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Now where is my mint.....they did a good job to clean my exterior too but forgot to vacuum it. Oh well, I am just being anal :>
Thanks guys for making me feeling much better now :>
Billy
However, while I have not yet test driven a 2002 A4 1.8T, I spoke to a dealership who told me I could likely get a 5 spd. 1.8T Quattro with rooof and convenience package (no sport ) for about $39,950 (MSRP on this partic. car is about CDN$41,000).
Anyone have any thoughts on 2002 1.8T Quattro vs. 2001 2.8 Quattro for almost the same price? I look forward to all comments.
TIA (thanx in advance)
Question: Why does the brochure state 8 speaker stereo system? I can only find six, or is it 8 only if you get Bose? Or am I blind?
FYI: Another good site to read and post a review (like we all need that!) of your car is www.carreview.com. The A4 seems to get more positive reviews than negative so that is always reassuring.
To my understanding, both the Bose and the standard stereo have 8 speakers. However, I have read over on AudiWorld that others beside you have concluded that the non-Bose systems come only with 6. I have Bose and I count 8 but I would assume that even if the non-Bose does in fact have only 6 that the grills (for 8) would be there regardless. Mine are as follows: 2 in rear shelf, 2 in rear doors, 4 in front doors. The front door speakers would include a small tweeter that is located just forward of the door handle/lock switch ...that tweeter would count as a speaker and would be in addition to the bigger one in the lower front door panel.
Yeah, I've read carreview.com on several occasions. I agree, it's always reassuring to read positive reviews of the same car you own. Similar owner review sites I've run into are cars.com, epinions.com and MSN's carpoint.com. Again, those 3 sites also give more positive reviews of the A4 than negative ones. The odd thing is that the Forester I just bought gets numerous positive reviews on these sites but in the Forester's case, I really don't agree with all the great reviews it gets. I love my A4 but I'm just sort of *blah* on the Forester.
Billy-- I don't know if you missed my question on the door locks but if you can, will you let me know if programming the locks to auto-lock @ 10 mph is related to the lack of chirp and light blink when I arm the alarm/locks? I had the dearler program the locks to auto-lock @ 10 mph but I notice that the chirp is gone and the lights no longer blink when I arm the locks now. Are the two related or did they just screw up? Also, you mentioned once that your car's exterior lights (tail lights and front parking lights) will completely turn off (when leaving the headlight switch on) when you arm the alarm/locks. Can you confirm this? Mine doesn't but I saw a Jetta the other day where when the guy used his remote to lock the doors (he obviously left the headlight switch on because the tail/marker/parking lights were on) and all the exterior lights extinguished. Is there a code for this?? I think it would be a real convenience to just always leave the headlight switch on if all the lights turn off when the alarm and locks are activated.
Nobody reponded to my question last week about the instrument panel lights having automatic brightness control. Anybody?? Just what does this feature do and how does it work??
--'rocco
Sorry to hear about your ongoing situation with the A4, but I would insist on having the regional technician drive with me again.
As far as my car is concerned, I have not had any problems whatsoever. Except for the initial rattle in the door, the car has been flawless for almost 20,000 miles. More reliable than my Camry and Prelude.
As far as the 2002's are concerned, I went the other day for my scheduled maintenance, and they had a few 2002's that were waiting to get prepped. I asked to look inside a 3.0 and they were more than happy to show it to me and let me test drive it. It had a six speed, though, and even though I've driven five speeds most of my driving life, I am used to the tiptronic now, so it was not a very good test drive. The car, on the other hand was much nicer in person. Actually sort of striking. It had numerous amenities, much more than my Y2K car. I was very impressed, but the only thing that it will not have is a screen navigation system. For this reason, after owning our Acura with NAV for the past 1-1/2 years, I would probably not consider the A4.
I am surprised with every high end car company offering this option on almost every car, that Audi would stick with the system that is in the one that is in sight of the driver. My husband and I rely on the navigation heavily, and I promised myself that my next car would have a system like the Acura with one DVD for the entire country.
I test drove the Jaguar X-type and really liked it. That might be on my list next, providing Audi doesn't import the NAV system from Europe.
Take care.
Audibon, the 2001.5 loaner for my 10k service doesn't have the Bose pkg but there are 8 speakers in it. Did you count the 2 tweeters on the front doors? More snow in the Chicago/Milw area? Hehe time for Quattro to work :>
Scirocco, sorry for missing your Q's. My car still chirps when I lock it after the programming. I tell ya what, one time it didn't chirp and the the little LED's didn't blink so I was like, oh no, here we go, German electronics. So I called the dealership and told them what's wrong. They told me to check all doors and trunk and make sure they are slammed shut. I was like, oh so you think I'm an idiot and don't even know if the doors are closed. So I went to the car and sure enough, the trunk, which appeared to be closed, wasn't "slammed" shut. SO I slammed it shut and chirps echoed throughout the parking lot. LED's started to blink too. Try it out. About that auto headlight shutoff with the alarm arming, I need to get back to you on that. Auto dimming control?? Well I noticed the window up/down and door lock buttons will light up when you go into a dark environment even before you turn on the headlights. I assume there is a code for programming the car to turn on the instrument cluster without us doing anything in the dark?? But I don't think there's automatic dimming control in mine, to answer your question.
Equalizer, yeah I'm also surprised that Audi doesn't offer a screen with directions but opt for displaying words. The Japanese ones (in Japan) actually has digital pictures of what the buildings look like approximately so you can be sure where to turn, etc.. Jaguar X-type? Well I don't know about that one.....it's just a reclothed Ford Contour. I don't know how good Jaguar's (or Ford's) AWD is compared to Audi's. I don't think Jaguar had made cars with AWD before, right? With my recent experience with Volvo's, they are very nice too but the ride feels like I'm in a Taurus and it's deterring to think Ford has something to do with it.
Billy
--'rocco
Like you (except for the exhaust problem), my car's been tight, rattle-free, reliable and a joy to drive. I saw a black 2002 3.0 at the dealer a few days ago and was pleasantly surprised. I expected to hate the A6-ish rear end, but thankfully it's not an exact copy and looked good, as did the overall design. The interior was gorgeous and much more upscale-looking than previous A4s, and appeared to have more room. My complaints are minor, mostly concerning the questionable use of slightly overdone chrome body accents in the front and rear, obviously borrowed from the A6....yuk. It was the only 2002 on the lot and was scheduled for prep, so I didn't get a chance to drive it. Overall, the new design looks good.
After leaving the Audi dealer, I drove across the street the the Mercedes and Lexus dealers to check out the new C-Coupe and Lexus 300 Sport and IS300. The new Mercedes coupe is a joke. The 300 Sport looks good in TV ads, but came across as cheap in person, with an unimpressive interior and a bulky-looking rear roof line. The IS300 is a nice looking vehicle, but the interior was unexciting. After owning Audis, most other interiors look unexciting.
I've only seen the Jag X-Type in ads and it looks really good. Sure would like to drive one but unfortunately, we have no Jag dealership here.
BTW, I'm with you concerning the Audi nav system requiring several CDs to cover the U.S. They need to get into the current century. As you know, my A4 came with nav but is a feature I would have never ordered...and never use it. If the dealer hadn't completely knocked the nav off the selling price, I'd have never signed the deal. I received an updated nav CD from Audi the other day and remember thinking "why bother if they can't cover the entire country instead of a few southeastern states." God forbid I'd ever have to use the nav in any state west of Alabama.
Take care
. The new shape, to me, looks good and seems more functional (provides for more room in the engine compartment and trunk).
. I like the additional storage space. I like the change drawer next to front cup holder and I like those decent sized drawers under the front seats.
. I like the more spacious and easier to access trunk.
. The back seat leg room is indeed better (in my current car there's no sitting behind me when my seat is adjusted for comfort - I can sit there in the new one).
. I like the more radiused section of the center console where your leg rests against it during long trips (that irritating intrusion into your leg isn't so noticeable).
. The steering wheel seems to have a broader range of adjustment relative to your seating position and the view of the instruments seems better).
. Cruise control no longer shares the turn signal / dim/bright switch lever. It now has its own dedicated lever (which had been the headlight switch). The headlight switch is now on the dashboard. So, no more accidently turning on the brights when setting in your desired speed.
. There's a sub-woofer mounted on the shelf behind the back seat and a center speaker mounted at the base of the windshield. I'll let you know how it sounds when I drive it on Monday (although it doesn't have the Bose speakers).
. The seat height control sort of jacks up the seat (much better than the old style where you have to lift yourself up).
. I also like the power lumbar control and better control for moving the seat fore and aft.
. The interior, to me, seems very substantial and even a bit nicer than my 2000's (There were earlier reports from preview looks that knocked the interior. If nothing else, it seems to me to be even nicer than before).
. The glove compartment seems quite a bit larger and has a shelf for the documentation packet.
. The manual shift lever seems shorter with maybe a tighter throw (I should hold this comment for my driving experience report on Monday).
. The layout for the 6 disk CD changer with it's single slot feed looks good (again, I'll report on Monday).
. I'll also give a report on the dual climate control system (I'm not that fond of my current one).
So, what do I like better on my 2000?
. I prefer the sports wheels style on the 2000. Those on the 2002 aren't quite so 'clean' looking. Everything else seems better.
I have been reading the A6 board and there have been some disturbing comments about A6 reliability. I wonder if I'd be better off with an A4 (but it is also in its first model year too.... bugs?). I've test driven an A6 2.7T and the power is there. Logically I'd assume that the lighter A4 would "feel" about the same with the 3.0L engine as the heavier A6 with the 2.7T engine. Your comments are most appreciated.
The sales staff was guite busy. Does anyone know if the new dual exhaust has increased horsepower on the 2002 1.8 turbos?
Audi (the leader in my poll right now). Very nice car both aesthetically and performance wise. It offers quattro AWD and has for about 20 years. It is in its 4th generation and it is really the benchmark for AWD performance. It has a great warranty. Some may say that you'll need it, but even my current Japanese car has not been trouble free and it is much less sophisticated. Since I save every shread of paperwork associated with the things I own, I have calculated that I have spent an average of $1000/year to keep my Japanese vehicle running. I've had at least 1 recall, and have been towed by AAA about 7 times. But then the older the car becomes the more forgiving I seem to be.
VW Nice car. Sort of a cousin to the Audi. More of a commuter "family" car as compared to sportier Audis. If I were to consider a VW, I'd definitely get 4-Motion. I like the look of the VW more since the mid 2001 redesign.
MB What can you say it has the 3 pointed star, a definite status symbol and it is "affordable".
I've driven several MB, ranging from the ML320 to the E320. I drove a C280 in Europe for 3 weeks last year. Of the group the E320 was my favorite. It drives great. It also costs >50K so it should. I know that MB makes a big point to emphasize the safety of their cars and I think that safety is an important criteria. The new C-class for instance has very good marks for crash safety and they are sharp looking cars as well Unfortunately, they are RWD and IMHO may put you in a more hazardous position compared to AWD cars. Why else is MB planning to make every model they produce available with 4-Matic? The C will have 4Matic in another 2 years or so. I don't know if it extends to the coupe. I've heard that the C class is still getting all the bugs worked out and make sure you get one made in Europe and not in Brazil. But getting back to what I wanted to say about the drive, the C280 I rented in Europe was OK but I enjoyed the BMW 318i (I believe that was the model) I had rented there previously more. The MB was a bit overrated.
Also, have you considered getting a 2001 A4 off the lot rather than waiting for a 2002? You might be able to get a nice deal now, with dealers wanting to clear their lots for the 2002s....
Billy-- Forget my question on the chirp and light blink upon arming alarm. Evidently it had something to do with the hood being up. I had it in my garage with the hood open for several days as I was trying to clean up the spilled oil, etc. This is the condition it was in while I noticed that the horn and the light blink was not working when I locked the doors but upon closing the hood, they now work as they should. hmmmm, I don't know why the hood being open has anything to do with it but now all is well! --thanx for your input!
Charles-- Yup! ...I'm in the Seattle area and we've got what appears to be a pretty healthy inventory at both our local dealerships. I saw 3 of them today out on test drives. I think I read that the Bay area has probably even more inventory according to the posts I've read at other online site's message boards in the last week. When was it that you talked to your dealer? They've evidently been available for test drives and of course available for immediate sale for a little over a week now. So I'm sure you can now run immediately to your local dealer and buy one! ...do it before they're all gone! *winks* :P
My gripe on the new A4 (which some of you already know): I'd seriously consider trading for one if they had retained the integrated voltmeter gauge and the oil temperature gauge. I really would miss those! ...it was a feature that played a serious part in my decision to go with the A4 in the first place. I know the vast majority of people don't put much importance on those integrated gauges but I love 'em and would hate to part with them. Sure, I could add them as an after-market add-on but they're just not the same as having them factory integrated into the instrument cluster. Don't laugh too hard, please! :P
--'rocco
BTW, everybody wish me a belated happy birthday!
Both the mats and trunk liner were from clairparts.com.
Although accepted wisdom is to 'take it easy' with a new car, this one just begs to be let loose. The V6 is REALLY smooth and the car is so quiet..you would never know it is 4WD.
FANTASTIC!
Alex-- Most here know how much I love the 1.8T engine *grins* ...I probably have three or four posts on this board where I expound in length my reasons why. I'm finding that it is more than adequate for my needs although the idea of chipping did intrigue me at first. If you find that the power is inadequate, this engine is without a doubt, the most "tunable" engine out there. I'd suspect that you'd be pleasantly surprised at how much power the engine actually has at stock. I think you'll be impressed, especially mated with a 5-speed manual (too bad the 6-speed isn't available with the 1.8T *whimpers*).
Karen-- Well happy (belated) birthday!! I can't think of a more perfect birthday gift than those sport mats! I've got the "A4" mats that are the same thing only without the red sport logo but with the gray A4 logo instead ...I can't figure out why they charge more for the red sport logo but I figured the cheaper ones were okay ...if they were the same price, I definitely would have opted for with the sports mats. And that trunk liner sounds great too! I guess you can now put all that potting soil, mulch and fertilizer back there with no worry, eh? ...well, I doubt that you'll want to put fertilizer back there though :P --congratulations and may you have many many more birthdays! ...maybe next year you'll get a nice cat-back exhaust system!
--'rocco
Oh, by the way, the salesman had me driving an S4 w/ 6 spd. while he searched down the new A4 demo. Tell you what ... if I had $40K for a car (and maybe if I was a few years younger) I would definitely own one of these. Wow ... What a rush.
Oh, some Audi chippers swap chips when their cars are in for servicing. I would think that the mechanics would be able to tell that this is the case.
Best bet: chip friendly dealer.
Byron
I keep my cars until they become a nuisance due to frequent repairs. So...does anyone have any input regarding a sensible interval to change my oil? What is so different about Audis that they can go for 10K miles between oil changes?
swimgal
--'rocco
Thanks....
1) The stereo changes songs and the tone settings spontaneously. The dealer is replacing the stereo.
2) The fuel gauge broke prompting a new instrument panel by the dealer.
3) A strange rattling noise was diagnosed as a faulty camshaft adjuster prompting the dismantle of my engine (I'm SO upset).
I took my car on Monday morning to have this work done (it all started breaking right around the same time). My car is still being repaired and I just found out about the engine issue this evening. I was so upset I went straight over to the dealer. Has anyone else had such awful problems?
I'm worried the engine was damaged or will not be the same after it has been reassembled. Anyone with a mechanical background that can give me an unbiased answer?
Thanks!
A quick comparo and I mean quick, yielded some interesting numbers. I think when we all reflect on these it is easy to see why we chose our particular cars. The A4 represents very good value for the money. Well, here is the tale of the tape.
A MB C320 sedan 37595 base add in options 48115.
A BMW 325xi sedan 29495 base add in options 37855.
A Jag X-Type sedan 30595 base add in options 39770
An Audi A4 1.8 26865 base add in options 31170.
An Audi A4 2.8 30801 base add in options 37624.
A VW Passat GLX 4motion 32025 base no options to add.
Most of these are 2001 models, the VW and Jag are 2002 models. Granted the MB has the largest engine of this group but look how much the price jumps compared to Audi and the other makes. Food for thought next time you are out shopping. Unless noted I chose the smallest available engine but loaded the vehicle to the gills option wise with items that most of us on this board would typically want. So, what does this mean to us? We can get a car now with a decent engine and AWD from 4 different brand lines. Are they equal? Of course not. When I drove a 4 motion it paled in comparison to either A4 version. The Jag wasn't available and the BMW was just too much money for my wallet. It is all relative. Make an INFORMED decision and you will be the one with the big grin driving down the highway no matter what you decide. Happy motoring.
A.L.
"I'm worried the engine was damaged or will not be the same after it has been reassembled. Anyone with a mechanical background that can give me an unbiased answer?"
I have a mechanical engineering background and used to design engine components at Ford. It is generally not a good thing when a dealership has to do any major engine work since you never know what else may have been damaged and you also risk contamination, leaks, etc. That said, a faulty cam adjuster is not a major engine failure and most likely would not cause damage to any other components. Chances are slim that you would have any other problems due to this repair.
Since high milage reliability is so important to automakers (resale value, customer satisfaction, 100k mile emissions regulations, etc), I don't believe they would recommend an interval that would reduce the engine life or reliability. Recommending shorter oil change intervals is such an easy thing, they would do it if it was benefitial.
The 3k oil interval has been around for many years (1950's or so or maybe earlier). The quality of the engine oil is much better (even petroleum based) now than more importantly there is much less interaction between the oil and the combustion gasses. One of the major reasons for changing your oil is due to contamination from the exhaust gases and from fuel dillution when fuel gets past the rings and goes into the oil. This is very bad for the oil.
Modern cars have much more strict emissions requirements which requires automakers to be very carful about burning oil. By keeping the oil and fuel (or exhaust gases) seperate, you prevent contamination and you don't have to change the oil as frequenly.
kk13, thank you for your comments on oil change frequency and on you response to lanceL99s posting. It's really refreshing having someone with your background visiting our site. Any comments on the octane article?
Do you think I should get rid of the car? I LOVE the car and don't even know what I'd get instead. (It's hibiscus red with ecru interior, prem pkg, sport pkg, 5 spd manual, FWD.) I sincerely appreciate your response. Thanks!
Lance
RECOMMENDED OCTANE:
I agree with the article. Use the recommended octane if you want good performance. Using regular won't hurt anything, since I am sure all Audi engines have a knock sensor that will reduce timing to prevent any damage, but you will get lower performance. The reduction in timing is why you get less performance. If it didn't reduce the timing you would still get good performance on regular, but you could cause damage to your engine with prolonged use.
ENGINE REPAIR:
Are you sure they removed the pistons or just the head and cam? I am not sure what this engine looks like but I was assuming you were talking about an adjuster that removed the play in the cam chains. Either way the only effect should be that the timing of the engine could change or vary during operation. This could cause rough running or the misfiring the dealer mentioned, but should not cause any problems with the pistons. The only thing I can think of is if the timing went so far off that the valves hit the pistons, but then you definitely would have had to replace the valves.
This should in no way cause any scuffing or scratching of the pistons and that would not cause a rattling noise. The rattling noise was likely the chain rattling around.
I would ask the dealer what happened to the pistons. Seems odd to me.
If the car runs fine, I would not worry about it. There are lots of engine repairs done every day without any problems. Relax and enjoy your car.
* The 1.8L was much stronger than I thought it would be. It had great low end torque and was quite fun to drive.
* The 3.0L was also strong. Much smoother, and quieter, but not as much fun to drive. It didn't have the torque kick of the 1.8L.
* I was surprised at how rubbery the 6-sp felt relative to the 5-sp. The 5-sp was very good, although not as good as the 3-series manual. The 6-sp did not have a positive feel and was very rubbery. So much that I found it very distracting. I think there might have been a problem with this particular car, since it looks like many people have not mentioned this problem. To me it wasn't so bad, that they would get complaints, but it is giving me concern about spending so much more on the car, if I had more fun driving the 1.8L 5-sp.
Any similar experiences out there?
I was excited about the new A4, and after reading here and elsewhere I had decided that the new 3.0 with the six-speed was the car for me. I was ready to order sight unseen.
I went to the dealer yesterday to get my oil changed and they had one A4 - a 3.0 with tip and 3.6 miles on it. I initially liked the looks of the front end, but the rest of the car looked chunky and angular - not the smooth flowing look I am accustomed to. I saw an '02 A6 next to it and really appreciated the nice lines, even the rear end which I used to hate. On the inside of the A4, it is also more angular, and the instrument cluster is much less appealing (too much digital mess, no oil temp gauge, and no analog clock). You can't raise the parking brake without bumping up the center console. The audio and heating/ac systems looked much improved however, and I like some of the new features. It is obvious that the Germans will never cater to our "Big Gulps" though, and after having spent some time driving in Europe I know why.
The test drive - the 3.0 is really powerful and they have tuned the engine and the exhaust so that you really know it's there. Still not enough low end torgue though. I thought the handling was kind of squirrely, but the salesman called back later in the day to say the car had not been prepped and the blocks were still in the suspension. No wonder it didn't feel right. The tiptronic was actually a lot more fun that I expected, especially because it had the steering wheel mounted shift buttons.
I then drove the A6 with the 3.0 and the tip. I know it has to be heavier, but it didn't seem much slower. I really liked the extra room after having driven an A4 for four years, and the interior is gorgeous. It also obviously costs more money.
Questions:
1. Have any of you die-hard manual tranny loyalists bought a tip and been satisfied?
2. Would you spend more money on an A6 now when they are going to change it next year and likely add some new technology?
3. The A4 was silver, showing all of the body panel lines and angles. Have any of you seen a dark color, and does that "wash away" a lot of that?
4. Is the A6 just too refined compared to the A4?
5. I'm concerned about the comments regarding the 6-speed tranny in the A4 (Post #2090). Has anyone else driven one?
I think all of the Audis are great, but I wasn't as impressed with the new A4 from the appearance and interior standpoint. If I could justify the extra money, maybe the 2.7T in an A6 with the sport suspension is the answer.
Any input would be appreciated. Just when I thought I had made up my mind, more choices. All good ones though.
I also got a price of $3000-3500 for custom covers. I have seen an A4 with a kit job and thought it was good. It looked like it came with the car and had a similar feel. To me this is a reasonable alternative.
The price of the 02 A4's, especially the 3.0 with Quattro and loaded, actually costs about the same as an A6 2.8/3.0. If you don't care too much about the few tenths of a second acceleration difference between an A4 3.0 and an A6 3.0, want a bigger and more luxurious interior, you should get an A6 3.0. Of course I would get the 2.7T A6 if I need to get an A6. You should definitely consider the A6 3.0 if you are looking into an A4 3.0. I sat in both cars today when I was at my dealership changing my squeaking windshield blades (for free :> ). The new A4 is quite alright, but the new A6 3.0 is very nice too. And yup, I like the extra room in the A6 :>
Billy