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Pat
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The A6 out-classes the TL in every regard, though the addition of the Type S narrows the gap a bit. Here are some specifics:
Exterior styling: Admittedly, it's subjective. While the TL is certainly not homely, it isn't distinctive, either. The A6 has just enough "edge" to it to be unique. It resembles nothing else on the road. I can't tell you how many passers-by have commented to me on the car's beautiful styling.
Interior styling: Nobody does interiors like Audi. Unlike Acura, Audi uses real wood (in your choice of two types). The red and white fiber optic lighting is downright sensual. Add small features like puddle lights, floor lights that illuminate in conjunction with their respective open doors, the rear compartment reading lamps that don't blind the driver, lined door bins that actually open and close, three FULL adjustable rear headrests, the list goes on and on. The A6 interior is a MARVELOUS place to spend time!
Interior choices: I've never understood Honda's approach. They'll build you a blue car, and they build a black interior. They WILL NOT, however, build you a blue TL with a black interior. They take it upon themselves to deny their customers choices. Take a look at the color charts; the choices and available combinations are extremely limited. Contrast that with Audi. The A6 is available with 3 different seating materials in 6 different colors (or color combinations). There are 3 different leather textures, two unique stitch patterns, 2 types of wood, three colors of metal trim. The point is that Audi gives you MANY choices to choose from, and that's a very cool thing. (If you haven't yet seen the striking Vanilla/Satin Black or Vanilla/Royal Blue interiors, I suggest that you check them out. They're positively stunning.)
Other unique Audi features: quattro, choice of 7 different A6 wheels (depending upon specific model and whether or not Sport Package is ordered), front AND REAR fog lights, available 6-speed manual transmission (2.7T only), available front AND REAR heated seats, etc. etc.
To me, the A6 is a no-brainer.
3Y5(Sunshades), PAW(Cold Weather Pkg.), PHS(Bose Stereo), PAL and PFX(Preferred and Premium Pkg.), PST(17" Sport Wheel Pkg.)
Racing green with Melange interior. Was told it is a custom order so wait is 8-10 weeks.
Got it for 4% over invoice.
Only thing is I got HAD on trade in value of my Honda. I'm going to sell it myself!!
Keep you all updated!!
First place I saw anything significant on the new A4, including plenty of photo's, was on AudiWorld. But I wouldn't expect anything any earlier than probably May. Here's their link:
http://www.audiworld.com/
http://www.zainobros.com/
Their polishes are polymer based and provide a hard, very long lasting shine. The sparkle and depth are almost unbelievable. The products are also easy to use. They provide complete instructions for the application and use of their products at their web site. It's very important to follow them, and if you do, the products work as advertised.
Pat
Host
Sedans and Women's Auto Center Message Boards
Rick 00 2.7T Ebony Pearl
Sport/Convenience/Cold Weather Pkgs
SSR Competition wheels
what will it be worth in 3 yr and 60,000 miles?
Thanks, and no offense to that Audiphile thing.
Lots of choices for High Performance all season tires -- www.tirerack.com.
If -- the car has the P6000's on it does this mean it has the Sport Suspension? Try to keep the same "circumference" on whatever tires you ultimately get -- for the computer, etc.
Good luck.
Good lead on the Zaino products. I have been using them for about a year, and I could never go back to waxes. As you say, the shine and protection are unbelieveable - and it's easy, too!
I'd also suggest checking out Tire Rack on the net. It's a good place to both learn about and buy tires. I'm also attaching a URL for tire size comparisons. It happens to be for a Miata, but includes all A6 tires sizes as well. It's easy to use and informative.
http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html
Good luck!
TIA!
- Ray
Who does not really want to pay to immediately 'throw away' 4 16" alloys to have Z rated tires on 17" rims installed after purchase...
Much appreciated.
http://commerce.audiusa.com/
Under "Accessories" in the left hand column, click on "A6", then click on "Performance".
Example: I have a 1998 Mazda 626 ES-V6 w/automatic. At 73,000 miles, it's been completely problem free. Folks who bought the lower power engine have had all kinds of trouble.
I just leased an A6 4.2. 1100 miles so far and zero problems (no rattle, headliner hum, overboosted steering, changing radio stations, none o' that). Everything works, and I'm looking forward to 47 months of near perfectness.
I think A6 is a better deal and worth the money.
The brakes on my 1997 A8 (the rotors that is) and the front rotors on my 2000 A6 4.2 had to be replaced a couple of times before they got a "good set."
My 1987 5000 CS quattro did have a little squeak in the driver's door which was fixed first time and the stereo on the same 5000 CS quattro had to have the speakers replaced in the rear doors as the tweeters blew after I discovered the Burning Down the House CD and cranked it too much.
Virtually all -- and probably literally all of my Audi "problems" have been fixed for free (but yes, I grant the problems did "put me out.") Overall, I have always felt that the Audi provided a level of performance, safety and fun that somehow made its less than "Japanese reliability" worth it.
The last few Audi's we have had, even the afforementioned A8 and A6 with their brake rotor problems, have been fundamentally bullet proof.
Nothing mechanical is perfect -- no car I have ever had is. My friends with their Toyotas and Hondas have nice reliable cars -- and they (the cars) are frustratingly unremarkable to the point of boredom and tedium. My friends with their BMW's Audis, Mercs -- even Volvos and Saabs -- may (MAY) have their cars "in the shop" with greater frequency than the Japanese car owners -- but they love driving their cars. The thing most people say about their Japanese cars is "they get me from point a to point b" or they are reliable. Seldom -- if ever -- have I heard the owner of one of these "perfect" machines opt to take their cars when they can ride in mine. Moreover, I cannot recall any of them ever actually talk about their driving experiences.
My European car -- especially German car owners -- friends will often wax poetic about how much they enjoy driving their cars.
Different perspectives I guess. Low maintenance would seem to be equal to low involvement and low "fun." Perhaps some of the higher maintenance some people seem to mention should be put in the perspective of their (generally) high praise for their cars "driving pleasure," "handling," or other aspects of its performance.
Sure, we all want a zero maintenance, high performance, high fun car -- I have yet to see anything that actually beats an Audi -- in its price class and certainly in its performance class. Of course, I believe that Audi quattros have few competitors -- although both Mercedes and BMW are trying to change that with their recent inclusion of AWD models in their respective lineups. Ahh -- but competition will surely improve the breed.
No Japanese cars need apply for residence in my garage -- life is too short.
But -- then again, "it" is in the Eye of the Beholder.
It is so embarassing to have my wife take me to the Audi or BMW garage every two weeks with her Lexus. Toyota is just zero problems. I guess it makes me mad, I am leaving for the Audi garage tomorrow, AGAIN. The V8 that I had before the A8 had $14,000 worth of warranty repairs, most of them on stuff I never knew wrong, dealer replace option.
Thanks again Mark for your comments. Heaven help Audi and BMW if the Asians ever get the fun in the cars.
Pretty soon I will be inviting the Audi Service man to dinner, I see him more than most of my friends.
My Audi carries me safely and luxuriously through the rain. My Mazda likes playing in the rain and makes me crave rainy days. "Yippee, it's raining! Let's go for a spin! Yeah, let's take that curve a bit faster. Kewl! That was fun. Grrrrrrowl!!!" Have you seen the new Mazda Miata commercials where there are three cars playing around... ZoomZoom? It's not a joke. Just be sure you get the biggest engine they offer for whatever model you get.
On the other hand, when I feel like being pampered or want to go for an extreme performance drive, I prefer the A6 4.2.
My Mazda definitely has a better Bose stereo implementation as well. I also "feel the road" much better in the Mazda, while in the A6, I accidentally found myself going 125 and thought I was doing 70.
On the other hand, I submit my 2001 A6 4.2 with sport package (even tho it has an automatic) really does love rainy days, the twisties and handles like a snake in a rat hole.
While your enthusiasm is refreshing, it has in no way dampened mine -- and until there are many more who share your enthusiasm for the Japanese (esp. Mazda) magquis, I still remain unconvinced.
I'll take the great luxury (pampering) and/or extreme performance drive -- every day -- any day!
The V6 626 is to me far more entertaining and fun to drive than its competition - Accord, Camry etc 6s which is why I bought the thing even with its depressing resale value over much more saleable rivals. Mazda really does have a penchant for producing fine driving cars in their class and is a massively underestimated marque. Obviously it's not in the same class as the A6 in refinement or power or safety and isn't intended to be at $20K or so. Also worth mentioning is that Mazda marketing savvy is laughable and they have been unable to craft an image in the marketplace no matter what they try. I got 180,000 out of my last 626. 10yr old hard driven Miata with 150K plus on original clutches, gaskets and pumps are common. Again their driveability shines above their competitors - not just my opinion either - but who the hell thinks of MAzda first when they want to look at fun affordable cars with great reliability ? Me and the guy above and that's about it !
However comparing the Audis as I did several times to Lexus ES and GS, to MB E Class and to BMW 5 series I can honestly say it was more enjoyable than any of them.
....Now if it had a ragtop and could turn and hold a curve like the Miata we'd be on to something - including lapses in the laws of physics.
She says the car is fun, safe and with the hatchback almost stationwagon like without looking it. Holds golf clubs, groceries and a bunch of other stuff -- and it is FUN.
Can't speak to reliablilty -- has 11,000 miles on it, and DID require a new set of tires, but they were really HP tires and therefore were kind of expected to only be good for 10 -15K miles.
Love this forum!
TT's look cool as hell and are undoubtedly fun, but the Miatae are not as much of a compromise. Other than maybe some power accessories the Mazda has absolutely nothing that does not maximize handling and driving enjoyment - from a 50-50 weight distribution so niggly that they put the battery in the trunk ( there is room in the front ) to a suspension set up that means you can drive over a quarter and tell which side up it is.
This also means they are pretty much suicidal in the snow and have all the luxury of a park bench. However just watch people cover their eyes when they see you take a sharp exit ramp at 80mph then gape when you don't even touch the brakes all the way around. Now that's fun !
Not knocking TTs. I'd definitely take one if I had to have one year-round car and wanted a convertible. Roomier trunk by 20% or so. 4" more shoulder room ( I'm about 260 ). More HP although not really faster because of the weight. But $10K more and 1000lbs heavier and not set up to take the corners the same way.
Miatae really compete more with S2000's and MR-2s than TTs, which are aimed at a more affluent and more luxury inclined market.
It's not a Miata going around the curves, but it does surprisingly well. I wonder what the skidpad is on this car? Hmmm... The 626 is remarkably well-balanced too. I was surprised to find out it's a FWD, 'cause it sure doesn't feel like it, and it's almost impossible for me to push the tail into an uncomfortable position. I think it would flip over first, it's so stable.
It's definitely a much better car than Honda/Toyota, even Lexus. As I said before, this car has great road feel. I didn't buy a 540i because, as the sales guy was saying "doesn't it feel like a car should" and I thought...cheap looking plastic, uncomfortable seats, one little strip of wood-grained plastic as an accent. Then, I tossed it around a curve that I always take at 70 in my 626. At 45, the 540i started sliding...almost had to change my underwear. I mean it wasn't that tight a curve! When I test drove my A6, I took the same curve at 75 and it didn't burp. That clinched the deal. Quattro works!
2. Just think...the fun, reliability and road feel of a Mazda PLUS the elegance and further attention to detail of an Audi. Combine the two and BMW simply wouldn't compete. The resulting car series would be remarkable. Also, Mazda has a large-scale, halfway decent service network.
Maybe we should start a petition...
BMW will always be BMW though. They still have the more prestigous image, and the best performance sedans.
The new 2002 A4 ups the ante again!
The "prestige" that is BMW is far greater in the US than elsewhere.
For the money, I just can't see (and neither can more than a few journalists) a BMW beating an Audi -- now if you crank the BMW's price up quite a bit, you can out accelerate and sometimes out handle an Audi -- on a perfect road, especially a perfectly dry road. The Audi seems to live in the real world, where it rains and snows and freezes a lot more competently.
Now, Audi better be looking over its corporate shoulder as we now have BMW and Mercedes apparently ready to "get serious" about AWD -- but at least at this moment in time the Audi, in its understated way only loses the prestige contest, not the performance or safety contest (again, especially at the same price point).
I can take the same corner at the same speed in an A62.7T as a 530i. The Audi if anything feels slightly more responsive across the powerband. Top speed I never did and never would get close to so it matters not. Acceleration if any different would have to be stopwatch tested because you can't feel it. Add to that cheaper cost, quattro and much nicer interiors and it's no big decision at all for me.
I don't want to get in a piddling match with BMW guys because frankly it's all down to taste anyway but I wonder what specific objective advantages the BMW has.
As far as styling, I think both companies are very good. I much prefer the A6 over the 5 series, the 3 series over the A4 (though not by much) and the 7 series over the A8 (though I suspect the A8 is a better car overall). Interiors? No contest there: Audi!
Is Audi a better car for the money? Yes. Also, I personally don't like the BMW "image".