Subaru Impreza Outback Sport & TS

bluesubie

Most cats can clear a 4ft fence with no problem. ;-)

-Dennis

ateixeira

DOH! I swear, he barks! ;-)

-juice

armac13

and a lot of patience to teach a cat to bark. You should be proud of yourself Juice. ;~)

Ross

celeste2

Sweet ride and sweet little doggie. My cat's taking her first ride in my OBS tomorrow to get her yearly, but won't know much anyway from inside her little kitty carrier...

if she's not good, I'll floor it... still is a thrill even tho' I have an automatic, because that Ganzflow just makes it kind of take off...

ateixeira

OK, I gotta call my therapist. Wait a sec, you ARE my therapist! %*}

-juice

brekke

how hard would it be to install a new shift boot? I am not mechanically inclined.

ateixeira

It should be quite easy. I took the center console apart to install the STi shift lever, and it's just a matter of finding the bolts and unscrewing them.

I didn't look at the shift boot specifically, but I was able to obtain access to it within a few minutes.

-juice

brekke

how does one remove the shift knob? Do you screw it off or wrench it off? Can I put any shift knob on there, or are imports and domestics different sizes? I saw a nice-looking leather shift knob at JC whitney but I'm worried it won't fit.

shift knob

ateixeira

Screw it off, counter-clockwise to remove it. I think the boot snaps on/off.

The JC model is different. It slides on and then fastens from the side with an allen-type screw. It's not as secure.

Some stuff from JC Whitney is cheap, others are fine. I'd stick with the OE leather shift knob, which I have and cost me something like $38 IIRC. The trick is the bottom mates well with the shifter boot (snaps on), and universal replacements usually don't (the base is often thicker and does not match up well).

-juice

brekke

yes, I figured I'd probably be better off with the OEM knob and I'm looking into an OEM boot. JC has wheelskins leather shift boots for $18, which is very cheap, and as I've mentioned I'm happy with the quality of my wheelskins steering wheel cover.

ateixeira

Well, you could get it all from them, since it'll match. The only catch is you'd have to lift the center console, but it isn't very hard to do that.

-juice

celeste2

When you comin' down to the sunshine state? Hey if we hook up my son can disable your daytime running lights if you want. They can then just be re-plugged back together if at anytime you want them back on!

He probably could put on that shifter boot, too, as long as you get one that is known to fit. He's had my center console out a few times already. AND taken off my shift knob (I practically panicked the first time he had all that suff apart until he showed me how quickly he could get it all back together.)

brekke

that would be great, Celeste, but I'd most likely fly down to FL. I will definitely get in touch if/when I make any plans.

paisan

Come to one of the I-club meets and they'll fix the DRLs and one guy in queens actually sells the shift boots. I think there is a meet sat in Alley Park IIRC.

-mike

brekke

yes I would like to go to one of those meets.

I ordered a 20mm sway bar and then I specially ordered some bushings. The bushings didn't fit and I didn't have an accurate way of measuring the sway bar so I took the circumference and got the diameter from that because I assumed the size of the bar refers to the diameter (which came to 17.5mm)

Aren't the bushings supposed to fit snug? And does the size of the bar refer to the diameter? I want to exchange the sway bar if they sent me the wrong one but I'm not sure if the sway bar is wrong or the bushings are wrong. *sigh* I doubt the dealer is going to help me out.

If anyone knows the part #s of the sway bars to the WRX wagon and sedan, that would be helpful. The part# on my sway bar is 20451FE010.

ateixeira

Ask that question over in Subaru Crew - Modifications. I think Ken has the part numbers for the 18mm bar, and that might help you. He drives a Forester and may not follow this thread.

Yes, you do need different bushings for each size sway bar. They compress a little, so you may have to press hard to bolt on the bushings, but if it really doesn't fit you probably have the wrong sizes.

-juice

Karen_S

Don't forget tonight's chat!



KarenS
Host
Owner's Clubs

burnsmr4

Hi, folks,

As of sometime tomorrow afternoon, I hope to be a certifided Subaru Crew discussion type with either a 2002 Forester S or a 2002 Outback Sport. I'd like to hear some input from both camps before I make a decision tomorrow. Just so you know -- this message will be cross-posted in both discussion areas -- try not to reply twice. ;-)

Forester S Impressions:

I really LOVE the Forester S, and it's my first choice. Only cost will keep me from having it. It's all the crap that comes on the S models around here in Atlanta -- I only want the armrest extension and the filtration system. Alas, metro-Atlanta dealerships are hawking the loaded S and S premium models.

Things I like about this car -- ride height, tall roofline, cargo space, alloy wheels, and the standard features. I'm coming down from an underpowered V-6 automobile, and the Forester just seems downright peppy and sporty in comparison. Go figure.

Outback Sport Impressions:

I'm test driving this cheaper alternative tonight From my research, I've discovered that the legroom and headroom measurements aren't too different from the Forester S. The same engine and 16" wheels are also pluses for the Outback Sport. The bad thing is the loss of cargo space -- one of the reasons I like the Forester S.

Things I like about this car -- I love the black and greystone finish on the one I'm looking at. I think it's the best color combo available. Also, I like the sporty, Audi A4/S4 Avant-ish look to the roofline (I'm totally off on that, but it's the first thing I think of).

Decision Issues:

Cost aside, what am I losing if I don't get the Forester S? Is the ride height similar on the Outback Sport? I'll miss the 6-disc changer in the Outback Sport, but I can live without it. What about REAL space front seat and back seat? Is there a REAL difference in terms of comfort? I know that the Outback Sport doesn't have rear seat headrests -- that's part of the comfort equation in my book. Is the Outback Sport cargo space seriously deficient? With the seats up, of course? Finally, what about driving quality? Which one is smoother/quieter, and which one is faster off the line? I'd expect the lighter Outback Sport to be faster.

Any help (general -- don't be too specific or try and scare me off with horror stories) is greatly appreciated. Thanks, and I look forward to hanging out here in the near future.

Later,
burnsmr4

ateixeira

What can I say? Both good choices. I'll talk about what I like about the OBSport here, the Forester in that thread. :-)

The OBS is a bargain, no doubt. For the price, you get sporty looks and alloys, ABS and AWD, the works. Only a moonroof is missing, and you could get an aftermarket model for about $900.

Resale is good, so even if your needs change, you should be OK when it's time to trade it in. I can see that happening only if you add a couple of family members, or adopt 3 large dogs.

Reliability is good, too, plus the warranty is pretty long. Many of these also apply to the Forester.

During my test drive, I did find the Outback Sport to be smoother and quieter than the Forester, because it is more car-like. It did not feel quicker off the line, and I did drive a 5 speed. Call it even.

So, how do you decide? Get behind the wheel. The OBS has less space but costs less (parity), so choose the one that is more fun-to-drive. The driver with the bigger smile is always happiest.

-juice

aajoslin

Last time I checked my 2002 OBS had rear headrests... Unless they recalled them while I wasn't looking! ;-) If the front seats are pushed back all the way, you may have to take the rear headrests off to lay down the rear seats, but there definitely are headrests... even a low-profile one in the middle.

If it was up to me (and it was last August) I'd get the OBS... This is a biased and prejudiced opinion, as I never drove the Forester.

celeste2

Will you be hauling alot of stuff all the time? The cargo area on the Forester is boxlike so that is what gives the spacious interior in the back. If you have to haul boxy stuff that would fit that type space, you probably should get that. I don't think the Forester has more than 2 cu. ft. more space in the back, though compared to the OBS.

I agree with your color choice. I have black with very dark black tint and it gets looks ALL the time. Bear with me all of you that have seen this photo, but I'm posting for burnsmr4:

celeste2

Oh yeah, if you get the OBS take those cross-rails off the roof racks. It makes the car look so much better!

ateixeira

I agree. It looks better without them on the OBS, but better with them on the Forester. Maybe it completes the SUV look on the latter.

-juice

paisan

Paint that bottom black and you have a classy car!

-mike

burnsmr4

Hi, folks,

This is great feedback. As I noted in the Forester discussion, I thought the OBS was a really cramped left and right. The headroom, however, was great. Why is the passenger front seat jacked up, though? Lower it a little Subaru! I was left looking for that height adjustment.

I was pleasantly surprised to find the rear headrests too. You were right. There was a bunch of stuff in the back for hauling cargo -- more than what was listed on the sticker. Cool stuff.

Celeste2 -- I drove the same car you posted. Is that YOUR house in the back? Nice! Well, anyway...I drove the exact same car and loved the look. Nimble too.

Unfortunately, for the next 2-3 days, my purchase of either vehicle has been put on hold. The buyer of my car bailed after he couldn't get financing. He's young, and I was worried he wouldn't get the credit rating he needed for the loan. Oh, well.

Keep those suggestions coming. I'm reading every one of 'em. I'll join this group if I have to sell my future children for a Subaru. ;-)

Later,
burnsmr4

armac13

What is the "child futures" market like these days?
;~)

Ross

ateixeira

Check out the preview pics of the Forester under Future Models. Looks a little more aggressive, a little bigger for 2003.

-juice

brekke

I haven't driven the Forester, but the more I drive my OBS the more I like it. When I first took delivery, I admit I had mixed feelings. Not any more!(well, except for a mild case of WRX envy. OK, not so mild.) The total driving experience is such a pleasure. (However, this is coming from someone whose two previous cars were manufactured in the '80s.)

Sure, I fantasize about upgrading eventually to a "better" car but my OBS drives so nicely, with so little drama, that it would be hard to give her up.

One of my coworkers is a VW nut (I do like their looks) but the body lean just maneuvering in the parking lot with his Passat wagon was giving me motion sickness. Could I be mistaken that it's worse than our Subies?

celeste: I love that tint, woman!

ateixeira

I too felt that Passats were sprung a bit softly. Closer to an Outback than it is to a Legacy GT.

-juice

brekke

I think it's worse when you're a passenger! No steering wheel to hold onto.

twrx

Burnsmr4, Here is my perspective on this comparison. I traded in a 98 forester L on a 02 WRX wagon. Granted there are some not so subtle differences between a wrx and an obs but in terms of performance, but they are the same basic shell.
I would go for the OBS. Yes the Forester has been a bit more useful for large cargo but my wrx is quieter, smoother, handles better, and has better seats. I think that the obs has height adjuster on the driver seat like the wrx. There is more front seat legroom on the passenger side than my previous Forester and that translates to a better back seat ride for the passenger in back of it. The Forester was nicer for small storage. There were more compartments including the sunglasses one in the ceiling, the cargo area side bins, the dash compartment and the armrest compartments that the wrx lacks.

btw, I am 6' and 250 lbs and both cars fit me well. I'm glad that Subaru designs cars fore the real world.

TWRX

newobslvr

Hello, all--

Just wanted to let you all know the odd tire has been replaced with a matching RE92. What a drag! But, thanks for all your input. Was just a case of a tire illiterate making a big goof. All seems to be well now--

Thanks again,
Kim

newobslvr

Hi Burns,

I leased a Forester L for 3 years before I bought my OBS this past July. The Forester was terrific and I don't think you could go wrong with either.

For me, the biggest difference is just in the style and image. Yes, the Forester had a little more room, but it is more of a suv wannabe. The OBS is just a kick... it just "feels" a lot more sporty and fun. And the space loss was surprisingly less than I expected. I have been comfortable as have been my passengers (a few of which are larger folks), and I still have plenty of space in the back for my bike and whatever other stuff I happen to be schlepping around.

Good luck! Let us know how things finnaly pan out for you--

Kim

PS And don't ever put a different tire on, no matter what! Sigh.

ateixeira

twrx brings up some good points. The 2003 Forester will get the same improvements the 2002 Impreza got, i.e. more refined, quieter, better ride, seats, and probably that height adjuster. It might even appear in dealers as soon as May.

-juice

celeste2

Paisan: I actually fantasized the car in an all-over drop-dead anthracite. Yeah!!

Burns: No way, dude! Not my house--Rollins College campus here in Winter Park Florida, very Mediterranean and very beautiful. (Hint: see how the curb is painted red?)

Brekke: heh, heh, I knew this car would win you over. Isn't it a thrill to drive on curves? The pickup even with the automatic transmission is great. The other day I saw a Porsche Boxter behind me at a red light. I was the first in line waiting to turn left fron a single lane. Well, the light changes and I'm ready, so I naturally floor it and you know how fast you can maneuver and turn at the same time. He swings into the right lane anticipating my car is going to slow him down. Sor-ry! I shot out ahead so far of him that he got stuck behind a slower car--poor guy... how humiliating...

but here's the clincher--if I really feel I need extra takeoff speed I'll start from first and shift up, but this time I left it in drive!! yuk, yuk, yuk....

Brekke you gotta get that Ganzflow, it's a beautiful thing!!

brekke

Are there any downsides to the GanzFlow? Will I lose torque or power at any point as opposed to stock? I can't decide, but it seems like a worthwhile mod.

celeste2

I know some of the "experts" argue about some low end loss, I believe is what they say, but in all practicality, I don't see it myself and can tell you the car feels like a little rocket with the Gansflow even though the hp gains are supposed to be slight. Now I'm contemplating an exhaust but will have to give it careful thought because the cavernous back end of the wagon will amplify exhaust sounds and I don't want a big noise factor.

ateixeira

Consider a pulley, then. The UR Underdrive Pulley is lighter than stock and drives the accessories a little slower. If you're not a big A/C user, they claim a 5hp gain, but what you really get is better throttle response, because it revs up much quicker.

-juice

celeste2

yeah, we bought one then sent it back when we found out what it would do with the A/C, and believe me, we use the A/C seriously most of the year round, except for a few cold spells...

I know there are ways to do exhausts to tone them down but will do more research when I get there.

burnsmr4

After much debating and financial wrangling over a 2002 Forester S and a 2002 Outback Sport, I turned out to be...

A FORESTER KIND OF GUY!!!

I got a nearly loaded 2002 Forester S for about $500 under Edmunds.com TMV in Atlanta, GA. Burgundy/graystone paint scheme. Automatic transmission. After a test drive in a loaded 2002 Outback Sport (a sweet little ride in its own right), I just couldn't stand not having the cargo room and extra space.

Sorry folks, but I was replacing a '99 Mercury Cougar V-6 -- a car that was plagued with little fit and finish issues. Although it was a sweet looking little coupe, I had to find something more reliable, more practical, and driveable by a fiancée WITHOUT manual transmission driving skills.

The Forester won by a slim margin, given that I could've saved a buttload on the OBS. Oh, well. What matters is...

I FINALLY GOT MY SUBARU!

Later,
burnsmr4

celeste2

Hey Burns, congratulations! I'm sure you'll be extremely pleased with your new car. Have you gotten to drive around in any snow yet?

burnsmr4

...in Georgia?

[Keels over dead from choking on his own uncontrollable laughter.]

;-)

burnsmr4

lisabuff

I just bought, well going on a month and a half now.. a 2002 Outback Sport. I seem to have an odd problem..water. My windows are constantly steamed up.. actually more than steamed.. downright wet. Now only once can I say it was due to heavy breathing.. does anyone else have this problem?? Its driving me nuts, the entire car is steamed over and I cant see out the windows!

paisan

Have you tried the defroster?



-mike

lisabuff

Im a woman but Im not that dumb!!...yeah, I tried the defroster!! Actually its so wet on the back window it takes a good 20 minutes to clear the inside of the window. For the side windows im stuck running the heat out the top vents (freezing my toes).. just to get the front window clear enough to see out of!

paisan

Strange.... I'll think about it over lunch.

-mike

dielectric7bb

I don't know if the subbies do this automatically, but turning the AC on with defrost can help drop the moisture in the car down. Is the heater/defroster blowing HOT? I know when mine is on (not a subie) it can really burn once warmed up Also you don't want to recirculate the air. So if you can select where the ventilation system pulls it's air from, either inside or outside or mixed, picking the outside or mixed setting can help.

lisabuff

Yeah, my settings are on the fresh air... I hate to turn the AC (or have to turn on the AC) when its only 20 degrees outside! even if I had the thing on recirculate it should never get to the point where the windows are dripping.. and it gets there within a couple minutes of being in the car!

armac13

I use the A/C more in the winter than I do in the summer. In Vancouver the humidity is very high in the winter (ok, it rains all the time) and A/C is the best way to dry all the windows.

Ross

bluesubie

IIRC, the owner's manual even recommends to use the a/c when defrosting the windows. The temp setting doesn't have to be on cool when using the a/c.

If you think it's an issue, have the dealer check it out.

-Dennis