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Anonymous, I owe you my apologies.
One thing that we can certainly agree on is that SET is the exception and not the rule. So, unless you live in SET, then the invoice pricing of the 2004 Camry LE with (ABS, Side Curtains, Moonroof, Mats) falls about $1000 to $700 short of the price of the Accord EX.
Going back to the source of debate, I said it then and I'll say it again- some prefer the a la carte Toyota pricing, and some Honda's all-inclusive. Just like the cars, its a matter of preference.
~alpha
But you are still getting less features with the Camry. I believe the only advantage that Camry would have is the power seat. Although if you consider dealer's fire sale prices on the Camry you can probably get a Camry for even less than the prices we mention above. OTOH, Accords can be had below invoice right now as well in some areas.
I prefer the all-inlusive approach. Nothing is worse than being able to build a car with every eact option you want only to find that the manufacturer only makes 2 cars in that combo. When I was searching for my latest Accord I knew that as long as it said EX-L manual transmission it would be the exact model I wanted. No guesswork involved. Out of curiousity though I did search for a Camry SE manual transmission and only came up with one.
Anonymous, the EX-L 5M Accord represents a very small slice of the Accord sales pie, as does the Camry SE 5M.
On pricing, you state "But you are still getting less features with the Camry". Thats true, but thats why its 700-1000 less in most regions than an Accord EX at invoice. Really, the only major things I think you're really giving up are the alloy wheels, cd changer, and rear disc brakes (since we're talking about a Camry w/ moonroof). Also, don't forget that the 2005 Camry invoice prices seem lower than those of the 2004s, according to edmunds.com. This is the point the original poster was trying to make- in order for prospective Accord buyers to get a moonroof, it has to be the EX. Camry buyers can choose 3 of the 4 trim lines if they want a moonroof, OTOH. So the buyer who doesnt care about alloys, for example, can get a more closely spec-ed to preference Camry than Accord.
~alpha
With Accord, you just choose model and colors plus any dealer-installed accessories you might want. Simple.
The ala carte options are one theory of why the Camry has lower resale than a comparable Accord.
Honda is one of the few companies that do not have a long list of options for each vehicle. Makes it easier to get a vehicle EXACTLY as desired after looking at the manufacturer's brochures or doing research here at Edmunds web site.
Saying you have Michelin tires is almost like saying you have dark-colored tires, therefore they must be the same.
The Camry is a fine car, but I bought the '04 Accord (EX-L 4 cyl. AT sedan) because it's more fun to drive and has a more inspired interior design, too. Also, the Accord is a simpler purchase because everything that matters (including side curtain airbags) comes with the car. No options of any kind are required....Richard
~alpha
On the A/C issue, we were cognizant of it because it's so bad in our Civic. The Honda top of the line has the dual zone feature, which is nice, but the A/C, as a whole, in the Accord seemed clunkier and noisier than the Camry. Not very precise, I know, but the Camry A/C seemed to be a bit more effective given the same level of air. That was our impression. And, as someone noted, only the Camry has the vent in the back.
Good luck on the car and congratulations on your baby. (Ours is due in October.)
One suggestion is tinted windows. My black 03 coupe had tint all the way around and it seemed to get the coolest inside even though it was a heat magnet.
Now the Accord out performs as far as handling & brakes but the Camry was better as a family sedan.I love the Honda but I think I would have rather bought the Camry...atltech2000
Camry had better air conditioning in that it moved more air.
Honda had firmer seats and ride - definitely more sporting.
Camry was quieter and handled nasty bumps better - better for long trips on freeways.
Also, according to some CA lemon law lawyers I queried, one will get better resolution of a "lemon" with Toyota. My personal experience with a former Honda backs it up.
Having owned both a Camry and an Accord (though both were automatics), I imagine that you'll find the Accord more sporty. I haven't driven a Camry SE, though, so it's not a totally accurate comparison.
In my ownership experience, the Camry was more reliable, but I don't think that many people have had problems with the manual Honda engine.
I test drove a Camry when they first arrived in 02 but I was unimpressed. It drove nicely enough, was pretty quiet, and way more responsive than the 97-01 Camry 4 cylinder prior to it but the interior turned me and my husband off. I was willing to look at one when we decided we wanted to trade our 04 Accord sedan automatic for a manual transmission but there was only one SE with a sunroof in the entire area. Besides, my husband was still against the idea of a Camry because of the interior and no XM radio.
So we bought another Accord, this time a manual EX-L in Redondo Red. It's a gorgeous car with rear spoiler, fog lights, front chin spoiler, splash guards, and fenderwell trim. The 4 cylinder/manual combination is splendid and a dream to drive. I could never imagine myself being this happy with a Camry regardless of the bigger trunk and softer ride.
The Accord is designed to have a stiffer (sportier) ride and is thus preferred by buyers who want to feel the road more. The Camry is surely a smoother ride, and no one can beat Toyota when it comes to isolation.
As for issues, Honda automatics do seem to haev some issues, but then Toyota is not fautless here. They had major sludge issues and have in fact sent letters to all 97-01 owners to this point. All cars will be repaired at Toyota's cost.
I have been driving a 2003 Accord since Oct 02, and have done close to 40k miles. I had a tranny issue and it was replaced promptly by Honda, and I really appreciated the speed with with the issue was resolved.
Even after this happening, given a choice, I will still pick an Accord over anything else in the segment for its virtues which I feel I value more than maybe someone else would. I also looked at the Camry, but the interior, front seats, and the mushy feel of the brakes put me off. Having said that, there is no doubt that both these cars are excellent choices, though they seem to cater to slightly different audiences.
The interior of the Camry, IMO, has been well improved for the 2005 MY- just as the electroluminescent treatment did great things for the Accord, so have the new gauges for the Camry. Additionally, the center stack/console is now covered, a welcome addition.
The Camry also offers VSC on all models, a big selling point, IMO, and completely unavailable on the Accord.
~alpha
</endsarcasm>
The Accord now has standard side and side curtain airbags along with standard ABS from the DX up. This is also a big selling point on the Accord's side.
The interior is better than the older Camry, but I still like the Accord's much better.
I have to agree that Honda usually leads Toyota when it comes to the interior, new / standard features, etc. but the Camry is still well-matched with the Accord (and a large number of drivers agree) Toyota made some nice updates to the interior, as much as they could until the next gen at least.
One more thing, sometimes a negative experience at a dealer can turn a person off and send that person to the competition (its not always the vehicle's fault)
They have to save something for the next Camry, why waste money on designing a new dash when the next gen Camry is only 2 years away.
It isn't only less stylish than the Accord dash, it is worse than
Passat and Altima.
The Solara dash is Lexus like in design with cheaper materials.
The Accord's "Gee, whiz" display and better looking interior controls were strong selling points along with its much tighter ride. When the Honda was new it almost felt too harsh, but after a couple of thousand miles the tires and other parts seemed to have smoothed out a bit. I think the Accord rides very well now--firm and well controlled.
The car I fully expected to buy (I had a Mazda and liked it) was the Mazda 6i, but its 4 cyl. engine and clunky, Ford transmission were poorly matched--the car felt sluggish on initial acceleration and hunted between 2nd and 3rd gears on hills--crude for a new car these days.
The Mazda had the best handling and brakes, but on balance, the Accord seemed to be a better choice for me--no regrets since buying the '04 Accord EX-L a year ago.
I see that the Camry now has "Optitron" gauges that modernize the dash--that's an improvement........Richard
___Although I believe the Accord the superior automobile for any number of reasons, I saw a local dealer selling new 04 Camry LE’s for just $15,988! This is a long way from $17,500 for an LX in our neck of the woods. Chicago area that is
___I wish Honda offered the Camry’s smooth ride and wish Toyota offered the handling of the Accord.
___Good Luck
___Wayne R. Gerdes
First, you DO have to drive them both. They have a different feel. Many people think the Accord does not have as comfortable of a ride as the Camry, but others prefer the Accord because they feel more connected to the road and the car.
Second, the looks of each are different. Which do you like more?
Third, consider the dealers. Some Toyota dealers really help out the nearby Honda dealers, and I'm sure the reverse is sometimes true.
You may notice I'm not mentioning the cost. The pricing shouldn't be all that different. Who knows, if you spend more for one than the other you may get even more back at resale. If you care about your car at all, I think you are better off buying what you like rather than what you can save a little cash on. Would you want to get in it every day and think, "It's nice but I liked the other car a little more?"