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Comments
LCDs are highly profitable, yet it still took them 3 years to be able to make supply meet demand. Explain that!
JOHN
As for the Fit--you can't buy one of those in the U.S. today at any price. So your choice today is wait for a Prius, wait for a Fit, or buy something else, e.g. a Matrix 5-speed has the room and utility of the Prius and will approach 40 mpg highway. And it costs a lot less than a Prius.
To have to move even ONE Prius product at less than MSRP was probably the so called "kiss of death" To have ANY product availability other than a massive waiting list and some of the execs were probably expected by pass the kiss, to commit sepuku
Actually I don't know if the 1997s have had any battery issues or not. I don't have infroamtion on Priuses; I doubt if a consolidated compendium even exists. Those vocal for the Prius only like to report positive facts. And I don't know how many Prius owners particpate in Edmunds forums. All I was saying is that even the 1997 is only 7 years old, so there are any failures yet after 8 years.
I am glad you like your car. Tell me the 3 things you like the best. Tell me 3 things you like the least. What would you change? If you had it to do over again would you make the same decision?
I hope you and other Prius and other hybrid owners don't have any major battery problems.
YMMV,
MidCow
So you think I need a 5-speed TDI I will consider it!
BTW, do you think the Sienna is a profitable vehicle for Toyota? Let's assume it is. Then how can you explain the massive shortages of '04 Siennas? Since they are so profitable, Toyota should have made more in a heart-beat, right? Instead, they forced customers to wait and to pay MSRP or close to MSRP prices for Siennas. Was this an insiduous plot by Toyota--or maybe just a case of production not keeping up with demand because the new Sienna was a much more desirable vehicle than the previous-gen Sienna?
Three features I like best: Smart Entry/Start, NAV, Stealth Mode...
What I'd change:
Better OEM tires (I changed mine)
Provide EV Swich in the US- Nice to have when you just want to move the car a few feet and don't want to engage the ICE.
One touch up/down on all four windows instead of just the driver's window.
If I had to do it all over again, I'd buy it in a hearbeat. Absolutely NO regrets. I can sell mine today for $25k!!!
There is not an enqueue/dequeue locking feature to ensure you are always looking at the most current set of posts.
Thee is a latent demand for Prius, If they were readily available I would stongly consider buying one in spite of it not being standard shift. I could probably get use to the CVT and I could probably get use to the power, although I would probably only be a 40 mpg person.
What bothers me most about the Prius, is the hauty attitude of the sales people and their absolute lack of knowledge or incorrect knowledge about the Prius and hybrids.
If batteries are in short supply, then that explains some of the production backlog. It seems other battery manufacturers would be clamoring to get Panasonics business.
Have a great day!
YMMV,
MidCow
I don't understand how Toyota can legally claim to sell a product they can't deliver on for, in some cases, two years.
Yes, two years. That's what Twin Cities, MN dealers are currently claiming.
That's insane.
PT Cruiser & MR2 both have experienced the same in the recent past.
JOHN
I remember when my 1987 TLC was still under warranty (2000 units total importation to the USA) and either I was unhappy with a part or they discoved something wrong, the part had to come from Japan. So naturally hearing this at the dealer level, I was envisioning a 1 mo wait, etc. Not more than TOTAL 3 days, the vehicle went in for initial warranty, the part was ordered/received and put in and I was on my way.
"Then Toyota tilted the system in favor of Japan. It raised the 2004 U.S. allocation of Prius cars to 47,000, up by 34 percent from the 35,000 level set in September. It nearly doubled the 2004 Japan allocation, from 36,000 to 70,000."
"Toyota raised Prius output in April from 7,500 a month to 10,000 a month. It plans to build 130,000 this year, including 10,000 to be made on overtime and Saturdays."
"Now that Japan's higher allocation has trimmed the waiting time in that country, Toyota may be ready to raise the U.S. allocation. But there are no guarantees."
"Although the current allocations "are not written in stone," the July allocation could reflect product-cycle planning, says Toyota spokesman Paul Nolasco. That means Japan could continue to get a disproportionate share of Priuses while the car is seen as new and hot there."
"In Japan, car sales often tumble once a car is a year old or even less. In the United States, sales usually don't fall dramatically as soon."
Read the whole article: http://www.autoweek.com/cat_content.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat- _code=carnews&loc_code=index&content_code=07665061
Dennis
I am not yet certain that I'm prepared to do so now.
I'm certainly not prepared to put down any deposit money for the privilege of waiting two years for Toyota to perform a rectal capitectomy on themselves.
Kia Spectra- Cheap, lots of goodies for the price, not the best in the mileage department but respectable.
Corolla- Great value, great mileage and a great price
Civic- Outstanding reliability, excellent mileage and very good prices.
But I'm also not a patient person. I can't honestly forsee where I'm going to *be* in two years time, so I have trouble with the idea of waiting that long now that I'd started to lean Priusward. I also consider it to be borderline-fraud to claim to be selling a product which no-one can actually obtain in a reasonable amount of time, and that angers me a bit.
Seriously, I am a fan of this car, but there would not be waiting lists if everyone had the choices in this country that are available in the EU. We just got back from two weeks in the UK, hauling around 4 people and 150 lbs of luggage in a "mid-size" [that is, huge, by EU standards] Vauxhall/Opel Vectra 5-door 2liter turbo-diesel that averaged 35-40 mpg for the trip. And this is not even the latest technology available - all of the MB, BMW, VW, and Peugeot lines are top-to-bottom loaded with great diesel engines in every car they make, from the smallest to the largest. No one there thinks it's remarkable to be looking for good space, good pace, and good fuel consumption in one package.
This Prius only seems miraculous in a nation that thinks it is a God-given right to get 12 mpg and complain about the price of motor fuel..."we rule"...duh...
They are.
So are the Australians.
But since we scream louder and have far more of a consumption & pollution problem, we have been the majority market for this phase of non-domestic rollout.
Japan consumers are much, much, much more accepting of change. So there rollout schedule is quite different, which allows for the flexibility.
JOHN
If you care to share, what were the prices you paid and or observed for diesel and or unleaded regular and premium??
If unleaded gas is 1.95 and diesel #2 is 1.59, your diesel 35-40 mpg is -$.0454285-.03975 per mile here, USA. My 48-51 mpg would yield $.033125-.0311764- per mile. A Prius at say 50 mpg would yield $ .039 per mile.
Understand, there are literally dozens of choices of smaller 4-door hatchback diesels [VW Polo, Audi A2, Peugeot 2xx and 3xx, the new BMW 1-series, MB A-class] that easily exceed 40 miles per US gallon, and 50+ is not out of reach. All of these are slightly smaller inside than a Prius, but they all have bigger brothers in the form of the so-called MPVs [Renault Scenic , Opel Zafira, etc.] that have all the room and can still reach those fuel consumption figures.
I read everything I can get my hands on when we are on our overseas trips, and I can assure you that there is no great demand for hybrid technology in the EU. Thus, I think Toyota is right in focusing on Japan and the US, neither of which has significant penetration of the market by state-of-the-art auto diesel engines.
The marketplace, all things being equal, is usually semi-rational; it's easy to argue it's even semi-rational here, right up to the point where it seems ludicrous to complain about "high fuel prices" when 55% of the market is for trucks. Frankly, most Europeans think we are quite out of our minds, and so do I...
Another thing is that you run your heating oil furnance what 24/7 during the 3-4 month winter season? app 2880 hrs? I bet your furnace doesnt even come close to the emissions abatement that I have or most any passenger car has on their diesel engine. I ran 26,000 miles this last year and used app 520 gal of #2 diesel fuel (heating oil, as most know differs only in the additives needed for the portability of passenger car fuel) Or I ran my TDI engine app 520 hrs? How much heating oil did you use last season or last year?
At 1.59 per gal and 1.95 per gal of unleaded regular, I am more appreciative of paying .0318 cents per mile. Obviously Euro folks pay 3.55 x's more!!!
Be a Smart Buyer!!
Don't pay sticker price for a used Prius with 9,000 miles on it!
Don't pay $3000 over MSRP for a new Prius!
Don't pay $1500 for someone's place on a waiting list!
These are all offers that currently are listed on eBay for Toyota's new 2004 Prius model. Sure it's a great car but you are buying one to save money, right? It doesn't make sense to purchase a Prius to save at the gas pump if you have to pay way too much to get one!
Right now Rice Toyota in Greensboro, NC is taking orders for the 2005 model Prius. They are being sold at Toyota's Suggested Retail Price. You can order whatever color and option package you like. You get a new 2005 model. We don't make you purchase a paint protection package. We don't have a additional mark-up sticker because of market or demand conditions. You don't even have to pay $169 for floor mats ( unless you want to )...
Well, at least they don't mark up the car or make you by the high-priced floor mats. The bid price is $1.00 and there are no bids yet. I don't expect there will be any either. I expect anyone interested in this offer will just contact the dealer directly. When you think about it, this is a pretty clever, inexpensive way for a dealer to advertise to the entire world.
>you have to take your hat off to them
>for doubling the cost of basic transportation
>while making an "environ, techno, status,
>image" statement!
I'd like to have a share of that marketing person's bonus!
Ford announced they will only offer 20,000 hybrids next year, even though they have roughly 30,000 interested buyers already. That's a rather significant backlog...
Only picking on Toyota is not appropriate.
JOHN
YMMV,
MidCow
Not in the slightest!
Being disingenuous is basing the purchase decision solely on factors existing today, rather than when the person will actually get the car.
Remember, for years now Toyota has been proclaiming their worldwide hybrid production would be 300,000 units by (the end of) 2005. They are right on schedule toward meeting that goal... which was considered absurd at first. But a lot has changed over the past 9 months.
Stop being short-sighted. Think long-term.
JOHN
I am, that is why I am considering the Prius in the long term and not anytime soon!
It just didn't cut it against the VW Jetta TDI. 17.6k and 19k tax and tip!
Also if the regulators, supply and demand and the other market forces are successful in raising fuel prices, it will bring probably enough pressure to bear to start bringing more diesel vehicles to the USA market. On the hybrid vs diesel thread, there is a link to a diesel Toyota that gets 63 mpg! 15.2k to 22.5k US MSRP!!!! I am guessing 12.5k to 18.5k invoice pricing! Makes my wildly fuel efficient TDI at 50 mpg and the Prius at 50 mpg look like fuel guzzlers!!