Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
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Any Questions for a Car Dealer?
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Upon entering, loudly ask "Who want's to sell a car today?" When the dust settles from the experienced sales people fleeing to the top secret salesman's lounge (you know, where they hi-five each other after each fleecing...err I mean sale), approach the nearest greenpea. Corner him, and then begin talking down the exact car you want to buy. You know "No one wants a 5-speed" and "Well the Corvette is sooo much faster" and "The Expedition has waaay more cargo room". By the time you go through this for about 5 hours or so (hopefully you got there no sooner than 15 minutes before closing), they will probably pay YOU to take that heap off of their hands and BOOM! (don't sue me John Madden) you've got yourself a car!!!
PS: be sure to hang the survey over their heads to leverage a year of free oil changes at 1,500 mile intervals along with a complete detail with every visit. They do this all the time, so don't let the screw you over on this.
Well, you learned a lot. Now you know that you are going to have to pay more if you want that vehicle.
There is no reason to get upset or emotional. Either cough up some more money to buy the Honda, buy a cheaper car, or go hike the AT where you won't even need a car.
Well, you are correct on that point.
I think all of the information out there has you a bit pickled. I would try to concentrate on the VALUE of the car *to you* and forget, if you can, about the amount of profit they may be making.
And, forget about holdback. It isn't profit.
You, like others are making this a frustrating process. It really doesn't have to be...try to have a bit of fun if you can.
Five speed CRV's, although not nearly as desirable as the automatics are not distressed merchandise. They do have their fans.
Make a reasonable offer and see what happens.
Good Luck!
The "reasonable deals" seem to be for about $1000 off MSRP, with $1500 off being exceptional. Some, who only will accept one specific color, or the dealer has to trade for their car, may pay closer to MSRP. You MAY be able to get buy one for invoice, but chances are you won't. If you really want the car, don't let them know that you won't go get a RAV4, and do like Terry says. Offer a couple hundred over invoice, and see what happens. Isell is right.. They are a great value at close to MSRP. (that doesn't mean you shouldn't try to pay less).
regards,
kyfdx
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I bet they accept.
holdback is the money the manufacturer offers to the dealer to help pay for the interest from the floorplan loans. the more interest a vehicle accrues, the less holdback is available on that particular unit. some units have none left, and some are brand new with most left. but this amount is FAR from profit. all the cars average out to almost exactly offset the interest. its pretty much a wash.
will a dealer dip into it? sometimes. but the response you got about being on drugs was likely because you asked for it.
also, if they have to dealer trade for the unit, the original dealer usually keeps the holdback...so your dealer's cost is the published invoice.
But doesn't that also mean that the dealer keeps the holdback on the unit they trade out? So isn't it pretty much a wash too?
That kind of vehicle can be tough to deal with. Sure, we all know the handshaker is tough for them to unload, but now that YOU want it, they no longer see it as "tough to unload" but as "rare." So i don't think you'll be getting a screaming deal on it. Personally, I'd be looking at $21K even, but that's just it - personally. What you are comfortable paying is a very subjective thing (as isellhondas mentioned). Good luck.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
regards,
kyfdx
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
When I DO trade, I try to send the oldest unit I have in that particular category - the holdback's gone, but maybe I can stop the bleeding with a band-aid...
I try to be nice and bite my tongue but some of these "prices paid" are a bit...well...impossible!
People blow smoke? Say it ain't so!
I have always wondered why a dealer would lose $2,000 on a vehicle when they can drop it on a transport, run it through the auction and make $2,000 .. hmmm if my math is correct, that's a $4,000 swing, but then again I don't get out much ...
Terry ;-)
I'm not sure if these posts come from people who have forgotten what they really paid or if they are simply not telling the truth.
Maybe there was a trade involved that distorted things?
Gets real frustrating sometimes when I try to explain reality to a customer who believes "the internet" and not me.
I'm polite and friendly as I explain the market and they usually come back after they have gone nuts in five different stores trying to match or beat an impossible price.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Terry.
In order to title it in Arizona, since it isn't permanently registered anywhere at the moment, I need the Manufacturer's Statement of Origin (MSO) document. Dealership says it'll be a couple of weeks before they get it...I would've thought it was shipped with the van and received by dealership when van was delivered there.
Can the pros give me an idea if a couple of weeks is reasonable? I'm on a 90-day permit, so it isn't a huge deal, but I'd like to get the whole thing done and out of the way. Thanks for your help and insight!
You shouldn't have any problems.
I also got that same listing of "facts" from something on the Honda dealers site in Washington state, where I originally shopped the car" and I quote
" Q. what is dealer holdback
A. Dealer holdback is hidden profit manufacturers apply to the invoice prices and give to the dealers. Dealers are allowed to use this profit anyway they see fit. You can use it as leverage for a discount."
it goes on to explain steps to determine the dealer cost etc, and "calculate the hidden profit or holdback from the chart at the right. ex. Honda 3% of Base MSRP (except Prelude).....so if folks like "me ' are making it more confusing and harder than it has to be....maybe the information dealerships themselves are providing needs to be more accurate and directed toward the "facts" of dealer ownership, or more realistic about what they are willing to accept as the price of the car and running the business.
Now please don't get defensive, but perhaps car shopping could be a more pleasant experience for the shopper and dealer alike, if accurate portrayals of the cost are on the car, instead of something you have to "work" out of them. some dealerships are more guilty of this practice than others, but I don't have this problem at the orthodontist, grocery store, the clothing store, or other big purchases (ok, except some tv, furniture and appliance guys, )
I am grateful for the fact that you guys are here and willing to provide what I would hope and expect to be accurate information and insight into what dealerships side of it is, but by the same token I don't want to fund the company Christmas party with money I can use for my kids braces, etc. because of "what the car is worth to me"..and I was silly enough to pay more than its value..that's a line if I ever heard one. Either that , or we truly will be living in our cars, since it is sounding more like a real estate deal than a car. But , I am truly appreciative of all that you have shared here and will go in with a new vision of what to expect. Thank you.
I know for a lot of shoppers, it's not the price that's the problem. It's the fear that just maybe someone else paid less for the same car.
"Value" means different things to different people. If you are happy, then you received good value. This isn't a "line" it's the real world.
I have subscribed to CR for many years and respect them. They do, however, sell magazines and not cars. In my opinion, they are much better at testing products then dispensing car buying advise. They sometimes do a good job of helping people *not* buy a car becaue of this.
I do wish you well in your frustrating quest to buy a new CRV!
Name one business (other than government regulated ones) that tell you what their costs. Do you go into your local pharmacy and say, "Before I go in and buy the Lipitor, tell me what it costs you. Oh, and ask Pfizer the same."? You would get laughed out of there very quickly.
You don't get that answer when you buy your home or when you head out into any retail situation for that matter. Nor should you.
Maybe I shouldn't tell you that Coke costs 0.5 cents per fluid oz ... and you pay $1.39 for a 32 oz serving ...
Obviously, to use the word "profit" in that sense is incorrect in that profit can only be determined after expenses are examined. The correct word is "revenue." Holdback is revenue that the dealership receives to help partially offset its cost of financing its inventory. Manufacturers require a franchised dealer to carry a certain level of inventory so it makes sense that they help offset the dealership's cost of financing this inventory.
Regarding your comment about having to "work" the price (I assume you meant price and not cost) out of a dealer, of course that is only true if you want to spend the least amount of money. You (and everyone) may want that but there is no "right" to save money. To get that, you have to put some effort in.
Much like everything in life, whether it's getting the best education, getting the highest salary, finding the best investments, or getting the best price on a car, getting a worthwhile result takes some work.
It's a response from a Q&A part of the site .. you know, it's probably Rivercrust at another forum .l.o.l..
Terry.
Holdback is nothing more or less than amount of money that the dealers receive to *offset" the cost of floor planning their inventories .. it's certainly not a profit or a figure even close to it ..
Actually a good example of this is about 4/5 posts up from Beechan .. the dealer sold a vehicle that he has been paying floorplan on and he doesn't even have the MSO, but he still has to pay for it, it probably hit his inventory sheets 2/3 weeks ago and he still won't be able to pay it off until the MSO shows up, in the meantime he's paying the floorplan charge, kinda like paying mortgage payments on a house you don't live in .. got it.?:
Terry.
It's human nature that kicks in. I read about a guy who knew a girl whose second cousin twice removed friend paid $5000 under invoice for this vehicle so I should get that too. When asked if they have proof it must be kind of like I read it on the internet so it must be true.
I'm all for getting a fair price on a car but when the internet line blurs between fact and fiction sometimes that I think makes it tough on both the seller and the buyer.
Just my .02
Duncan
PS Hey Jolie you can take back your arctic clipper weather anytime. :-)
It can't drop back down cold until after I manage to get the cooling system in the Explorer taken care of......should have been done yesterday but we all know where that went. ;-)
Sunny and -1 here.
Grand High Poobah
The Fraternal Order of Procrastinators
;-)
p.s. this way i get to use the 4x4s. (desperate attempt to remain on topic)
I have Bridgestone Blizzak DMZ3 on my new Explorer, it rarely comes out of 2WD even on the ice.
the last time it snowed more than 4 inches here in KY was 1994. i feel like my son is being deprived of winter!
;-)
Lots a FWD cars hanging around used car lots this winter.
hopefully back soon, since my wife is driving my 4x4, and i'm driving a borrowed 83 cutlass wagon
with inoperable wipers. PLEASE stay below freezing, and don't snow!
otherwise, i'll be at the car dealer asking 'who wants to sell a car today?'
;-)
Is it the SAME reason that they add those other "official" looking stickers for "fabric protection, paint protection and undercoating"?
Inquiring minds want to know!
fastdriver