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Mainstream Large Sedans Comparison

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Comments

  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    Toyota/Lexus have always seemed to take a more aggressive approach to protecting us from ourselves as well as paying the most heed to their own liability lawyers. It is a shame that it has to come to all of this and even worse that our silly government gets involved. Put me on snow covered roads and I'd rather be driving your 03 with no interference than either your current Av or certainly that Solara.
  • vic10vic10 Posts: 188
    Yes, the Taurus. Having just rented a 500 for a business trip, I can say it succeeds in a lot of categories but one of them is not speed. Not sure a bigger engine will help that much if they don't fix the transmission. On that car when you kicked it down, you could go out for coffee before it decided to downshift...and then all you heard was noise, not much acceleration. And on a 600 mile trip I only averaged 28.5 mpg. Did the same trip last Oct in my 300C and averaged 26 mpg.
  • Luckily there's a new 6 speed transmission to go along with that great new 3.5 engine. I test drove the new Taurus, drives like a dream.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    was aware that Ford had discontinued the CVT on the new Taurus but never read anything that said they were changing the 6 speed tranny. I did read somewhere that Ford and GM had pooled resources (or the lack of them) into a 'joint'effort at a 6 speed. Maybe what you experienced on your test drive was the same 6 speed used with the GM 3.6 for some time now? Does anybody know? Would be interested on your comments on how refined (smoothness, quietness, eagerness to rev) you found the 3.5?
  • I'm on the run right now, but for a brief description on one of my many test drives so far, go here - LINK
  • tjc78tjc78 JerseyPosts: 5,025
    From what I have read the 6 speed is the one you are referring to, its being used in the Edge, MKX, and Taurus/Sable on the GM side it is being used in the Acadia triplets and the 3.6 Aura.

    1999 Chevy S10 / 2004 Merc Grand Marquis / 2012 Buick LaCrosse

  • barnstormer64barnstormer64 Posts: 1,106
    Having just rented a 500 for a business trip, I can say it succeeds in a lot of categories but one of them is not speed. Not sure a bigger engine will help that much if they don't fix the transmission. On that car when you kicked it down, you could go out for coffee before it decided to downshift

    Shoulda rented one with the AWD (which means it would've had the CVT) . . then you wouldn't have experienced that problem. :P
  • alexstorealexstore Posts: 264
    well there is always a time and place to improve and currently there are 2 cars in 08 I am looking forward to.
    I know that Hyundai lovers will be talking about Genesis, but this not the car I am looking forward to currently.
    2008 CTS AWD with new 3.6
    2008 G8 with v8 - which falls into large category with length of 196". The competition between Hemi and GM 6.0 V8 is heating up. In Holden it does 0-60 in 5.7. US version with all extra weight will be probably 5.8-5.9. Can you handle Hopefully price will be 25-35K.

    BTW in reference to 3.7 in Maxima, look at history of nissan and infinity and you can see that once new engine is introduced for Infinity usually next year Nissan vehicles get same engine. 370Z is obviously first, followed by Maxima and Altima. One thing I cannot find info about anywhere is whether it will be in a current form or will be in the next generation Maxima. Looking into Maxima's history -3 yr and redesign, then 2 yrs. So we can say that 09 maxima will come in at the end of 08.
  • allmet33allmet33 Posts: 3,557
    And yet the Santa Fe finishes 2nd to the Nissan Murano! I've been in a Santa Fe and they are right, the woodgrain leaves a lot to be desired. They hit the nail on the head by saying it looks like the graining was drawn on with a Sharpie pen. But pointing out that small negative point belies the overall view of the vehicle and obviously doesn't stop it from being an all around good mid-size SUV.

    Funny how folks read an entire article and will pull one negative thing out and automatically...it's a bad vehicle! LOL

    Oh yeah, Alexstore...I've been paying attention to the Maximas I've been seeing here in the DC Metro area since our discussions started. One thing I've noticed...a vast majority of them are being driven by women now. Seems the guys are abandoning them and jumping into the new Altimas with a bit more power. Why not, almost the same room, more engine and fully loaded comes in around what a Maxima would run anyway. Yeah...I'd go for the Altima too.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    does have a different exterior look doesn't it? By your pics it sure seems like Ford is still in 'show car' mode in terms of getting these things out for sale although I'm sure they'll happily take your deposit - afraid the car may be too little too late and still wonder why the 'Taurus' name. I assume that the 8.34 0-60 and that 85 mph quarter must be from the old 500 - sorry numbers that go along with a seriously overburdened engine - the new 3.5 would logically figure sub 7s and over 90. Any idea on the FE numbers or pricing?
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    the woodgrain on a new Sonata I drove recently was also a real downer, not even representive of any 'wood' I knew of, almost like it came from Jupiter! The Azera OTH much better (as would befit the corporate 'flagship', perhaps.)
    Think that Hyundai, in general, does need to spiff up their interiors.
  • joe97joe97 Posts: 2,248
    That was the article you were trying to make your claim? Not a good one to pick out and prove your point. The Santa Fe isn't perfect but certainly all others aren't either, I can point out a lot of faults of every other car. But credit should be given when it's due, and the Santa Fe has great fit-and-finish, and quality texture. Go examine one yourself if you don't believe me.

    Let's leave it at that move back to the sedans, shall we?
  • alexstorealexstore Posts: 264
    well @ work we have ratio of 7/2 for male/female maxima owners. ( I was 2nd one to get it). Now I do agree with you that with 07 maxima redesign is plain patching job. If I was on a market now, I will buy Altima though my maxima with less HP still beats it to 60 because of Auto vs CVT.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    yeah, that would be something that Maximas has always needed, more power! ;) Already likely the 2nd most powerful car in this group (among the V6s) and already amongst the leaders in FE. A great engine the VQ and I would not bet my farm that even my Avalon could 'out drag' it, and I know that it won't outhandle it and sure as hell, doesn't drive like it! Folks that buy Maximas do so for the car's responsiveness and generally sportier look and feel, Azera and Avalon buyers have different priorities - as they say - different strokes.....
  • jaymagicjaymagic Posts: 309
    If I was looking for a sport sedan in this class, I think I would look at the VW Passat. LOTS more money, but well built and very good handling.
  • tjc78tjc78 JerseyPosts: 5,025
    Even the "SL" trim level of the Max is firmer than the Touring Avalon. I guess Nissan's image for performance would not allow for a "plush" riding sedan. As for Max VS Avalon in a race, I would say it would come down to the driver, they are that close.

    1999 Chevy S10 / 2004 Merc Grand Marquis / 2012 Buick LaCrosse

  • alexstorealexstore Posts: 264
    yes you will beat me 0-60 in Avalon and in 1/4 mile.
    I agree with you as to the reason , people buy Maxima over Avalon or Azera.
  • allmet33allmet33 Posts: 3,557
    The Passat would definitely get a nod, but that price tag...WHEW!!! That's the only thing that keeps it out of this forum.
  • allmet33allmet33 Posts: 3,557
    I can see the new Maxima getting the 3.7 L power plant and instead of getting 330 like in the Infiniti G37, it'll get the same 320 that the new 370Z would get.

    They might also want to consider stretching it a lil bit to give he Maxima more room inside. I mean, right now...it is almost identicle to the Altima. It needs more than horse power to give it it's own identity.
  • tjc78tjc78 JerseyPosts: 5,025
    "It needs more than horse power to give it it's own identity"

    The vehicle already suffers from torque steer... with 40-50 more HP it can only get worse.

    1999 Chevy S10 / 2004 Merc Grand Marquis / 2012 Buick LaCrosse

  • allmet33allmet33 Posts: 3,557
    Hmmmmmmmmmmm....make it a RWD sedan and it'll fit right in with the 300 C / Charger R/T.
  • joe131joe131 Posts: 972
    "...price tag...WHEW!!! That's the only thing that keeps it out of this forum."

    How about the fact that the Passat, at 96.2 cubic feet EPA stated passenger volume, is NOT a large car? The Passat is smaller than the Elantra in that important regard. Seems like that is THE reason it is not included here.
  • batistabatista Posts: 159
    I considered the Passat before I bought the Charger and found it very uncomfortable. Seats are too narrow.
    It rated dead last in terms of reliability (Consumer Reports) with the 2.0 turbo.
  • allmet33allmet33 Posts: 3,557
    Well...yeah, that too. :blush:
  • alexstorealexstore Posts: 264
    What I am afraid of that your changes will make maxima heavy. IN addition with AWD or RWD it will weight 3800+ lb. One of the things I love in maxima that its not heavy and also by making it rwd it will compete with G35. My guess FWD and optional AWD will be in maxima's future. Same will be for Avalon and Azera.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    in these days of $3+ gas, I doubt very seriously that you'll see any of these cars RWD (or even HONEST AWD) despite the 260+ HP, simply because of the weights (probably closer to 2 tons (like the 300)) , the fact that the platforms these cars ride on is shared with other higher production FWD vehicles and the fact that any RWD Maxima, for example, would poach sales from the Gs and Ms or a RWD Avalon from the GS and even the LS. Infiniti and Lexus make more money for their respective mfgrs (on a per unit basis) than Nissan and Toyota do - why would they want to screw that up? This type of thing is why I anticipate Hyundai going upmarket with the Genesis, while we can argue until we turn blue about market acceptance, it is still the most logical approach for Hyundai to take - a 300C/ Charger RT can get up there price wise.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    conversely the 3.6 V6 has been doing pretty well reliability wise - a solid entry into the 'who's got the best V6 sweepstakes' and maybe an indictment of sorts on the costs of the added complexities of turbo/super charging?
  • oskidunker1oskidunker1 Posts: 213
    Tell me about the fron leg room. I am considering buying an Azera. Have a problem now with a a 2004 audi A6. Have right leg pain when I drive more than 40 minutes. Foot has to twist right to reach the gas and knee sometimes hits console. Would the Azera be better? I have not driven it but drove a Sonata.
  • floridabob1floridabob1 Posts: 1,190
    re; 2611
    I'm 6'3" with long legs and find the leg room in my Azera sufficient.
    I have also driven a 2006 A6 and found that leg room adequate as well.
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