Full Sized Vans

fourspeakers · September 1999

I ordered a van on 16 AUG 99 through our local autobytel dealer. The salesman was helpful and the process quick and painless. I believe I got a good price ( 1% below the dealer invoice as listed in Edmunds). I was to receive a build date within 2 weeks and take delivery mid October. I have yet to receive my build date. The sales manager was checking with Ford but I still don't have an answer. The sales rep tells me he has one other customer who ordered before me who's without a build date ( different vehicle ) and that quite a few who ordered after me already received their dates. These include a couple E-350s. I think my problem is with the Ford factory. I don't know, but I guess they build one model at a time and I'll just have to wait until they they need to build E-150 Chateaus.

larry63 · September 1999

They have changed my build date 3 times for my E150. Overall it takes approx 8 weeks. I work for Ford and all I got was $500 (rebate money) below invoice. You got a good deal. What color did you get? We're getting Deep wedgewood blue. I'm going to have it painted Chateau style with lower silver accents. We needed more seating than the Chateau. Good luck. Larry

Ordered mine Sept. 1 should be here Nov. 1 or so...

fourspeakers · September 1999

We ordered the deep emerald green. A family in our football club has a ' 99 Chateau in deep wedgewood blue. Very nice looking van. I thought that you get the rebate offered at the time you take delivery. I believe Edmunds lists a $500 customer incentive and a $500 dealer rebate on 2000 E-150s with V8s through Oct. 1. We are to receive both if in effect on delivery. As an employee do you know any secrets that would help me find out about my van?

C13 · September 1999

I've never heard of receiving a rebate at time of delivery 'if it's in effect' at that time. I thought it was always based on what was in effect at the time of the signing of the sales contract. It's usually just used to reduce that amount from the sale price.

But there's a lot of stuff I never heard of.

fourspeakers · September 1999

I ordered my vehicle and made a $500 deposit (refundable). I have not signed a sales contract. I was told that I would receive the rebate and incentive that is being offered by Ford at the time the van is delivered to me. I have purchased several new vehicles, but never ordered one. The sales rep said this is the standard procedure. Does anyone have further knowledge? Thanks

larry63 · September 1999

You are correct...the rebate is for what is available at time of delivery. I personally know the guy who ordered mine and he said typically October is a good rebate month. He said $500 minimum. If there's no rebate he'll give it to me anyways. Plenty of room in the hold back. Might not be till Nov. anyway...changed the date again. Oh well.

guitarzan · September 1999

C13, one confusion I have from reading this: Is a sales contract always signed at the time of order? That could be the difference. The Odysseys are so popular, people are posting that they simply got on a list. If they didn't want it, they dealer knew they could sell it immediately. On most other vehicles, perhaps dealers require a sales contract at the time of order...Fill in what you know about standard procedure.

guitarzan
Community Leader/Vans Conference

mrinaldi · October 1999

We have just experienced the miracle birth of four new children and soon will need something to carry them around in. I researched mini-vans quite extensively, and found their pluses to be:
- Safety and convenience features (especially dual side doors);
- Maneuverability and ease of parking (especially for my wife who drove a Sable);
- Front wheel drive (for WI snow);
- Fuel efficiency;
- On some like the Pontiac Montana, seating flexibility.

But their negatives are:
- Limited cargo area with four car seats (we are planning on using two, twin-kid strollers);
- Ease of placing child seat in rear (have to hoist over fixed seat);
- Not much room for many more people.

In general, I can expect to outgrow one in a year or so.

So, with the kids some weeks from needing a ride, I am now more seriously considering full size vans. I just saw a GMC Savanna and drooled over the 4' of space behind the third row seating and the ease of access to both rear seat rows from the double doors (on the passenger side only though). I have heard that Dodge RAM vans have dual doors, but haven't seen any yet, and can get an employee deal on Ford company vehicles. We won't be driving this vehicle much over the next year, and I would be happy with a good quality '98 or so that hits the main points I have mentioned.

What would you all recommend ?????

guitarzan · October 1999

Mrinaldi, congratulations!

guitarzan
Community Leader/Vans Conference

midasgold · October 1999

...For ourselves and our 6 kids. It's a 12-seater, which means 3 benches (2 3-seaters and 1 4-seater) behind the two front "captain's chairs." Space behind the 4th-row bench is limited, though - 2 feet from the back of the bench to the rear cargo doors - not much room left for anything else with two double strollers. You'll get lots more cargo space by removing the 4th-row bench (or getting an 8-seater, which sounds like the one you drooled over)... or by getting an extended-length 12-seater.

ml16 · October 1999

Have decided a full size van will better accommodate my family and was wondering if anyone had any advice on purchasing the Dodge?

How about it's handling capability in rain and snow?

Thanks in advance.

Michael

mrnimmo · October 1999

I'm still wishing for an Econoline. My preference would be the diesel. I drove them years ago in ambulances and they seemed MUCH more reliable than the old gas 460's. (Can't compare to 351 or 302).
Any thoughts on the newer Ford diesel's reliability? Are they still a Navistar? What kind of MPG could I expect in window van (assuming no conversion or camping equipment)?

Thanks in advance for any comments. If you would rather pmail me, use mrnimmo@yahoo.com.

jboater · November 1999

wayne2970,

Sorry, NADA has no recent pricing for Regency.

Jerry

mgmkbq6d · November 1999

My 95 8 passenger Ram Wagon that is a short (109") wheel base replaced my 89 TownCar. It was $2500.00 less than all the Mini Vans. It has a 318 and a 4 speed overdrive trans to pull my 18' boat. My Kids
are in High School & College and out grew the Lincoln. All there stuff fits under the seats that I can remove in 5 minutes. (The seats are bolted in, in a conversion) It is 15" shorter than the TownCar so my Wife can park it in the same space as a Taurus. All our stuff isn't tied on the roof on vacations. With 95,000 miles on it, all it has had is Oil changes, Tires and a fuel gauge sending unit (under warranty). I will replace it with another one if it ever starts giving me trouble. You my have to order a Ram Wagon at most dealers because conversions have more dealer profit in them. $18000 base van + $3000 dealer pays for the coversion = $27000 window price. My SLT with CD, power seats, 4wheel ABS and more was about $ 22000 on the window. I get about 17mpg at 70mph on flat land.

jakeblade · November 1999

Does anyone happen to know if it's possible to mount a wrecker bumper onto a full size van ? I don't know if van frames are the same as truck frames. GM or Ford.

fauxpa · November 1999

we are the proud owners of our 1500 dodge - with a great conversion - by el kapitan (CA). WE tested a chevy, gmc, ford vans. The van has a v8 5.9L. I loaded the van with 4 adults and 3 children - and camping gear!! We went to the mountains - with only 66 miles on the clock - I expected about 12 MPG - I got 15 MPG - amazing!! A great ride - smooth and safe - a heavy vehicle to stop - but the pedal pressure does not require "2 feet".THe acceleration, "feel" of the road, control placement, noise, wind - all are the same or better than a mini van. WE shopped for a new sienna - oddesey - caravan. WE paid 29,700 for the full size van - we feel very confident with our purchase - epecially when we are at a light next to one of those "big" boys - the excursion or explorer - they look so cute sitting down there...

fauxpa · November 1999

we are the proud owners of our 1500 dodge - with a great conversion - by el kapitan (CA). WE tested a chevy, gmc, ford vans. The van has a v8 5.9L. I loaded the van with 4 adults and 3 children - and camping gear!! We went to the mountains - with only 66 miles on the clock - I expected about 12 MPG - I got 15 MPG - amazing!! A great ride - smooth and safe - a heavy vehicle to stop - but the pedal pressure does not require "2 feet".THe acceleration, "feel" of the road, control placement, noise, wind - all are the same or better than a mini van. WE shopped for a new sienna - oddesey - caravan. WE paid 29,700 for the full size van - we feel very confident with our purchase - epecially when we are at a light next to one of those "big" boys - the excursion or explorer - they look so cute sitting down there...

fauxpa · November 1999

heh - i'm getting pretty bad at double posting - what the heck am I doing wrong?? I only hit the POST button once -honest...

fauxpa · November 1999

heh - i'm getting pretty bad at double posting - what the heck am I doing wrong?? I only hit the POST button once -honest...

guitarzan · November 1999

I did pass your concern along fauxpa. However, according to your nickname, you would always goof when you posted, eh?

Guitarzan
Community Leader/Vans Conference

ernest · November 1999

I have just taken delivery of a 2000 Chevy Express Passenger Van-8 Pass. I only drove it home from the dealer; but, I noticed something that concerned me. The brakes feel soft, almost spongy and when I set the parking brake, it went all the way to the floor. Is this typical of the anti-lock braking system. The brakes on my old 86 Dodge Van were very firm and positive. How do your brakes on Savanas or other Express vans feel? Any info. on this will be appreciated.

Vipergg · November 1999

I can officially say that these vans are great values . I have a 1997 Dodge Ram Conversion Mark III . It is the extended length version 127" , has the 318 v8 , 4 speed , cruise , tilt,power windows and locks , tinted glass all the way around , front and rear heat and air conditioning . , 4 captains chairs, 1 bench seat , bought new in 1998 as a leftover , total price new was $18400 "BEFORE" trade . While it more thirsty than a minivan , $6000 buys alot gas which is what a grand Caravan would have cost extra and you can't tow anything with those , this will tow 6000 lbs .
Admittedly you have to take your time in the snow but hey it's a small tradoff and they are great to travel in .

quarterdunn · November 1999

Does anyone know how the Savana/Express benches are removed (i.e., do you need to remove bolts, or can they simply be popped out like most minivan benches)???

mrh3108 · November 1999

Get the brakes checked out. My Express drives, stops, and corners just as good as any GM full size. No spongy feeling at all in the brakes.

midasgold · November 1999

The benches are secured by locking pins. Lift the carpet flaps (the velcro is a sad joke in an otherwise wonderful vehicle), pull out the locking pins, and the bench is free.

midasgold · November 1999

Our parking brake also goes all the way to the floor, but the brakes aren't mushy at all.

ernest · November 1999

NOTE:
After driving my new 2000 Express Pass. Van more over the weekend, it appears that the brakes are OK; just not as hard feeling as my 86 Dodge van that I am used to driving; but, it seem to stop OK.

However, the parking brake does go to the floor and will not hold the vehicle on a hill. I tested it by depressing the parking brake and then dropping it into drive and it began to roll.

I also checked a friends older GMC Savana conversion and her pedal goes to the floor as well.

This must be an inherent fault that GM has never corrected. There are times in life, like parking on a steep hill, when the parking brake is needed to keep from getting "torque lock", is using the park position only.

Has anyone taken it back to the dealer for this and gotten it corrected? What was the problem?

ernest · November 1999

Midasgold gave good advice on this. The procedure is outlined in the owner's manual. You can't imagine how many sales reps I asked this question prior to buying my van, and none of them knew.

In my owner's manual, it's on page 1-6.
1. lift the carpet flap at the inboard side of the seat base in the rear.
2. locate the red handle on the inboard side of the seat base and rotate it up.
3. once the red handle is rotated up, pull the handle to remove the locking pin.
4. stow the locking pin on the rear of the seat base in the hole that is provided.
5. repeat this procedure for the pin on the other seat base.
6. Pull the seat rearward about 2 inches and then lift the seat from the floor rails.
7. remove the seat from the vehicle.
8. install the trim covers to the floor rails. These were supplied in a cardboard box at delivery.

But before you do this be sure to disconnect the quick release latch plates for the lap shoulder belts on the bench seat to be removed. To do this, press the tip of a key into the release hole of the safety belt buckle while pulling up on the safety belt.

good luck

midasgold · November 1999

I once "tested" our Savana's parking brake (not intentionally, I assure you!)...

I started the vehicle, shifted from park into drive, but forgot to release the parking brake. When I pressed the accelerator, I can assure you the parking brake was quite effective. (This happens to everybody once in a while - doesn't it?)

I'll try to perform the hill test... next time I find a hill...

midasgold · November 1999

Ernest wrote:

"8. install the trim covers to the floor rails. These were supplied in a cardboard box at delivery."

You mean those cheap plastic POS that don't even fit into the floor rails?

But, really, we LOVE our Savana anyway...

jlflemmons · November 1999

To All;
It is possible that the rear brakes are not properly adjusted. However, GM(and most other)brakes can be adjusted by backing the vehicle up and repeatedly pumping the brakes. This will allow the adjuster on the drum brakes to take up the slack. An emergency brake going to the floor with little effort is a sure sign of rear brakes being out of adjustment or badly worn.

If you are seeing this problem on a new vehicle, I would definitly take it to the dealer for a check out. I may be nothing more than an improper initial adjustment.

Jim

midasgold · November 1999

Thanks for the info - I'll have my dealer take a look.

dougc5 · November 1999

My wife and I have 5 young children and have grown out of the minivan club. We are starting to look into full size vans and are searching for advice from full size van owners. We always buy used and would be looking for a '97 or'98 with a seating capacity of at least 10. What are the advantages/disadvantages of buying Ford, Chevy or Dodge?

midasgold · November 1999

Well, if you can find a '97 Chevy Express or GMC Savana, the bench seats have headrests - for some reason the headrests were omitted in subsequent models.

We have a '99 Savana and are very happy at almost 14K miles so far.

ernest · November 1999

Thanks for the advice. I think I will have the dealer look at it. I have to go back anyway because the remote door locking device doesn't always lock the side sliding door. It should right?

mrh3108 · November 1999

The remote locking for the side door may not work occasionally as the side door may be open when you attempt to lock the door. GM vans have a spring loaded pin in the side doors which connect to the power lock contacts on the chassis. If the door is open the pins are not making contact with the chassis. Just a thought.

jlflemmons · November 1999

I'm not certain about the full size vans, but the Astro and Safari have for years had a delay lock system for the sliding door such that if you lock the doors with the door switch or remote a relay is armed in the door jamb that will lock the side door 3 seconds after it is closed. This is one of the coolest features GM never advertised. I have had several of these vans, and the only thing that ever stopped the door from locking was corrosion on the door contacts. A little rub with a pencil eraser will take care of that problem.

Jim

quarterdunn · November 1999

To Ernest & Midas Gold,
Thanks for taking the time to respond.

ernest · December 1999

Thanks for the information. But in my case (a brand new van), neither the remote or the lock swith on the driver's door will lock the sliding side door when it is CLOSED. The only way I can lock the door is to walk around the van and manually depress the mechanical locking device. Very cumbersome. The remote does unlock the door, however. Any more thoughts, anyone? Ernest

mjwhetst · December 1999

Has anyone had any MPG numbers for a 6.8L V10 and the limited slip 4.10 axle? I am ready to buy a used one with 72000 miles on it and am assuming the 6.8 is only a little worse than the 5.4 as far as gas mileage but combined with the 4.10 axle I am not sure. I am hoping it would get 14MPG on the highway with 65-70 MPH. I do not plan on towing, and there does not seem to be much of a used selection of the 12 passenger Ford vans.

ALso, are people having good luck with the transmission and engine as far as reliability?

gerardb58 · December 1999

Does anyone know when Ford plans to change the
body style on the current Econolines.

midasgold · December 1999

The current Ford full-sized van (Econoline/Club Wagon) is based on a redesign in about '92, I believe. The last redesign before that was in the 70's. The current GM full-sized van (Chevy Express/GMC Savana) is based on a dramatic redesign in '96... the prior redesign having dated back to 1971! Dodge, in response to Ford and GM, gave their early-70's-based van (now known as the Ram Van; there even used to be a full-sized Plymouth Voyager before the minivan was introduced in '84 and got the Voyager name) a number of improvements, but stopped short of a full-scale back-to-the-drawing-board redesign.

So, if history means anything, we can probably expect the current designs to be around for quite a while.

vandalybay1 · January 2000

Next time you drop the spare, I suggest that you inspect the winch/hoist connection to the galvanized tube. The tube is the part into which the tire tool is inserted when lowering the spare. This tube connects to the winch with a pin. The pin is supposedly held in place by a clip.

While performing routine fluid change on the rear locking differential, this clip just fell off. Good thing the tire was off! Otherwise the tire would be stuck in the up position!

I reshaped the clip so that once snapped into position, it wouldn't unsnap again. An easy preventative measure would be to wrap the pin and clip with durable electrical tape.

rogerf2 · January 2000

yes, the remote should lock the slider. As someone else noted, if the door is open, it won't lock until it is closed - then after a 3 sec delay, it locks.
Take it back to the dealer!

campout · January 2000

Hello to everyone on the list. I currently started doing some maintenance on B-Series wagon which belongs to my church, my question is, does anyone know were you can order an owners manual for this vehicle? It has 116k on it, runs good except for some minor things, no rust. Would like to match up things that have been done to the van with the recomended schedule that Dodge prescribes. Thanking in advance.

Paul

guitarzan · January 2000

Hi Paul, have you called your local dealer?

Guitarzan
Community Leader/Vans Conference

tenohio · February 2000

I have an 89 GMC Starcraft conversion van with 122K on it. Body is in excellent shape, runs good and I have all the maintenance records. But I am confused on how much to ask. I ran the Kelly blue book and it said retail at 5600 and wholesale at 2800 where do you price it??

I have it list at 5300 and received some calls but as soon as you tell them the miles its "bye".

Confused...any help??

guitarzan · February 2000

I think it is weird that someone would call for a 10 year old vehicle, and think 122k is high.

Your object is to get as much as possible for it. Why not reduce it $500, and put the mileage in the ad, and see what happens?

Guitarzan
Community Leader/Vans Conference

C13 · February 2000

From what I heard, and I used to sell em, the cost of the conversion depreciates immediately and completely; that is, you can expect the same price as a stock van.

If the Kelley thing takes mileage into account, I'd try getting some other estimates, like Edmunds' guide, and checking the ads on a site like Excite. Do a search. You'll find em.

But of course the main thing is if nobody's buying, you gotta drop the price.

jboater · February 2000

tenohio,
Comparing tradein and retail values between KBB and Edmund's on the cargo van it appears that the two are close on tradein,about 2700. but widely apart on the retail. KBB is about 5300-5400 on your '89 and Edmunds is about 3700. on a '90.
NADA shows Starcraft value at 1300. tradein and 1600. retail. The 5300. asking is probably upper end of scale.
I agree with Guitarzan, show mileage in your ads. Maybe a price drop to 4995. or best offer will stir more interest too.

Jerry

Full Sized Vans

Comments

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles