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Comments
That operation eliminated the roof rack wind noise, makes it a lot easier to wash and dry, and gets rid of the special "water holder" feature the rails provided.
The only reason I am looking at the envoy, is because it has the 7 passenger option (I also looked at the TB, however I prefer the envoy).
Is there anyone out there that has had major problems with the suv, that don't recommend buying it?
Also, I noticed that they are currently giving out big discounts, is this because they are not selling well? I saw an ad that was selling the envoy XL SLE (2003) for 27,370 (MSRP is 33,220)
3100 Dealer discount
2750 GM discount
Thanks for any feedback.
Gino
GM has worked out lots of bugs on these during the first year of production. In fact, I bought mine in Spring '02 (A year after they were first introduced) and it is fine. With an '03 you'll probably be fine. I would say the only thing that really bugs me is the wind noise which seems like it comes from the driver side door. Take a test drive and get it out on the freeway to make sure the one you buy doesn't bug you this way. I have to admit though, it sure is a lot quieter than my '93 S10 Blazer ever was. If you like a lot of off the line power, get the V8, which is available on the extended version.
If not, the I6 is very smooth, with the power kicking in higher in the RPM range.
As far as the rebate being an indication of how these are selling, it's not. It's the economy. Everybody's offering rebates right now. The dealer discount is what you'd be getting anyway by talking him down from the astronomical MSRP.
Can anyone comment on what impact just removing the cross bars make? Is there a noticeable improvement in noise? I don't hear anything from the roof area but then again, it isn't the quietest vehicle in the world.
Paul P
Also, sorry to hear about so many problems with TB's. My '02 Envoy XL SLT's been great. Bought in May I now have almost 11K on it and its as tight as a drum and haven't had any problems. I feel I am getting my monies worth and at this stage in life (still having lots of fun at 49) I'd rather plunk down the cash for a vehicle of this substance than for a BMW. Or wait, give me the BMW as well! Actually, I'd rather have a Vette.
Chris
Chris
Typed it in, was told number was invalid.
I am going to try the GM help site mentioned within previous post
Chris
Ed
Ed
Ed
Don't you mean LIFT springs?
I have been looking around the search engines for lift kits for the Trailblazers, but not seen too much. Anyone have any more besides Belltech?
http://www.truckaddons.com/ Catalog/subpages/ground_force10.htm
http://www.djmsuspension.com/ Products/ProductsByMake/Chevy/Envoy.htm
both list kits for the non-air suspension 4 x 4's.
Remove the spaces in the URL to get the links.
I'd be really interested in the air level adjusting site calucyk mentions in 9083. I've not had any success doing a websearch. Combining that with a front kit might be an option.
Ideally, someone should come up with a kit that combines lowering coils with air bags to improve handling and retain the levelling function.
Joe Consumer decides to lease a vehicle, and to bring down his payment he pays a $2500 CAP reduction out of his pocket. This lowers his payment by $40/mo. Smartly, he also gets GAP insurance on the lease. A month later his brand new vehicle is totaled in an accident. His auto insurance pays most, but not all of the costs and GAP insurance covers the rest. However, he's still out the initial $2500 in cash he paid up front for the CAP reduction on the lease.
Mary Consumer leases an identical vehicle with NO out of pocket expenses. (ZERO CAP REDUCTION) She also pays for GAP insurance. Her payments are $40 higher per month than Joe's. She's putting on makeup while driving and also totals her vehicle after one month. Again, insurance pays for most of it and GAP covers the rest. But she walks away with no significant financial loss, other than the $40 more she paid in monthly payment than Joe for the month she drove the car...(and the broken mirror in her compact)
The moral: Before you pay the CAP Reduction, figure out whether you're accident prone or if you live in an area full of careless morons that are apt to hit you...
If so, can you tell me where you put the CB and where you put the Antenna?
I have plans to install a radio and would like to minimize the look of the antenna.
Thanks,
Matthew
m_griffin@auhsd.k12.ca.us
Frank
Frank
hth, tim
http://service.gm.com/gmtechlink/arcv_pdf/5_01_e.pdf
go to page 6 of 8.
Enjoy
you were ripped off. i had mine installed for only $250.
anybody with the same experience?
So, it's passive voice when referring to Joe and it's someone else's fault?
She's putting on makeup while driving and also totals her vehicle after one month.
So, Mary is doing something mindless and trivial and she causes the accident?
How about we say that Joe was busy gossiping on his cell phone and caused a 30 car pile up while Mary's car was totalled by some goosehead who busy preening himself in his rear view mirror?
Let's try to be a bit more sensitive to ALL Town Hall members!
tidester, host
Anyway GM does have an general installation guide for radio installation:
http://service.gm.com/techlineinfo/radio.html#top
Some of the info might be a bit extreme like running the power leads through the firewall directly to the battery which I would certainly agree with if you were running a 100 Watt ham rig that pulls 20 Amps. Your 5 Watt CB won't pull more than a couple of Amps and if you have a good match to the antenna the RF will radiate outside the vehicle. GM of course has the customary disclaimer.
ficuss I do remember your concerns and I appreciated them at the time as well as now. I think that might have been my first post to this board. What I got from that original question was a number of opinions and several email replies from people who had done radio installs in their triplets and a good basis to make my decision to go ahead and try it.
I guess to me it seems like Mary is the scenario one wouldn't want to follow. If I were a woman I would be very offended. Hell, I'm offended and I'm a guy.
In any case, life is a gamble and there are thousands and thousands of "what-if scenarios". It's obvious this person doesn't know much about leasing as in well over 75% of the lease contracts INCLUDE GAP insurance and hardly anyone pays extra for it. Further, Why pay the $40 a month interest worrying about a "what-if" situation? The simple fact is, if the terms of the lease are met and, like a mojority of leasees, the car is turned in at the end of the lease then the interest is saved and everything is fine.
As an accountant I deal every day in hard facts. I see too many people who look to the "what-ifs" in life and don't mind paying dearly to keep those "what-ifs" from hurting a little less. Meanwhile they deglect to look at the things that are GOING to happen regardless and try to make them sting less.
Ok, off my soap box now. Lets just say this to all of you people who try to play "Finance Guy".
I've been in the business. I've done this numerous times. I know my financial situation and my reason for not adding a quickly depreciating asset to my portfolio (Ok, stocks aside, these days). I've researched it and researched it and found a plan that works for me. I spend much less money than a lot of people and I have two nice, new vehciles every two years.
By the way, I'm also a financial consultant and people pay me for this advice usually.
Anyway, you know that the last person to work on a car or any thing for that matter is usually the first to be blamed for the next problem. If you accept that premiss, don't be too upset when the dealer blames you for the next problem.
By the way, remember the signs along the side of the road advising drivers of a blasting site nearby, and asking drivers to NOT use ANY radio transmitting equipment near there?
Frank
Basically, when compared to it's competitors of just a slightly higher or equal price range, the Envoy did not score well at all. Its main high points were: Bargain-basement price, very cool looks, DOHC in-line six-cylinder. But, the low points centered on: Blowzy handling, early-Hyundai interior.
The worst points were clearly the overtly soft, springy suspension, and the very cheap, dime-store interior, as said in their words. The handling was clearly the worst, and the ride spongy and "trucky" (that one got me too?). In addition, the interior was befitting of a much cheaper, much lower quality car from many decades ago, and was not at all impressing. It was also said that the engine, while a standout when the vehicle is tested alone, is quite lackluster when put up against such awesome competition.
It was the cheapest vehicle in the group, but was clearly visible as such. All I can say, is that it lost even behind an ancient Land Rover Discovery, with it's old Buick engine, and off-road suspension, and meriting its own share of negative comments.
It's a great read, if you don't have a subscription, you should go pick it up....even if it doesn't make you happy to read...
They all have brand new part numbers and the old part numbers have been discountinued.
The parts are on order and nobody can give me a clear time frame of when they will arrive.
So much for loading up with big Xmas packages or taking the dog for a ride!
GMC SUCKS!!!
Anybody?
As far as unexplained problems caused by RF, yep that's possible (anything is) but that's exactly why GM would test these vehicles in a high RF environment- to prevent catastrophic failure or weird glitches. I have had none of the strange unexplainable electrical problems described here, transmitting in my TrailBlazer or otherwise. Getting blamed for a problem: that's why I did a no holes-no mods radio install. I can remove everything in about 5 minutes "just in case". Oh, and that antenna mount stuck to my window? That's for my "scanning receiver" I use on an occasional trip. In case anyone wonders.
Regarding the GAP insurance... It may be included on 75% of leases from dealer finance companies like Ford Red Carpet and GMAC, but it's not automically included by all. GeCAP and some other banks/finance companies (the OTHER 25%) sell it as an add on. (it SHOULD be included in all leases IMHO) We just looked at a lease an 03 Isuzu Ascender and the GAP insur. was NOT included in the deal. The Cost: $300 extra. I'm an advocate FOR leasing... I've leased my last 4 cars and like our beloved CFP, I've seen the benefits of having a new car every 2-3 yrs...
The whole point wasn't about the GAP to begin with -- it was to point out that paying a large CAP reduction COULD be a bad idea...
From one Radio Man to another
Happy Holidays
Frank
As to the VW, what a gross, overweight PIG! It's smaller than the Envoy, yet weighs more than a full size Tahoe! Plus it gets the fuel mileage of a full size 4X4 pickup. Oh boy! The Germans stuffed way to many pastries in this puppy. Alert the FDA, we aren't the only ones with an obesity problem!
GAM
All that "country, religious, rock" stuff is part of the RDS system that is supposed to ID the station on the radio display, show song titles and a bunch of other stuff. You can set the radio to only stop on specific types of programming (country, religious, rock etc) . Problem is, hardly any FM stations send out that signal! One handy thing it will do is if you do find a station that sends out the RDS signal and IDs on the display, after a minute or two on that station, you can press the HR and MIN buttons together and the clock will (usually) update and set to the radio stations time.
I agree with other TB and Envoy owners who have stated for the price these vehicles are darn good.
PS. I like the way my XL handles but I've got ECAS as recommended by Motor Trend for superior ride and handling.
Chris
"WASHINGTON (AP) - The Bush administration approved a modest increase Thursday in fuel economy for sport utility vehicles and small trucks, beginning with the 2005 model year, administration sources said.
The change is the first since 1996, when Congress imposed a freeze on the federal fuel economy requirements on automakers.
The Transportation Department will require fuel economy for SUVs, pickup trucks and minivans to increase by about 1.5 miles per gallon over three years beginning with the model 2005 vehicles that arrive in showrooms in late 2004, said the sources, who spoke on condition of anonymity.
Automakers currently must meet a fleet average fuel economy of 20.7 mpg for the "light truck" category that includes SUVs, minivans and pickups."
My rule of thumb is that if you can't afford the mo.payment without anything down then you're looking at too expensive of a vehicle.
I look at insurance dedcuctables in a similar way. To carry a $0 comprehensive coverage on my cars cost me very little compared to a $250 or $500 deductable. Not worth it for me as even one new windshield and or a shopping cart could counter the savings. I eventually took it so far as to lower my collision down to zero, but that's just me. $780 year on a $35k vehicle to get full comp/collision is worth the peace of mind.
"The moral: Before you pay the CAP Reduction, figure out whether you're accident prone or if you live in an area full of careless morons that are apt to hit you...
Oh, the Honda Pilot is boring looking and it drove just like the MDX. It also lacks many options.
Since I have problems paying MSRP for any vehicle, the Acura is not an option. We drove the Highlander and it drove like a Camary. Very nice, but seems to lack power and size. The HL always has bland styling IMO. The 4Runner is even smaller inside, but has better styling.
Toyota is out.
Nissan is way behind in the "car-like" SUV market. They still depend on their Pathfinder and QX4. These vehicles are nice, but again, small inside. Their new Murando isn't any bigger.
Nissan is out.
So now I am looking to go American. However, I am very reluctant to make this move. I am concerned about the vehicle quality after 3 or 4 years.
We own a Honda Prelude right now and it has been bulletproof.
The Envoy is the best mid-sized SUV in terms of American vehicles. It has good style and many nice features. 17" wheels standard is also nice.
I realize the Trailblazer and Bravdo are essentially the same vehicles, just don't like their looks as much as the Envoy.
I can get any GM through their supplier program which I am still learning about. I guess I can buy a GM vehicle slightly under invoice price. Anyone ever done this?
Anyone seriously consider a Ford Explorer before buying their Envoy? I'd be interested in hearing your feedback.