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The rest of the industry has V6's with 250+ hp and fuel economy ratings in the 30 mpg range
I didn't say 30 mpg min.
But just to mention two in that range..
Camry V6, 268 hp and 28 mpg
Avalon, 268 hp and 28 mpg
So going 70 instead of 75 could mean ~34 mpg instead of 30-31.
it just makes it seem like you are trying to confuse things.
As for manual transmissions... we'll have to see if the 6-speed in the new Sonata is as good as the 5-speed in the Accord. The last Hyundai I had with a stick was a 2001 Elantra, and its shift feel was "OK" but didn't have the Honda crispness. I'll bet though that MT Sonatas will be a very small percentage of the 2011 units, especially with the 6AT with paddle shifters available.
I think the V6 Sonata also is at either 28 or even 29 hwy mpg and is around 250 hp or in that range anyway.
I've heard that Fords are also quite reliable these days.
Unfortunately I'm one of those who holds a grudge for owning a 2000 Ford Focus ZTS that suffered through a dozen increasingly alarming recalls before I gave up on it. It may not be rational, but my grudge is still there for now, and I'm not sure it'll go away.
I genuinely admire the Fusion's looks, however, and it's nice to see Ford doing so well with such a sharp product.
year of that style. It's has what I call a baby V6 2.5L 165HP, it has
2 little tail pipes but only 1 muffler. But it also has the MAZDA "zoom"
as they call it, no turbo just DOHC 24 valve. I don't race any more
but if did I would put this (baby) engine up against any new version
I4 (non turbo) even with up to 25HP more. BUT!! it doesn't have a prayer up against the nowadays V-6's of any make. I know I know
this is not a race forum, just making a point about how the new
technology is pulling so much HP/MPG ratios out of these small but
very powerful cars engines.
The little V6 may not win the race but you will know you were in one.
How's the Sonata? It's a heck of a lot of car for the money. I think the Hyundai engineers are getting closer to the leaders with every generation of Sonata, and with the 2011 they may have not only caught up but reached the top in a few areas. Nice that it's made in Alabama too...
I wonder how the 2011 Sonata will look to us in 2016, or 2021? Some cars have classic styling--Audi and BMW for example. They still look good 10 or more years later. The new Sonata is very daring for a family car. Will it stand the test of time?
When the '06 Sonata came out, the pundits complained that it seemed dated and derivative, and compared it to the already long-gone '98-02 Accord in its conservatism. Yet four years later, the same basic design still looks nice, restrained, not particularly dated--dare I say "classy"? One could say the same about the Optima too.
Meanwhile the "daring" '06-09 Fusion (an excellent car in most respects) seems like last year's trendy look.
Incidentally, at the risk of going OT, does anyone else out there think the Cruze is a dead ringer for the Sonata/Optima?
I do not look at the brand name, and I am not loyal to any particular brand, I get the car that I like, and I feel is will be good value and looks good. I maintain it properly, and so far have not been let down.
I do tend to pick cars that eventually get a cult following. Check out on youtube the Daewoo leganza.
Some people even did music videos for their souped up Leganza's
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_1e-kcYJkc
It is also in Guigiaros page
http://www.italdesign.it/dinamic/gallery/gallery_scheda.php?id=316&num_rows=1&fa- mily=p&data_p_title=Giorgetto+Giugiaro
I hope my new mazda6 ends up as reliable, because it surely looks good and is also attracting the same type of activity on youtube.
----------------------------------
I see some similar lines but the Cruze is much smaller and aimed at the Elantra.
Chevy did a nice job with the Cruze and although it's technically a C segment vehicle and doesn't qualify for this thread, it's EPA Interior Volume is very close to the Malibu (110 cu.ft vs 113 cu.ft) and it has a larger truck than the Malibu to boot!
The really nice car coming from Korea will be the 2011 KIA K7. It was designed by an Audi designer and you can easily tell from this video, especially the rear lights and front headlight treatements. A very classy car.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2AiitnVj5I
The new 2011 Sonata is more daring and busy in its design, but I think it's still pretty good looking and is likely to be relatively enduring. It seems slightly more integrated and good looking than my 2008 Accord, but that's probably not saying much.
Now that is a classy new offering from Kia.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
BlueAnt SupertoothII-Battery, clip on visor, works good, charge lasts very long time. About $60-80 online.
Parrot-Wired into sound system. Works good, different models cost between $150-$250 online. However, unless you're very handy, it can cost $100-200 for installation especially on amplified systems.
Too bad you did not wait a year, the Focii have been pretty reliable from 2001 on (of course we may have made the same mistake, my wife has car from the first model year of a redesign, 2005 Jetta). So far only warranty and recall repairs.
the '10 fusion is a nice update, though.
the sonata is kind of anonymous, not good not bad.
just about every has their good and not so good angles to be viewed from.
my ruler for the looks of my vehicles is, if i go into the garage, do i still like how it looks? the fusion still makes the grade.
when my wife had a 96 taurus, it did not make the grade after a while.
Why am I not surprised?
Interesting that the folks over in Honda land are already trashing these Hyundai engines. I suppose since they aren't Honda engines, they will be crap. :P
And I don't think they are trashing Hyundai, they are just showing that there are trade-offs with DI engines. When you first look at it on paper DI sounds like a win-win--more power and more mpg. But if you think about possible maintenance issues 6-10 years down the line, and nvh issues now, it clearly is a trade off.
Some of the vtec people say that Honda may go to DI as well in a couple of years...But then again they might not.
I am impressed with the Sonata. I drive an Accord now and like it very much, but it is not perfect. The seats are not very comfortable and to get lumbar support I need leather and to get leather I need a sunroof which means no headroom. If Hyundai actually has availability of the stick (unlike Toyota and their vaporware) I would take a hard look at one in a few years when I am ready to get a new vehicle. I am very impressed with the mpg.
Now if Honda brought over their 4-cyl diesel that would be the end of the story, but they are reluctant. Seems like they want to concentrate on big heavy inefficient vehicles right now like their guzzling crossover. Nice to see Hyundai thinking outside of the box.
I think Hyundai is going to have a winner in this new Sonata. They have been bashed for copying designs(and boring designs), using old technology, transmissions a notch behind the leaders, not having cutting edge tech inside, interior quality finishes, suspension issues, etc. Don't know about the suspension but they seem to have addressed all the other issues just mentioned in this new version.
As far as design goes the Lexus ES350 is hardly called a wild design or too far out. If anything it is usually referred to as less than daring but that is probably the car that the new Sonata reminds me of from a lot of different angles. The only thing that I see that is a little overboard is the hood creases. Camry isn't exactly beautiful from the front and Accord is downright ugly from the rear. I think the Mazda6 may be a little gaudy with the bulged out wheel wells for a lot of people's preference. I have an'07 Mazda6(which has been trouble free for 38,000 miles) and like the new version but the interior was just not upgraded enough to get me excited about it.
plus like many other things there have been advancements since someone first took a chance on the technology.
I assume the Hyundai engineers have sat down with Hyundai accountants and execs and looked at it and decided it was going to work...
But other car companies (VW, anyone) have also had faith that things would all work out, and sometimes they just did not.
My sour grapes against VW (had a jetta that was a nightmare) is that I trust Hyundai a lot more than I would trust VW.
Hyundai probably has a big winner on its hands. I think the 2011 Sonata looks like a great car. But would I buy one? I've had such great experiences with my Hondas that I probably wouldn't....But I still think that Sonata looks great.
Including the Ford EcoBoost engine, which is also on the Ward's 10 best list.
Do we get some of the lowest-quality VW offerings here in the U.S.? How is it that VW is leading the world in automotive sales when all I hear is that they're horrible with electrical gremlins, these DI VW motors are gunking up too early, etc?
I'll continue to stay far away from their vehicles, for now anyway. You see, I learned to drive stick in my Dad's 4-speed '66 VW Fastback. That was a great car to learn stick in, easy to steer and handle, too. Light in weight, and actually the car accelerated pretty quickly.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
I forgot that the Hyundai 10 warranty wasn't transferable. And since many people only keep a car for 3-7 years, and since the DI problems are more likely to crop up in years 7-10, that does limit some of their liability...
Still the new Sonata does look good in pix and on paper...
of dollars to develop "what I think" is 2 of the best and most efficient
car engines in years, will stop putting them in the car they were
actually built for, such as soupping up the 3.3l V6 to make the new
SE "more sporty". Personally that is the main reason I bought the 2009
SE w/ the V6, it has more than I expected and then some. The only thing
I might add would be a trunk key hole, so I am happy I did opt for this
car. After buying 23 vehicles including this 1 in the past 45 years so far
it has been the best. The technology in this thing is amazing to say the
least. The old saying goes "if it ain't broke don't fix it"!!!! IMHO
Good luck to the people that are waiting for the 2011.
the 4 cyl should be plenty powerful enough for most buyers.
that I read while doing research on the Sonata. For the 2009 Sonata SE it was
in the plans by Hyundai to develop a high performance engine in attempts to
make the SE a little more sporty to compete with cars like the new Mazda6
and Fusion and Malibu etc. (if that was accomplished or not is an opinion thing).
It is not and I don't think it has ever been advertised as a sports car. And how
they "souped it up" was increasing the horsepower and torque and opening up
the power curve. This was done by adding C.V.V.T to both camshafts and add
VIS to the induction system, the engine is built out of aluminium which also helps
performance. This upped the HP from 234 to 249 and increased the torque also.
All this was done and the MPG rating actually went up. Hyundai USA's engineers
and builds their own engines in the plant in Alabama. The other engine is the
I4 2.4L that is used in the Sonata, its HP also went up.
The Se has a different suspension as you said, it also comes with a larger
breaking system than the others. The engine is mounted on hydrolic motor
mounts. All this was done by Hyundai alone, this V6 drive trane is getting
a lot of attention by other car makers, very good MPG's and dependable also.
To me that is pretty amazing technology.
to be used in the SE, sorry if you misunderstood it. I did not post the comment
to knock the Limited or the GLS, I would be shooting myself in the foot sort of
speak. They are basically the same car but the trim levels are not the same, the
GLS has a few options that can be added, same goes f/ the SE and the Limited,
but some options are not available on all trims. There are items for the SE that
are for the SE only can't even be ordered for the Limited or the GLS. (maybe
some after market), such as the fore mentioned suspension and breaks. Will
that make it special? it is called a SE I think means (special edition) but again
that could be subjective. How will this fare with the rest of the US cars, who cares
other than the buyer, like me. Do I think it,s special? absolutely IMO, I have owned
many fine autos including other brand HIGH performance models and this holds
it's own, actually I consider better! It has the smallest liter engine (3.3) than the
others I've had such as (GM's) 3.8l turbo charged Bonneville's SSEI that was on
the market about 15 years that was a nice car but had issues.
How well will the 2011 go over here in the US market remains to be seen. We will
see soon enough.
Happy holidays to all !!!!!
such as soupping up the 3.3l V6 to make the new
SE "more sporty".
The above is where I got the idea that you meant they souped it up specifically for the SE. Maybe that's not what you meant.
the I4 come in all three trims, thats very good Hyundai USA can concentrate their
efforts on only these 2 engines for the Sonata. Go to google and type in (2009
Sonata SE v6 specs and reviews) it will provide all the info about what was done
to the "new version 2009 SE) well over 1000 parts were changed from the
previous 2008 model including the bigger break system and suspension. (I
found it very interesting). That made me go for the SE over the other 2 trims
and buy a Sonata in general. Whatever the reason the new engines were built
it added a good dimension to an already good drive trane.
Some times my thoughts are not conveyed perfectly. It's a pleasure exchanging
info with people that share the same interests. Have a good one!!