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long. This is the vehicle that Winnebago converts to the Eurovan Camper for the US Market.
So you can buy it, but only with all the Camper equip in teh US. In Germany you can
also get the ironically named "California Generation" camper, this has all the camper goodies in the regular wheelbase model - and a 6-speed manual tranny.
http://www.vw-nutzfahrzeuge.de/
Vanagons were also called Caravelle.
In most other countries, commercial/cargo Eurovans are called Transporters. Just like the old days. The long wheel base cargo vans would be a Transporter.
T4 is the designation for the current Transporter/Caravelle family. Vanagon was T3. Etc.
-Don
If the Weekender is completed in Europe, I think a EDP would increase the appeal of the package.
Just my $0.02
A separate program for a model that only sells a few thousand here is hard to justify... they'd almost have to get Audi to slip the Eurovan into its EDP.
Still, I'd love to do it, and it's probably the only way I'd end up in a Eurovan here in the States.
Well, with F&M, it'll probably be 2002 anyway.
I called VW HQ and there is a delay in Germany (where, btw, the Weekender is modified) concerning the tires. Wrong ones put on at plant; VW and (I think) Michelin are "working it out", so it could be months till we see anything. I have my VID and confirmed its sitting on a dock there...bummer. Sold my other car...
I read somewhere that the Sharon was some sort of a joint venture with Ford, and there are agreements that VW would not sell it here in the states.
Someone asked where in Bergen Cty can they find a dealership that has a 2001 EV...no where.
Agin, the VW website allows you to "find a dealer" and I did a 150 mile sweep, called everyone and the lack of knowledge about this vehicle is astounding. Well, I guess that when the total amount sold nationwide was under 2500 last year, it explains why no one at the dealers (at least the sales reps I spoke with) have any idea whats up with this unique Van.
I'll let you know when I get mine...someone in Colorado reported in YahooGroups that he received his and it was incredible. He used the word "fast" to describe it. Isn't that an oxymoron when used with a VW Van??
Thanks
I'm convinced that VWoA exec's attempted to take one of those Japanese management seminars, but accidentally ended up in a kamikaze history show instead. They've been flying there company into the ground ever since.
We've told them for years we want Beetles. Especially ragtop beetles. And Eurovan's. Especially poptops, diesels, and manual tranny models.
They sent us Rabbit's, and Dashers.
Recently VWoA's products have been vastly improved. Hopefully, the will soon make rational marketing decisions regarding transporters, Urovan or New Bus.
I'm holding out for a passenger Sprinter.
http://www.mercedes-benz.com/e/ecars/transporter/sprinter/allrad/transp_allrad_sprinter.htm
It's being imported this summer. Narrow and tall, like a Eurovan. Diesel engine gets 30mpg+. See
http://www.sprintersavvy.com/
The site only shows the ugly tall roof vans, but low roofs will be made after the plant fills the large order from Fedex.
And rumors are that Vito will replace the Caravsparetrannyvan/Voyager/T&C. We can only hope...
http://www.mercedes-benz.com/e/ecars/transporter/vito/modell.htm
Bigger vans has remained the domain of the Detroit3. There is no reliable and (relatively) economical bigger van on the market. I wondered how long it would take for Toyota to enter the market. Or VW to make a serious attempt. It seems ChryslerBenz will be the first.
I started a Mercedes thread, but no one seems interested.
I called VWoA HQ and spoke with some folks there; I was told that there was a tire issue that needed to be worked out between VW and (they thought) Michelin. It is apparently resolved now.
I will post my driving impressions in a few weeks (I hope!)
Vito Marco Polo (camper) and Vito F (weekender) are converted by a company some of you may have heard of, Westphalia.
I have always owned VWs(Golf, Jetta, Rabbit and even the Rabbit Pickup) but my second car is a Dodge Grand Caravan Mini van. Just picked up a 2001 Golf in exchange for my 1990 Jetta Now looking to exchange my Dodge for a EuroVan (2001).
According to the 2001 EuroVan Specs, it has a towing capacity of 4400 pounds, yet it only has a 2.8L V6, 201HP, 181 lb-ft torque engine (... the 2000 EuroVan has a smaller engine and less torque).
The question is: Does anyone pull a 3500 pound trailer with a 2000 EuroVan, and if so... do you find the EuroVan meeting the 4400 pound towing capacity expectations? Can you go up a hill without getting out to push..?
What I find difficult to rationalize, due to the fact that I can not find one to test drive or find someone who pulls a trailer with a Eurovan, is that the 2001 Dodge Grand Caravan has a 3.8L V6, 215HP, 245 lb-ft torque engine with only a 3800 pound towing capacity. Yet, the EuroVan has 4400 pound towing capacity with a 2.8L V6, 201HP, 181 lb-ft torque engine....smaller engine, less torque but more towing capacity...?
My fear is that the EuroVan will be a great mini van, but will be disappointing when it has the trailer on the backend.
...As you can tell I need a vehicle that can tow a large trailer across country and not just on the flat roads from the dealer to my house.
...any feedback would be appreciated.....would love to stick with VW's....
P.S. My dealer tells me that the 2001 MV weekenders are packaged in Germany, and that the MV weekenders have not arrived in the USA, however the GLS and base MVs have arrived and are in Port in Houston, Texas.
As for brouchers...good luck....I have ordered three times from the VW web site...with no response....
Mark.
weeks. How does this compare to what others are getting?
Thanks for feedback.
Funny, I wasn't aware that Caravans could tow themselves around for more than 30,000 miles without requiring new tranny. Tow with one of those? No thanks.
Seriously, there's more to towing ability than horsepower and (especially) torque. Brakes, size of the tow vehicle, coolers (tranny and engine), and many other factors all are important.
Of course, it wouldn't surprise me to learn that the manufacturers cheat a little.
Folks here seem to be considering or trying to buy Eurovans. You may be better served by talking to the folks who already own Eurovans on the list at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ev_update
Those folks may be able to tell you how well you can tow with a Eurovan.
Personally, I would try not to tow unless it was significantly less than the rated towing capacity, by that I mean half or so. Most people forget that towing capacities are listed for empty vans, yet most people tow with a van full of family members, luggage, and vacation gear. Those oversized American butts seated in your vehicle further decrease your the amount of weight you can tow behind your vehicle.
One person, waiting for a 2001 Weekender, asked today (4/12) if anyone had added a second, deep-cycle or RV battery, to their MV. No, I have not. I have a 2000 EVC with second battery in place. But I'm sure it's possible, with effort and care.
J. C. Whitney (jcwhitney.com) has a "complete auxilliary battery kit" for as little as $47 (year-ago price). Does what you want to do, but it looks like it's specific to GMC and Toyota, apparently because it plugs into the alternator. Also has a "dual battery charging system," as little as $30, but the amp rating is low. I say that because my dealer has tested mine for 80 amps from the alternator to the coach battery. A discharged battery would presumably draw 80 amps, and would ruin an underrated device.
Camping World (campingworld.com) has a "Sure Power Multi-Battery Isolator" and kit. 95-amp Isolator is $38; kit is $27. Less if you join their club. campingworld.com. Maybe there's a Sure Power web site, too.
Then there's the battery box -- you probably wouldn't want the battery in the passenger compartment. The EVC places it in a separate compartment in the back, in a hermetically-sealed sturdy battery box, vented with a one-way flap through a large reinforced vinyl tube to the exterior. Probably because a charging battery, when introduced to the proper spark, will explode. I've seen this happen, and it ain't pretty. Secure the battery well, too, because a 50-pound hunk of lead should not be let loose in a high-g situation, and I hear battery plates don't take bad vibes gracefully.
Then, the wiring. 80 amps max would require a sizeable conductor, with circuit breakers/fuses at each end. I've also seen a large, red-hot conductor flaming under battery charge. Spooky, with acrid smoke. Wouldn't want that.
As far as the battery itself, the news is better. Mine came with a Trojan POJ that didn't last four months, with minimal use. The dealer eventually replaced it with an Interstate, which is faring much better, thank you -- a world of difference. Sears has had deep-cycle RV/marine batteries on sale for $53 recently, plus tax, plus exchange.
It can surely be done, but please keep safety first. A car battery is a dense package of lead and sulphuric acid, jam-packed with electrical energy, and should be given all due respect at all times. Place it wisely, secure it well, and install the charging hardware with appropriate care, and you should be okay for a long time!
That seems like a really great price.Did you get any chargte from the dealer beyond the invoice cost (listed here) and the $615 destination charge?
I got hit with approx $200 in some sort of line item that comes charged to the dealer from VWoA.
Jeff
One incredible muck is the canvas on the Weekender. While the camper canvas is light colored with giant windows on the sides and front (great views and cool breezes) the MV Weekender has dark canvas, two tiny half circle windows in the sides...and nothing at all in front. Claustrophobic and hot. I thought Westphalia was wonderful in all things and Winnebago was second best. Certainly this is not so with respect to the poptop canvas. The Winny top is wonderful, light and airy. The Westy top is dark, dank and hot. Is there any place that resews poptop canvas?
If they are still at your dealer...go try 'em. The 2001's are fine vehicles.
Steve
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-James
Steve
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So give me round headlights, a TDI, and a 5 or 6 speed and I'm all over this!
Drew
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I would like round headlights, but it is attractive still.
I hope they develop it, but it says it is just a concept and I've read about it before. Nothing new. Is there any news that this will become a reality?
My 2000 Eurovan has 18K miles, and I've owned it for nearly two months. During scheduled maintenance today, I asked the service desk at the dealership to look into the noise.
They described the source of the noise as normal behavior from the Evaporative Emissions Purge Valve. When the service desk was asked if valve replacement would clear up the noise, I was told that a replacement valve would have the same problem. The noise did not come from a noisy lifter, I was told.
Can anyone comment on this issue? What does the Purge Valve do? Should I get a second opinion, or should I live with the noise, like the dealership suggests?
Steve
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The weekender includes a bed in the back and a bed in the poptop. It includes a small refrigerator. With a Weekender you seat 7 instead of 4 and still can sleep 4 with the poptop. Plenty of equipment unless you're living in your camper most of the year.
Mmimmo's point about weight limits is well taken, though. I think the new Eurovans are rated for 4,500 lb.s or so braked. But if you read the fine print you'll see it goes down greatly with both load in the van and with altitude.
OTOH the same engine/drivetrain is used by Winnebago in their Rialta RV, which is vast compared to a Eurovan Camper. So a Eurovan can pull a suprising amount of load (as long as you're not in too much of a hurry).
We went back and forth between buying a Weekender or a Camper for a long time. We finally opted for the Camper for several reasons.
Power: As of the '97 model VW put in a V6 engine strong enough to haul the Camper's extra 900 lbs. comfortably. In fact, we've found that our Camper can keep accelerating on any highway in California, even the steep one that swoops up the eastern face of the Sierras to Tioga Pass at over 10,000 ft. altitude. And it has a top speed of a true 106 mph (115 indicated).
Winter camping: the Camper model's 12,000 btu propane furnace let us go camping in Yosemite in February with over 2 ft. of snow on the ground. We were toasty inside.
Summer camping: the Camper's Winnebago poptop is vastly superior to the Weekender's Westphalia one. Our Camper's poptop has three big rectangular screen windows and a rooftop vent. The camper has two small semicircular ones. Inside on a hot day our Camper is airy and comfortable where a Weekender would be sweltering (and a normal minivan unbearable).
Camping while it's raining: we can cook, eat, talk and sleep inside the Camper. Our first trip it poured cats & dogs. We enjoyed the patter of rain on the roof. We didn't have to venture out except to use the restroom. The extra 15.8" length of the Camper made up for the narrower space left by the cabinetry along one wall.
Commuting: despite being longer and heavier, my wife finds the Camper is a great commute vehicle and uses it every day, leaving our Jetta in the garage. Both the Camper and Weekender handle better than other minivans (due in part to the stiff truck suspension) and the high seating position and huge windshield let you see farther down the road--even over the roofs of Jeep Cherokees. Parallel parking in the 17 ft. long Camper takes getting used to, but you learn to swing wide. The Camper will fit in a normal parallel parking space.
We did have give up one thing in choosing a Camper: the Weekender's beds are wider, since you don't have the interior cabinets. But the space is shorter and the front seats don't swivel.
Once we drove a Camper and found the power satisfactory it was a no-brainer for us. Especially since when we bought ours in July '98 the Camper actually cost less than the Weekender, despite its additional length, propane furnace, three way refrigerator, sink with running water, second camper battery, rear spritzer faucet thingie, ability to run everything on AC from a shoreline while camping, storage space over the cab (accessible by unzipping the front screen window) and more. Ya gotta pay for Westphalia workers' six week summer vacations I guess.
All Eurovans do have one defect relative to other minivans: they're noisier inside. It's not unbearable, but I hope VW does something about this as some point. A hearing-impaired friend wound up with a Grand Caravan solely because of this factor.
For more information from owners like us, join the EV_update email forum. Go to http://groups.yahoo.com/ and search on EV_Update. It has nearly 1,200 members and covers all models/years of Eurovan (but not earlier VW Vanagons/busses).
The weekender's jumpseats fold out of the way. The optional center seat for the camper must be stuck in your garage to camp.
Agree with the better poptop on the camper vs weekender. And the longer body is desireable.
I too noticed that previous EVC's were no more expensive than weekenders. BUT, now that VW has dropped the prices on their Euro's, but Winnie has not, there is a significant price advantage for a weekender. I personally don't camp enough to justify the propane and galley stuff. (Probably don't camp enough to justify a weekender)
I'am glad you like your EVC! I recognize your comments. You are obviously a member of vanagon.com.
You could also put a self contained camping module in a weekender, if your the type that doesn't camp enough to justify the kitchenette fulltime:
http://www.zproducts.com/
Select "Van camper kit" and "kitchenette"
http://www.eurocampers.com/EVKitchen.html
Happy Camping!
Is THAT what that noise was? 2000 Eurovan Camper, 4948 miles, 60 mph on cruise, no A/C, and the engine lost all power for a half-second. Then the Check Engine light came on for another half-second. After stopping, the rhythmic clicking was noticable over the idling engine. It had "never happened before." After shutting off the engine, the noise persisted, and was I traced it to a 2"+/- diameter black plastic valve thing in a vacuum(?) line, had some wires coming off it, led to a fitting with a tag labeled something about "EVAP," but I did not pursue it when the noise stopped. Van is in the shop now for its second oil change, and the dealer will check for a code, which should have been recorded in its memory. I'll try to let you know if they find anything, which they typically don't...
The EVC is longer all around, which provides more room for sleeping and storing all the other stuff you can take camping, fishing, backpacking, etc., at the expense of more weight and a larger turning radius. Doubtless poorer mileage and acceleration with the extra weight, but it still handles amazingly well, with those Michelin load-rated tires.
Consider also the features over the Weekender:
Three-way fridge that won't drain the vehicle's main battery (one guy called it a four-way fridge when used as a cooler -- I heartily agree).
Coach battery can be recharged from the land line (supplied). Don't know if the converter also charges the main battery. It might.
Superior top with triple windows and a roof vent, smoke detector and CO detector. Possibly more room under the top when raised.
Propane for the furnace, two-burner stove, fridge, and propane detector, with the requisite loss of ground clearance. Fire extingusher, too, just in case. I won't have a vehicle without one. And, actually, I prefer a pack stove or two and a cookset on a picnic table to cooking in the van, unless the weather goes south, or I'm in a hurry, or I have to prepare a larger meal.
Very decent cabinetry throughout and storage galore, front and back.
12 gallons of fresh water and 8 of gray, sink and rear sprayer (very handy), can run off an AC land line or that second battery.
Possibly more and better lights in the interior (don't remember). 4 AC (when plugged in) and 2 rear DC outlets. LED status indicator for the coach battery, propane, fresh and gray water -- trick!
Two-part dining table. Swiveling front seats. CD in 2000 vs. cassette, but "only" four speakers, and the rear ones are crummy. Removable face. Speaking of which, why on earth didn't Winnebago spend the extra thirty bucks for the next model up and get us a stereo with a remote?! Finally, a vehicle where it makes sense, and they save a few measly bucks!
Does the Weekender offer full privacy curtains/shades? I don't know, but the EVC does.
Of course, all this complexity means more maintenance, more things to pay for and haul around and to go wrong (don't ask me how many times I've had to take mine in to fix the Winnebago-supplied stuff, but now all the bugs seem to be worked out). Furnace, fridge, battery, seems every major gizmo but the water system and stove have given me lip. And the dealer's really slow to agree with me when something's wrong, or to fix things right the first time...
By the by, spoke with a guy at a campground last weekend who paid $36K out the door at Niello in Sacramento for a "plain" 2001. I know it had a sunroof and climate control. And very pretty, aggressive looking five-spoke 16" aluminum wheels -- are they standard? My 2000 EVC was just under $40K out the door at Ron Price in SSF, after some haggling. I think I did okay...
No propane, kitchen items, or A/C land line capabilities.
$36k for a plain van? Ouch. That should be more like $26k- if you pay list price! $31k for a Weekender. I haven't seen prices for the new '01 EVC.