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Edmunds TMV is 33,809 after rebate.
Dealer has offered 33,865 after rebate.
How close does Edmunds get on these TMV quotes?
Would 33K even be a good counteroffer if the dealer takes it or is it still too high?
tidester, host
type tires. The Eagle LS only has a 350 tread wear rating and many demos approaching the 5,000 miles turn in level were showing significant wear. Sinking feeling that quick tire wear would be a major problem with the Eagle LS?
The higher end MM models come with BFG Rugged Trail T/A in 245/65R/17. Same goes for the E/B and Limited Explorer models. The BFG selection, except for maybe the 17" size itself, seems like an ill tire selectiion for the higher priced luxury models. Seems like the luxury models would have the performance tires. Any insights?
The Explorers we drove with the BFG tires seemed to handle slightly better than the base XLT models with the Michelin 235/70R/16 Cross Terrain. Again probably solely due to the 17" wheels and tires.
Any experience with the above tires on these models?
P.s. We liked the MM better and she wanted to try the AWD, but could not find much selection in 3rd seat delete Mountaineer models.
Also, he wants a "high-end" version which will probably put him on a Lincoln-Mercury lot as most of the MMs are "higher-end" than the most common XLT Explorer..although we fully understand that most dealers have at least a few Eddie Bauer and Limited Explorers too. Anyway, he want's it WITHOUT the 3rd row seating. At one point you could not get MM without the 3rd row. Somewhere I seem to recall hearing that for '04 you could order it with a 3rd row DELETE option.
Yes? No?
Info would be appreciated since, unfortunately, the dealers either don't know the truth about these two items (we've been there and are getting different stories at different dealerships) or purposely aren't telling because they suspect the answers won't sell what's on their lot today.
F/L/M in Tocccoa, GA 30577 for an example of a 2004 Mountaineer with third row delete. Assuming it has not sold since I did a bookmark a couple of weeks ago. (Should also be able to find it through www.mercuryvehicles.com using the above zip)
My wife and I drove several 2003 Mountaineers with third row delete in the late summer of 2003.
Edmunds.com Announces Editors' Most Wanted Awards for 2004 Model Year (Yahoo news)
Steve, Host
"Give us your feedback about our Editors' Most Wanted picks.
E-mail: editor@edmunds.com"
Steve, Host
Seriously, that was a cut and paste from the bottom of the Most Wanted article. Don't be surprised to see your missives quoted in the Letters section in a month or two.
Steve, Host
The OEM Goodyear tires definitely will not last past 30Kmiles, they're already showing significant wear.
Also, the aluminium accent on the steering wheel is fading out, especially the bottom left spoke. We took it to the dealership since it's still under warranty, they replaced it with a new style, leather all around. This is the standard since 2003 cause Ford has too many problems with the aluminium accent. So, all of you who have warranty left better go get it change asap.
SIRIUS Satellite Radio Now Available on Select Ford, Lincoln and Mercury Vehicles
Thursday September 18, 4:33 pm ET
* SIRIUS satellite radio retails for $329 plus installation and tax on ten 2004 Ford, Lincoln and Mercury vehicles. * Ford Motor Company has future plans to offer SIRIUS to its other brands.
DEARBORN, Mich. and NEW YORK, Sept. 18 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- Ford Motor Company (NYSE: F - News
Any other suggestions???
http://media.ford.com/newsroom/release_display.cfm?release=15369
Looks like you are right though. It say's specifically, "dealler installed option." That may or may not be a big deal. It could be installed before delivery, and would be warranteed for 3years/36,000 miles.
On the tire choice question I would go with the Michelin Cross-Terrains, I saw them on sale @ walmart last month for $125 which is not a bad price for 60Kmiles tires.
You sound disappointed. If it will make you feel better, I'll trade you my Goodyears, also with 30K miles, that I worry won't make it until the Spring. As a bonus, I'll also swap the alloy wheels with the mysterious looking scratches on them!! ;-)
prior message******************
#1313 of 1643 8 cyc stall/surge on braking by dvdsteve Mar 15, 2003 (4:02 pm)
Greetings from New Jersey...
I have an '03 Mountaineer Premier with the 8 cycinder engine. 11,500 miles in 4 1/2 months.
At least twice a day, and only when I am braking to a stop, at the moment I stop, my engine surges high to low to high to low, or, it stalls.
3 trips to my dealer and of course, it never happens when they test drive it, nor do they find anything when they put it on their computer.
Any thoughts on this???
Thank you for any responses...
Steve
So is the Michelin worth 50% more? It's probably a wash. BF Goodrich is $110 at Sams Club and Michelin Cross-Terrain is $160. Costs 50% more and lasts about 50% longer. The difference is that there is less hassle and less changeover (mounting, balancing). So maybe the Michelin IS worth it.
Thanks...
The big difference between the two, is mainly what options you can get. For instance with the XLT, you can upgrade your wheels, stereo, interior (to leather if you wish), and get the V8 just to name a few. I hope that this will help you at least a little :-) Goodluck!
Michelin 235/70R/16 Cross-Terrain tires have a treadwear rating of 420 or so versus 700 for regular Michelin Tire Store Michelins. Anyone know the difference? Typical Ford cheapo
version? Hnadling not that good witht he 235/70R/16 size. Any suggestions such as a tire in the 65 series? Is any 65 series size suitable? Same height? Michelin OEMs seem to be wearing down fast.
No mechanical problems at all in first 3,800 miles.
ford may have spec'ed a softer or tackier rubber compound, or traction requirements that translate to the same thing, for their OEM tires, and that would account for the difference.
if you tell the Michelin-franchise tire counter guy you want the tires for a 2003 explorer, they might indeed find their replacement tire is built more like the OEM tire than your look at what may be a general replacement.
Vehicle manufacturers have to meet CAFE (Corporate Average Fuel Economy) requirements set by the US government. One of the ways to help meet these requirements is to use low rolling resistance tires, and one of the ways to get low rolling resistance in tires is to sacrifice treadwear (Another way is traction and that's just not a good option).
Fuel economy is rarely an issue in the aftermarket, but treadwear is - big time! - so most aftermarket tires will have higher treadwear ratings than their OEM counterparts. The notable exception to this is high performance tires where traction is the issue in the aftermarket, and treadwear is a bit of an issue in the OEM market.
Hope this helps.
The noise difference is dramatic. The cheapo XLS interior was much quieter than the MM interior. It seems that there's a wind noise in the MM that I can't quite track down. From the driver's seat it sounds like its coming from the passenger side. My wife, however, says it's coming from the middle. I don't have a sunroof.
I also have the Goodrich tires on the car and they are way noisier than the OE Explorer tires.
So, what problems can I look for in the MM? And how do I fix this wind noise, or is that something that we all live with?
Note to all you Explorer buyers. I had the 02 XLS 4x4 for a year. Loved it. The only problems were a bad wheel sensor which caused the ABS light to come on, and the cruise control would go out or not function from time to time. Could never get it to do that at the dealership though. Gas mileage was great. I never thought I'd own one, but I wouldn't rule out another.
BTW, I think Ford has done a commendable job working out all of the new Explorers/Mountaineers first year bugs. So your 03 should be even better than your 02 in terms of mechanical reliability!
I won't mention which vehicles/brands, but there's a few that are supposedly AWD and are the first to get stuck in snow. I've been able to defeat some AWD systems (on closed testing facilities) and hae an 4WD system. There should be a programmed ratio for each differential to correct a slip. The easily defeatable AWD systems are those that run ALL wheels, at the same time while 1, 2 or 3 wheels spin endlessly seeking traction, chances are the 4th won't recoupe, therefore you'll see them hit a snow drift or curb.
The better AWD systems are those that send power to the wheels that grip, while the spinning one's regain traction, in whatever methods need be (some use brake intervention to do so, and these are the more advanced versions).
One example, is the Jaguar X-type sedan, which is AWD, but uses a rear biased AWd system, directing around 60% of it's power towards the rear wheel, while the front receive the remaining power. On dicey situations the system is able to compensate for lost traction on one wheel, but becomes a bit riskier when more than 2 lose traction on the same axle.
Most car-based SUV's such as Escape/VUE/Highlander/Pilot, will use an AWD systems that's quite easy and simple. Since it's FWD, their weight over the front wheels, allow them to use a simpler version, BUT many times in AWD optional form, might not work as well on black ice for example.
In those simple systems, they are FWD biased, and will only switch to AWD by transfering their traction to the rear wheels when front slippage is detected. Chances are if the front wheels are slipping (considering the weight overthem) chances are the rear wheels MIGHT help, but don't expect a miracle. And all this needs ot be accomplished by a very active and fast computer programming management system to switch the hydraulics for the rear wheels to compensate.
On the other field we have 4WD, that allows for more choices based on driver input. From 4WDlow, to 4wdAuto, or 2WD. These can help few economy, but most times are a bit more complex over AWD, and require a bit more mechanicals. Ford's Control Trac by far is one of the better 4WD systems on vehicles. Not only because of it's grip and ability, but it's durability as well.
Not stating which is better over AWD/4WD, just stating each system is vastly different from manufacturer to manufacturer, finding out which system and how it works, is what will make the difference. Have peace of mind that either of Ford's system is ahead of the competition.
And even better, are vehicles that incorporate an Anti-Skid Stability System onto their AWD/4WD. This can make good driver's, better. But doesn't make up for the bad one's that feel invisible either.
brast69: Your situation sounds very similar to mine. The new Exp. or MM will be my wife's daily driver, we have one child and another on the way. I, too, just want her to get in and drive and not think about whether or not the 4WD is engaged, so I'm leaning towards the MM. Glad to know the AWD does well at the beach as that is the only "off-roading" I would do as well. If I did a lot of off-roading and needed the 4WD low, I would either get the NBX or 4runner or Jeep for that matter.
I test drove the Explorer last weekend, my first time feeling the new suspension. Great improvement over my '96. Haven't seen the inside of the MM yet, but have read it's nice as well.
Still curious why I can't find an XLT with AWD, sales guy said it has to be special ordered from the factory? Then again, I want the heated seats/mirrors, upgraded stereo, so I'm back to the MM.
"Take our 2002 Mercury Mountaineer test vehicle, for example. Why should someone buy this SUV over a Ford Explorer Eddie Bauer or Limited? For the exclusive all-wheel-drive system? That Control Trac automatic four-wheel-drive setup on the Explorer is a slick piece of work, transferring power when the wheels slip so quickly that the driver barely even feels the system working its magic. So the Mountaineer's AWD, which distributes engine torque in a 35 percent front/65 percent rear split under normal conditions, is no reason to choose the Merc over the Ford.
Basically, it comes down to styling. Do you like the way the Mountaineer looks better than the Explorer? Then buy it. That AWD system isn't going to kill your fuel mileage; during two tanks drained on the mean streets of Detroit, we averaged 16.5 mpg with our V8 test truck, and that was with a reasonably heavy foot on the throttle."