Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Options
Popular New Cars
Popular Used Sedans
Popular Used SUVs
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
Do you think these types of posts belong in the Isuzu Maint & Repair or the Isuzu Trooper topic? That's the other reason I double-posted - wasn't sure what the best place is.
..
The oil flush did no harm to my Trooper.
..
The oil flush machine replaces the filter with a big machine which super cleans the oil while the engine is running.
I just okayed the dealer to do this quick flush. They also are cleaning the EGR system. I asked for an explanation again about the quick flush. Here's what I got - it's a "2-can" system made by B&G. Amounts to something like 2 oil changes in a row. Some additives are pumped through during/after the first oil batch. This is roughly similar to an auto trans power flush in that the procedure gets all the oil out, including the crap on the bottom of the pan.
I'm hoping this helps the consumption and does not introduce any problems. I'd prefer to do the cleaning myself by using well-regarded additives and doing my own oil changes after 500 miles or so, but I value my marriage too much to even mention this to my wife. So I'll bite the bullet on this overpriced dealer service and hopefully it helps. Advisor says they've had several folks complaining about oil consumption and this has worked well for them in the past.
Labor on this quick flush and EGR stuff is 2 hours total, @ $76/hr. Not sure of parts cost, but I'm probably looking at $200 total, maybe a bit more.
Dealer saw no damage done by the screwdriver, except it chewed up the serpentine belt which already needed replacement anyway. Dealer charge is $32 for the part and 1/2 hour labor, so 70 bucks total. This isn't something I'm comfortable trying, especially now, so I okayed them to do it.
As to where to post, granted at first it is more a help something is wrong situation. However, this quickly turns into a maintenance and repair saga so that is where I would post it. But like I noted that is just my opinion.
Replace timing belt, water pump, hoses (which ones? are these the radiator hoses?), and tensioner: $740. Not sure of the labor vs. parts breakdown.
P/S fluid flush, brake flush, new spark plugs, engine quick flush, oil change, clean EGR tube: $643 total-- $176 is parts, the rest (about 6 hours) labor. Seems pretty ridiculous for a bunch of little things that should be pretty cheap. I asked for more of a breakdown:
P/S fluid flush $17 parts, 1 hour labor @$76/hr = $93. Ridiculous! Probably $40-50 at a quick lube, right?
Brake flush - $93, same as P/S flush. Ridiculous.
Plugs - $81 just for the parts. That's over $15 per plug - ridiculous. This one I might try myself. Working backwards, dealer must be charging 2 hours labor for this which also seems ludicrous.
Quick flush and EGR tube cleaning - 2 hours labor. Not sure on parts.
Any thoughts? I'd prefer to have a dealer do this work, but at this point I can't justify letting them do hardly any of it because the prices sound astronomical.
I asked again for a quote on the brake flush + brake pads + wheel bearing repack, which should save on labor if doing all 3 together. Still waiting to hear back on that.
The confusing thing is I wasn't in a hurry and thought I was taking my time. I doublechecked both the new PCV valve and the coil pack for proper fit before closing the hood, but by that time I had forgotten all about the screwdriver. I was more worried about doing something wrong w/the PCV or coil pack.
I do feel that I know my limits, and I try to do only the things that are really easy. It's too bad I don't have an old beater vehicle to learn on.
The service advisor at a local dealer told me today they recommend anything but Champions. He was asking the technician while I was on the phone and I thought the tech also said something like 'we do not recommend double platinum plugs.' Seems I've heard similar double-platinum advice (i.e., stay away from 'em) from a few Town Hall folks too.
When changing the plugs, is there anything else to change as part of this procedure? Do the coil packs or wires have a recommended maintenance interval? I don't recall seeing one in my '98 Trooper owners manual. Is replacing the coil packs/wires/etc. unnecessary, or smart proactive maintenance?
Speaking of Champions, that's funny - I was quite surprised upon removal to find that the original plugs in my engine were Champions. I have a motorhead buddy who is down on Champions too, for some reason. That's why I put Autolites in. They were not "double platinum" though. That isn't really needed unless you are going to go a long time between plug changes. I plan to replace mine every 30K, it is so easy and cheap to do.
I don't think there is a recommended change interval for the coil packs, they have no moving parts and so are not a "wear" item.
You dealer flushing prices do sound way too high IMO.
As to doing the plugs, try the search feature as I thought someone already did a good writeup for that. FWIW, in summary here is my approach- unhook the battery, unclip the coil wire, unscrew the coil pack, gently but firmly pull off the pack, unscrew the plug using a long socket extension (use 2 smaller extensions fed on one at a time for the one close to the firewall on the driver's side), gap the new plug, apply very little if any anti-sieze (the plugs come pre-lubed, at least the Champions do) and some dielectric grease, CAREFULLY install the new plug DO NOT CROSSTHREAD, re-install the coil, screw down and clip back in. Repeat for each cylinder. Hook up the battery. HTH and I didn't forget anything.
Thanks for the part number reference on the PCV valve by the way.
Dealer called late today and said front brake pads still have a good 10-15k miles left on them. Said rear brakes are in need of new pads. Since the brakes aren't pulsating during use, dealer said the rotors didn't need replacement and also said they are too thin to be turned/machined.
Dealer quoted $142 to replace the rear pads! They won't get the work at that price. Dealer also recommended non-Isuzu rotors - said the Isuzu rotors run appx $200 each (not a pair, EACH!) and he could get aftermarket ones for half that. $100 apiece still sounds a bit pricey, but somewhere in reality.
I'd love to be able to justify having the dealer do the bulk of the maintenance work on my truck, but the prices are just way too high. Looks like I'll probably use a shop nearer my house. It's a Honda dealership and they also have a non-Honda service business that they've advertised quite a bit the past year. I visited once last year and was impressed with the folks I talked with, the very reasonable prices, and the couple freebies they gave me (brake inspection and one other thing I forget) even though we didn't discuss that. Plus they give a free king size candy bar with every visit
I found the hardest part of the job was getting the black plastic manifold cover back on. It pressure fits in 4 places using notched rubber bushings. The problem being that if you leave the bushings on the posts on the engine, the cover wants to catch the notches in the bushings rather than easily sliding over them. The simple cure was to pull the bushings from the posts on the engine and insert them into the cover. Then tap the cover with the now installed bushings on the bushing posts. Just a heads up suggestion for others getting ready to do this job.
PCV valve is connected on 1 end to a rubber black hose, maybe 1/2-3/4" diameter, and on the other end it sticks into some metal part of the engine (no idea what). The hose is kept tight on the PCV by a metal band with 2 plastic tabs that you push on to loosen the band when removing the PCV from this hose.
The removal of old PCV and install of new PCV took ME like 3 minutes. Your description sounds a little more involved. Not sure why Isuzu would have changed the design on the 99 Troop. Or maybe I'm just not understanding your explanation very well.
Are you sure you got your plastic cover piece on correctly? I know I couldn't get mine to easily and properly reset without resorting to the above.
Has anybody had this done? I'm planning to have a bunch of maintenance taken care of this week at a shop that's not an Isuzu dealer. Any idea how involved and expensive a valve clearance check is? How about a valve adjustment?
Could out-of-spec valve clearance be a cause for increased rate of oil consumption?
Let us know what prices you find. Given the design and likely price for a shim kit I doubt it will be cheap even for an independent shop. It also seems like a job that is easy to do wrong or at least requires a lot of attention to detail to do right.
I do worry about the job requiring considerable skill and being easy to screw up.
I spoke with the shop manager while dropping the car off. It was encouraging that he seemed to know the basics of a valve clearance/adjustment. He didn't mention the word 'shim' but seemed to know what he was talking about - though it's hard for me to tell due to my very limited understanding of modern combustion engines. He said the adjustment is basically the same thing as the check - you do all the same stuff and either need to adjust 'it' when you're in there or you don't.
Based on all the feedback, I'm leaning toward not having the valve clearance checked since I don't really notice any unusual noises from the engine. Occasionally I do hear some spark knock/pinging but I don't think it's valve tapping. The engine oil has always been changed at fairly short intervals so I think the engine should be in good shape.
Now I'm quite conflicted - if I have the shop do the job at $300, will they do it right? Will they do more harm than good? Is it an important maintenance item or an unnecessary expense? If I don't have the job done, am I better off since I'm not risking the shop doing the job wrong?
I know a real 'valve job' can be extremely expensive, and I don't want to run the risk of needing that procedure due to neglected maintenance. I'm leaning toward having the shop do the valve work.
What exactly is done on this valve adjustment?
* A couple guys who seem knowledgeable say it's adding a shim to make up for the lost clearance. These guys are saying it's not necessary if I'm not hearing valve ticking.
* The most recent guy said "there is a disk that rides between the cam and the bucket that is used to adjust the valve lash." This is the guy who thinks the valve clearance check/adjust is important.
* I asked the shop mgr how this adjustment is done - is a shim added or something. He said no, that there's an adjusting screw and the tech simply adjusts the screw [tightens/loosens it?] to achieve the desired clearance. He said some other stuff but I didn't totally follow it.
I'm having trouble reconciling the different opinions about how this job is done - it seems there is some conflicting information.
Any more feedback?
My understanding is that in the case of the 3.5 V6, this is done by adding shims (discs). The reason that it is important is that the shims do wear out and eventually end up being pitted. The pitting on the shims, if allowed to progress, will eventually lead to accelerated wear on the cam lobes.
Replacing the camshafts is going to be way more expensive than doing the valve adjustment. Once you hear the ticking, the damage may have already been done to the cam lobes.
-mike
What experiences have you had with the Bridgestone 684's?
I'm thinking of a highway/offroad tire next such as the BF Goodrich TA - any experiences with that?
..
When comparing tires ask the tire store people to give you the shipping weight or tire weight. I use the weight to weigh my decision on how big to go. I like tires larger than stock, but to go from a stock tire 30 to 33 lbs to a nice looking LT265/75R16C at 48 lb. is too big a stretch for me since my Trooper is my daily driver and MPG is extra important to my wife. If I had a different vehicle for commuting I would go to the larger tires.
Our 684s were replaced at 52k miles. I could have stretched them to 60k but wanted more tread on the road so we swapped them out.
They don't have to be factory alloys. A suitable aftermarket set of steel wheels, 15" diameter, and a set of 31" or 33" tyres. M/T's maybe.
Then I can swap between the standard size for day to day, and put the others on for having fun.
I forgot to ask why the tensioner wasn't done. I asked about the idler pulley. They originally quoted $25 for the part price and I think labor was nothing additional (plenty of labor for the t-belt and water pump already!). When I picked truck up, shop mgr said the pulley was actually a $130 part (the $25 quote from parts guy was for serpentine belt). Shop mgr said the pulley was metal, not plastic as on some vehicles, and it looked fine and there was no reason to replace it.
I don't know if that's actually true or if he didn't want to replace it since he would have had to eat the difference in the part cost or try to pass it on to me, which I would have objected to.
As to what to do now, you might want to remind the service manager again that you ordered a new pulley. Note that you hope he is right about the pulley lasting. Then ask how much of the labor they will eat if the pulley dies before the next scheduled belt change? This might tell you a lot about the shop.
I agree with that 100%. Can't tell if they were looking out for my best interest, or if they considered this a 'fixed-price' job since I had agreed to the work and was given an estimate, so it saved them $$ to not do the pulley, tensioner, etc. if they could still charge me the original estimate.
There were a few things I did wrong with this $1,050 work I spent on / invested in my Trooper. First, I approved the work by phone. I didn't have a printed copy of what work would be done and the estimated cost. Stupid, especially since this was a pricey visit. My Excel doc notes from discussions with the shop mgr actually make it look like I might NOT have mentioned the t-belt tensioner; now I can't remember. I definitely did mention it to a different Isuzu dealer that quoted me a price on t-belt/water pump/hoses/tensioner, but don't recall if I mentioned tensioner to Honda dealer that ended up doing the work. That Isuzu dealer quoted $760, by the way - much more than I paid, but I didn't get the tensioner or hoses replaced.
I didn't spend enough time looking over the paperwork when I picked up the truck, either. I had my 18 month-old daughter there, which made it tougher.
Plus I didn't make the shop give me back any of the old parts. I thought shops had to do this automatically, unless part was too heavy or had to be sent back to automaker due to hazardous materials or something. Maybe they must return parts to customer, but only if the customer asks? Because of this error, I wasn't able to look at the timing belt to see how much wear it had, if any. That would've been helpful info. Plus, getting old parts back is better proof that the work was actually done.
-mike
Just had timing belt replaced - 98 Trooper, 75k miles. Wanted tensioner replaced too but don't think it was; need to call shop back and find out for sure. Seems like the tensioner can actually wear out quicker than the belt on the 3.2L, and maybe 3.5L, Isuzu engines.
What would you guys recommend as my next course of action?
Trooper running well considering I blundered back in November during a late night rain storm cruise run.
As I pulled off the main road in an attempt to navigate through a soaked and muddied field, I decided (actually it was my wife who decided) it was more than I wanted to handle. While reversing and trying to back onto the road, I slid into a trench. I was able to reverse myself out in 4 Low but twisted the tail pipe around the rear wheel in the process. The wheel popped but the truck did pull itself out which was pretty impressive all in it's own.
Fortunetly, the field was directly across from my home so I was able to slowly drive the truck up my driveway where it sat in a nasty rain storm until I was able to access the damage in the morning.
I had to have it towed. The total job cost me about $600 for a new tail pipe and muffler and some other connectors, doo-dads and what nots.
I also put on a set of Yokohama Geolandar HT's. I paid $77/ea through "tirerack.com". "tirerack.com" blew everyone's price away.
Compared to the Duelers, I feel that the Yokohama's give a better ride on the highway and provide more stabililty for turning and overall handling. We had a few snow storms here in Bucks County PA and these tires seem to handle as good as the Duelers. I am very happy with the Geolandar HT's.
Steve
-mike
Thoughts on this?
So they want about $500 for the whole job...ugh! He said that if they just replace the pads, I will get pulsing when I brake...what do you guys think?
Here's a great website for ordering brakes.
http://www.brakewarehouse.com/newddtfdb22.asp
-mike
Shop mgr told me they'd machine the rotors while still on the truck. Price for the Isuzu pads wasn't bad, but I think they inflated the labor way beyond what should have been necessary for the job.
Surprising you need brake work at such an early mileage. What are you doing to your brakes to wear them so quick?
$500 doesn't seem way out of line for that work. Yes, it's a lot and you could save a bundle by doing yourself, but I'm in no position to do that work myself so I bit the bullet and paid up big.