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I want tires that will last for a while. Not 1 year. At 180 bucks per tire, that's a lot of money to spend.
Go over to www.tirerack.com do some basic research about tires - pay special attention to the UTQG rating.
The stock TL Bridgestone tires have a mileage rating of only 260. The HIGHER this number is the more miles you can expect to get - this is just a base number based on government testing - but it is a way to compare tires.
With the 235 45 17 size (stock on the TL) it will be hard to find a tire with a high mileage rating. BECAUSE ITS A PERFORMANCE TIRE.
You should have purchased a Honda Accord.
The TL is a Sports Sedan.
Sports Sedans come with Performance Tires.
Performance Tires wear faster than conventional all-season radials.
BTW, how does anyone drop $30,000+ on a car without doing basic research first?
That, I'll never understand. :confuse:
True- it's not a fancy sport car.
"I got it because it's a family car."
IMHO, I would not characterize it as a family car. It's a entry level luxury PERFORMANCE sedan which combines luxury, performance, technology and can haul the wife and kids down the street.
Family car IMO is a minivan w/ a "soccer mom" sticker on the back
Gotta agree with most here, tlhater. You should have bought an Accord if you wanted a great family sedan. Performance sedans get you performance-oriented, low profile tires. Which do wear more quickly.
Good luck, I still think the TL is a fab ride!
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
Big difference IMO between 30K highway and 30K city - the starting/stopping & corners reduce tread life - not sure but maybe even more so with a FWD car.
Can anyone give me a good reason to do it? I'm inclined to ignore my maintenance minder that keeps nagging me that it's time to rotate my tires.
I'll let you know how I make out in court. It has nothing to do with having too much time on my hands or whatever, I called their customer service, they were worthless robots reading from a script. None of them had any authority to make a decision. Who knows, maybe the call center is in India.
I already sent notice. In two weeks I'll file my claim in court and let's see how they answer it. A judge will decide what is fair. And a judge can decide either way and Acura's lawyers know that.
Did you read the brochure, where it states very clearly that the tires on the TL are performance 17's.... and to expect quicker wear than on a conventional all-season radial tire?
Suppose not.
Good luck in court.
Yes, the Acura is a fancy Honda, but this is why people buy them.
They offer a higher level of comfort, luxury and performance than that of it's Honda counterpart.
I own a Honda Accord EX.
I'm now looking at Acura TLs.
I'm aware of the differences, did my research and I'm also aware of the fact that the TL's tires will get anywhere between 15,000 and 30,000 miles, depending on driving style and conditions.
I'm also aware of the fact that this is a performance sedan.
You did not buy a Honda with an Acura label on it.
You bought an Acura Sports-Tuned Sedan.
If you wanted the honda, you should have bought it, and saved up to $10,000 in doing so.
He probably would get 30k on Honda Accord tires as well since they are not low profile high speed rated tires
(1) The Acura TL - especially in automatic form - is NOT a sports sedan. The fact that the 6-speed, which I own, has a stiffer suspension and Brembo brakes, makes it "sportier", and better handling but it is essentially still a sporty FWD family sedan.
(2) In general, the buying public has been suckered into thinking that 17-18-19" wheels and Z rated 45 series tires on a 62/38 weight un-balanced FWD car turn it into a sports sedan. The reality is that, while the larger wheels and tires may look aesthetically more appealing, they aren't increasing performance in proportion with their wear and cost. My 1995 Nissan Maxima with 15" wheels, 60 series tires that lasted 50,000 miles a set, can handle almost as nimbly as my TL 6-speed. It's FWD and 60/40 weight biased as well, but weighs around 450 lbs less than the TL.
(3) All season tires on the automatic should be capable of lasting 30,000+ miles, without any noticable decrease in the actual performance of the car. If you're plowing a FWD automatic into corners as though it's an M3, expect to pay the price in tire wear that will be WORSE than a RWD 50/50 balanced M3 (or 330i for that matter).
(4) All that said, I can still say "so what" with a smile on my face. If you bought a TL and didn't notice that, since the 2004 redesign, it came with 17" 235/45 series tires, well, shame on you. If you actually got a set of bum Tourenza's, go to court if you want. But all Tourenza's are pretty crappy from what I can tell. The (better) Potenza's on my 6-speed only lasted 17,000 miles. Pretty pitiful, since I traded in a Honda S2000 with 18,000 miles on it's original set of tires. Now that is a car that makes good use of rubber - but even it only came with 16" wheels and 55/50 series tires.
Agreed. However, IMHO even in automatic form it is still a sporty FWD sedan.
"The fact that the 6-speed, which I own, has a stiffer suspension and Brembo brakes, makes it "sportier", and better handling but it is essentially still a sporty FWD family sedan.
In general, the buying public has been suckered into thinking that 17-18-19" wheels and Z rated 45 series tires on a 62/38 weight un-balanced FWD car turn it into a sports sedan."
So you don't think those tires contribute to your "sportier" driving experience?
My understanding of putting good "rubber" on a vehicle enhances the "performance" feel of a vehicle notwithstanding your obvious dislike for FWD.
The IS was our first choice - but simply could not find ANY to buy -
I look at the TL as the sporty version of the Accord! BTW a manual tranny and stiff suspension do not = sport car. My Nissan 4x4 PICKUP had both - but I don't think many would call it a sporty vehicle.
The issue with the tires comes down to this - is it reasonable for Acura to agree to pay 50% of the cost if the tires last "only" 17,000 miles?
I say yes -
Very marginally. I can definitely tell the suspension difference between the automatic and 6-speed. But I doubt that I - or anybody - could tell the difference between 17" 45 series tires and good 16" 55 series when it comes to handling in the TL. Maybe if I was inclined to take it to the track, but I never got to one with my S2000 and I'm still waiting to take a performance driving course before trying with my 911. Our TL gets "sporty" family duty, but not sports car duty.
"My understanding of putting good "rubber" on a vehicle enhances the "performance" feel of a vehicle notwithstanding your obvious dislike for FWD."
Several years ago, when Lexus introduced the GS400, they offered a 17" performance wheel and tire package. They ended up giving a lot of customers refunds and their 16" wheels and tires back. The GS suspension was too soft, the tires wore like crazy and the whole thing was an embarassment. A friend with a BMW M5 got more mileage out of his 18" tires than his mild mannered wife did out of their GS400.
So putting good rubber on a bad chassis is a waste of money. And putting a whole lot of money into tires on a FWD sedan that has a nose heavy weight distribution isn't much better, even if it has a good suspension (which the TL does).
I've never owned a BMW. But I subscribe to their claimed mantra that everything starts with the chassis and suspension. "Make it faster than the engine" or something like that. "Rubber" is the final element and an important one. But tires can only go so far in making up for engineering flaws or limitations on what they are attached to.
I would agree - but on the other hand, there is no such thing as a (real) sports car with a soft suspension and slushbox. Half full, half empty....
Your tires are worn out right? So are you driving around with worn out tires? Or - Did you park the car? Or what? - maybe drive around in another car and let your new Acura sit in the driveway! That must really be HURTING Acura.
What if it takes 3 months - or 6 months (or longer) to get this thing to go before a judge - do you just wait?
habitat1 - I know some think that a car must have a manual to be considered a sports car. I am not so sure - What is a BMW M6 or a Viper - or a Porsche 911 with an auto tranny? A family car?
I also feel that it enhances the car's ability in snow, extends my mileage per gallon, and I get exceptional life out of my brake pads.
I like driving a stick.
Yes, the TL is a sedan, but it's a lot of fun to drive, and even more fun with the stick.
I personally feel that the "Sequential SportShift" automatic is a joke.
It hesitates.
I can slap the stick to downshift from 5th to 3rd, and I have enough time to sip my coffee before the car kicks in.
It's a gimmick for Auto-trans lovers. It downshifts when it wants and not when I tell it to, and downshifting doesn't help in slowing at all.
I think the stick shift offers more feel, control, and enhances the driving experience.
More problems though. The dealer has told me that I have two bent wheels? When I asked him how these could possibly get bent he told me that Acura supplies low quality alloy wheels that when driven over pot-holes (I live in New York), the bend quite easily.
Another piece of crap put out by Acura. How could they seel a car in New York that can't hold up? I'm adding this to my lawsuit as I will not pay for new wheels. Thirty-three years of driving 8 cars, never had a bent wheel.
My alloys aren't bent, that I notice, but a couple of scrapes...
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
Anyone else had problems with their wheels getting bent? If TLHater is accurate in what the guy told him, then it's pretty common. But, and this is a big but, how can we trust what a dealer tells us? We've all had stories where we take a car in for tire rotations and get told how we need new brakes, rotors, struts, engine mounts, and on and on, so I'd like to hear more from you owners before popping the cork on a purchase.
Wheels bent -- I have driven now 18,100 miles in New York area (I live just north of NYC). There are roads, believe it or not, that have rough surfaces, pot-holes, etc. Other than driving my daughter to camp this summer and last (on the NYS Thruway), I drive mostly to the train and to the city. I haven't driven off the road, over tree stumps, into ditches, or anything like that. I don't drive over curbs, take high-speed jumps over hills, or drive fast over those stupid speed-bumps. Two of the wheels are bent. Can someone explain how this could possibly happen?
Both were steel wheels, which take much more abuse than Aluminum Alloy.
One was on a Ford Escort, the other on a Honda Accord.
The Ford POS was a factory steel wheel, the Honda was a snowtire on a winter steel wheel.
Both were bent when hitting a pothole. (Massachusetts is also full of them.)
Potholes bend wheels of all types, not just Acura wheels.
With that being said... these bends were obvious. Ya know, where the rim's edge has a bend in it, threatening the bead seal of the tire.
I'm not sure this is what you guys are talking about though.
I know that Acura has said the Vibration issue is sometimes caused by bent wheels.
This sounds more like a rim running somewhere out of true... not literally bent.
Correct?
That's ridiculous and if several people have the same problem, then it's obviously an issue that Acura should address.
I hope the Type-S wheels hold up better than these 04-06 wheels.
In fact, I wonder if Acura is already trying to address this issue.
I noticed that the 07 base model also gets new wheels.
They look like the once optional 17s
Hmm....
Had an 01 TL and now an 04 TL (60K+ miles), both with OEM alloy wheels and never had a problem. Perhaps if severely bad roads in your area, might want to consider a vehicle that has at least a 65 profile tire. The 45 tires on the current TL provide very little shock absorbing action because the sidewall is so narrow.
Have had Hondas in past also with alloy wheels and never a problem, even during road destructive winters and the potholes that they bring.
Give me a break - go read the forms from every car company that sells a car with low profile tires and you will see a few posts about tire wear and bent wheels.
I am somewhat surprised that Acura would agree to pay for 1/2 your tires while you are trying to take them to SMALL claims court. What that tells me is - even when the customer is a complete jerk - Acura still does the right thing.
I noticed that the 07 base model also gets new wheels.
They look like the once optional 17s
Maybe more plasible explanation is just a change in style. Car makers do this all the time.
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
I also drive a 45 series tires to and from work everyday on the same route mostly freeway, I know pretty well which exact spot on a certain lane to avoid to prevent tire/wheel damage. I will try to avoid any crack or uneven surface of the road. I never have a problem with pot hole for over five years here in USA.
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
The person driving through the big-dig -- I hope you have a strong roof!
BTW, there is no TSB for bent rims issued by Acura.
I would like to be able to say I have always been able to work out a small potatoes problem like this with a few phone calls and maybe a letter or two. But a few years ago I did have a situation where this was not possible. I could have went the legal route - choose not to - total problem was somewhere around $1,000.
Maybe this is because I have been involved in several legal disputes - I know what is involved.
But then I would use a real attorney - not some shyster that would take a $400 case.
Think that the best you can do and still keep same rolling circumference is 50 series. If you wanted 55, 60 or higher, you would still need to keep the same rolling circumference but your rim diameter would get smaller. This would probably be a clearance problem in that present rims used in 04-06 just barely clear the calipers. Smaller diameter rims would not clear calipers.
I generally let other people defend themselves, but your arrogance demands a response. Before you accuse someone else of having no knowledge of the law, consumer protection rights or anything else, perhaps you can explain what kind of idiot buys a $30k+ performance sedan without understanding what the hell he is buying? :confuse:
Acura didn't hide anything from you. They didn't sneak those 17" alloy wheels and 45 series performance tires on the car when you weren't looking. The fact that you apparantly have no knowledge of the difference between performance wheels and tires and standard ones is your problem, not Acura's.
It's people like you that give "consumer protection rights" a bad name. More like "protect me from my own ignorance rights". And the attorneys that pursue such frivolous cases are at the lowest end of the evolutionary chain. If you had spent even 10% of the time you've been posting your complaints on this forum researching the car you were buying before you bought it, you wouldn't be here. And probably off suing Toyota for making a Camry that doesn't corner as well as a TL.
There, I've got that off my chest. Now I can go drive my 911 with 19" wheels and 30 series tires over some nice big potholes and collect some real dough. :surprise:
The thing that I really just don't get is what attorney would take a case like this? I am starting to think you are just making this whole thing up.
Boy, the ride was bumpy...but dang if the car didn't handle like it was on rails !! My wife drove the car most of the time, and at gas stations, all the other guys would come over, admire the rims, and then lament...who scratched it all ? ( lots of parallel parking meant that all four wheels, and every single inch of the periphery , were scratched up...and very bad too....deep gouges...!!
The yokohams lasted only 15,000 miles...and were nearly bald !! I decided not to pursue it with Acura...though maybe I should have. However, summer grippy tires are known to last only thousands of miles...
No bent rims...even though the tires were only 1.5 inches thick ?!
At trade in, the Honda dealer was appalled at the damage to the rims, and asked for $750 to repair the rims...he still gave us a good trade in price !! OVer $28,500 !! What a nice car...and good thing lots of people want to buy it. Kids and wife wanted a minivan...so traded it in.
My dealer and the guys at Tire Rack suggested replacing the original 235/45 tires with 245/45's. Slightly wider tire that fits the rims better and bingo - no more rim scratches as the sidewall touches the curb first. The 245's result in a slightly larger overall diameter, but the factory speedometer/odometer settings were set too high, so that actually makes the readings more accurate.
http://expertpages.com/news/performance_tires.htm
TLhater, hopefully your judge knows little or nothing about cars or tires, and make sure that he or she does not see this article. Good luck!