Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/22 for details.
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/22 for details.
Options
Comments
On second thought......don't. :P
around town 19-20 mpg
70,000 miles and pretty reliable
MODERATOR
Need help getting around? claires@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
Tell everyone about your buying experience: Write a Dealer Review
I assume, in City driving both are the same. Highway driving would be different. I have not seen any concrete numbers.... Dealer was saying that I should get 2-3 miles more with VCM. I seem to recall it is one a mile more for VCMs. Logic says, it should be much more though.. :confuse:
Thanks,
This is what I hear too....
When I first heard, it was disappointing to me. I still wonder that this new technology worth getting just 2 extra MPG.
over time 3 cylinders more worn than other 3 :confuse:
Not sure what speed this occurs at. Can any VCM owners report at what speed the eco light will not come on when cruising?
From what I understand the eco light being on does not mean vcm is on, but if it is off, then vcm is definately off.
-Dudley
...unless, of course, he included the phrase "NEVER again Honda" in every single post.....
The engines in the VCM and non-VCM are not setup the same since the VCM engine achieves maximum torque at a lower rpm than the non-VCM model.
I would agree with you fundamentally, but the only way that you could really answer this question would be to run a side by side test of identical VCM and non-VCM vans. You would have to equalize the weights, tires and tire pressures, oil, etc.
Also note that with the shorter gearing in 4th and 5th and with the lower max torque, the VCM van should accelerate faster and get better mileage!
My car show me that i can drive ~ 270 Miles! - where is the problem ?
Thank You
My 2002 T&C LX with the smaller 3.3L V6 has an overall average of 20.4 mpg since it was reset and has gone 1471 miles. It now shows 343 miles to empty with the fuel gage slightly above 3/4.
The trip computer on my T&C is VERY accurate.
Try re-setting the trip computer, drive a few miles on the open road, and then check your distance to empty.
Here in Canada I get about 600km's in combined city/h'way driving with a thrifty drive style. When I step on it, the 3.8L will be quite a gas guzzler, so the 270Mi. is not unrealistic. Driving the vehicle hard will also wreck the transmission in no time!
On some other forums I see info: that if I try to clear my computer (disconnect the battery) this will resolve my problem. This can be true...?
Thanks for any suggestions, Artur
I know the VW lifetime average is really a moving average of your last 1,000 or so miles, so if Toyota (or Chrysler) are like this then a long trip may bring up your average.
The whole point of DTE is so that you don't run out of gas - the last thing it wants to do is tell you you can go further than you really can. Since it does no know what you will do next it uses a long term average.
-Dudley
i prefer the low-tech method.
don't you have some indication of relative amount of fuel remaining, and also have some form of low-fuel warning light?
personally, i've always been successful with my vehicles judging when to fill based on the low-fuel warning light, which comes on conservatively when i have 3-4 gallons of fuel remaining. you really don't want to run out of fuel.
anyway, if i had a DTE or MPG estimator in my vehicle, i wouldn't use them, for the simple reason the short-term numbers are impacted by your short-term driving style, and as far as using or relying on long-term numbers, well, they don't reflect what you have been doing in the short-term.
try this: fill the vehicle, reset the trip odometer, run the vehicle till it's low on fuel, then fill it and divide miles driven into gallons pumped. do this a few times to get a handle on how accurate your vehicle's MPG estimator is if you want... but regardless, don't rely soley on that automation.
Is the glass half full or half empty? I would say over time three cylinders less worn than the other three.
Also, it is not new technology. Cadillac did this (poorly) in the early 80's I believe. What you get with this technology is about a 10% gain in fuel efficiency for relatively little cost. It is a shame, though, that the deactivated and activated cylinders do not alternate. I guess that would require even more sophisticated noise cancellation technology.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variable_Cylinder_Management
In part, it reads,"It uses a solenoid to unlock the cam followers on one bank from their respective rockers, so the cam follower floats freely while the valve springs keep the valves closed."
Note the part where it says "keep the valves closed."
Honda's VCM technology is an offshoot of their VTEC technology and works by some of the same basic principles.
Here is another write-up on Honda's VCM technology:
http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/041014.htm
I had a question about gas mileage.
I've only used one tank so far. Roughly 70% highway (with cruise control on) and the rest city driving.
My results were roughly 10 mph. Ugh! I was hoping for more.
It does have a Wheel Chair Lfit which ads weight.
I've read varoius places on the internet and in discussions where people with the same van/configuration are getting 15 to 18 mpg.
So I'm curious. Is 10 mpg really bad performance for this vehicle?
Anything I can do to improve it?
-Dudley
Now given these readings are taken during winter driving, but I would expect the mileage to be much better than this. I've been basically driving to work and back, you can consider it half higheway and half city.
Bottom line I bought the Sienna after reading it's advertised gas mileage but the actual figure is nowhere close.
I'm gonna do some more readings though.
It is the distance travelled divided by the fuel used that determines fuel mileage.
It is a good idea to calculate it after refilling a nearly empty fuel tank.
spark plugs: do you have the right ones and is the gap ok? Check the three in the front , they are easiest to access.
Tires and tire pressure
Does the torque converter lock?
When you're driving at a constant speed of about 40-45 Mi/Hour the converter should lock, so the rpm's drop by about 500.
Also check the engine oil and transmission fluid levels and the condition of the engine oil ( have oil changes been done regularly, or is the engine clogging up?)
Talk to your mechanic, he/she might have suggestions
the half ton (5 lug wheels) are rated better on the mpg, but i cannot attest to that since ours is on a 1 ton chassis.
The DTE is based on lifetime/long term mileage. If you drive all city mileage, then fill up, your DTE may say 300 miles. You can then go on a long trip and drive 450 miles before filling up. The DTE is based on your city miles.
Of course the DTE will get more accurate as you use up gasoline since it tells you what remains, and does not subtract from the initial number. ie: DTE says 300 miles you drive 150 mile and the DTE now says 200 miles.
-Dudley
I would be more concerned about carbon build up and valve wear in an engine which was run significantly in the VCM mode since three of the cylinders would not be experiencing the same exposure to burned hydrocarbons (temperature and residue) as the other three.
I also have questions about the break-in on a VCM engine. You could easily operate the vehicle for 4-5,000 miles and only have three of the cylinders running for say 500 miles. Is that adequate break in? As an owner of a 2006 Odyssey EX-L, I guess that I will find out!
True. But remember, VCM is only activated under light throttle conditions so the amount of 'additional' wear experienced by the active cylinders is insignificant compared to the amount of wear experienced by all 6 cylinders under normal conditions. IMO, I would be more concerned about the 'extra wear' on the engine caused by the VCM-equipped Ody running a slightly shorter final drive gear (meaning that VCM-equipped Ody's are turning slightly more rpm at all road speeds compared to non-VCM Ody's). Does 'extra wear' from running a shorter gear bother you? It doesn't bother me.
Carbon build-up? Why should there be more carbon buildup on the valves for the 3 operating cylinders than in all 6 cylinders of a non-VCM engine? Again, VCM only operates under VERY LIGHT throttle applications. You are stressing about 'extra wear' due to something (VCM) which is only operating when the engine is being stressed the least?
In all honesty, I would be more concerned with the reliablity of things like the adaptive engine mounts and noise cancellation technology than any internal differential wear experienced in the engine due to VCM. VCM or no VCM, how many Honda engines (given proper maintenance) simply 'wear out' their valve springs and/or rings/cylinder walls?
My 2006 Odyssey EX-L has just about 1500 miles on it. The last 800 of those were on a trip at 72 mph with the VCM on conservatively 95% or more of the time.
800 miles at 72 mph = 11.1 hours running; 5% of 11 hours = 33 min. So only for 33 min out of 11 hours did three of the cylinders have any hydrocarbon build up in them. I am getting 19x more exposure to carbon build up in three cylinders vs the other three on a long trip. I am not comparing VCM to non-VCM
You are stressing about 'extra wear' due to something (VCM) which is only operating when the engine is being stressed the least?
At what point does the VCM cut out. When Honda engineers have determined that the three operating cylinders will be beyond their HP/torque limit and need more. On a normal vehicle, this would be a downshift point. The VCM will "lug" to the point where more cylinders are needed. In my case I have noticed that, with cruise control on, the vehicle speed will drop 2-3 mph as the 3 cylinder engine runs out of power before the VCM kicks out. I do not notice this on "normal" vehicles which shift down to maintain speed. I believe that Honda engineers are good and hope that they have designed these vehicles to operate beyond their expected normal life. Only time will tell.
My Tire pressure is fine, also i like to check the torque converter lock - maybe here is my problem...? I see some info label under the hood - on this label is: that Transmission has firmware upgrade on 2002 maybe Chrysler does some torque converter lock adjustment that is still not corect...?
All oils is changed to fresh on the day when I buy this car ~ 4 weeks ago...
Willem - Thank You for great suggestions...!
The trip computer on my 2002 T&C LX is also very accurate. However, the DaimlerChrysler trip computer calculates DTE based on mileage since the trip computer average mileage was last reset...unlike the Sienna trip computer DTE which is lifetime/long term mileage.
I think each method has advantages.
Previous refill with NO road driving, 10 to 15 minute warm up each morning, etc. 10.8 MPG. Refill today with half of the driving on the Interstate was 23.6 MPG.
Not for the cars sake - for the drivers.
BTW even if you drive off right away you will still get poor mileage until the car is warmed up. This can take as long as 20 miles depending on the temperature (the coolant warms up in a few minutes, but the engine oil takes much longer)
Just took a 450 mile trip in my 2006 Sienna. Driving 75 mph in cold weather (about 10 degrees). Averaged 24 mpg one direction and 24.9 the other. This is with snow tires on, and less than 3,000 miles on the vehicle, and starting off with a very cold engine. I expect it to get better.
Did notice something intriguing - when I dipped into some long valleys that were below 10 degrees, the instant mpg dropped a few ticks. I know engines are most efficient when warm, but this was quite noticeable.
-Dudley
DaimlerChrysler stupidly eliminated the Instant MPG reading on the trip computer in 2003 or 2004. The Sienna now has the BEST trip computer of any minivan.
It is certainly fine to drive a cold car, but one of the worst things you can do for a car is to drive it hard when it is cold. Pre-warming a car is not bad for it, it is just not really necessary - for the cars sake.
I am concerned about startup wear though and that is one of the main reasons that I use synthetic oil. Makes quite a difference when the temp is well below zero.
Do love the instant mpg on the Sienna.
I agree that beating a cold engine is about the dumbest thing someone can do to a car.
Driving a cold engine will warm up the engine faster which is better for your engine.
Ironically, some people will pay MORE for a minivan that does not have the features of a Sienna...just to get a few more horsepower and a few more lb-ft of torque. :sick:
if you think you've got to have it all, or are jazzed by technology for technology sakes (gratuitous) or technology = value, then go for it.
yeah, i'm one of those people that would pay more for less. instant MPG calculation just adds to your heads down time hansienna. laser cruise? pleeesssseee.