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Good luck with the dealer. Ours was a pain and located far from the house so I just went to a tire shop that I trusted. I took the factory specs with me and made sure they met them.
Many people have reported the pulling to the right problem and that it took some effort to find a shop that would solve it. As I see it any shop can fix the alignment, some are just too lazy to do all the standard steps properly (i.e. add/subtract the shims as needed).
The Trooper does tend to follow the crown of the road. You can test this by finding a nice safe place to drive on the left side of the road and see where it heads. It should drift left.
An alignment shop that is capable of doing trucks can minimise this easily. You will find that you might not get rid of it completely, but enough to make it a non-issue. Just get it done quickly otherwise you will start scrubbing out the shoulders of the tires.
My dealer didn't give me the "design feature" story. This is the first time I heard that one. What they did say to me is that Jackaroo's do require a specialist shop to do the alignment and that their workshop was not equipped to do it. The dealer paid for a specialist shop to fix it under warranty.
That sounds more credible to me than wandering steering being a design safety feature.
-mike
Any good explanations?
FWIW, the guy that did our Trooper said it is a very typical design that can be aligned with any standard alignment machine. He said the problem comes in when mechanics try to take short cuts. Instead of dealing with annoying camber and caster shims they try to skip those steps and only set the easy to adjust toe-in.
If you still have the pulling it is probably worth calling the dealer and asking them if there are 2wd/4wd setting difference and verify they used the correct ones on your vehicle. Alternatively, you could go to an independent shop with your printout and ask them if they see any suspect settings that they suggest adjusting.
Also, on some level the technician was probably right about setting it "straight" causing problems. For example if he set a 0 caster angle and calls that "straight" then that would cause problems.
Bottom line, my Trooper pulled noticeably to the right when new and I got the "that is per the design" story. I took it to an alignment shop that put it in spec. The pull disappeared and my tires are wearing just fine 3 years later. Granted I can still ever so slightly follow a left or right road crown or be pushed sideways by wind.
They cited several possible reasons: Big pothole, when it was unloaded at the docks it was dropped a few feet onto the concrete, when it was tighted down to the truck too much during cross country shipping, when they backed it off the truck it dropped a few feet, etc. Basically some "jarring" event that caused the caster to be off.
It was covered under warranty...however it took several "I can't find anything wrong" trips to the dealer and 3 trips to an independent shop to get it resolved. Was it a major problem? No, but the amount of effort to solve the problem was too much. I still had to get the alignment after all was said and done at an independent shop to get it right...so it cost me probably $150 out of pocket and a lot of time.
Sometimes the tires will cause a little drift. My Trooper was tracking straight, then a few weeks ago I rotated the tires, and now it will drift left if I let go of the wheel. Pressure is equal L/R, so it has to be the tires. It is not a strong pull, though.
-mike
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I would like a table of this percentage vs SUVs across the market. Anyone know where to get such information?
1 qt every 1000 miles is extreme though. I would think 1qt every 3000 miles to be acceptable.
So far mine is doing well. No oil consumption at all and it has 53000 kms on the clock (or 32k miles). Generally running 10W-40 synthetic oil in it.
I have used Mobil One 5W-30 since day one.
If my engine burned a quart every 1K consistently, I wouldn't worry about it. It's that change that folks are talking about that's worrying.
It's interesting that sawas_e runs 10w40 - could the viscosity of the oil make a difference? Are those of you whose engines burn significant amounts of oil mostly using lighter weight oil?
Someone suggested before that the oil consumption might be due to oil evaporation(heat), so the driving sytle/pattern/habbit might have something to to with it as well. My truck spends most of its time at 3k rpm (highway) because of higher gearing.
While I agree it is not a problem to check (for me) and it doesn't mean that it is a "bad" engine, it makes it a tough vehicle for people not into checking or really able to. I.e. it isn't pratical for elderly, single mothers with kids, etc. I think a 1/2 a quart is reasonable per 3000 miles, but 1 quart per 1000 miles seems like a lot. A non-savy car person would then go into typical oil changes 3 quarts down.
Last night I watched a commercial tape from Moab Easter Jeep Safari - it was fun to watch some Jeeps have trouble with obstacles I walked up in my Trooper...and it really go me itching to go out there again, but ZuZoo VI is still 6 months away! Aargh!
Watching some of the trucks drag off of ledges had me looking forward to an improved departure angle with this new rear bumper...
So if you really want to detect your rate of burn, you need to check regularly and refill regularly.
And I use synth so I can go 5K between changes... but only if I check if frequently.
Again, it's the change that some folks are reporting that alarms me.
Oh, well. I do love my Trooper...
Philip
Philip
My concern is not the cost of adding oil or the burden of remembering to check frequently, but rather the nagging feeling that the increased consumption rate means there is something not quite right with the engine.
Any ideas?
My 02 gets its 1st oil change real soon!!! I bought mobil 1 10w30 dino oil and plan on adding a quart of synthetic. I plan on using a mobil 1 filter. Expensive, but everyone on the oil forum thinks Fram sucks. Personally never had problems with orange Fram filters but what's 5 more dollars twards the truck I love.
Anyone know what the factory fill oil is on the Troop?
I think my owners manual said 7500 miles between oil changes? Anyone know for sure?
What do you think a good break in milage is for the 1st oil change? I'm at 4200 and will probably go to 5000.
An earlier post seemed to suggest that an external oil cooler made some difference in oil consumption. I wonder if anyone else has had this experience.
..
BTW I also have been using the 5W30 Valvoline MaxLife because it makes the lifter noise go away and stay away as long as the full synthetic I was using.
http://www.valvoline.com/pages/products/product_detail.asp?Product=7
I think the http://www.redlineoil.com products are awsome, but the price is too high for engine oil use, even though RedLine will allow going a little longer between changes without too much risk of the lifter noise returning.
That's fine in the warmer months, but I find it quite noisy at startup in the colder months. That's why I switched to the 10W40 normally, and I may use 10W50 during the peak of our summer.
I personally know 5 owners of the 3.5V6 Jackaroo and none of them have oil consumption issues. One of these Jackaroos has 220,000km or 132,000m without any consumption. None of these run 20W50, but there is a mix of mineral, synthetic and semi-synthetic oils in this sample.
I'm starting to think this is a US thing.
FWIW, I've heard very good reports on using the Valvoline MaxLife & the Castrol equivalent for high mileage engines from my V-6 & V-8 SHO lists - especially with respect to oil seals.
There are some informative oil filter studies on the 'net that makes for some interesting reading.
I admit being more fanatical than most people, but I always do the first change on a new engine within 1000 miles. On a motorcycle I like to do it at 500.
I saw a few 02s in the Twin cities area advertized by dealers for the asking price of $20k. They seem to be dealer demo cars, since they have between 4000-6000 miles.
I went to one to see if they have an 02 LS, but they didn't. The salesman tried to "make a deal" on the Black S for $19.2k.
1. Recent trip from Henderson, N.C. to Charleston, S.C. and back,totaling 646 miles--mostly across flat country.
2. Air pressure (cold) was: 33 lbs front, 37 lbs. rear
3. Speed ranged from 65 mph to 75 mph with about 70 much of the time.
4. Mobil One oil used: 10-30
5. Vehicle carried 2 persons and normal luggage
6. Burned regular unleaded gas.
7. Vehicle was 99 Trooper with 29K miles.
8. Gas mileage was calculated to be:18.3 mpg.
Okay, how was the mileage, good? bad? or ugly?
Flyinlow - I think if you change your orig. factory fill oil at 1000 mi. you definately want to use a high quality syn. oil for the refill. New engines need TLC for their break in.
Boxtroop - I like the idea of the larger filter. What is the diff. on the bypass pressure setting versus the stock filter? I think that Purolator rated well on the data sheets I saw. I used a Mobil 1 filter ($10 but HEAVY DUTY) and a 20% synthetic Mobil 1 blend 10w30 for the fill.
Anyone know the maker of the original Isuzu oil filter? That thing was tough! Stubborn as a mule to get loose though. Or maybe I was weak from Turkey overdose.
I prefer to use the Mobil 1 or the K&N filter equivalent in my Gen II SHO but only because of concerns w/ the very high flow demands of the oiling system & pressure drop - flows 5 quarts through the sump about every 6 seconds @ 43 psi at 6400 rpms (12.1 GPM). Some filters haven't been tested past 3 GPM, IIRC. I'm not sure what our oil pump is rated for in the Troop. (anyone know?) but I doubt that it's as high as my full Yamaha engine...satisfied w/ the OEM Trooper filter at this time.
A couple of tips -
Try running your tyres at 36psi all round next time (front & back) on a trip like this. I find this has a significant effect on consumption. However not much is gained by going over 36psi. You will also find it steers and tracks better with the front at 36psi. (As an FYI...I have BFG A/T's running at 36psi all the time and there is no accelerated wear in the centre of the tread).
You will get much better mileage at 60mph. Mind you, I always set the cruise control to about 115kmh (70mph) anyway. OK, so I don't follow my own advice.
Use the cruise control as much as practical when on a long drive. Of course commonsense has to prevail as to when you use it.
Try all that and you might crack the 20mpg mark.
I'm assuming you're running 245/70R16 size tyres?
In US measures... 0.26qts every 3000 miles. 48000 miles on the clock.
To me, that's acceptable.
heng "Winter/Adverse Weather Driving Discussion" Dec 1, 2002 8:54pm
Thanks!
Steve, Host
-mike