Audi A6

hintz · December 2002

The 2002 Audi A-6 is 3.0 FWD with preferred pkg/premium pkg/bose/$100.00 wheels. The car is a leftover 2002, never titled and 24miles on it. I'm still torn over what to do. I wish it had convienence pkg too. However, the 2003 is less money with the same options, expect they don't want to discount them. What to do?

shs111 · December 2002

Does Audi still plan to release a redesigned A6 in 2004? Any pic's of it? I'm very impressed with the pic's of the 2004 A8, and am hoping some of this carries over to the A6.

Audiot · December 2002

Try this link...personally, I don't think I like the 2004's front end (maybe the pic does not do justice)... then again, I didn't like the Audi design initially - it just "grew" on me.

http://www.greatimes.ru/cars/audia62004.html

Audiot · December 2002

Try this link...personally, I don't think I like the 2004's front end (maybe the pic does not do justice)... then again, I didn't like the Audi design initially - it just "grew" on me.

http://www.greatimes.ru/cars/audia62004.html

mccurtin · December 2002

I am thinking of upgrading to the A6 from A4...although I understand a new body style for the A6 may be due in 2004. Anyone hear/see anything to that end? If you have any articles or web sites that verify this - please respond.

Regards,

mc

mccurtin · December 2002

Thanks Will. I am wondering when the A6 is GA in the US/CAN.

mc

timcar · December 2002

The only people who know for sure when the next A6 will be introduced, and what it will look like, aren't talking. Best guess is late autumn '03 as an '04, or early spring of '04.

Thanks for the link to the photos, Will. I've seen similar shots before. I wouldn't be surprised if the next A6 DOES end up looking like one of the top two photos. The other photo looks like the existing A6 with a bit of tweaking. I think the Avant is an old model A6, or 100, before Audi changed the designations.

While I'm hardly an expert, the top two photo's still look like they've been Photoshopped a bit. However, this doesn't necessarily mean this isn't what the next A6 will look like. I've seen the basic grill and headlight treatment on other spy shot mock-ups, and the overall design is consistent with Audi trends. But I also think that the next A6 may look nothing like it.

I'm not happy with the grill either. The rest of the car looks pretty much exactly like the current A6, except for slight differences to the rear.

mpyles1 · December 2002

In an earlier message I reported problems with the Audi Telematics system in my two Audis -- a 2002 A6 4.2 and a 2002 S6. (Other owners were having similar problems.)

I bought the A6 at New Country Audi in Greenwich, CT, near where I live. I had to buy the S6 from a dealer in Chicago to get the features I want.

I called both dealers about the problems with the Telematics system, and both told me they had too little experience with the Telematics to help me. Neither offered even to have me bring the car in. So I contacted Audi USA. They took all the information and assigned a case number for each car, telling me someone would call me back within two days. I waited five days, but they never called back. So I called them back twice, and on the second call they said the Greenwich dealer was going to get in touch with me.

He never did, so I called him. Since I was getting ready to get rid of the A6 and keep the S6, I told him that was the car I wanted to bring in for service on the Telematics. He could not find the S6 in his database, and when I told him I had bought it at another dealer, he said he would prefer to work only on the A6, which had been bought at his dealership.

(I had tried to buy the S6 from his dealership, but they did not have one in stock with the options I wanted. I asked them to do a search and swap. Two days later, they told me they had searched and turned up nothing. I got on the internet myself and found two cars within twenty minutes . . . one at the Chicago dealer where I eventually bought the car. It was obvious that New Country in Greenwich had not even searched in order to try to force me to take one out of their stock that did not have the options I wanted.)

Audi dealer service is despicable . . . and don't expect any help from Audi USA.

I love these two cars, but they will be the last Audis I own. They simply cost too much to put up with dealers who lie and who have no interest in servicing them.

markcincinnati · December 2002

My telematics issues are behind me and I love the whole integrated phone, sat nav and On*star -- but it was a hassle to get it all working. It cost me 11 days -- and it was practically speaking the first 11 days of ownership after I had already made one lease payment.

But the problem ultimately was fixed by "leaving my car in my driveway overnight so that the On*star team could send the required software to the unit" -- or so they said. Whatever they did, when I pulled the car out of the garage at 11PM the On*star was not functioning but by 8:30AM all was right with the world.

The initial problem, however, was that the On*star Sat Nav wire was connected to the Audi Sat Nav system and NOT to On*star. It is possible to have sat nav without On*star, but with On*star GPS must be enabled (but not Sat Navs functions). Ditto, you can have On*star without a phone, but you cannot have a phone without On*star.

The 11 days it took were mainly diagnosing the problem, the fix was relatively easy, then park it outside and let On*star reboot the system (or whatever).

There seem to be so few people at On*star and at Audi that know ALL the systems that getting them to speak to each other live at the same time, rather than voice mail messages, must be tactically difficult.

Now that everything is working, I can say I love it, but I wish they would have gotten their act together on THEIR dime (or $750 lease payment as it were) rather than MINE.

I would, nevertheless, highly recommend the entire telematics ensemble, however.

Just make them prove that they have it functioning before you pay them and drive off into the sunset.

And, on the other point, my experience with AoA has been mainly "wow, they treat me VERY WELL!"

So sorry your experience has been so crappy.

mpyles1 · December 2002

I'm glad you were able finally to get your Telematics fixed, Mark. I'm going to try to make the arrangements you suggest.

When I first experienced the problem with the A6 right after buying it in May and got no help from the dealer, I contacted On*Star to see if they could help with the problem. They said the problem was with the car and not with their system. I accepted that assertion, since the On*Star system is several years old but Telematics was brand new. Also, I cut the dealer some slack because, in all fairness, I had bought the first car they sold with Telematics . . . and I know it takes a while for dealer service shops to gain experience with new features. But that was May and this is December. At this point, it's just plain disinterest on their part.

Having spent over $110,000 on Audis this year, I find it absurd that I have to go on the internet and plead with other consumers for help instead of getting assistance from Audi USA or Audi dealers. If they expect to play in the luxury car game, they are going to have to do better than this. They badly need to take a lesson from my Lexus dealer.

markcincinnati · December 2002

Well, my allroad was, pre-discounts almost $52,000 and my wife's TT was $42,000 -- so I know what you mean, you spend $90 grand and "something just ain't right!" And, I have never owned a Lexus, but I have heard all about the legendary treatment.

I do not know if the treatment at my Audi dealer is in the "Lexus League" -- I just know that I am, generally, pleased with it.

ON*star, themselves, were very responsive, very concerned -- my god they called me practically every day with a progress report (which, in all truth, was really content free in that they called me just to tell me that they were concerned, but they actually had no real explanations -- but they did the Hawthorne Experiment thing and in that respect, it worked).

I saw about 80 hours of shop time wherein my Audi tech was working with the ON*star tech probably doing trial and error activities.

Again, I applauld the effort, the follow up, the apologies -- it was NOT my dealer's fault after all was said and done. I look at it this way, the dealer should maintain and repair -- technically nothing was "broken" -- something was "plugged in wrong" to put it simply -- but my dealer had to turn into a diagnostic provider -- which usually goes with the territory, but this time On*star kept saying "this can't be, this can't be." So I cut the dealer slack.

If the dealer could be faulted for anything, in hindsight, it was not making 110% certain that the On*star was working correctly before I made my first lease payment. Heck, I could have waited another 11 days -- and I would never have even known then.

So I empathize and agree with you -- and I'll even go so far as to offer help to you (on my dealer's behalf) -- the dealer is Northland Audi, the Service Manager is Bill Fliehman, the Salesman is Ralph Winters and their telephone number is 513 851 5900 -- they, by now, must know every ON*star certified Audi advisor and ON*star technical resolution person in North America.

Maybe they can help their "brother" dealer resolve your issue -- of course the way the world wags, they may not have much incentive to do so if the other dealer, the so far unsuccesful dealer, gets paid for their efforts. We still are capitalists, remember?

What the heck, it may be worth a shot.

I don't know what else I can do -- but the Internet is the most powerful attention getting device I've ever seen in my 50 years on planet earth.

Lets give them a clue (from the Cluetrain Manifesto, btw).

-- Mark

carbuyerm · December 2002

If I buy an A6 am I destined to have repair after repair as some would suggest? I love this car but I don't want to spend my life and money having it repaired. I like to keep cars way past their warranty.

markcincinnati · December 2002

Your A6 with regular maintenance, as per mfg specs, with more than specd oil changes, should last 200,000 miles -- dealer service tech has a 1986 4000cs quattro with 300,000+ miles on it.

However, repairs on Audis (and frankly all European cars) can be breathtakingly expensive. My service tech says change timing belt @ 60K not 90K -- change oil and filter every time and do so at 5K miles. Change ALL fluids regularly and frequently. Wash and wax car regularly and frequently. Keep everthing well "lubed" that is.

Use the best gas possible -- cheap gas is a false economy.

Buy the extended Audi warranty.

==========

These are the things the service manager and techs recommend and perform on their own Audis -- and apparently they get to use the dealership to perform the work on their own cars (and also get parts @ cost).

Lot of very high milage good looking "older" Audis at my dealership.

I personally -- so far -- have not had the money to keep a car past the 50K mark -- except one time, see below.

I have "talked myself into" thinking that keeping the car past 50K or 36 months is more expensive than a permanent car payment (lease) and always having a "relatively" new car.

Who knows, I could be operating under a "false economy" myself.

I just have read too many horror stories -- about cars in general -- and I like having the latest and greatest, to keep a car, any car past its warranty (original or aftermarket -- as I did keep a 1988 Audi 80 quattro 100,000 miles with an extended warranty).

max27t · December 2002

I purchased and installed winter tires on my 2.7t a couple weeks ago. This is not the first time I have ridden on winter tires - I have just about every year for the last 10 years - but I have never noticed such a marked difference from summer to winter tires.

There are a number of differences this year; new car and different winter tires are the biggest. My expectations for cornering are much higher with this car, my first Audi, than for previous cars. Up until I changed tires a couple weeks ago, I was running the stock Michelin HX Pilot MXM4 tires. Within minutes of driving after the Nokian Hakkapeliitta Q were installed, I noticed more drifting while cornering. It just feels "squishy".

On other cars I have installed Hakkapeliitta 1 and NRW tires, and did not have that sensation, but then they weren't on an Audi, either. I also notice more body roll. I increased the inflation to 38 psi from the 35 psi the installer set. I might try a higher value again.

I read as much as I could for reviews and opinions on the Qs before I bought them. I even talked to several Nokian dealers. All recommended the Q. It was never clear to me why people would switch to a winter tire and then put on the NRWs, which are rated as all-season tires. It seemed like a half-way measure. But, the NRWs are certainly a much higher performance tire on dry, cold roads. The Hakkapeliitta 1s are a winter only tire for use with or without studs.

I went with the Qs because they were designed as the best studless ice and snow tire Nokian makes. I went with Nokian because I have liked the other Nokian (then Nokia) tires I used. To be fair, we've had almost no ice or snow in the Twin Cities yet.

The Q's icy road performance is improved by the spiral siping of the tread. I suspect this is also the reason for the degraded cornering performance. The tread can be easily deflected with your thumb. Having lots of squeegees seeking traction on ice is probably better than one stiff block of tread, but I guess there is a price to pay for that performance.

I'll wait at least one full season (more if we don't get much snow this year) before second-guessing my decision, but right now I am have doubts whether the Qs were the correct winter tire choice. Of course all it will take is one freezing rain storm to remove my doubts.

markcincinnati · December 2002

I can't tell you if you picked the right tires or not. But my experience with Audis is that tire changes are very noticable.

Some other cars I have had seemed little effected by tires. But then again, Audis are just higher performance overall.

My "guess" is that you have done OK!

timcar · December 2002

I'd tend to echo what Mark has said. I haven't swapped out my OEM all-season's yet, but have read many similar comments from other A6 driver's regarding the dramatic differences tires make to the car. I personally don't feel a need to run two sets of tires of tires in NW NJ, and find all-seasons an effective compromise. Minnesota is a different matter, I'm sure.

I drove about 20 miles in a snowstorm last Thursday, and was very impressed with my '01 2.7T. While my aging Conti's provided only adequate traction, the quattro, ESP and ABS all worked seamlessly and very effectively. This produced performance vastly superior, and far less tricky than any other car I've driven in the snow. As usual, the limiting factors are more other drivers and and their vehicles, rather than what my car can or can't do.

It used to snow a lot in NJ, and I've had to do plenty of driving in it. The past 15 years have largely produced mild winters, and I think some younger folks may not have too much experience in the snow. I saw one younger gentleman with a 3-serries with 18" wheels and maximum performance summer tires who couldn't even get it out of his local street. Hope he turned it around and went back, and waited for the plows.

I'm not familiar with the Pilot MXM4 tires, but assume they're maximum performance summer tires. From what I've read of many posts on AudiWorld on this topic, pretty much everyone has described what you did Greg. But if you are driving were people regularly drive in snow and ice, and expect to encounter it, I've no doubt you'll be very happy to be wearing what you are.

Again from AudiWorld, a lot of posters seem to have liked Bridgestone's Blizzak series of tires. Here's what Tirerack's latest survey results show

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/surveyresults/winter.jsp

JBaumgart · December 2002

When I first put Blizzaks on our '98.5 A4, I couldn't believe how "squishy" they felt on dry pavement compared to the Dunlop 8000E high performance summer tires. This was 4 years ago now and I think they've improved the original Blizzak tire (the equivelent tire is now a WS50, I believe). Anyway, when new, they were so bad in the handling department that they truly felt unsafe - like I had lost almost all control of the car, especially around bends and when switching lanes, etc. But after just a few weeks, when some of the soft compound began to wear a bit, they started to improve to the point where I began to regain more control, and soon found that they were absolutely great when driving on ice and snow. But of course they were still a major compromise on dry pavement, compared to the stock (sport suspension) tires. The latter, however, were absolutely worthless on ice and snow, which I learned the following year when I didn't get them changed over quite quickly enough. We still have them on the A4, now in their fourth season, and even though the sticky multicell compound is worn off, they still have plenty of "all season" tread left, and are much better than any sport/performance tire when the roads are slick.

On our allroad I use more of a high performance winter tire, the Pirelli Winter 210, which I bought at Tire Rack before last season, on closeout for $99 each (great deal in the allroad's larger size). Although better than the stock all season Pirelli P6 "allroad" tire when driving on ice and snow, they are no match for the Blizzak's in really bad conditions (which we get maybe a dozen times a year - I also live in the Twin Cities). They do ride very well, however - MUCH better than the cheaper Blizzak's - on dry pavement, which you'd expect with a "H" rated winter tire. Again, it's a compromise, and you just have to go with the combination that's right for you. In either car, I never worry about getting stuck or spinning off the highway, which for me is a big stress-reliever, especially when my wife and daughter are either driving separately, or are passengers in my car). When you live here, usually from about mid-November through March, putting winter tires on a quattro-driven Audi gives peace of mind that's hard to beat.

marleybarr · December 2002

I haven't had any problems with winter driving here in St. Paul, MN. the last 2 seasons with stock conti 16" rubber.

I agree with the other previous posts from today that it is the OTHER drivers that limit what I can do with Audi Quattro in the wintertime.

The combination of Quattro,and the other electronic "programs" have made winter driving a pleasure here in MN. during the heavy snow season.

The only real challenge I have noticed is driving on "black ice"- especially on some of the bridges- that has been treacherous on certain winter days in the last 2 seasons of winter Audi driving.

Where is winter this year? No winter at all in St. Paul yet- the weather has been simply amazing -temps. in the 30's and 40's -extremely pleasant!!

max27t · December 2002

Mark, Tim, and Joel, thanks for your comments on the tires. I am comfortable with my decision to use winter tires, but open to second-guessing on whether the Q was the right selection. Nokians are not as well known as Blizzaks, but I have used and liked them for 10 years.

This is the fourth set I've bought. Two of those went with the car when we sold it, and only one set was replaced because of wear. This was the NRW set, which are rated as All-Season, and I left on the car for a summer or two. The NRWs are an H-rated tire, unlike the Qs which are Q-rated. It seems that NRWs are more popular with Audi/Nokian owners than the Hakka 1s or Qs. My thinking was to go for the best ice and snow performance, which is the Q. April on AW has recommended the NRW, but I don't remember seeing any comments from her on the Q. The Hakka Q is a newer design (1999) and not as well known as the older designs. Of course even in Minnesota, most winter travel is on dry roads, so the NRWs might be a better choice most days. There are always trade-offs, aren't there...

Tim, you mentioned NW NJ. In the 80s I used to visit a family that had a place in Hope, NJ. What a pretty area. The western side is quite a bit different from the eastern side. The Michelin Pilot HX MXM4 is the All Season tire that came on my 2002 A6. Apparently it is also used on 540s and Volvo S80s. I don't know what % of 2002 were shipped with the MXM4s, but I have been pleased with them. Here is a description :
"HX MXM4
All-season driveability, plus superior highway comfort, low noise levels, and exceptional wet and dry handling makes this world class touring radial the perfect choice for today's luxury performance coupes, sedans, and roadsters. Available in 65 series and lower and H-, V-, W-, and Z-speed ratings."

Mark, hope you enjoy the new Allroad and that the telematics problems are all behind. It is good of you to volunteer for bleeding edge service.

Cheers, Greg

markcincinnati · December 2002

Am at 2000 miles -- 6 weeks. Car keeps performing better all the time.

Thus far, I cannot see any reason to chip it -- but I want to. I just can't imagine what will happen -- I'll be getting tickets all the time.

I can see myself with the quickest station wagon in the world!

Woo Woo.

Anyone need any On*star guidance -- no pun intended -- I'll be glad to help them.

northhou · December 2002

Hello everyone, I've enjoyed reading this message board and have a question.

I am in market for a new or used car and absolutely think the A6 is the best looking car on the road. There is a black 2000 A6 2.8 Quattro with 25K miles for sale at a dealer for $24,450 and it is certified. Sounds like a good deal to me based on Edmunds, the car is in great shape and looks new. What has been the service record of this car? Any ideas and help is greatly appreciated.

allagaroo · December 2002

I have a 2000 2.7T with app.32000 miles on it and it has been perfect except for replacing fuel sensors. 2000 was supposed to be the worst year for reliability on that car also. I am going to buy(lease) a 2003. Lease expires in March

markcincinnati · December 2002

The price isn't bad -- when does the original 100% Audi Advantage expire? It was 3 years or 50,000 miles initially and then AoA changed it to 4 years or 50,000 miles. If it is the latter, well then this may make some sense, since you would have 25K miles of 100% (not just the add on piece) warranty.

However, I know personally that my dealer has an 01 A6 4.2 that would be perhaps "only" 20% to 25% more and also have the extended warranty. I know, cause it used to be mine. 37K

Tis avail to be leased as well.

The one you are looking at to BUY, I assume, will cost about as much as a 2002 or 2003 A6 quattro 3.0 would cost to lease -- brand new, based on what I have seen in terms of lease payments.

Just another perspective. If you really like the one you posted here, do find out about the original warranty expiration and if it still looks good and it meets your price -- go for it.

This may spoil it for you, but try testing an A6 3.0 (02 or 03) and you may find that that 2.8 just doesn't have enough grunt, tho. And, the 4.2 -- can you say zooooooom?!

northhou · December 2002

Actually the car is Certified and comes with a 2 year / 100K miles warranty when the original warranty expires (100K total miles). Supposedly it also goes through a 300 point check to make sure everything is ok.

I drive too many miles a year (20K to 23K) for a lease to make sense...been down that road before and won't do it again.

dsumbera · December 2002

Which dealer are you looking at. I got my '01 2.7T from Advantage (formerly Don McGill) on the Katy Fwy. Was in there just before Thanksgiving for an oil change and they had quite a few used A-6's on the lot.

Can't say enough about the service I have received there. Usually next day appt's and no wait longer than 3 days.

Happy Holidays,

DS

northhou · December 2002

Advantage has 2 used A6's on the lot and Momementum has 1 according to their web sites. I'm talking to Boardwalk in Plano who has 59 used cars, with over 10 A6's on the lot. They also list them on Ebay.

Thanks

troyy2k · December 2002

I take a lot of sharp, fast canyon turns on my route to work, exclusively on dry pavement. I rarely ever drive in snow or in rain.

How does the quattro system affect handling when taking sharp, fast turns on *dry* roads? My salesperson it would greatly enhance the "road holding" capability on tight turns over dry pavement, but I don't know if he was just trying to sell me extra options.

timcar · December 2002

IMHO, quattro does nothing to improve "road-holding" as an absolute. Objective tests have proven the opposite: I.e., all other factors being equal, the mass added by quattro, or any other AWD system, reduces absolute cornering ability under perfect dry conditions.

That granted, I'd rather drive quattro under almost any conditions rather than any other drive layout. The 50/50 torque split under dry conditions provides neutral handling with neither the tendency to under-steer of FWD, or the oversteer of RWD. But I can still tighten the line with either the application of brake or throttle. In the hands of really skilled driver, quattro will do things that can't be done with other drive layouts. I believe it was banned in racing for many years for just that reason.

I also find that quattro makes the car more forgiving. Got Dumb? Don't panic, that's OK, point-and-shoot and you can manage the car really well with throttle. quattro can help pull you out of what you're headed into. Combine that with ESP and ABS, and you've really got to mess up badly to put it in the bushes.

And while it may not rain too much, or ever snow, if you are driving quattro in less than dry conditions, you'll appreciate quattro compared to either FWD or RWD.

While I've not spent time driving a BMW, I'd have to think the quattro will make the Audi more forgiving, though I have no doubt a RWD on perfectly dry pavement will offer the utmost in handling.

nosho · December 2002

troyy2k,

I drive a 2.7T manual, it really comes down to how much brake you use in the turns. If you take turns very fast, thus needing almost all your brake power to negotiate the turn, then quattro will be a disadvantage. The AWD system uses the brakes to distribute power to the wheels. In sharp cornering the wheels spin at considerably different speeds, enough so to activate the ABS and cause unruly handling.

This is my experience with a 2000 A6-2.7T compared to a 2000 Lincoln LS manual.

garycase · December 2002

We're about to buy a 2003 A6, and I really like the idea of a nicely integrated phone - but the dealer knows next to nothing about it! (they assure me they're fully trained to install it, but have done no installs yet -- they're "waiting for someone to buy it"). I can't even get a straight answer about what the total cost would be.

I'd appreciate answers to any or all of the following from anyone who has the telematics option with a phone installed:

(1) In addition to the telematics package, what did it cost for the phone & installation?

(2) Is the phone "trivial" to insert/remove in the car? I.E. is it just a clip-in cradle, with no wires to plug-in or unplug?

(3) What happens if you push the phone button and the phone is not in the cradle?

(4) A picture the dealer has of the install shows the cradle is mounted in the center console, and flips out. I presume the cradle can be put back in the console (and the console closed) with the phone installed and everything still works fine. Is this correct? Is there any reason not to do this (since the phone is completely hands free)?

(5) Does the stereo simply mute during a phone call -- or does it pause any cassette or CD that might be playing?

(6) Does any information from the phone display in the driver information area in the dash (e.g. the phone number being called, caller ID info, etc.)?

Thanks for any info you might be able to provide. We love our current A6 (2000) and are looking forward to getting a 2003, but I'm still trying to decide if the telematics system is ready for prime time.

timcar · December 2002

John, your information regarding braking and quattro is something I haven't seen before:

"The AWD system uses the brakes to distribute power to the wheels. In sharp cornering the wheels spin at considerably different speeds, enough so to activate the ABS and cause unruly handling."

I thought quattro was a largely a product of the Torsen differential and electronics like EDL, unlike other AWD systems, such as Mercedes', which DO use the brakes to limit slippage at any given wheel.

I've mostly had the ABS activate when more or less going straight in very slippery conditions like snow. Since my 2.7T is an '01, it also has ESP, and my understanding is that ESP works in combination with ABS. I do remember two notable occasions when ESP/ABS activated: The first was on dry pavement when I came into a sharp turn too hard. The ESP flashed briefly, and a slight thump when one of the rear wheels momentarily was braked. And the drama was over. I was back on course with perfect control of the car.

The second situation was more entertaining: I was on snow after having a tire replaced. Somehow, I wound up with 10 PSI less in my rear tires. I was negotiating a gentle curve at moderate speed, and my rear end came loose and began to gradually drift to the outside of the curve. Apparently, the motion was too slight and gradual to exceed the thresholds of the yaw sensors. I counter-steered, and the rear end moved a little in the other direction. But since this was a very narrow road, and I had a car about to approach in the other direction, I panicked and lightly touched the brakes.

Boy did I get lucky! Unlike other cars, where brake application in a skid is likely to accentuate the problem, from the moment I touched the brake pedal, the skid was eliminated. Undoubtedly this was a product of the ABS/ESP software working in combination to sense and correct the problem faster than I could even think about it.

So, while I find your experience regarding ABS causing unruly handling when braking surprising, I can say from my own experience, that in post 2000 cars equipped with both ABS and ESP, the opposite is true. The combination of ABS/ESP greatly enhances stability when braking and cornering simultaneously, or under any other conditions.

kirby2010 · December 2002

I've forgotten what the postings have said in the past about turbo whine. Lately I have a high pitched whine when I start the car; it continues briefly after the car is parked. It's been very cold here - don't know if that's a factor. Otherwise nothing unusual with the car. Can someone comment? Thanks!

nosho · December 2002

If it consistently occurs, confirm the squeal is coming from only one side of the engine (it's unlikely that both turbos are whining). If this is the case, then it is indeed a turbo and it will only get worse and ultimately fail. Only cure is replacement.

Temperature effects cold start oil characteristics but doesn't effect engine turn off. Low oil pressure could be a possible cause but a squealing turbo is a damaged turbo.

Let us know what it is....

jazzspot · December 2002

Hello all,

Great discussion group!! I just bought a 1999 A6 Quattro for $19800, which includes a 36 month/36000 extended warranty. Mileage is at 49,300.
Test drive for an hour or so and it seems to drive very well. Do you folks feel I made a wise choice? Any good tips that I should be aware of, besides the regular maintenance checkups and oil changes, etc.?

garycase · December 2002

Local dealer says they don't have the codes for setting the automatic locking & remote control window rollup/rolldown for 2003 A6's. Said they would do this if I got the codes for them. I got the codes from this forum 3 years ago when we got our 2000, and thought perhaps someone could help with the 2003 codes.

morphie · December 2002

Congratulations on your 1999 A6; The extended warranty is a good feature.

I suggest that you verify that all recall work was accomplished. We had a 1999 A6 which had several important recalls, one of which was the fuel gauge sensor.

Further, if you are contemplating keeping the vehicle beyond the warranty period, follow the suggested maintenance carefully. The service intervals, for the non-turbo 1999's, is 7,500 miles. Also, I would not hesitate to use a synthetic oil, such as Mobil 1.

One last thought: your performance will be somewhat superior if you utilize the reccomended premium fuel. Good luck with your purchase.

awd2003 · December 2002

Has anyone drove an 2003 A6 3.0 AUTO with 17" tires? We were looking at 330 and MB C-320 AWD. I liked the handling of the BMW but it would be nice to get a larger car. My present car is 328Ci.

majariwr · December 2002

I'm seriously considering an A6 2.7T, and recently test drove one with the luxury package, winter package, Onstar telematics, sport seats, parktronic, and Bose. I informed the dealer that I considered the Onstar, parktronic, sport seats and Bose to be unimportant and would prefer instead the to simply have the Premium package and the winter package, saving almost $2k off the sticker. However, I can't recall ever seeing an Audi with anything but the luxury package and therefore the full leather interior. Any impressions out there about the "leather seating surfaces" versus the leather contained in the luxury package? Is it just quantity (surfaces v. full leather interior, including door inserts), or is there a difference in quality? Are there any pictures anywhere of an interior without the full leather coverage of the luxury package?

timcar · December 2002

I don't have them Gary, but think you might want to check here -

http://www.audiworld.com/forum/index.html

There are, or were, several posters who had VAG tools and reprogramed these and other codes themselves. My thinking is they're likely to know, or know how to obtain the '03 codes.

I'm surprised your dealer doesn't know. They're not Pontiac dealers are they?

;-)

timcar · December 2002

Haven't driven an A6 with the 17" wheels, but reports are it firms up handling a little, without too much harshness. FWIW, if you want to stretch a little, the '03 2.7T comes STANDARD with the sport suspension along with (I think it's still an option.) optional 17" wheels. The sport package alone should give you handling approximating your Beemer, and the 2.7T engine should provide more go than any of the cars you're looking at. I doubt your negotiated price would be more than you'd pay for either the Beemer or the Merc. I.e., you should be able to knock $2,500 - $3,000 of the A6 sticker.

ibmct · December 2002

My lease on my S80 expires soon. While I enjoy it, I am not going to buy it. I'm looking for guidance in comparing the two models. Any opinions are welcome. Thanks.

notane1 · December 2002

I have a 2002A6 2.7T and lately I've noticed wind noise while driving at freeway speeds. It seems to be coming from either around the windows or the windshield. Has anyone had this type of problem?

timcar · December 2002

One man's opinion -

http://www.epinions.com/content_83769069188

JBaumgart · December 2002

Nice review - in the narrative you say you bought a 2003, yet down below it says 2002 (?) - presume it's a 2003 as you talk about the improved steering.

garycase · December 2002

Thanks Tim - but I've already looked there. They have the codes for 2000 & 2001, but not yet for 2003. Our local dealer (San Antonio) does not have the codes for the 2003's - and yes, they are an Audi dealer. (although they also know virtually nothing about the telematics system - another thing I'm trying to get better info on as noted in my post #3485)

Great car - we love our 2000 - but frustrating lack of info on the "toys." And having had the auto-lock and the remote window rollup/rolldown it would be frustrating to pay the $$$ for a 2003 and lose these features - minor things I admit, but you do get used to things (isn't that why we buy $40,000 cars instead of $15,000 cars??)

markcincinnati · December 2002

(1) In addition to the telematics package, what did it cost for the phone & installation?

$995

(2) Is the phone "trivial" to insert/remove in the car? I.E. is it just a clip-in cradle, with no wires to plug-in or unplug?

It is very easy to plug and unplug the phone, can be done with one hand even while driving.

(3) What happens if you push the phone button and the phone is not in the cradle?

The phone works anyway -- but not the phone in your pocket. The On*star system has a phone too. If you push the button and the V60 phone is NOT in the cradle, you will hear a voice prompt say "READY" -- then, if you say "DIAL" it says "NUMBER PLEASE" -- then you say "five" and it repeats "FIVE" you say "one" and it repeats "ONE" and so on until you have recited the entire number -- then you say "dial" and it says "CALLING" the phone rings and your party answers and you talk. You can also program this feature to respond to your saying "call" -- if you have previously loaded a number with a NAME TAG on it it will call "MOM" -- it is very slick and seems to understand male, female and even accents, within limits.

If this doesn't work, it is because you didn't purchase "units" -- easy to check, press phone button car says "READY" you say, "units" it says "ADD or VERIFY" you say "verify" and it says "YOU HAVE 54 UNITS REMAINING, GOODBYE!" Thats it -- it responds to dozens of voice commands -- and it will tell you if you say "HELP" when it says "READY."

(4) A picture the dealer has of the install shows the cradle is mounted in the center console, and flips out. I presume the cradle can be put back in the console (and the console closed) with the phone installed and everything still works fine. Is this correct? Is there any reason not to do this (since the phone is completely hands free)?

You are correct in your assumptions. The only reason to pop out the phone is when you are checking voice mail and you have to issue commands using the touch pad on the Motorola V60.

(5) Does the stereo simply mute during a phone call -- or does it pause any cassette or CD that might be playing?

The stereo mutes, the CD or tape pauses, the display on the head unit reads PHONE and the display between the tach and speedo tells you the number and name of the person you are talking to if you initiated the call and the word INCOMING CALL is displayed when the phone rings -- which can also pause the sound system CD or tape that might be playing.

(6) Does any information from the phone display in the driver information area in the dash (e.g. the phone number being called, caller ID info, etc.)?

Yes, all the above.

======

My door locks in my 03 allroad are programmed to lock at 20km and unlock when I remove the key, the windows go down when I press and hold unlock and the windows and sunroof close when I press and hold the lock button -- or you can always do the same thing by inserting the key into the driver's door.

The dealer did the programming, it took less than 5 minutes. Also did my wife's 2003 TT. As he says, it is not rocket surgery. Or Brain Science either for that matter.

timcar · December 2002

Joel, I lifted the link from AudiWorld. He had written it, and posted the link there. I thought it might be particularly useful for Noel, who's thinking of coming out of a 3-series into an A6. My car is an '01 2.7T.

Sorry Gary. :-( I thought someone at AW might have them. It's really frustrating when your dealer is or plays dumb. Especially after reading Mark's post, as his dealer evidently had no problem doing it. AoA evidently has frowned on the reprogramming of certain features, and I suspected the dealer might be playing dumb. Not long ago, Mark posted the name and a phone number for his dealer. Perhaps that dealer could be prevailed upon to divulge the codes to you to relate to YOUR dealer?

garycase · December 2002

Thanks Mark & Joel.

Mark - you're undoubtedly right about what happens when you press the phone button with no phone installed IF you live in an area where OnStar Personal Calling is available. Unfortunately, this is not available in San Antonio - and OnStar doesn't have any projected availability date. I called OnStar to get some of my questions answered, and I can't even buy personal calling for use elsewhere in the country. If you (or anyone else) were traveling in this area, personal calling would work for you, since you have it, but I'm out of luck until they sell it here! I would guess that in my situation pressing the phone button with no phone in the cradle would simply connect us to the OnStar system.

I love the concept of the fully integrated phone, but with the problems you had getting it to work, the inexperience of our local dealer, the unavailability of OnStar personal calling (to me the most attractive feature of OnStar), and the $1600+ net cost, I'm inclined to skip telematics altogether and go with a professionally installed hands-free kit. While not invisible, these increase the phone options (Motorola or Nokia), still mute the radio and display "Phone" when the phone's in use (you do lose the number display), and if multiple people (e.g. me & my wife) have the same phone model we can both use the hands free without having to pay $625/phone.

Mark - as I wrote the above I had a thought. Have you tried your installation with a non-Audi V60 phone plugged in? Just curious what it would do -- my guess is it would work fine but you wouldn't get the number displays (just like a "normal" Motorola V60 hands free kit).

As for the codes, as you noted it's not rocket science to change the codes. Took perhaps 2 minutes when they did it to our 2000 3 years ago. I originally really wanted the auto-locking and just had the remote window up/down down for the "coolness" factor. But my wife ('tis her car) uses the remote rolldown all the time - it gets rather warm in San Antonio and it's nice to roll down the windows as you approach the car in the summer. You do get used the these features, and if we buy a new 2003 I definitely want them. The dealer in San Antonio has changed since we bought our 2003, and the new dealer either doesn't have the codes or is "playing dumb." I don't understand why they would do this, since it's a matter of plugging in a connector and changing a couple of numbers! On the other hand, I don't understand why Audi ships the cars with these features disabled, or why AoA would discourage using them.

markcincinnati · December 2002

I do not have any reason to believe that AoA discourages the full use of all of the features that the Audi central computer has that can be turned on or off -- if I led you to believe that, sorry.

There are a couple of others, too -- turn on the wipers and the headlights come on low beams automatically. Defaults for the sonar can be changed too -- of course front sonar is not avail in NA only Euroland. I read about several other features that are available, but I can't recall them now. Perhaps someone has the "list" of the things that can be done with "feature codes" -- I can't remember them.

Why these codes are not "user selected" from a menu beats me too. Some people may not want their cars to automatically relock if the remote is used to unlock, but no door is opened, for example.

And, yes I had a few issues with my On*star and I did find them annoying -- but I assume my issues are very rare. I would still get the stuff!

Now, the phone works to call On*star, but NOT to make an outbound call? HUH? Who thought of that idea.

On the other hand, the calling feature of On*star is NOT to be used for normal talking time -- it is WAY WAY too expensive. The On*star calling feature could cost many multiples of my Verizon monthly airshare minutes. I share a minute pool with my wife and we still have separate phone #'s -- the On*star minutes are something like a buck a minute, I think. I'm still on my "free" 60 minutes.

allagaroo · December 2002

It is a mystery why Audi doesn't make you aware of the features that can be accessed with changing codes. There is also no mention in the manual about the hidden equalizer that has seriously improved the sound system on my 2000 2.7T. I don't think you can do it on the '03 I'm about to order.

Audi A6

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