Is Cadillac's Image Dying and Does Anyone Care?

sls002

Calling the SRX a tall wagon is a good description. Much better looking than the SUV's on truck platforms. My point was that the D-pillar (rear end) is squared off in much the same way as the Suburban. The Lexus RX is more rounded off:
http://www.autopress.be/Temporaires/SALON/PARIS_2004/Lexus%20RX400h.jpg

As far as the SRX's interior goes, I say that it is an SRX interior. The 2007's model looks a lot like the BLS. The older SRX interior was similar to the CTS, at least materials are similar looking.

sls002

The car guys on Car Talk say otherwise. I am inclined to think that they may know what they are talking about.

rockylee

The average annual household income of all
2003 Range Rover buyers is $463,000, with more than a third of the owners
citing an annual household income of more than $500,000.

Yes that is quite high but I seriously doubt it's higher than Ferrari's, Lamborghini's, Maybach's, Bentley, Rolls, Bugatti's, etc, annual household income. My point Range Rover owner's don't have the highest incomes like you claim

Rocky

tlong

I would say thats not the best thing, the 3 series is to small, so small that I cannot drive the thing.

That may be true for you, but some of us weigh well under 200lbs and our choices for quality smaller cars are limited to imports. Perhaps the domestic makers are missing out on an important market while they overproduce hulking SUVs?

british_rover

I weight a good bit more then 200 lbs, have shoulders like a linebacker, legs like tree trunks and I fit just fine in the 3 series.

You have to have a really odd body type to not fit in a 3 series.

autoboy16

Think of that creep on the highway thats owns a suburban and is single with no kids... Or Shaqs qx56...Shaq is tall and has a big family so the qx56 is practical for him. he looks at those hulking SUVs. That single could use a 335i or tsx ect.

-Cj

autoboy16

bet u can't say the same of the rear of the 3... Thats one thing i give to the cts although i cant say the same for rear headroom...
-Cj

mediapusher

Yes, like it or not, that's what you'll see flooding the streets this fall. I don't think it's ugly, but I don't like the design better than the current one they have
--mediapusher
__________________________

Is that first one supposed to be the '08 CTS? Oh yuck.
--bumpy

snakeweasel

something is better.

You hit it, their marketing is better.

snakeweasel

And if you want to make it fair and just restrict it to modern cars well then Aston Martin makes the sexiest modern vehicles.

I don't know, this could give the Aston Martin a run for its money in that aspect.

snakeweasel

That is true but 200 more isn't a significant amout is it ?

a 50% increase, thats significant.

You may not now but perhaps in a few years you might.

Most likely not, when I got my V I was looking at just a regular 3.6L V6 CTS. The V was a once in a lifetime, never was before and never will be again in the history of this or any other universe deal.

readerreader

Is the ONLY official picture of the 2008 CTS we will see until tomorrow morning (dv) at 9:40.
What kind of misinformation are you spreading with that false picture of yours?

You should desist from posting it again, because it will look absolutely foolish in the morning.

mediapusher

I don't understand why Cadillac feels the need to keep the 2008 CTS design so secret. It's like whoop de "huckin" doo.


Now apply that enthusiasm to the rest of your name plates and car models boys.

And some would say they screwed up a perfectly good exterior design. It just needed a little tweak here and there, it didn't need an entire "scrap and redo".

Frequent drastic design changes are something General Motors is famous for.

rockylee

I honestly don't think they did anything drastic but smoothed out the lines a bit. What I've seen so far from the interior I'm very impressed.

Rocky

rockylee

Do you know of any place where we can watch it live ?

Rocky

rockylee

I suppose we can watch here ?

http://gmtv.feedroom.com/ifr_main.jsp?nsid=b-7c8d0189:10ffee1e72e:-1a68&st=11682- - 14436156&mp=WMP&cpf=true&fvn=9&fr=010507_033447_w7c8d0189x10ff3f75cebxw79d3&rdm=- - 859761.3204798619

Rocky :shades:

autoboy16

If given the choice,would you opt 4 a bls or cts? Personally the bls has my vote for my next car.

nvbanker

The average annual household income of all
2003 Range Rover buyers is $463,000, with more than a third of the owners
citing an annual household income of more than $500,000.

Those other cars Rocky listed are not mainstream - Rover is. And, that explains why I don't have one yet. Little short still. Working on it.

mediapusher

Autoboy16-

The British Cadillac BLS gets my vote. There's no contest there. But no we can't have such stuff here in the U.S.A.

If you'll notice the BLS looks like a slightly modified design of the former USA CTS design. The interior is drastically different because it's all SAAB

I don't understand why Cadillac had to do such a drastic design change for the new 2008 CTS

mediapusher

NvBanker you don't want a Range Rover anyway. Take a look at what J.D. Power and Associates and Consumer Reports says about those vehicles before you plunk your hard earned money down on the counter for one.

They have one of the worst if not THE WORST record for brand frequency-of-repair

louiswei

For me, the BLS has to be at least AWD (prefer RWD), interior being improved to the next gen CTS's level and have at least 250 HP in order for me to consider it.

Wouldn't consider the CTS because it is just simply too big.

readerreader

I guess you wouldn't be so obscene if it were a Honda?

The Honda Accord will be unveiled immediately before this tomorrow (dv), and we have not even heard a peep from them.
Why don't you shout at them instead?

GM can take care of itself.
Cadillac alone is twice as old as Honda--they've been around and certainly don't need your style advice.
They're famous for it alright!
They practically invented it, remember?

louiswei

Would take Acura RDX over LR2, BMW X5 over LR3 and Porsche Cayenne over Range Rover in any given day.

british_rover

I don't appreciate being called foolish or being accused of spreading disinformation when all I did was link to the story that Rockylee posted about.

But I guess it was ok for him to post that link and call it sexy because he is a member of the faithful. :confuse:

fintail

That red V16 roadster has a body designed and produced in Switzerland, FWIW...

autoboy16

I wish i could see the new design but i am using my psp and it doesn't have the power 2 process the picture.

I do agree about the bls. Maybe we`ll get the bls this fall. With both being new neither should have bad sales. The 9-3 is another story...

-Cj

mediapusher

If they can take care of themselves then perhaps they should stop whining about poor sales and getting some competition, and stop whining and worrying about who is number 1, since Toyota is poised to beat them in that Arena soon. Just because GM is the biggest doesn't mean they are the most profitable, which they aren't

And had you been paying attention you would have seen on my earlier posts I thought the picture of that Scion XB someone posted on here was quite ugly

And no I don't remember GM inventing style (if that's what you wanna call it) I'm not as old as dirt like you apparently are.

----mediapusher
___________________________________

I guess you wouldn't be so obscene if it were a Honda?

The Honda Accord will be unveiled immediately before this tomorrow (dv), and we have not even heard a peep from them.
Why don't you shout at them instead?

GM can take care of itself.
Cadillac alone is twice as old as Honda--they've been around and certainly don't need your style advice.
They're famous for it alright!
They practically invented it, remember?
-----readerreader

readerreader

I don't appreciate being called foolish or being accused of spreading disinformation when all I did was link to the story that Rockylee posted about.

But I guess it was ok for him to post that link and call it sexy because he is a member of the faithful.

You're much too sensitive here.
Nobody called you foolish.
That would be counterproductive--and untrue.

I said that the picture you posted will look foolish in the morning in light of the real ones.
It is a terrible photoshop that has been floating around the internet for quite some time.

As a separate matter, you were quite wrong to use it in your "beautiful cars" comparison precisely because it is not real.

The Vanquish, however, is real and is beautiful.

P.S. I don't know what "faithful" you are talking about or what any "rockylee" did. That's between you and him. I can't help you out there at all.

readerreader

If they can take care of themselves then perhaps they should stop whining about poor sales and getting some competition, and stop whining and worrying about who is number 1, since Toyota is poised to beat them in that Arena soon. Just because GM is the biggest doesn't mean they are the most profitable, which they aren't

And had you been paying attention you would have seen on my earlier posts I thought the picture of that Scion XB someone posted on here was quite ugly

And no I don't remember GM inventing style (if that's what you wanna call it) I'm not as old as dirt like you apparently are.

----mediapusher

1. I have no clue what Toyota has to do with this. You seem to have other problems with GM, the likes of which I cannot help you with.

I myself have no beef with any car company, so I cannot readily identify with how you feel. Sorry.

2. Surely you are more mature than that. I am not insecure about my age; but neither do I find it relevant to any discussion of style.

You exploded in anger and I called you to task--asking you to produce some knowledge of, or contribution to, automotive style above and beyond a sweeping brush thrown the way of the gentlemen involved and a 100+ year-old company.

All companies make mistakes in history. This may or may not be one. We will only know a year from now--if ever.

rockylee

NV,

I never looked at Range Rover being more Mainstream than lets say a Mercedes S-Class :confuse:

Rocky

british_rover

But we still manage to sell everyone we can get with little in either incentives of dealer discounts.

And most Range Rover owners are very satisfied with their vehicle. Many of my clients are on their third or fourth rover and some are on their seventh or eighth. I have had several clients tell me that even with the ocasional problems they do have with the Range Rovers they don't mind and would still buy another. When they do have problems they are taking care of quickly and normaly fixed the first time. People appreciate that.

The Range Rover also has one of the highest APPEAL raitings by JD Power of any vehicle. Kind of makes you wonder why people are so happy with the car if it brakes all the time.

And to who said they would take a Cayenne over a Range Rover the Cayenne is rated below the Range Rover...

Range Rover

Cayenne

autoboy16

The whole bls bs is a great example of said mistake.

-Cj

rockylee

I'd also take a Range Rover over a Cayenne.

I'd also for your information take a LR-2 over a RDX

I'd also take a LR-3 or a Range Rover Sport over a BMW X5

Rocky

nvbanker

I say bring it here unless it would be an issue with having their entry level car be their best looking.

Funny, that's just what I was thinking..... :P

laurasdada

"The average annual household income of all
2003 Range Rover buyers is $463,000, with more than a third of the owners
citing an annual household income of more than $500,000."

I just bought a Range Rover this afternoon. You may now adjust the above numbers WAY, WAY DOWN!!! Got pretty good trade on the old Le Car, though...

autoboy16

i read that... IT WAS HILARIOUS!!

Take good notes and pics for me tomorrow! I have school from 730-230 and probably wont be back until 730pm. I'l l miss everything ...

btw, 128posts in here today! Thats a personal record

-Cj

rockylee

Yeah,

Most everybody's football team is out of the play-offs so what else is there to do but enjoy edmunds.com on a sunday night.

Rocky

mediapusher

Why do yo guys think the BLS won't be brought here to the states? It seems fishy to me. It's a car that seems as if it would sell well here, especially since it's design will no longer be similar to the popular CTS

It can't be about cost, I thought G.M. had more money and credit than "GOD".

fintail

GM seems to like to ignore the NA market. Europe and Austrailian GM cars have been superior to NA GN cars for years. Even the Chinese Buicks are nicer than what we get.

rockylee

A MUST READ

http://www.thecarconnection.com/Vehicle_Reviews/Luxury_Cars/2008_Cadillac_CTS_Pr- - - - - - eview.S183.A11488.html

Rocky

P.S. 2008' CTS is going really upmarket with a
Bang & Olufson surround sound I hope it's the same 1000 watt version they use in Audi. OMG that is Audi S8 quality :shades:

merc1

Thats nice, too bad it didn't make a difference in the overall scheme of things. Those are the type of meaningless figures and boasts that GM used to love to make, and once buyers found out that it made no difference in the real world, poof there went the loyalty.

M

merc1

Scathing post, but GM does have at least one other standout, the Corvette.

That said, you're basically saying what I've been saying for years. GM doesn't sweat the details. They'll get the powertrain right or the styling right, but muck up the interior or leave off important features. All of there recent hits or near hits like the Aura, Solstice, Sky, Escalade, STS have the same problems that GM cars have had for years. Either cheap materials and poor finish and missing and/or outdated technology. There is no way anyone sighted could have approved the soft-top fit on the Kappa roadsters. When their tops are up they're the most raggedy looking softops I've ever seen. They have wrinkles, don't seal properly in back and just plain don't fit. Now I'm reading that GM is making changes to correct this. Why couldn't they have done that to start with. This we'll make running changes sucks when you just bought one with all the flaws! The new Slade has a 80's style tilt wheel when everything else has a power wheel in the class. Yikes. It is the little things that GM sucks and it is still business as usual it seems. Now we have the 08' CTS, we'll see if anything has truly changed.

M

merc1

See its statements like this that make it impossible for me to take you seriously.

Bingo! I've been wondering why anyone does.

M

merc1

I'd rather take my chance swimming in a tank for of sharks and barracudas wearing a meat suit rather than step foot in another Toyota dealership. Those guys automatically assume you're going to buy a car from them and that they are doing you a favor.

A lot of Bingos(!) in the 300 some odd posts I'm trying to catch up with. Yes Lemko they and Lexus dealerships are like this and it is totally disgusting. Toyota had better not ever lose their rep for reliability because when you're treated like that and that cars look like blenders reliability is the only reason people put up with that kind of BS*. Success has made them oh so incredibly smug.

*These things can happen at a dealer for any brand, but in my experience it happens more often at Toyota and Lexus stores.

M

merc1

I agree. Mercedes name is so far under the ground when it comes to Consumer Reports to the point where I don't see why anyone the subscribes to them would even buy one. If they don't buy how can Mercedes be accurately surveyed? I too like JDP methods a little better, but of course you know I don't care much for surveys anyway.

I'm waiting to see what CR (and JDP) says about the 2007 S-Class. The new S has been by all accounts except theirs and JDP has been the most reliable Mercedes in years. The owner boards on MBWorld (about 35K members in total, not all S of course) report nothing. Zilch in the way of "problems". Now if they're going not recommend the S due to brake dust then I'm done with even trying to understand or caring about Mercedes and Consumer Reports.

M

merc1

Not the whole story. Consumer Reports also buys cars of every make and model, and then does it's own test.

Do they keep the car for the long term or do they buy for roadtest purposes to ensure it is a random same and that the manufacturer hasn't "gone over" the car?

M

merc1

Trust me here Rocky, I live in Atlanta for 10 years and people here whom are influenced by athletes, hip-hop and comedians usually don't drive. They use this form of transportation calls "MARTA". This thing has 6 cars tied together and rides on rail.

Hilarious!

M

merc1

It is called denial. I've seen posts here claiming that 80's GM cars were on par with and/or better than the competition. Anyone who believes that simply doesn't know what they're talking about regarding GM cars regardless of what their experience was because it was no where near the norm. They seem to think that just because they still see them "running" that is a sole measure of quality and longevity, nevermind that the body, interior, suspension and nearly everything is shot to hell.

M

merc1

Please note that the Japanese cars usually get a new water pump when the timing belt is changed at 60,000 or 70,000; whenever the belt life is expected to go.

This is true, I did that every single time I changed the timing belt. What a gouge that was!

M

merc1

I'm impressed, that is one hell of a demographic. The young and wealthy love Rand Rovers. Kinda goes with who I see driving them most of the time. Every other luxury maker would kill for those stats.

M