CR-V vs Escape

stevedebi

I just read an article on the new Ford Fusion. It has a Duratec 3.0 that is tuned to 220 HP. I wonder why they didn't (or don't) put that in the Escape?

stevedebi

"The Escape is more of an SUV than the CRV. Very apparent when you tow, pull, haul. "

Sorry, have to disagree there. The CR-V will haul just as much, and as well, as the Escape. And get 27 MPG @ 75 MPH doing it.

Personally, I have no need for towing or pulling (not really sure what the difference is, but oh well), so I am completely happy with my CR-V. If I wanted to tow, I would have considered a larger SUV or pickup, and probably not a small SUV.

Still have my question open on posting when that Escape hits 200K miles...

thegraduate

I noticed you aren't getting a response back about that 200k mile challenge.

My 96 Accord just clicked 151,000. Can I post a reply here when I hit 200? Someone should share my joy!

thegraduate

I would imagine that the Escape is torquier?? Anyone's thoughts?

Perhaps its (Fusion and Mazda 6) got Variable Valve Timing and/or lift?

PS, is it not 210 on the fusion?

stevedebi

"I would imagine that the Escape is torquier?? Anyone's thoughts? "

The Fusion Duratec 3.0 is rated at 205 lbs at 4800 RPMs. The current Escape has 193 @ 4850.

The Ford website lists the Fusion 3.0 at 221HP@ 6250 RPM. The 2.3L appears to be the same Spec as the Escape.

thegraduate

Does the Mazda/Fusion version of Duratec have Variable Valve Timing? If so, that would probably be the difference. No VVT in the Escape helps make them cheaper.

explorerx4

i don't think anyone is 'against' anyone else. maybe your 200k challenge could get a repsonse at a more escape central site. i don't want anyone to have bad luck with their vehicle or anything else. they should be enjoyed for what they are.
seeing that you don't own an escape or a crv and you are posting here, i don't think it will be a problem to let everyone know when you hit 200k. you might get a more enthusiastic repsonse on an accord forum, though.

regarding the torque and horsepower, the numbers posted are peak numbers.
many engines are tuned to sacrifice some peak power for a broader power curve.

dromedarius

Keeps asking why we didn't buy station wagons, to which I've replied over and over again, "Why didn't you buy a Liberty or a bigger SUV more suited to towing than an Escape???" Not so much as a peep out of him...



Also, speaking of public relations nightmares, my boy scape2 REFUSES to comment on the Ford recall for fires resulted in people's death. Maybe, when he's doing that he could talk about the legions of Ford Explorers which kept flipping over, at which pont Ford blamed it on the tires, nevermind that the roofs were collapsing. I suppose that was the fault of the tires, too...Instead, he keeps referring to these engine fires which have never actually been tied to the CR-V, but the mechanics.

:sick:

He does have a good point when he says that Ford would pretty much be nothing special without their F150, but I would love for him to explain how Ford went around claiming the Taurus was the #1 car in a America for years, when in truth a large percentage of those Tauruses were going to rental fleets at discount prices in order to get that title.

dromedarius

I think a very relevant point of discussion is the relative antiquety of the Escape with a new, bigger, improved RAV4 in a few months, followed in another year by the new and improved CR-V. Since each has been updated once already since the Escape debuted, what are the implications for Ford now that they've once again failed to update their product in a timely fashion???

explorerx4

just noticed that the 'crv problems and solutions' made the hit parade.
since mid july of '01 there have been about 3500 posts on the crv, 2200 on the escape. maybe 90% of the post are for 'solutions', but i kind of doubt it. :P

scape2

I'll take the 200K challange.... Typical Honda attitude, no way can a Ford product make it 200,000 miles. I already had a Ford Product that made if 100K no problems. my mother and Father in laws 1995 Taurus made it 160K, ran fine when they sold it..
This stigma of Fords not being able to have high mileage is a joke!. Geees.. My first vehicle was a 1969 Ford Truck with over 175,000 miles on it. Ran fine, little rough, I rebuitl the engine at 190,000. It had a 390V8..
Fact is folks, you are talking to someone who just doesn't believe in the Honda superiority thing anylonger. I will never pay the extra $$$ for a perceived reliabiltiy advantage.

dromedarius

And up until the other day there were 220+ reviews on the CR-V, and 16 on the Escape. I would anticipate it means their are more CR-V owners on this board than Escape owners.

:P

tidester

Can I post a reply here when I hit 200?

Please do! But continue to participate in the meantime!

tidester, host

stever

And up until the other day there were 220+ reviews on the CR-V

You have to watch that you are comparing same years; right now there are 16 Escape reviews and none for the CR-V.

But that's only for 2006 models.

Steve, Host

thegraduate

It's interesting to me how I never doubted the lasting quality of the Escape, but you are the one to come up with the idea that a Ford can't make 200,000. If I said they weren't capable, I apologize, but I don't think I ever brought that up. My neighbor's daughter is driving their old 1993 Taurus with 131k miles. I think that is great! I continue to be positive towards Ford, and you keep putting words in my mouth. I wish you wouldn't, because I have yet to slam a Ford!

thegraduate

Honda doesen't offer such a "station wagon" that scape2 speaks of. This is the reason my dad didn't buy one when he made his switch from an Accord to a CR-V in 2002. He wanted wagon versatility (meaning lots of cargo room), full size interior room (more legroom than most other cars of its size and economy), and good economy (nearly 30mpg). The CR-V fit all those molds. I didn't have to answer, but I did.

Tell me again why you didn't buy a vehicle more well suited to YOUR needs, like you say WE should have? Where is the big tow-er?

explorerx4

grad... i think you are stepping over the line. if you owned a crv and said all those good things about it, i would give it a lot more 'cred'. this is my own opinion. comments about mpg, etc. should be based on your actual experience. it's means more if you have your own money in the game.

thegraduate

Having ridden in one of these daily for 2 years, I'm sorry if I felt like I was experienced with the CR-V, so I thought I had cred, and this is MY own opinion. Pardon me if I tripped over your line.

thegraduate

:)Good research, blueiedgod, and I am personally impressed with those off-road shots, espcially those from the water! I would expect to see the Subaru Forrester in the picture to be floating away :sick: , but I suppose it made it too! Impressive...

lscrv

The road noise in this car is above speaking decibels. I am hoping to reduce this by replacing the OEM tires. Has anyone been successful in reducing the noise with a tire replacement. If so, which tires would you reccommend?

lscrv

Does anyone have anyexperience with a spare tire bike rack? I'm wondering if the spare tire bracket and door will support the added weight of the rack and 90# of bike?

bshel

lscrv, try Accessories forum, not CR-V v. Escape comparison.

dromedarius

He pulls a boat over a mountain to and from work everyday. Regardless, nice post, blueiedgod, we probably won't be hearing from our buddy for a little while as he takes time to regroup.

tidester

tone it down and drop the personal attacks.

tidester, host

stevedebi

"He pulls a boat over a mountain to and from work everyday."

Huh? Where does he work that he needs to pull his own boat?

stevedebi

"'ll take the 200K challange.... Typical Honda attitude, no way can a Ford product make it 200,000 miles. "

All right!! Now let's hope our two vehicles don't meet with some kind of mishap.

BTW, having owned Ford products before, I would not have taken the challenge. Not that they are bad or anything, but they do tend to wear out at around 140K. But good maintenance can make a world of difference. If the Escape were truck based I think it might be a different story. I tend to trust Ford trucks for longer term useage more than their car platforms...

tidester

The topic is the vehicles and not the people. Let's stick to it.

tidester, host

thegraduate

I wouldn't be surprised to see many Ford Vehicles at 200k miles on the road. Ford made a lot of cars, mind you, and certainly some were made better than others. In the parking lot that I see everyday, someone drives a Taurus that is from the original line (1980s). Impressive for any manufacturer.

I wouldn't know though, since I haven't driven one everyday, apparently that doesen't give me the credintials to talk about this. (see earlier posts from the Explorer man or woman, as he/she explains it and puts me in my place.)

anythngbutgm

I've had a few in the past and I can sum it up as this. Ford products are only as good as the service dept. I have a local dealer and they have been probably the best dealership I've ever worked with (my Acura dealer is a little better maybe) because while I was a stickler for maintainence, things failed that were unplanned for (O2 sensors, wheel bearings, PCV) and this was where the dealer shined the most. Any issues were taken care of quickly and reliably and I got nary a wimper from them about "Sorry we can't reproduce your problem" or "They all do that" B.S statments. Excellent, and sure, while issues were an inconvienience it was knowing that the service dpt. stood behind the product and their customers.

- On a side note, I like the F/L/M so much that I actually bought my wifes MDX there and would most likely buy another vehicle from them if I was in the market.

I can see where others may be ticked at an issue with their Ford product but I wonder how much of that frustration comes from an inept service dept.

I can't make the comparison with my Honda/Acura dealers since I only bring my vehicles in for service. All 8 of my Hondas that I've owned have never required anything more than routine maintainence...

explorerx4

i think it is quite a 'tribute' to that ancient 'mariner' the 'escape' that it can still compete with all the newer offerings.
everyone have a great weekend. i'm getting up at 4 and heading down to dover.
not taking the escape. where i park, i might need 4 lo to get out. depends how much rain they have had down there lately.

thegraduate

I think you had too much pun, I mean fun, with words there.

thegraduate

I haven't heard from scape2 in a while...I miss this once-lively forum. I have a 2 hour lunch break everyday and like to visit here...It's been lonely lately! Get back here and defend your vehicles!

scape2

Reason why I have not been here is both my daughter play classic soccer and I travel on the weekends. My work is into a big project and I have been working 10-14 hour days too!
Get it right. I tow two PWC's (personal watercraft) for you Honda owners who cannot own them, because you cannot pull them!

scape2

You could have bought a Subaru station wagon, 4WD Matrix, 4WD minivan and would have done the same thing as your CRV..
Ever asked yourself why the previous years of CRV didn't catch fire? Hmm...
design flaw pal.. Honda has done a great job in keeping this under wraps. Got to give them that..By the way, if you actually read the news... Toyota 4-Runner and the Mitsu Montero, Isuzu Rodeo, Honda Passport ALL had flipping issues...
Ford Explorer just got more press because it was a top seller.. and by the way.. still is :surprise:
Kind of funny youu mention the Taurus... A person on my daughters soccer team has a 1996 Taurus 3.0 Vulcan engine.. with over 210,000 miles!... Talk to him about Fords not making it over 100K..

scape2

I am your worst nightmare. An Engineer with a Ford. I keep my Escape Immaculate inside and out. Perform all my maintenance on time. My Escape has about 60,000 miles and runs like it was new... Looks like its new also. Statements like "Tend to wear out at 140K just ticks me off! It has been beaten into our heads that anyting Ford/GM will plain not last. Kind of funny when you look out on the road and see all those Escorts, Taurus, Explorers and even Contours!.. Hmm....

scape2

gone. Been here for over 5 years. I came onto Edmunds as Vince8. I owned a Ford Ranger 4x4 XLT. I was told then my Ford would not last, it was junk, blah, blah, blah by the same type of crowd. Those who constantly beat the Honda/Toyota drum of superiority.. I don't buy it anylonger. I will not pay the extra $$$ for a perceived reliability advantage... :shades:

dromedarius

I'm glad your Escape has lasted for 60,000 trouble-free miles, as it seems to have come as a great surprise to you, but I'm completely and utterly flabberghasted as to why anyone would buy a "cute-ute" to do any serious pulling, which incidently, you don't do. Otherwise you would have bought a pickup, since that is what they are made to do. Pull things, and I'm not talking about a couple jet skis, which a CR-V is completely capable of doing...

:confuse:

thegraduate

To buy a cute-ute for serious pulling makes sense (if the pulling is under a certain weight). You get better mileage and maneuverability with a smaller utility vehicle, but still get a good dose of utility. This is true of either small ute. (I think I just defended the Ford...Hmm, interesting! Nothing wrong with that!

suvshopper4

You've got 60k miles on your Escape, and you tow.
Have you replaced your brakes?
If so, front only? Front and rear? At what mileage, and what cost?

Thx.

stevedebi

"I am your worst nightmare. An Engineer with a Ford."

Congrats, I am an Engineer with a Honda...

All vehicles have some examples that go beyond the "normal" miles. But I see more Honda Civics still on the road than I do Escorts. Have you seen a 1980's vintage Escort lately? How about 1980's vintage Civic? Not that either couldn't make it to the high mileage, but my odds are on the Honda in similar circumstances.

BTW, I tend to agree that Honda should have put that oil filter in a different location. But I suppose they are legally covered because the actual cause of the fires has been improper maintenance during oil changes. No improper maintenance, no fire. I suspect there is no easy fix, or they would have put it in. It is not so simple to do a TSB to turn the engine around 180 degrees.

stever

The Used Car link on the main Edmunds.com page only has cars back to 1981. I searched for '81 Escorts and Civics within any distance from my Idaho zip. Found one of each - a Civic Wagon in Everett WA and an Escort just a few hours away in eastern Idaho.

The Escort was listed for a few hundred bucks more. Two grand would buy both with enough money left over to see the Lion King. :-)

It would be interesting to see a study of this vintage car on the road - like all those ads that say "98% of every Chevy truck ever registered is still on the road." Anyone have friends at your local DMV?

Steve, Host

dromedarius

I think Honda's racing roots are really starting to show through in their domestic vehicles. The CR-V and the Accord have the iVTEC, as does the S2000, and now all of the new Civics will have the iVTEC (except maybe the HCH). The mix of economy and power of Honda powerplants astounds me. That was one of the major reasons I went with the CR-V over the Escape.

If you put a person on a test drive and told them one of the vehicles they were about to drive had a V6, and they didn't know the specifics of each vehicle, my guess is they'd say the CR-V had the V6. It was smoother, felt at least as torquey, and combined with the 5 speed automatic, it's smooth as butter. It never gives off a hint of all that leading edge technology revving softly beneath the hood. Oh yeah, and it gets 25% better fuel economy in the real world!

:shades:

stevedebi

"The Escort was listed for a few hundred bucks more. Two grand would buy both with enough money left over to see the Lion King."

I suppose it would be interesting to see where the rest were. Are those 80's models in the junkyard, or in the owner's hands? No way to tell... let's call it a draw.

scape2

Don't think the CRV is capable of towing 2 watercraft/trailer as confident as the Escape can. Does the CRV have a transmission cooler or tow package available? To discount a 60HP and 60ft/lb of torque advantage is just plain ignorant. It is obvious to me you have never driven your CRV loaded down with 4 or 5 adults, gear and towing two watercraft. Nor have you every towed anything. All the gearing in the world won't help you. The V6 in the Escape is an advantage. It is quit amuzing how you keep trying to justify in your mind the 2.4 is more powerful or just as powerful as the V6 in the Escape... If the 4cyl in the Accord is so vastly superior, then why would Honda even bother developing and offering an Accord V6??? Hmmm.....

scape2

Did the front brakes at about 47K, rear are going to need to be done soon. Don't forget, the Engine and trans sit over the front wheels of the Escape and are heavy, causing more front brake wear.. This is not only a "Ford" thing as some people want you to believe. A co-worker has a V6 Camry and had thier front brakes done at about 28K... Get out on the net and you will see its across the board with all Brands. Also, brake material is now softer for better braking.
Hey, by the way, use the new ceramic brake pads for the front. Cut my brake dust down to about nothing...Shop around also.. My price for rotors, pads was about 180 if I remember right...

scape2

Your generalizations just crack me up! I have a nephew that for a first car has a 1991 Escort with 180K, does this count? How about my moms 1993 with 130K, does this count? I did a search in my Zip and came up with 4 80s Escorts.. I am proof Fords do last.. You play your odds, I'll play mine. I won't pay the extra $$ for a perceived reliability advantage. Did it once, won't do it again. Get out on the net, visit other chat rooms. There are plenty of peeved off Honda owners out here. The new word is "Refinement" in the auto-world. Reliability is way up across the board. It has become a virtual non-factor.
Word is spreading that you don't need a silver "H" do get a reliable vehicle.
You say your an Engineer. Ever ask yourself why the engine fires did not happen on the previous generation of CRV? or in other Honda models? Design flaw my friend, plain and simple. Honda has done a great job in keeping this under wraps.. got to give them kudos for that. I just hope noone gets hurt...Now, I have never said Honda does not build good vehicles, they do. What I am saying is Honda has lost this advantage. More people are seeing this, Now what for Honda?

scape2

Then I guess Honda can drop all V6 engines? and all thier V8 engine developments too??? Why does Honda put a V6 in the Accord if the 4cyl is so superior? or why a V6 in the Ridgeline? or the Odessey?
Please tell me your not saying Ford has no racing roots... Please.... Ever hear of Carol Shelby for one?? SVT? Saleen? I can go on and on.....

dromedarius

We already went over this (at least three times), but you seem to ignore things in favor of repeating the same fallacies over and over again. Get out on the net and do a weight comparison between a CR-V and a Pilot, Odyssey or Ridgeline. Maybe you can answer your own question. Put that engineering degree to work. And while your at it, why doesn't Ford offer the Duratec V6 in the Freestar, the Explorer or the F150 if it's so great??? Why bother a steal a four cylinder from Mazda, since no one wants one since they need a V6 to compete with a supposedly inferior four cylinder which is far superior on gas mileage, smoothness and acceleration...

And it appears maybe people aren't quite so willing to take your word yet, as Honda sales were up 12% for September, and Ford was down 20%. Finally, I don't know how much your engineering degree is worth, since to this day, 190-160 doesn't equal 60. I could have told you that about the time I was 6.

baggs32

Why bother a steal a four cylinder from Mazda, since no one wants one since they need a V6 to compete with a supposedly inferior four cylinder which is far superior on gas mileage, smoothness and acceleration...

Will you guys please get this right! Ford owns a controlling stake in Mazda and therefore calls all the shots for them. Ford ORDERED Mazda to develop the Duratec23 for all of it's brands. That's it, end of story. No stealing, no buying off, no secret truck convoys leaving in the middle of the night.

mikefm58

" 4 or 5 adults, gear and towing two watercraft "

Towing all that in a mini-SUV??? I don't care how much more power / torque the V6 Escape has over the CRV, it's still a mini-SUV and way over loaded with all that. Your credibility is sinking.

" why would Honda even bother developing and offering an Accord V6 "

Umm, maybe because the Accord's competition does and Honda feels they need to, to increase sales.