But, if that's a serious question, I'd be glad to give you a serious answer.
Just like auto sales people have buying signs they want to hear in discussions and negotiations, the same goes for selling everything else in life - and, as a salesman for more than 30 years, I would hope to be able to recognize these signs even though I don't sell RE for a living.
Landru - I'll ask again: What's the problem with giving a non-serious buyer your best price on selling one's house? They can't shop it. They might know some other party that house shopping and mention it to them. If they come back a month later and say that bottom price is still too much and they want to negotiate further, you can say no. So what's your problem with giving out a bottom price? Against the Auto Salesman's Creed?
"It would be my job to separate the joy riders from the real prospects, something I do 50 hours a week in my real job."
"What's the problem, when selling a house, in giving a not-serious prospect your best, bottomline price?"
If there's no problem, why do you bother separating the joy-riders from the real prospects at your real job? Or do you spend time at your real job discussing your bottom-line pricing with those joy riders?
I have bought and sold houses 5 times in the last 12 years. Its not the same thing as buying a car as there are no 2 exactly alike. Jeffmust is exactly right. However, about a prospective buyer come up and asks "What is the lowest price you'll take?" I don't care if he is serious or not, you don't just give him the lowest price right off the bat. Even if he puts down earnest money and offers you 10% less than you are asking, you counter with an offer that is still probably not your minimum. You will counter with 97-98% of your original list price since that is the normal eventual sales in most areas assuming you have done a CMA and set the list price appropriately. Then he might make another counter. At that point you probably have to consider offering your final offer because the buyer is probably at his limit of negotiations. It might not be money but some option or warranty. Car sales is similar on several of those points. Therefore the question still begs to be answered. Why does a car dealer need to know if you are ready to "BUY TODAY"? What have you lost if the buyer walks away after you giving him your lowest price? Your time is all. Now, if you have 5 others buyers standing in line to talk to you, then this is could be costly. I haven't seen much of this in dealerships though. Not many customers standing around waiting on a salesman. Therefore, what is the harm in spending 30 minutes with a potential buyer and having him walk away if you don't have another buyer waiting? If you are cordial to him, he might still come back. Asking if they are read to BUY TODAY just irritates them.
"However, about a prospective buyer come up and asks "What is the lowest price you'll take?" I don't care if he is serious or not, you don't just give him the lowest price right off the bat."
So that's how it works for houses but not for cars? Okay.
..Landru because he bowed out - after not answering my one single question - bummer!
If a car sales person gives you their best price early on, there's not much more left to discuss. That's why The Best Price Must Be Left to the End.
They rightly fear their best price, if given out before the buyer has one way or another committed to the rest of the deal, will be shopped around town, around the county, around the state, around the nation via the Web, whatever, and some other dealer will offer the exact same vehicle at a slightly lower price - just enough lower to take their sale away.
This is what leads into the "what do we have to do to sell you a car today?" theme because they need your psychological commitment to making the deal happen inside of their physical space and within their timeframe - or account control is lost because the buyer can go elsewhere for this commodity item, and, usually, get a better priced deal. The infamous "be-back" prospect that's never heard of again.
not giving the best price up front is because VALUE is in the eyes of the beholder. My tacoma isn't worth $5. to my wife. but her car is worth 1,000,000. IHO. plus if a prospect doesn't know what he is buying what diff does it make what the price is. ever watch an infomercial, they tell you WHAT the product is before they say HOW MUCH it is. Its called the selling process. In order to make an educated decision, YOU should know what you are looking at before you know the price
AND THE HARM IN GIVING A NON SERIOUS PROSPECT THE BOTTOM DOLLAR IS ITS A $%& &@*# WASTE OF TIME....THEY'RE NOT SERIOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!
agree with you - but at least you're man enough to answer a simple question in a few, well-chosen #$%^&+X//!) words.
Let me ask you another - have you ever had a non-serious buyer turn INTO a serious buyer when you gave out your rock-bottom price before they left the building?
be a waste of time they aren't buying the house so what difference does the price make?
Ok who buys a new house that wasn't planning on it when they got up this morning. houses are a little more stationary than cars. cars CAN be an impulse buy. Everyone I have ever sold a car to was "just looking" when I greeted them. What do you say when you go looking to buy a shirt and the lady behind the desk asks "can I help you" It's a defense mechanism. Sales has much more Psychology involved than you know of..... obviously.
a. The non-serious ones may be first-time buyers, ignorant and unaware of what RE is going for in their targeted neighborhoods.
b. If so, they may turn into Serious Buyers within a short time frame by checking other RE in the 'hood - and come back to me because, all of a sudden, MY bottom price now looks good after they've seen a few more comparable properties
c. If I hadn't given out that price, in the 10 seconds it takes, they might go away thinking I'm too expensive - when I'm not.
b. I don't deal, in effect, directly with buyers - they're usually represented by an agent. Their agent, if a pro, has already qualified them for a certain price range and it's a waste of their time to check properties outside that range.
And, as for my own understanding of Sales Psych 101, my friend, its excellent - and I've made a wonderful living from sales now for 30 years.
If the vehicle is perfect and your price is in the price range - why discount?
With all that psych knowledge, you oughta be gettin' full MSRPs at 9.9% money with 700+ FICOs, whole life, mop&glow, extended warranties, VIN etch, Lojack - right?
there are new cars like mine in every town. There aren't "perfect" houses, neiborhoods,shcool zones, ect. in the same town. most people won't drive out of state to find a deal on a house. they have to buy WHERE they want to live. with cars you go where the price is best and then drive HOME.
No, that is how it works in car buying. The game is the game. With the system the way it is set up now, I wouldn't give out my bottom line price on the first offer if I was a dealer either. The buyer would also be stupid if he offered his highest on his first offer. You have to make the salesman think he brought you up on price just like the salesman likes to make you think you brought him down. That's the way the game works. That's just negotiation.
I've learned a lot from this dialogue. No problem to boot anyone. I have decided the difference between selling/buying a house is there are rules and laws about representation and the in the paperwork upselling doesn't exist. I feel a lot better about the dealings with real estate than I have about car buying (and selling the used one). The approaches toward one's job here have been enlightening. I do know my next car purchase will be by telephone and or internet. A friend did this for her Miata. Now I understand why I'm so uncomfortable with the salesman who does it everyday while I'm just a little customer.
During my latest vehicle search one dealer website had where you could build a car and then bid an offer. It worked great. I configured my car and the invoice price came to like $22,300. I bid $22,000 and they took it. It would be cool if more dealer websites did this instead of the standard price quote request page.
But it appears from some previous posts that even when the buyer is definately serious, some dealers still want to play games, like the T&C story. How does the buyer let the dealer know they are really serious and want the best price, period? (I am sitting in your showroom with a checkbook, what else do you want?)
is one thing, but if I really knew that you were being honest with me and intend on buying a car, and you are just trying to see if it fits into your budget, I am more than happy to give you any price you wish. I think I speak for all salesman/saleswomen that we try not to just give out prices so quickly because the high majority of customers then turn and take my price and use it against me to buy somewhere else. I am not a service to help others sell you a car. NEWS FLASH...this is my business..profession...way I put food on the table for my family. I give you a price, BOTH knowing you are not buying and are going to my competition and buy there....what is the reason to give you that price. At least in my office..I give you the same respect back I recieve. If you are honest and straight forward with me form the beginning, You will recieve it twice over in return...I am more than happy to not only give a price, but give the car away if need be to someone that is truthfull from the beginning. You lie to me and be deceitfull well.....you get a the run around that all of you say you hate so much. Bottom line, you all want to be treated fair and honest from the start.....do the same.
I am one of the highest unit salesman in my store and area...I also have the highest customer satifaction percentage in my store...all because I treat my customers with respect and dont BS them...They all know me from referals and know to do the same to me. They dont want the BS you all hate, so they avoid it and enjoy buying a car because....they dont BS me either...think about it
as a "difference" between houses and cars, and EVERYTHING here applies to cars:
a. The non-serious ones may be first-time buyers, ignorant and unaware of what RE is going for in their targeted neighborhoods.
Car guys see that every day.
b. If so, they may turn into Serious Buyers within a short time frame by checking other RE in the 'hood - and come back to me because, all of a sudden, MY bottom price now looks good after they've seen a few more comparable properties.
Car guys see that every day.
c. If I hadn't given out that price, in the 10 seconds it takes, they might go away thinking I'm too expensive - when I'm not.
Again.
b. I don't deal, in effect, directly with buyers - they're usually represented by an agent. Their agent, if a pro, has already qualified them for a certain price range and it's a waste of their time to check properties outside that range.
there are some salesman out there that are a complete mess...LOL. But the majority these days are all about giving you want you want. If you are not being honest with me, how can I be honest with you. The majority of the time, the problems that arise and arguments begin with you, the customer. You walk in today and say I need to buy an Accord and don't talk to me like I am the devil himself, I will not only give you respect but also the price you hope to get...defuse any problems by not starting any....
Auto salespeople are licensed by the government after taking a course and passing a test. Like realtors.
Qualification? If you pass the test and can do the job you get hired. Same for both.
Accountability? What's the huge difference here?
Pay and incentives? The higher the price the consumer pays the more the realtor makes. Like car salepeople except that most car salespeople's pay is capped (the mini or flat) once the deal gets below $500 over invoice or so. $500 over invoice or $500 below invoice, the car salesperson is paid the same. Even if you sell your house for below your target price the realtor will still pick up a nice fat check.
GET PAID ABOUT 6% OF THE SELLING PRICE, REGUARDLESS OF WHAT THE SELLER MAKES. UNFORTUNATELY US CAR SALESMEN GET PAID A PERCENTAGE OF THE GROSS PROFIT....OVER INVOICE. IF CAR SALESPEOPLE GOT PAID ON THE TOTAL PRICE OF THE CAR....I COULD HAVE REITRED BY NOW....LOL
I didn't know that Canadian car salesman were licensed. That's cool. Here, only some states have any licensure laws at all.
Re pay and incentives, see post #3966. If the car guy gets into your pocket for an extra $K, it could mean what, an extra $200-$300, to him/her. If the house guy gets into your pocket for an extra $K, it means an extra $60.
yea, I guess your right. And when the price of the house is lets say only 100k, thats only 6k in his/her pocket. boy, your right, lets not give me 200-300 IF I get a 1000 deal......
No offense intended, truly. I hope I didn't even imply the car guy shouldn't get that $200-$300.
My point was that the pay and incentive plans differ between 'tween cars and real estate. Given the payoff, the car guy has a greater incentive to get into the buyers pocket.
542.00 profit is a joke and we are ripping them off and we are a bunch of theives. But be sure to go home and send a thank you card for the great job your RE agent did on hitting the lotto on you...It's pretty sad when someone is willing and happy to pay more in taxes then they are to pay us in a profit...
for someone that you know where they live costs about 300,000 for their house. And god knows how much everyone made there (agent, owner etc..) but yet 100.00 over invoice on a 25,000 car and I get looked at like I'm growing heads all over my body
try any extra money on any deal....stop !! Did you forget that everyone believes that all car salesman are independantly wealthy and do this just to pass time thru the day. When you sell 15-20 cars a month and even less in some stores EVERY DEAL MEANS SOMETHING.
on your way home and you stop for a pizza for the family and you order a large pepperoni with a couple two liters of pepsi and then he says 22.50 please. Tell him, NO way...you know how much his dough costs. You know how the sauce costs and the pepperoni. And you will pay 10.00 and not a penny more......well I hope you had a big lunch !!!
3975 chorton Sure, I might. I think I'd be big enough, also, to accept that a buyer would have reason to be suspicious about that extra $1K.
3976 landru2 Apples to oranges; $10K on a house for me would be about 10%, $10K on car would be about 50%. Even so, $10k to the house salesguy would be a 10% kick to his cut; and $10K to the car salesguy be a 1000% kick to his cut. By that comparison, the car salesguy would be 100 times more motivated to get into my pocket.
hondaguy9 Dunno what to say, beyond my opinion that the commission structure hurts both the customer and the salesguy and my observation that, like landru, you're comparing apples to oranges, sales where negotiation is the rule to sales where negotiation would be the exception.
I can tell you that you would not want to swap places with a RE Agent. She has sold one house this year. In a good year, she averages about 1-2/month. After the other agent take their cut and her broker takes her cut she gets an average of about $1500/closing. You would only have to sell 5 cars in a month to do that. How many cars/month does an average salesman sell?
Seems that those who work selling cars are bitter about consumers gladly letting other salespeople (like realtors) make substantial profits while trying to prevent car salespeople doing the same. This is true, but let me explain the consumer's view.
There is often a hostile relationship between car buyers and car sellers. This type of hostility is not as bad between consumers and other types of salespeople.
Many consumers believe they are treated badly by car salespeople and detest the experience of buying a car (even though they may like cars) and one of the ways consumers react is to resolve NOT to be taken advantage of by car salespeople. As a result, consumers go into a dealership like a marine entering a combat zone. I have done things in a dealer showroom that I would not dream of doing with my realtor, jeweler, insurance agent, etc.
Sounds like the solution to the battle is for Walmart to get into the car business. It sure would make it easier to know you were getting a _low_ price like they advertise. But didn't I hear that they were considering the car business. Anybody know for sure?
Big Orange is on the money; RE commission is negotiable. They don't want people to think that it is... and 1/2 goes to selling 1/2 goes to listing agency... in the agencies 1/2 goes to company, 1/2 goes to salesman. Is that about right? $200000 house, $12000 commission, $3000 to selling salesman in a four way split...
.... You make some very good points .. but why is it ok ..?
It's ok for a jeweler to make $300 on a $450 watch or $2,200 on that $3,000 wedding ring ~~ it's ok for a Real Estate co. to make almost $15 grand on a $200,000 home, it's ok for the ABC furniture co. to make $2 grand on that $3,000 dining room set, it's ok for the clothing stores to make $350 on a $500 suit, it's ok for a store to make $100 on a $125 pair of Nike tennis shoes.
But a Dealer invests literally millions, and try's to make $200/$2,000 on a $20,000/$50,000 investment and everyone thinks this not a good thing .. hmm, maybe I should open up a few jewelry stores and sell furniture out of the back of them ...
Maybe you should visit their conventions and see how they've done it. (The jewelry and furniture guys and gals that is.)
I like to read the stories, but I don't really think car dealers are off the the poor house in great numbers.
I'm sure people do pay higher profit margins in other retail situations, but I think the question is why are they willing to pay those prices without even a moments hesitation, but will haggle to the death over a dime on a car deal.
It's because they have the notion, real or otherwise, that car dealers rip people off.
You and I know that not all car dealers do, but then all you have to do is turn on a TV set or radio and hear screamer ads seemingly every other commercial.
Now to be fair, I've heard screamer ads for furniture stores, but can't say I've shopped a furniture store that ran such ads.
Finally, there is the notion in America that your car makes a statement for you. Heck, even my 13yo daughter believes that, as she doesn't like me taking her to school in a 16 year old Buick. She wants to ride in a "cool car."
So car purchases are much more emotional than furniture or jewelry.
While visiting dealers they have told me they could get whatever I want if not in their inventory and it would not be extra! I've always thought the best deal would be to buy out of inventory. Also on some discussion boards I remember it being said if dealer A gets a car for you from dealer B that dealer B gets the holdback and not dealer A. Is this true? If so, then Dealer A not in position to makes as good an offer. What if dealer A "trades" with dealer "B" for you, is holdback not then an issue?
There's a local Honda dealer here in Louisville advertising "Any Accord this weekend $2750 off MSRP." The example they give is a DX 5-speed, list 16,260-2750=$13510. Since the invoice on this car is $14688, they stand to lose over a thousand dollars on this sale. Do they hope to make it up on the trade in, financing, and extended warranty? But what if someone comes in without a trade, pays cash, and skips the extra warranty, are they still going to be ok with losing a grand?
Thanks Isell. I do not plan to get into pushing on dealer's holdback portion. Just thought that 'holdback" loss might not give me an opportunity to get as good a price. Just trying to understand the process to improve my "negotiating smarts". Curious on how the dealers handle who gets holdback when they trade cars and if they trade will it give me an opportunity for a better price other than costs for a driver. Again...thanks.
Comments
But, if that's a serious question, I'd be glad to give you a serious answer.
Just like auto sales people have buying signs they want to hear in discussions and negotiations, the same goes for selling everything else in life - and, as a salesman for more than 30 years, I would hope to be able to recognize these signs even though I don't sell RE for a living.
Landru - I'll ask again: What's the problem with giving a non-serious buyer your best price on selling one's house? They can't shop it. They might know some other party that house shopping and mention it to them. If they come back a month later and say that bottom price is still too much and they want to negotiate further, you can say no. So what's your problem with giving out a bottom price? Against the Auto Salesman's Creed?
"What's the problem, when selling a house, in giving a not-serious prospect your best, bottomline price?"
If there's no problem, why do you bother separating the joy-riders from the real prospects at your real job? Or do you spend time at your real job discussing your bottom-line pricing with those joy riders?
So what's your problem in giving a prospect your bottom line price?
Kinda like an internet car buyer service.
So that's how it works for houses but not for cars? Okay.
Then you're talking about home-buyer prospects.
Then you're back asking about giving non-serious buyers your best price when selling a house.
Now you're claiming I have a problem with giving a prospect a bottom-line price when selling a car.
I think I'll just bow out of this discussion for now. I'll just wait until someone is serious about having a discussion.
If a car sales person gives you their best price early on, there's not much more left to discuss. That's why The Best Price Must Be Left to the End.
They rightly fear their best price, if given out before the buyer has one way or another committed to the rest of the deal, will be shopped around town, around the county, around the state, around the nation via the Web, whatever, and some other dealer will offer the exact same vehicle at a slightly lower price - just enough lower to take their sale away.
This is what leads into the "what do we have to do to sell you a car today?" theme because they need your psychological commitment to making the deal happen inside of their physical space and within their timeframe - or account control is lost because the buyer can go elsewhere for this commodity item, and, usually, get a better priced deal. The infamous "be-back" prospect that's never heard of again.
AND THE HARM IN GIVING A NON SERIOUS PROSPECT THE BOTTOM DOLLAR IS ITS A $%& &@*# WASTE OF TIME....THEY'RE NOT SERIOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!
Let me ask you another - have you ever had a non-serious buyer turn INTO a serious buyer when you gave out your rock-bottom price before they left the building?
Just curious.
Ok who buys a new house that wasn't planning on it when they got up this morning. houses are a little more stationary than cars. cars CAN be an impulse buy. Everyone I have ever sold a car to was "just looking" when I greeted them. What do you say when you go looking to buy a shirt and the lady behind the desk asks "can I help you" It's a defense mechanism. Sales has much more Psychology involved than you know of..... obviously.
b. If so, they may turn into Serious Buyers within a short time frame by checking other RE in the 'hood - and come back to me because, all of a sudden, MY bottom price now looks good after they've seen a few more comparable properties
c. If I hadn't given out that price, in the 10 seconds it takes, they might go away thinking I'm too expensive - when I'm not.
b. I don't deal, in effect, directly with buyers - they're usually represented by an agent. Their agent, if a pro, has already qualified them for a certain price range and it's a waste of their time to check properties outside that range.
And, as for my own understanding of Sales Psych 101, my friend, its excellent - and I've made a wonderful living from sales now for 30 years.
But thanks for asking.
With all that psych knowledge, you oughta be gettin' full MSRPs at 9.9% money with 700+ FICOs, whole life, mop&glow, extended warranties, VIN etch, Lojack - right?
I have decided the difference between selling/buying a house is there are rules
and laws about representation and the in the paperwork upselling doesn't exist.
I feel a lot better about the dealings with real estate than I have about car buying
(and selling the used one).
The approaches toward one's job here have been enlightening.
I do know my next car purchase will be by telephone and or internet. A friend did
this for her Miata. Now I understand why I'm so uncomfortable with the salesman who
does it everyday while I'm just a little customer.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
But it appears from some previous posts that even when the buyer is definately serious, some dealers still want to play games, like the T&C story. How does the buyer let the dealer know they are really serious and want the best price, period? (I am sitting in your showroom with a checkbook, what else do you want?)
a. The non-serious ones may be first-time buyers, ignorant and unaware of what RE is going for in their targeted neighborhoods.
Car guys see that every day.
b. If so, they may turn into Serious Buyers within a short time frame by checking other RE in the 'hood - and come back to me because, all of a sudden, MY bottom price now looks good after they've seen a few more comparable properties.
Car guys see that every day.
c. If I hadn't given out that price, in the 10 seconds it takes, they might go away thinking I'm too expensive - when I'm not.
Again.
b. I don't deal, in effect, directly with buyers - they're usually represented by an agent. Their agent, if a pro, has already qualified them for a certain price range and it's a waste of their time to check properties outside that range.
That's the car manufacturer's stance.
Salesperson pay and incentive structure.
Auto salespeople are licensed by the government after taking a course and passing a test. Like realtors.
Qualification? If you pass the test and can do the job you get hired. Same for both.
Accountability? What's the huge difference here?
Pay and incentives? The higher the price the consumer pays the more the realtor makes. Like car salepeople except that most car salespeople's pay is capped (the mini or flat) once the deal gets below $500 over invoice or so. $500 over invoice or $500 below invoice, the car salesperson is paid the same. Even if you sell your house for below your target price the realtor will still pick up a nice fat check.
IF CAR SALESPEOPLE GOT PAID ON THE TOTAL PRICE OF THE CAR....I COULD HAVE REITRED BY NOW....LOL
Here, only some states have any licensure laws at all.
Re pay and incentives, see post #3966. If the car guy gets into your pocket for an extra $K, it could mean what, an extra $200-$300, to him/her. If the house guy gets into your pocket for an extra $K, it means an extra $60.
RE agent payplan + car sales
sticker=39572
invoice=36458
diff. = 3114
car sales payplan-
Selling price = 37000+TTF
Gross Prifit = 542
Commission 25%
paycheck = 135.50
RE payplan(if applied to car biz)
Selling price = 37000+TTF
Gross Profit = 542
Commission = 6% (of total selling price)
Paycheck = $2,220
Now if I made that on every car I sold that would be enough to retire in 2-3 years!!!!
My point was that the pay and incentive plans differ between 'tween cars and real estate. Given the payoff, the car guy has a greater incentive to get into the buyers pocket.
Rivertown-
if I need to make another 250 on any deal to cover my bills you bet I'll try for another grand in any given deal!!! Wouldn't you????
What are the chances that a car salesperson will get in the buyer's pocket for an extra $10,000?
Did you forget that everyone believes that all car salesman are independantly wealthy and do this just to pass time thru the day. When you sell 15-20 cars a month and even less in some stores EVERY DEAL MEANS SOMETHING.
Sure, I might. I think I'd be big enough, also, to accept that a buyer would have reason to be suspicious about that extra $1K.
3976 landru2
Apples to oranges; $10K on a house for me would be about 10%, $10K on car would be about 50%. Even so, $10k to the house salesguy would be a 10% kick to his cut; and $10K to the car salesguy be a 1000% kick to his cut. By that comparison, the car salesguy would be 100 times more motivated to get into my pocket.
hondaguy9
Dunno what to say, beyond my opinion that the commission structure hurts both the customer and the salesguy and my observation that, like landru, you're comparing apples to oranges, sales where negotiation is the rule to sales where negotiation would be the exception.
car talk... GOOD
get the hint?
kcram
Host
Smart Shopper and FWI Message Boards
There is often a hostile relationship between car buyers and car sellers. This type of hostility is not as bad between consumers and other types of salespeople.
Many consumers believe they are treated badly by car salespeople and detest the experience of buying a car (even though they may like cars) and one of the ways consumers react is to resolve NOT to be taken advantage of by car salespeople. As a result, consumers go into a dealership like a marine entering a combat zone. I have done things in a dealer showroom that I would not dream of doing with my realtor, jeweler, insurance agent, etc.
make it easier to know you were getting a _low_ price like they advertise. But didn't I hear that they were considering the car business. Anybody know for sure?
Big Orange is on the money; RE commission is negotiable. They don't want people to think that it is... and 1/2 goes to selling 1/2 goes to listing agency... in the agencies 1/2 goes to company, 1/2 goes to salesman. Is that about right?
$200000 house, $12000 commission, $3000 to selling salesman in a four way split...
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
It's ok for a jeweler to make $300 on a $450 watch or $2,200 on that $3,000 wedding ring ~~ it's ok for a Real Estate co. to make almost $15 grand on a $200,000 home, it's ok for the ABC furniture co. to make $2 grand on that $3,000 dining room set, it's ok for the clothing stores to make $350 on a $500 suit, it's ok for a store to make $100 on a $125 pair of Nike tennis shoes.
But a Dealer invests literally millions, and try's to make $200/$2,000 on a $20,000/$50,000 investment and everyone thinks this not a good thing .. hmm, maybe I should open up a few jewelry stores and sell furniture out of the back of them ...
Terry ;-)
I like to read the stories, but I don't really think car dealers are off the the poor house in great numbers.
I'm sure people do pay higher profit margins in other retail situations, but I think the question is why are they willing to pay those prices without even a moments hesitation, but will haggle to the death over a dime on a car deal.
It's because they have the notion, real or otherwise, that car dealers rip people off.
You and I know that not all car dealers do, but then all you have to do is turn on a TV set or radio and hear screamer ads seemingly every other commercial.
Now to be fair, I've heard screamer ads for furniture stores, but can't say I've shopped a furniture store that ran such ads.
Finally, there is the notion in America that your car makes a statement for you. Heck, even my 13yo daughter believes that, as she doesn't like me taking her to school in a 16 year old Buick. She wants to ride in a "cool car."
So car purchases are much more emotional than furniture or jewelry.
But then you already knew that.
What if dealer A "trades" with dealer "B" for you, is holdback not then an issue?
Dealers do have to pay to have a driver swap cars. The amount depends on the distance.
A dealer will ALWAYS be happier selling a car he has in stock and you may well get a better deal.
Good luck!