Older Honda Accords

normg · October 2005

My family owns 4 honda accord sedans (3-2003 & 1-2004). All 4 cars required the rear brakes to be changed (about 20k-25k miles). Front brakes were still in excellant condition. I thought the front brakes normally wear out first? I've owned older models accords, never had this problem. Could this be a design issue with Honda Accords? Can anyone shed some light on this? Thanks.

moemoe · October 2005

I spoke to the dealer about the glove compartment light shining through at night and yes it has been a problem since 2003 on some accords. the dealer is going to order a felt thicker felt like material that will help seal the light out a little better. It is thicker than the one that comes on the car from the factory...I will keep you updated if that works...

rumans · October 2005

I have an LX Coupe.
How long do the drum brakes last vs the disc?

mrbill1957 · October 2005

There have been many many posts on the rear brakes wearing out faster then the fronts, alot of talk, but no clear resolution.

Mrbill

gee35coupe · October 2005

Or does it just happed with the OEM pads. I'm waiting for mine to wear out so i can put on some crossdrilled rotors and high performance ceramic pads.

mrbill1957 · October 2005

Thats what I'm wondering. Honda probably use more then one source for pads, could one vendors pads last, where another vendors wear quickly? I don't plan on replacing mine with Honda pads.

Mrbill

mamamia2 · October 2005

Some of the features on the new, '06 Accord, are appealing to me, and seem like SOFTWARE related, rather than hardware...

So the question is, could I (well, my dealer, of course) upgrade my '05 to use some of the new features the '06 has? DRL could certainly be appreciated, for instance.... But there must be more...

berbel · October 2005

Hey Group:

Is anyone here aware of any actual road test results for the '06 Accord EX V6 Sedan

six-speed? If so, could you provide a link or other reference? I have not had much luck

trying to find this info and I find that odd since the car mags and other independent

road test resources usually have access to these cars before the public does. Thanks

in advance for any help!

berbel

atlantabenny · October 2005

Upgrading an 05 Accord's electronics to an 06's:

1) Definitely doable: DRL

This company apparently sells a DRL module that takes 45 minutes to install:
http://www.sav-a-life.com/Drl_intro.htm

A DIY-er who's done it but with DRLs at 100% normal brightness (true DRLs are at about 75% brightness):

http://www.miata.net/garage/drl/DRLs.htm

2) Possible, But Too Involving and Probably Not Worth It: Drive-By-Wire, aka Electronic Throttle (4-cyl)

whitecloud1 · October 2005

I replaced the rears on my'98 with other than Honda pads. They have lasted at least twice as long. Way back I did the same with an old Civic with pads I ordered from a catalog.

normg · October 2005

In my case, all the accords were new, so shouldn't the front pads were out first? Normally, the front brake pads bear all the force and thus should wear faster than the rear pads. Is this old news or am I missing something? Thanks.

whitecloud1 · October 2005

You're right and I still believe that with other cars. Not on the Hondas I've had though. The rear pads look thinner from new.

mamamia2 · October 2005

Thanks, atlantabenny.

I sent an email to the guys at sav-a-life. Let's see what they say. I currently leave my lights on. The car shuts the lights off when the ignition is shut off. Which is OK, but it doesn't behave as a true DRL.

For instance, if I drive to a mall and want to wait in my car with the ignition off, and the radio on, I have to first TAKE THE KEY OUT of the ignition and OPEN THE DOOR, so that the lights will go off. Only then I can insert the key and turn it halfway to get the radio working.

As to your #2, the '05 has ALREADY the Drive-By-Wire. And besides, I don't see any benefit of having that feature, to begin with...

haefr · October 2005

"It is quite transparent and confirms what I've known about J D Power for years; they are for sale to the highest bidder."

BING-GO!

(and if they don't have a category you need, they'll whip it up right before your eyes)

arjcom · October 2005

I've driven both the '03 and '05 and I feel the '05 handles better, not with the agility of any of the 4cylinders, but just when comparing the 6's. I'm not sure about the '06 V6, I haven't driven it yet. The ratings said it had tepid handling..I know they made some adjustments to the suspension on this model. What does everyone else think?

maltbie · October 2005

See my post 18104 regarding the stiffer steering of the 06 vs. 03. The 06 V6 has a softer ride than the 03. The 06 soaks up bumps better. The 03 had a jarring ride on rough roads. The 06 is not nearly as soft as the Camry but enough to appreciate it when riding on rough roads.

While the 06 may have a slightly more body roll, it seems more sure-footed than the 03. The 17 inch tires on the 06 seem to have better traction than the 16s on the 03. It was very easy to chirp the tires on the 03, which probably explains why they were bald at 35,000 miles. I have not chirped the 06 tires once yet in 300 miles.

cooljw · October 2005

I just saw a new 2006 Accord on the road for the first time today. Is it just me, or do the inordinately LARGE backup lights on the new rear end make it look hideous?!!" See the
backup lights

haefr · October 2005

I find the reworked rear end much more refined and appealing than the "wall-to-wall" tail light treatment on the '03s thru '05s. I guess hideous is as hideous does.

whitecloud1 · October 2005

May be ugly, but they look very functional, since they did not put a camera in the back or distance detection.

kgbkahnk · October 2005

I waited an extra month before buying my '06 Accord, specifically because I wanted to wait for the redesigned rear end. My number one gripe about the '03-'05 was the dippy (to me) taillights. The new taillights are what convinced me to sell my '95 Legend.

I've had my '06 EXL Sedan w/ 5 speed manual for about 3 weeks and 1500 miles now, and loving it.

tandy_13 · October 2005

I am sorry to ask this, but what does chirping mean?
I have driven my 06 V6 just about 300 miles, mostly over garden state parkway. Seems sure footed, definitely better than my light corolla.
PT.

ctalk · October 2005

The ratings said it had tepid handling

Where did you read that?

C&D just did a comparison test (December issue) between the Accord/Camry/Fusion/Sonata. They Accord came out on top, they commented on its "Muscular handling" and "serious acceleration"

avianflu · October 2005

Under sedans, the list contained the following:

Lexus GS300/430
LS430
IS300

Infiniti M35/M45

Honda Accord Hybrid
Accord 4-cyl

Toyota Camry

And interestingly under Minivan:
(None rated "Best")

jmaxe · October 2005

Not only are the backup lights ugly but so are the taillights. The LEDs may be functional but they sure as hell are not stylish. The individual lights are too big and spread out. I've seen much much better.

maltbie · October 2005

Chirping is the sound the tires make as they spin rapidly and without much traction on the pavement. It's something teenagers like to do in their hot rods, not something you want to hear when you're 40 years old driving a family sedan.

nelle2 · October 2005

I recently purchased an '06 LX and it's my first time owning a new car with all the warrenty considerations to remember. I too had (and still am having) trouble finding concrete maintenance schedule information. Granted, I am not the most knowledgeable about this type of thing (yet), but even on the website, its says under "normal" that at 6,250 miles I should "clean the air cleaner element" and "rotate my tires" and then at 12,500 I am to do those again, as well as "inspect valve clearance" and "replace spark plugs." As I go on down the list, it's more of that but nothing about oil changes, etc. Am I supposed to go in and get just my air cleaner element cleaned (whatever that means) and tires rotated or else my warrenty is invalid? What about oil changes?

I too don't trust my car's maintenance minder, I want it in writing and I want it to be clear. Any advice?

djm2 · October 2005

I have chosen, to change my engine oil and filter every 3,000 miles at the dealer. I use the dealer, because I want all my service records in one place, should a problem arise. My vehicle was purchase used from an estate sale, and it has an extended warranty,(100,000 miles). Money is not an issue with me. I don't care what the owner's manual states. I want a clean engine! The dealer that I use has a Quick lube Service. I am in and out in less than 30 minutes, and the prices are competitive with fast lube places. I also have the Automatic Trans Fluid changed every year. I would NEVER bring my vehicles to any Fast Lube places for an oil change! I also own a Mustang! ----- Best regards. ---- Dwayne

haefr · October 2005

"I have chosen, to change my engine oil and filter every 3,000 miles at the dealer. ... I also have the Automatic Trans Fluid changed every year."

You and I are in a rapidly shrinking minority about routine fluid replacement intervals, Dwayne. For our efforts we will be cursed with long-lived cars still going strong long after many cars have been hydraulically compacted to metal cubes. The only area where we differ is that I do all my own routine maintenance so I have a choice of what brand and quality motor oil goes into my engine. My automatic transmission gets the OEM juice, though. Modern automatics are just too finicky to play ATF Russian roulette with.

joe122 · October 2005

I'm glad to read this. Certainly, this is subjective and personal, but I really dislike the appearance of the '06. You are right; a tight LED configuration would have been more effective. I happen to find the back of my '05 LX very attractive, but so many people seem to think otherwise. The change in the front bumper is ugly too, IMHO. I think the Camry is hideous and ungainly and much preferred the Accord. The sloppy feel to the ride was another reason. I think the new Accord looks like a Ford 500.

imidazol97 · October 2005

I do my own but I try for 3000-3500 miles based on type of driving and 2500 in severe winter with lots of shorter trips mixed in. Oil is cheap insurance. My only concern is that I had been using Fram filters and now switched to Purolator. I'm concerned the Frams had dropped in filtration quality and media size losing ability to filter after 1000-1500 miles and they clogged up the area available.

I change my own and then reward myself with a flavored cup of coffee from the local UDF quick mart on my test drives checking for leaks. If I didn't like doing work myself, a fair-priced dealer would have my business over the quickly lube places. I have heard too many errors come from those places.

hrao · October 2005

The resent JDPower survey IQS (Initial Quality)
and longterm JDS does reflect a slide in Honda Quality.
Below is the Initial Quality result for 2005:

joe122 · October 2005

Indeed. J D Power was just as corrupt and paid off last year, so there is no change.

djm2 · October 2005

You are correct about using original auto trans fluid. In today's vehicles, there is no such thing as a universal fluid. Everything today is manufacturer specific. I use the dealer, because I get a Honda filter, and the engine oil that is specified by the manufacturer. If the engine destroys itself, it was their oil, their filter, and their technician doing the job. With an extended warranty, I do not want to hear any excuses. If the dealer was not using the correct oil, let them fight it out with Honda. Let them "bite the financial bullet"! Life is too short! Pay the money for the required service, back you vehicle with an extended warranty, and drive off into the sunset! Enjoy life. It will be over VERY quickly!----- Best Regards. ----- Dwayne

biker4 · October 2005

The problem with that survey is that the typical Malibu owner was used to some POS GM of the late 90s and the new Malibu is such an improvement that they have no reference. If they all drove the Accord instead those results would have been different. The results would certainly be different if you put an Accord owner into a Malibu. :shades:

arjcom · October 2005

Oddly enough, I read it here on Edmunds, under the road test stuff. Personally, I've never found any accord to have only tepid handling, except maybe the '03 V6. But the '05 I currently own handles great!

atlantabenny · October 2005

Apparently you've looked at the dealer's, and not Honda of America's (manufacturer's), website; the latter doesn't provide detailed maintenance information.

Your new car's glove box probably contains two publications: the thick owner's manual provided by Honda of America and the dealer's "welcome" booklet with maintenance-minder coupons.

Follow the dealer's reminders and easily, you're spending twice more than what's necessary in properly maintaining the car. The dealer is commercially motivated to shorten the manufacturer's maintenance intervals. The manufacturer, on the other hand, has spent tremendous R & D money to make cars as maintenance-free as possible.

Manufacturer's maintenance recommendations, which are likely tempered by cautious legal counsels, are therefore safe and smart to follow in my opinion. When adhered to, and with enough documented evidence (receipts, etc.), voiding warranties won't be an issue - contrary to dealers' hints or outright statements.

My advice - follow the manufacturer's recommendations and give it a 20% "peace of mind" buffer. For example, at 7,500 miles for an oil change, make it 6,000 miles. For tire rotation and inspection items, I'd have them done with the oil change (which the factory schedule coincides anyway).

I've done most inspection items myself on all our cars with no problem but, if this won't work for you, consider negotiating a maintenance arrangement with a reputable neighborhood car shop. And comparing that with the dealer's typical quote of $250.00 for a periodic oil change & inspection charge.

imidazol97 · October 2005

Check out this JDP rating of accords...

haefr · October 2005

"My only concern is that I had been using Fram filters and now switched to Purolator. I'm concerned the Frams had dropped in filtration quality and media size losing ability to filter after 1000-1500 miles and they clogged up the area available."

You may be overly concerned. I'm aware of the "FRAM frap". Virtually all Hondas produced in the U.S. are equipped with oil filters sourced from a facility in Canada. For its Japan-produced vehicles, Honda sources a very well made oil filter from a Japanise supplier: "Filtech". The Canadian facility is operated by Honeywell's FRAM division. These "FRAM" Honda filters aren't exactly the same filter as those labled FRAM, but they do share the alleged "major inadequacies" of FRAM filters when cut open and compared. To wit:

-cardboard endcaps
-reduced filtration area when compared to other brands

There've also been allegations that FRAMs have a defective anti-drainback valve, though I've never seen any actual verification of that. As far as reduced filtration area is concerned, the issue is overblown in my opinion. Modern motor oils, even conventional, are so additized with oxidation stabilizers and detergent/dispersants that clogged oil filters, even FRAMs, are highly unlikely at any reasonable oil change mileage interval. Even with the FRAM-made Honda filters, Honda still suggests changing the oil filter only at every second oil change. (Oil filters are cheap enough that I think it's criminal not to just change the thing at every oil change.) As far as cardboard endcaps are concerned, the issue is that they're alleged to be too weak to avoid bursting and allowing the flow of unfiltered oil. Sounds like a reasonable concern, but, guess what? The filtration medium is paper, too - and it's both structurally weaker than the cardboard endcap assembly, yet rarely involved with bursting unless processed incorrectly during assembly. The paper filtration medium is attached to the endcaps with adhesive. The high temperature oil-resistant adhesive will bond with the filter paper and the cardboard endcaps equally well since it's taken up by both matierials' fiber content. Attaching paper to metal endcaps is potentially more problematic, though to their credit, the filter manufacturers using metal endcaps achieve a satisfactory bond anyway.

So, do I use FRAM filters? Nope. Because I'm afraid of 'em? Nope. My decision is based purely on the economics - at $3.00 a pop at WallyMart's discount, they're still overpriced for their level of materials quality. I can get a better made Purolator for about the same price or the Champion Labs-made WallyWorld "SuperTech" oil filter for a buck less. Your choice of Purolator is an excellent one. Be aware that Arvin-Meritor's Purolator filter division also supplies other OEMs, including Ford (certain "Motorcraft" oil filters) as well as DaimlerChrysler ("Mopar"). Additionally, Purolator supplies certain autoparts chains and service centers with rebranded Purolator "PremiumPLUS" entry level oil filters. Pep Boys' "ProLine", and Pennzoil, and Quaker State (both "oil companies" now owned by Royal Dutch Shell) oil filters fall under this heading. Champion Labs (which was known origianlly for "Lee" oil filters) also makes K&N oil filters, certain American Bosch oil filters, aftermarket AC oil filters, an' a whole buncha store brand filters in addition to WallyWorld's.

imidazol97 · October 2005

Thanks for the thorough reply. I agree with your logic.

I just was at PepBoys and the partslady said the Pepboys brand is made in the same factory but doesn't necessarily use the same quality material as the standard Purolators. I picked up the Purolator 4 for $10 with flyer coupon they mailed to me.

I recall the Champion labs made some good other branded filters from teh oil study.

pj23 · October 2005

I find the tail lights on my '05 to be very nice. I liked the previous style on my '03 even better, however. The '06 does not appeal to me at all. especially the relatively sparse number of LEDs for the surface area (the best LED tail lights for density, in my opinion, are those on the outgoing DeVille).

The overall design of the '03-'05 Accords I think is much more cohesive than the '06. The '08 Accords, based on the recent Honda Sports 4 concept, should be a real stunner. I can't wait.

dilt1 · October 2005

I had the opportunity to test drive a 2006 Accord EX-L recently and I did not have the chance to try the heated seats out. Was wondering if those of you with much more Accord seat time could tell me if both the seat cushion and seat back are heated. Thank you.

ken972 · October 2005

On the drivers seat both the seat cushion and seat back heat up. On the passanger side just the seat cushion. Apparently there are sensors in the passagener seat for the air bag that prevent having both being heated.

allfiredup · October 2005

It amazes me how many Honda owners I've known who follow the dealer's recommendation for maintenance instead of bothering to read the owner's manual.

I bought a '94 Civic new from a dealer here in Atlanta and they actually recommended oil changes every 3,000 miles. The salesman said he'd do it every 2,500 just to be safe. I laughed in his face. I wound up using Castrol Syntec and changing it every 10,000. The car never had a single problem in the 177k miles I had it. I sold it to a friend and he put almost another 100k on it before he sold it.

I bet if you compared the profit of Honda and Toyota service departments with those of something like Chevrolet or Ford, the Honda and Toyota probably make five times the profit of the others!

It just amazes me that people fall for it. One guy I know actually works at a body shop, so you'd think he'd know what should be done and when, but he takes his wife's Honda to the dealer at their recommended intervals.

Everyone really should read their owner's manual as soon as they buy a car. It's amazing what you will learn (and how much money you'll save).

atlantabenny · October 2005

Amen to that.

Given that we're a close-knit clan, I hear how my sisters-in-law with busy or mechanically non-inclined hubbies get ripped off by dealerships at car-buying time (they wouldn't know it then) and for regular maintenance (they've come to embrace dealers' $300 "major" check-ups like physicals).

It's a cycle dealerships don't really want to break, until an aggressive up-and-coming carmaker (Hyundai ? Cherry cars from China ?) goes a la BMW/Audi by by building regular maintenance cost into the selling price to offer it "free" for 3yrs/36k or 4yrs/48k.

haefr · October 2005

I'm not defending the dealerships' blatant push toward excessively frequent service intervals - often if not always accompanied by various manufacturer unspecified "make work" procedures to pad the final bill. But, given the dismal Consumers Report long term reliability ratings as reported by owners of high-end European makes (including Mercedes-Benz and its disastrous foray into its "FSS" oil life monitoring system - which was quietly scrapped last year), I find those companies' soothing assurances and recommendations for extended fluid and filter change intervals to be more than slightly specious, too. BMW? Pick up recent copies of Bimmer magazine and read what BMW enthusiasts think of legendary BMW reliabilty since ~1985 and later. Remember, too, a large percentage of those makes are leased during their four-year warranty "free" maintenance program. The factory finances absolutely minimum maintenance schedules (really financed up-front by the owners or lessees in the selling/leasing price) calculating the expensive trouble will likely occur after the cars enter the resale channel and it'll be on the new owner's nickel. M-B miscalculated badly - terribly sludged and/or seized engines requiring exchange in as little as a year of service.

mamamia2 · October 2005

...Since you mentioned "the dismal Consumers Report long term reliability ratings as reported by owners of high-end European makes", haefr...

As a long time Consumer Report subscriber, I have been really BAFFLED at how poorly those upscale European cars have been performing in this country.... And I can't believe the real reason is what you mention, recommendations for extended fluid and filter change intervals... Actually, if you check the latest, 2005 CR annual Buying Guide book, for instance, both the Mercedes and BMW cars (as well as VW and Audi, and even the Volvo) between 1996 and 2003 -- MOSTLY DO NOT HAVE ENGINE OR TRANSMISSION PROBLEMS.

But then they have PLENTY of bad markings in:
Electrical (the #1 issue with most of those cars), Power Equipment, Integrity, Hardware, and Cooling.

Why can the Japanese make more reliable cars than the best of Europe? Baffling.

joe122 · October 2005

...because the Japanese have done two things:
1. They have studied the methodology of automobile manufacture with determination and single mindedness and
2. They realize that substance, not snob appeal keeps customers coming back.

Back in the '70's, when the flywheel broke in my father's new Buick Century (that's right, it broke!) he decided to try a foreign manufacturer. He purchased an Audi and had nothing but problems with it. The Volvo that followed was not much better.

The 3,000 mile oil change nonsense is very persistent. I should mention that my family members, friends and I have always strictly followed the manufacturer's recommendations for maintenance. None of us have ever had a problem with a failed engine, slugging, transmission failure or the power train. Normal small part failure or normal part replacement has been the experience.

moparbad · October 2005

2. They realize that substance, not snob appeal keeps customers coming back.

There is more to the German cars than snob appeal that makes them appealing.

Different reasons drive different buyers, however, ignore for one moment exterior styling and snob appeal, German cars are more fun to drive and more comfortable interior than their competition IMO.

I'd buy an Accord over a Jetta or 3 series BMW simply due to the Accords better value and reliability, don't think I'm trying to send buyers to other makes, I just wish Honda could duplicate the fun driving experience of the German makes. They are very close with the Acura models.

Bottom line - you can not find a better all around vehicle than Accord.

fuma20 · October 2005

Hello,

Occasionally, I like to drive my car in a sporty fashion i.e. aggressive acceleration from either from a dead stop, or rolling start. Can I cause any damage to my Honda while doing this, even if it is occasionally?

Thanks

mrbill1957 · October 2005

Aggressive acceleration is nothing that is beneficial for a car, Honda or otherwise.

You push any car enough, and you will get something to fail, just how long it will take is anyones guess.

Here is an example of what can happen when you push even a Ferrari hard enough.

http://www.ferrariclub.com/downloads/456_boom.mpeg

Mrbill

Older Honda Accords

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