numbers.
    How much money did you put down and was a trade in involved? How much total cash was required to start (security deposits etc.)?

    $37490 sounds like it should have been pretty heavily loaded with options for that price.
    What options are on the car and how do you like it so far?
  • xfactorxfactor Member Posts: 78
    Off Topic.

    Car_man

    What is a Peppercorn lease?
  • la_maxla_max Member Posts: 9
    Car Man,

    What are the current money factors on the 2001 Maxima SE and GLE? Also, what are the residual values for these two models? Have these numbers been coming down with the announcements of the new Altima and 260HP Maxima? Have they come down since Nissan started offering 3.9% financing?

    Thanks.
  • bobbysilbobbysil Member Posts: 4
    For a 3 year,15000 miles per year lease,what is the current money factor and residual offered by MB for a 2001 C240 ?
  • xfactorxfactor Member Posts: 78
    Sorry Car_man I was asked the question that I stated in 906 and thought it was worth a shot that you might know, as I did not.

    In any event the definition I found is that it is a U.S. term that means the title passes at the end of the lease for payment of a peppercorn, i.e. a diminimus amount. The indication from what I have found is it was actually used in Abe Lincoln's time.

    Just a point of interest.
  • topgun7topgun7 Member Posts: 412
    Car_man, what is the lease payment for a 2002 lexus sc430 with run flat, spoiler, and Nav. Proabably have to pay msrp :-<. I am interested in knowing the different in payment for 36 (or 39 months) and 48 months lease with minimum down payment and 15K per year. The dealer that I quote me a money factor of 0.0035. the dealer also mentioned that Lexus Financial allow people buying down the money factore by giving them more security deposit (each monthly payment worth will cut down the money factor by 0.0001 up to a max of 9 payments). Are you familiar with this security deposit deal? Thanks.
  • iamkimboiamkimbo Member Posts: 1
    In March Toyota had a lease special on the Solara. Does anyone recall the specifics?
    Interest rate? Mileage restrictions? etc? Thanks for your help.
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi xfactor. You're post isn't off-topic, after all it is a "Lease Question," so feel free to ask it here ;) . Unfortunately, I don't believe that I have ever heard the phrase "Peppercorn lease." Where did you hear, or see, it and in what context was it being used?

    Car_Man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi la_max. I would be happy to provide you with the information that you are looking for. However, you must keep in mind that Nissan's April lease program is only scheduled to run through April 30th. If you decide to lease a 2001 Nissan Maxima SE or GLE through Nissan Motor Acceptance Corp. prior to the aforementioned date the 36 month lease money factor would be .00220. The 15,000 miles per year residual values for these cars would be 51% and 52% respectively. The lease program on this particular car has been fairly stable over the next several months. It is difficult to say for certain what impact the introduction of new models will have upon it. I personally doubt that new models will cause the lease payments for a 2001 Maxima to dramatically improve. Even if Nissan does decide to increase their lease support on this car because new models are out there, new vehicles will likely cause the current Maxima's residual values to fall. This drop in its residuals would counteract much of the additional support that Nissan would introduce on this car and likely keep its payments in the same price range. Of course, theoretically Nissan could dramatically increase their support on the Maxima, which would provide more attractive leases. I personally don't see this happening, but it is difficult to predict what a particular automaker will do with their future incentives with 100% accuracy.

    Car_Man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi Bobby. If you decide to lease a 2001 Mercedes-Benz C240 for 3 years with 15,000 miles per year through Mercedes-Benz Credit Corporation right now, you will have to use their standard lease money factor of .00354 and a residual value of 67%.

    Car_Man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Xfactor, I just got to your second post. Thanks for the additional information. I guess that's why I hadn't heard of this type of lease. I was only in my teens when Honest Abe was around and was more interested in other things ;) .

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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi topgun7. The Lexus Financial Services lease program is only scheduled to run through April 30th. Please feel free to check back with me in a week or two and I will be able to give you a much more accurate estimate of how much money it will cost you to lease this car. Nice choice by the way. The 2002 SC430 is definitely one of my favorite vehicles on the road right now!

    Car_Man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Iamkimbo, Toyota breaks the country down into many different regions, each with their own incentives and lease programs. If you can be a little more specific about where you live, I should be able to let you know if I have seen any special leases on the 2001 Toyota Solara in your area. Thanks. Talk to you soon.

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  • bobbysilbobbysil Member Posts: 4
    Car_Man thanks for the quick response.
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    You're welcome, Bobby. I am glad that I was able to help.

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  • honda_man1honda_man1 Member Posts: 2
    Car_man,

    Want to check with you, on my quest to be educated on car leasing game. We just leased a 2001 Ody EX, trading in a 1996 Ody EX 3 months early. The bottom line is: gave them $3000 cash, dealer paid off the remaining 3 months ($442/month including tax, on a 5 year lease), got a all leather uphostery, rack, cassette player, MSRP at about $31k. New mo. payment is $479.60 (incl.tax) for 48 months, 15,000/year, residual at 52% (approx. $14,600).

    What do you think? Thanks a bunch for your feedbacks....
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Member Posts: 4,883
    IIRC...

    The latest Lease program on the SC430 is a factor of .00325 I think (WHatever LFS's top tier rate is) and a residual of about 63% for 36 months.

    That being said, if you can get one for MSRP.. grab it!

    I ordered 7 of them in the summer of 2000 and have been selling them for $75,000-80,000 each as they arrive.

    They're doing over $70K at dealer auctions!

    I know the dealer here in Orlando has 120+ pending orders with deposits for the car, I think they are sold out until next summer!

    Bill
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi honda_man1. Congratulations on your new van. As I am sure you are well aware, the market for the Honda Odyssey is still very strong, so I wouldn't have any problem if you had to pay full MSRP for one. That is what most people are paying for them. Let's work up a sample lease payment and see how it compared to what you are paying. If you were to lease a 2001 Honda Odyssey EX with leather, roof rack, and cassette at full MSRP ($31,000) through American Honda Finance Corp. for 48 months with 15,000 miles per year, your $3,000 down, pre-tax monthly lease payment should be around $382. So it certainly looks as though you either paid more than full MSRP for this van or that most of the $3,000 that you put down was not used to reduce your van's capitalized cost. Let's say that they used the $3,000 that you gave them to pay off your remaining payments on your other van ($442 * 3 = $1,326), for your first month's payment ($480), and for your security deposit (about $500). If that is what happened, only $694 of the $3,000 that you gave them went towards reducing your vehicle's cap cost. With a $694 down payment your payments would be around $438 per month. It is hard to say how much money tax adds, but it certainly looks to me as though you paid at least full MSRP for this van if not more. I haven't shopped around for a new Odyssey in your area, so this may very well be what they are going for at this point. It is difficult to say without at least comparison shopping a little bit. If you shopped around at a couple of different dealers and this was right around what they all were quoting you then I think that you did just fine.

    Car_Man
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  • timchar99timchar99 Member Posts: 4
    Could you take a look at the message I posted last week? I haven't seen any response to it, but if you replied and I just missed it, please let me know. Thanks.
  • xfactorxfactor Member Posts: 78
    Actually, it was a question dealing with a leasing of a commercial facility in Europe. I received one of those vague e-mails stating that the use of the facility would be obtained via a peppercorn lease. The term did not appear in any of the web based financial dictionaries and as far as I could tell is not a commonly used term in the states. In some additional research I found the term to be commonly used in the UK associated with 125-999 year leases of property. In one instance the lease was related to a person leasing a car in the UK. The term was so commonly used in financial articles in the UK that no one bothered to explain it. Having seen your considerable knowledge regarding leasing I was hoping you had run across the terminology before.

    In any event when I tracked down the sender of the e-mail I obtained the explanation previously posted.

    I have still not found independent verification of the term and am now suspicious that the term pre-dates old Abe.
  • shaker58shaker58 Member Posts: 130
    hi carman

    first does it pay to pay taxes upfront and second did bmw lower rates sunday paper had some strong deals on 330 and x5 no ad on 530i
    dealer said 62% and .0300

    I order my car on saturday here's the deal
    530ia with conv and climate packages sport/prem
    xexon headlights in dash cd sticker was about 47500.nyc tax rate 8.50%
    3 yrs 12000 miles
    695.00 with bank fee 525 1st month 695 and 150plates up front
    or 623mth with 3400 upfront taxes 2100+1370(525+695+150)
  • honda_man1honda_man1 Member Posts: 2
    Car_Man,

    Thanks for your quick response! We did leased it from AHFC, acquisition fee of $450, no security deposit. On the leased agreement, the net capitalized cost is around $29,600. Tax rate is at 7.75%. The total options that the dealer put to the van is about $4,500 (a $2999 on Leather, which is outrageous, but they did a clean job). Since this is Southern Cal., paying MSRP at $26,840 is not an option. The old 96 Ody EX had $11,500 residual value, dealer bought the van at $11,782. Those options that the dealer installed obviously are "Profit enhancing" for them at retail, on the positive side, I don't have to wait for the van. Had we wait for the old lease to expire, do you think we would be in better position to negotiate better deal with them? What do you think? Thanks again...
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Shaker58, BMW Financial Services' lease program was only scheduled to run through April 30th, so the leases that you saw in the paper should be using the same money factors and residual values that they have been using since April 3rd.

    Car_Man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Honda_man1, I certainly think that you would have been in a stronger position to negotiate if the dealership that you are dealing with didn't have to pay off your final three lease payments on your other Odyssey. Having said that, I think that your deal was fine considering your situation and taking the area that you live into account.

    Car_Man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Timchar99, I am really not all that familiar with companies that buy-out consumers' leases prior to their scheduled termination dates. Generally speaking though, consumers who wish to end their leases early usually stand to lose quite a bit of money. I think that the least expensive way for you to get out of your current lease would be to find someone who was willing to take it over. You can go to a Web site like www.swaplease.com to see if anyone is willing to do so. If not, then you may want to find out how much money it would cost you to buy out your vehicle on your own right now and then try to sell it privately. I think that you are likely to lose less money by selling your leased vehicle by yourself rather than adding another company to the equation that just has to make profit on the sale of your vehicle.

    Car_Man
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  • mmcbride1mmcbride1 Member Posts: 861
    I just wanted to thank you for all your help. Last night I finally got my Audi, and knowing the dealer's 'buy rate' on the lease was invaluable. They kept asking how I knew that. I just told them that I 'know people'.

    Thanks again!
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Congratulations on your new Audi mmcbride1! Thanks for coming back and letting me know how everything turned out. It is always nice to hear that I was able to help someone out. I am glad that you have found the information that I provided you so helpful. It definitely is a good feeling going into negotiations with as much information on the vehicle that you are interested in as possible, especially in today's marketplace where the marking-up of interest rates is so common. Enjoy your new ride.

    Car_Man
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  • svmansvman Member Posts: 25
    Car_Man, What are the recent (May) lease residuals and finance rates for a 2002 Envoy, 12,000 miles/year, both for 2 and 3 year leases? Thanks.
  • icdchessicdchess Member Posts: 83
    Car Man,
    Just thought I would point out that the URL is actually www.swapalease.com not www.swaplease.com (need to add the "a") as listed in your message #929. Interesting idea. I would LOVE to see that place become very active so those of us tired with our leases could get out of them without getting killed.
    Steve
  • s852s852 Member Posts: 1,051
    I wonder if it is really that easy. I'm am sure many leases are non-transferrable.
    Also, it may not be as attractive for someone to take over your lease as it is to you to have someone take it over.
    Most of the deals I saw look horrible. People had made huge mistakes and overpaid for their leases or went over the mileage and are looking for someone stupid enough to take over the burden.
  • wally00wally00 Member Posts: 7
    Hey Car Man, just curious on what the usual penalties run for breaking your lease a year early. Have 2000 S-10 Xtreme, 235/month 3yr 12000 yr, buyout roughly 11500. The problem is i will be buying a jet ski next may (02) and the xtreme can't be used for towing at all. I;m here in Omaha,NE and a chevy dealership promotes its $1 get out of your lease into any of our vehicles on the lot. Just curious on what you think. Are the dealerships more open if you want to get into another chevy?
  • purduealum91purduealum91 Member Posts: 285
    I would like a 1.8t quattro wagon or a honda crv se. 15k miles per year, zero down. what are the best lease deals? thanx

    tom
  • lrawles2lrawles2 Member Posts: 16
    I am quickly coming to the end of a 39 month lease. I just got my license fees from the state of Calif. for what would be the fourth year since I obtained the car (e.g., the last three months of the lease). Is there a way that I can transfer my license fees from the leased car to whatever car I get next at the end of the lease, so that I am not in essence paying a full year's license fee for the last three months of the lease? If so, how? This may be a total novice question, but I haven't seen it answered anywhere (maybe there's a reason for that). Thanks in advance.
  • s852s852 Member Posts: 1,051
    Yes you pay the fees. That is one reason I would avoid 39 month leases. You pay for that year, use 3 months of it and then pay registration on the next car again. The next buyer gets 9 months free registration.
    You cannot pay registration fees month by month. You have to prepay for a year. Maybe, if you had personalized plates, you could transfer them and the registration fees to the next car, but I'm not sure how that works.
  • lrawles2lrawles2 Member Posts: 16
    Car_Man,

    Any words of advice regarding BMW's Owner's Choice program. It appears to be hybrid of a lease and a financing. Title is transfered to the "buyer" but, the payments are essentially a lease sized payment (with only small amounts going to the principal -- or residual value), and then a big balloon payment at the end of the Owner's Choice term. At the end of the term, the "buyer" can sell it back to the dealer for very little (whatever he paid that actually was beyond depreciation and interest), finance the remainder or buy outright. Do you have any experience with this? Is it a good idea? Thanks in advance.
  • lrawles2lrawles2 Member Posts: 16
    There is no way to switch the license fees to your new car? That seems like quite a rip-off. Am I totally scr_wed?
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Svman, GMAC's lease program is scheduled to run through July 2nd, so I already have seen the 2002 Envoy lease data for the month of May. If you decide to lease a 2002 Envoy through them with 12,000 miles/year, their 2 and 3 year lease rates would 3.0% and 6.1% respectively. The residual values for this truck should be 59% and 51% respectively.

    Car_Man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Oops, my bad icdchess. Thanks for correcting the link that I posted earlier. I absolutely agree that the Web site certainly is an interesting idea. It seems to me as though it would be more of a place where educated consumers who got good deals on their leases, but just wanted to drive something new could get out of their current contracts for much less money than it would have ordinarily had cost them. However, I don't think that the site will be all that helpful for consumers who have signed leases that are way too long or way too expensive. I have a feeling that these people are going to have a very hard time finding someone who will assume the bad deals that they have agreed to.

    Car_Man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi wally00. A jet ski huh? Sounds fun. Unfortunately I don't live near enough to any body of water to justify getting one. As far as your lease goes, I can assure you that despite what the dealership in your area is advertising it is definitely going to cost you more than a dollar to break your S-10 lease early. When you agreed to lease your S-10, you signed a legally binding contract with GMAC, or whichever bank it is through, to pay them a specific amount of money over a certain period of time. They are going to want all, or at least the majority of the money that you are legally obligated to pay them even if you choose to break your lease early, unless you buy-out the vehicle that you are driving. You will be able to get out of your S-10 without having to make your remaining payments by buying it out and selling it privately or trading it in. Make a call to the bank that you are leasing through to find out exactly how much money it will cost you to buy your truck at this point. However, keep in mind that you will likely be upside down, owe more than your truck's worth, and will have to pay money out of your own pocket or roll negative equity over into your next vehicle to get out of your current lease. So, it is doable, but it will likely be relatively expensive to get a new truck a year before your scheduled lease termination date.

    Car_Man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi Tom. Both Audi and Honda's lease programs expired at the end of April and I have not seen their new May programs yet. Please feel free to check back with me at the end of next week and I should have more information for you. Thanks.

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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    lrawles2, BMW's Owners Choice Program is just as you described it, a combination of lease and finance contracts. This sort of contract is typically known as a balloon note in the industry. Balloon notes really aren't all that popular, except for in states where the tax laws make leasing more expensive than it should be. I personally don't have any problem with balloon notes. However, I myself would be more inclined to go with a straight lease or finance contract if I was in the market for a new vehicle. I am much more familiar with these two types of notes and would feel much more comfortable with either of them because I can calculate what my payments should be very easily.

    Car_Man
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  • jwilson1jwilson1 Member Posts: 956
    The new 3.5 RL from Acura is out, as you know, and was originally (for 36 mos.) at .00325. This week it came down a full percent, to .00280. I'm waiting for mine to be delivered and the salesman told me that he thought the rate was going even lower, and that they might be doing something about the residual, too (which currently is set at 53%, $23150).

    Have you heard anything, Car_Man? I'd appreciate any up-date (especially one that is lower!)

    Take care, as always.
    Joe W.
  • purduealum91purduealum91 Member Posts: 285
    nt
  • wally00wally00 Member Posts: 7
    Hey thanks Car Man for the info, its much appricaited
  • svmansvman Member Posts: 25
    Car_Man, Thanks for the information. Are the residuals dealer-negotiable or they set in stone by GM in this case?
  • carguy47carguy47 Member Posts: 3
    has anyone tried using this service, or anything like it....? just curious about experiences.

    thanks
  • curtnheidicurtnheidi Member Posts: 36
    I have used the service to get a car and assume a lease.

    I am going to do it again.

    I got into an unbelievable deal and the service I received from the staff is second to none.

    Curt
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