Input from a mom who doesn't want to project a "mom" image......around upstate NY "mom-mobiles" are mini vans and SUV's, especially the really big SUV's. So, now my husband drives the Explorer, and I drive the new Outback - Wintergreen of course!
This week my suspension is quiet again!? Last week, whenever I hit a bump or dip in the road, no matter the speed, the suspension would creak. The seat thing has also been intermittent. Still plenty of brake noise to let my fellow drivers know I am around. I have never noticed the pinging in the dash...until it was brought up here. Now, I think hear it sometimes. The power of suggestion.
Hey, I am single. I am in New England. I have a Subaru. I am actually just back on the market and my thinking was that the Subaru might make a statement about who I am and my values. If and when I get my next date, I hope she will be impressed when she gets into my luxuriously appointed vehicle with heated leather seats and pseudo wood trim and all the other features. So, I would not hold back on buying a Subaru because of any image issues. But, then again, what other answer would one expect when the question is asked of this forum?
First of all - hello again. I read every day but haven't felt compelled to add my thoughts in a while.....we truely love the OB, hubby steals it every chance he can. However, there are reasons that I prefer to drive the Explorer some times, and times when I think it may get replaced with something even a bit larger. Hopefully the new Forester in a few years will do the trick, if we can hold out that long. I do agree however, that the majority of the people who drive the large SUV's don't really have a valid reason for it other than image.
-I have a terrible time seeing at night, oncoming headlights blind me. Add wet roads and it's almost dangerous. In the Explorer I'm sitting above most of the lights of oncoming cars.
-We really need 6 passenger seating - my kids are old enough that often they each want to bring a friend along, especially on weekends to our camp. The Explorer is a manual trans also, thus only 5 passenger. Having to always negotiate who gets to bring a friend when we go somewhere is a pain.
-We also want light off road capability with AWD or 4WD, and we like manual transmissions
-We need at least the interior cargo capacity of the OB since we take our pets with us also, and still need to use a carrier up top to accomodate all the luggage plus fishing gear, etc. I absolutely refuse the drive a mini van.
So, my dream vehicle is probably the bigger Forester, but given the choices available today it would be something along the lines of the Durango, if only I could get the gas milage and have as much fun as in my OB!
Valid reasons for sure. I'm sure we can all agree you're in the minority, though.
Just a suggestion - you could lift a Forester's seat up a bit using spacers. Z3 owners have done this to lift the front about 1", so I imagine it could be done for the Forester also.
FWIW, there will be many new choices with 3 rows of seats. Check out the Suzuki XL7 for a smaller one, and the new Explorer should offer that option, too.
Our 18 month old is still a bit young to bring along guests, so I guess I'm not there yet!
HI everybody I get a kick out reading all the posts whingeing about gas milage. you guys in the states never had it so good, for instance at the minute I drive a 1993 Honda Accord wagon auto, which I dearly love, but due to changing circumstances I hope to change for a late model outback around March 2001, back to the Honda it has 135 horsepower, no all wheel drive gets around 24mpg. city and 30mpg. highway on a Canadian gallon, gas at the minute here is averaging $3.60 a gallon and has been as high as $4,00, so if anybody is entitled to a good whinge about gas milage it is your poor neighbours to the north eh. have agood day everybody. Pat.
The only problem with lifting the seats is that I probably wouldn't be able to reach the gas pedal Not to mention pushing the clutch in all the way.... This is exactly why I insist on getting the power driver seat as an option if it isn't standard. I hope I don't have to make any decision until the new Forester comes out though, that would mean getting close to 10 years out of our Explorer - yikes!!!
As you'll learn one day in the not too distant future, it's a lot easier to take two extra kids along than to have one brooding all weekend while the other enjoys smug superiority!
Hi. I am looking to buy a used Legacy AWD wagon. My budget has me looking between '93 and '96. I saw a '93 Legacy L AWD wagon today with 83K miles on it. I seems to be in good shape but was a little weak on acceleration - compression? Something that concerns me is that the 'check engine' light is always on. The seller says his mechanic says that the engine is fine and it is nothing to worry about - just a short or something. The seller wants $6800 for it. I intend to have a mechanic look at it later this week. Does this sound fair? Any comments/advice? I am quite surprised how pricey these cars are for their age and mileage, but I really want the AWD. Also, any info/advice on driving a Legacy AWD wagon on a beach would be appreciated. Thanks! -Piglet
Thanks for the reality check, Pat! I'm happy with my Forester's mileage, it's better than my 1.6l Miata, believe it or not.
Jeannette: I'm sure by then Subaru will have a 7-seater that runs on tap water and flies.
Piglet: a CEL on a '93? That could be a bad O2 sensor. It could also be your cat. Find out before you buy.
The '93 isn't going to have the ground clearance for the beach, at least not soft sand.
I think the 2nd gen came out in '95, and the Outback model that same year. In '96 it got a lift and a bigger engine, so that may be the minimum for you to drive on a beach.
'97 they dropped the premium fuel requirement and got 10 more horses. If you can afford it at all, try to get a '97 or newer Outback. You may even have a tad left on the powertrain warranty.
Hey Piglet! Time to update your profile...it says you are looking for a Toyota.
Re the CEL on the '93. My '88 Mercury Tracer, now driven by my kids, has had its CEL light on and off at apparently random intervals since 1993 and it's had a new exhaust and cat since then. If the cat is not working right you'll probably fail emissions anyway. In my case I assume it's the O2 sensor, but we've all kind of got used to it now so I don't worry.
Yes, there are a few missing posts due to the transition to new platform. It takes almost 24 hours to copy out the data, re-format it and then move it into the new system. Any post made from Wednesday night through early Friday afternoon will have been lost. Sorry for any confusion and inconvenience!
I presently own a '97 cutback with 42K on the meter. I love the car but find it uncomfortable on long drives. Since I just began a new job with a 70mi round trip commute I need a good ride. I'm thinking of the '01 Limited hoping the leather is a more comfortable seat. Just like to get some feedback before I drop 26K. Also, are there any other pros/cons on the '01?
The fact that you guys lost message is idiotic to very least. Being soft. eng. I'd never expect such a stupidity from any minimally popular website. We come to this site only to read each others opinions... and you just lost about 100 of them. It sucks I mean it.
I just bought a new 01 OB and have two questions. 1. Does it matter what kind of gas you put in? I think I can put in regular but should I put in premium once in a while? 2. Can I get oil changes at a reputable garage instead of Subaru dealership? Being a H4, I'm thinking that a regular garage might have some problem with it.
My sister has a VW Passat and I have a new 01 OB which I just bought. Recently, I had a chance to compare the two. I think the Passat is a more comfortable car and the interior is more luxerious. For example, when you go over a small bump, in an OB you hear the bump and feel it whileas, in the Passat, when you go over the same bump, you hear the bump but don't feel it. Of ofcourse the bump has to be a small one.
The Passat's inside seems more roomy but I'm thinking that this might be because of the OB's dash. In the Passat the driver's dash is flush with the front passenger's dash but in the OB the driver's dash sticks out in front of the passenger's dash. Maybe that's why it seems more cramped inside.
But still you can't beat the price of 24k and an excellent AWD with a better reliablity record than the Passat. But I wonder how the 4 motion 5-speed auto in the Passat compares with the 4-speed AWD with viscous limited rear differential? Is the 4motion audi's equivalent of VDC?
Since everybody talks about this missing item, has anyone found how to install a light that will help getting the key in when it is dark. Does SOA make an add on?. I have a 01' OB Limited and really miss the light, but am getting better all the time hitting the slot!
I am think about buying an OB Wagon Base model with anywhere between 10,000 - 16,000 miles, and I cannot find any information on costs, because the bluebook info. for 2000 models has not come in yet.
For a base model w/ 10,000 miles, the dealer first number is 21,000 but then I got him to say that he would have to make 19,700 in order to make a bit of money. Does anyone have any info. that would give me an idea of what a good price is for a used w/ the miles i mentioned above?
Also, I am looking at an OB Ltd wagon w/ 26,000 miles, in perfect condition, any suggestions what a good price would be here?
I don't *think* this topic is frozen--if it were, there would be a "read-only" icon by the topic heading. Everyone was either outdoors playing in the snow in their Soobies or wanna-be posters got hit by the login/not posting bug (that's being swatted shortly, so I hear).
Steve Edmunds.com Town Hall co-host Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories conferences
I wonder if I will be able to post now. The past few days have not been good on the Edmunds front. The hosts and all involved have my sympathy. Any one who has every done a software role-out with a lot of data conversion knows about the grief involved.
Anyway, to try my question for the sixth time, I think.
Does anyone know a simple check to confirm if the air con is working properly? It has been about 35 Celsius today (about 95F) and I am not keeping cool. I may have to fall in the pool to chill a bit, but even that is solar heated to 30C (about 86F).
Somehow, I think my son's hopes for a white Christmas may not come off.
You should be able to hear the A/C compressor cycle on/off if you toggle the A/C button. It may take a second or two after switching it on before it kicks on. For a quick cool down (provided the compressor is working), my Outback manual suggests you turn the recirculate button on until the cabin temp is stabilized.
Here in Kenosha, WI, we're pretty much guaranteed a white Christmas. Yesterday, we received 5 inches of snow and could get an additional inch from lake effect snow this morning. This is in addition to the 14+ inches already on the ground from last weeks' snow. And the temps aren't expected to get out of the low 20's (-6 or so Celsius) this week through Christmas.
hutch7: The '01 Legacy/Outback (and the '00) is built on an all-new chassis and body structure. The rear suspension is all-new too. Although the previous generation was a solid car, the new ones are considerably more so. Also the engineers have taken another big bite out of the H4's famed NVH (Noise Vibration Harshness) quotient. OTOH the interior is still a Subie interior, meaning that the seat construction is probably going to be pretty much the same as the earlier model. So the answer to your question really depends on your definition of "comfort". If the seat simply doesn't suit you, the new car's seat may not either. My personal experience with '00 leather vs. cloth is that the leather has less pronounced side bolsters; for me that meant I liked them less, and chose to go with cloth seats. I wish the lumbar support were greater, and I've heard that from others too, but it is enough so that I do not exit the car with a backache even after the longest drives - and I've done some l-o-n-g drives. Also note that, depending on the model, Subie Legacy/OB's come with a 6-way power driver's seat, which I absolutely love because I'm forever making little adjustments ;-) If however your "comfort" level would be raised by having a quieter, smoother, more sophisticated feeling driving experience, the new models will certainly show an improvement. I'd suggest driving one.
Nikita: chill! The new format is pretty nice - when it works ;-) I've been playing around with the Subscription feature and it has promise. I'm also confident that they will work out the bugs. I've already seen several of them definitively squashed. I've been frustrated too, believe me! But, in my humble opinion, calling the hardworking Edmund's folks names is not the best way to vent it.
Graham: when I twisted wrenches there were two ways to gauge AC function. One involved gauges and hoses and open hoods (bonnets?), and the other involved simply stuffing a thermometer into the dash vent. The latter was always the final arbiter because it was after all what the customer experienced. The vent air should get down to around 40°F (4.5°C) but not much colder, else freezing problems begin to arise. Bear in mind that my experience is from the "bad" Freon days and may not be directly applicable to the "new" Freon systems. My opinion of the AC in my '00 Legacy is that it is not spectacular (dare I say "adequate"?). OTOH I can hardly feel any loss of engine oomph when it is running and I like that too.
AS I have admitted in a previous post I am not very computer literate it was nice in the last format to be able to type in pull up a specific post without having to scroll through the posts, this is probably a dumb question but is there away to still do this in the new format. Thanks Pat.
I have to say at the minute this format is the pits, the number of new posts is practically non existent, the speed with which the posts came in on the old format could almost be compared to being in a chat room. As well I have enabled auto login countless times but I have to log in just about every time. I think its time you had all the bugs worked out guys. Cheers Pat.
I can't remember the last time 20 hrs go by between posts, let alone 20 minutes!
Wait a second, I just had a thought. Be right back...
A-ha! Suspicions confirmed. I have a link to the old town hall topics and I just posted a message in the "Subaru Crew - Meet the Members II" topics, and guess what? It showed up. I don't see any new messages there besides mine, but they really should lock that place down.
-Dan
PS On an off-topic note, my Outback is still running great *<|:-)
As for the new one, I've been toying around with "Subscribe" and "Message Center" and I have to say that I might actually be able to get used to the new format. Check it out.
Update to new Outback owners: I've now got 66K miles on my '96 manual transmission Outback and have had a great experience with this vehicle. I've replaced the rear brakes, but the fronts are still OK. I have been doing the scheduled maintenance all along. I have only had 2 minor problems in 4 yrs:
1. Actuator in passenger door for power locks had to be replaced. 2. Dashboard temperature gauge had to be replaced.
I plan on driving this car for many yrs. to come. Great job on the engineering Subaru.
I recently replaced the tires with Michelin Radial +'s from Costco. These tires are awesome in all conditions (including snow). Anybody looking to replace tires, these are highly recommended....
Car and Driver published a more thorough review of the H6 (VDC model) in their latest issue (January). As I suspected, they liked the car overall, but seriously balked at the price. Sounds like it's mostly a matter of perception ($32K for a Subaru does not sit well apparently), but their comments about price/value tend to carry a lot of weight. I'm not sure I agree, but I wouldn't complain at all if I could get an H6/5-spd in a base model Outback for around $24K . . . .
Just bought a new 2001 Outback 5sp . While driving home, the gear shift didn't seem very smooth. Instead of a nice click when I change gears, there is a grate. The vehicle itself moves smoothly when I change gears, only the feel of the gear shift is a bit hard and not smooth. Is this normal in new outbacks and will it improve with some running in or should I get it checked with the dealer? Also, the dealer was offering extended warranty of 6 yrs 80000 miles bumper to bumper for $1450. Is this worth it?
C&D did not like the new H6. They called it a 90's car. I have no idea how much of that was due to the price, but the message was pretty clear.
subsid, is your gearshift making a grinding noise when you shift, or is it just harder than you would like to push into the next gear - notchy, in other words? The difference is very important! As for the extended warranty, shop around if you think you really need one. I understand that there are some outfits that sell them for less than the ones Subaru dealers offer. I myself never purchase extended warranties - anymore, after having purchased a few and never using them.
Filled the tank for the third time this past Wednesday. Mileage was 16.9 mpg, a drop of 3 gallons from previous week. All driving, however, was done locally and in snowy conditions. Temperatures ranged from low teens to 2 degrees with wind chills as low as -30! No troubles other than driver's window squeals upon opening and closing. This does NOT happen when door is open. Window must be binding at point of closure. The wagon will be checked next week and, hopefully, the problem corrected. The automatic climate control is super. Works effortlessly and does what it's supposed to do. Much more convenient than old dials on the '96.
All in all, the LL Bean is one hell of a package and, in my opinion, a great buy!
It seems like most people have a problem with a Subaru stickering north of $30K. I have to agree, if Subaru is planning to reside in the $30K+ neighborhood—which is what they seem intent on doing—they need to offer more content as standard equipment, such as: Security System and in dash 6-CD changer.
Interestingly, the sub-$30K LL Bean has the Security System standard. %-(
Also, as we've discussed many times before, add a 5EAT with Sport-Shift, and a 6-speed manual.
Adding all those features—at $32K—makes the bullet a lot easier to swallow.
It's really a shame that "sticker-shock" is the theme that seems to dominate the published reports. At least that's the general feeling I get. It tends to obscure all the positive facets of the vehicle. Subaru has only themselves to blame for this.
I read the C&D article and I agree -- sticker shock seems to be the prevailing theme. I think most of the reviewers had a hard time swallowing a +$30K Subaru. I wish the testers could have gotten beyond the price and tried out the VDC system, for example. What I'd love to see is a another comparison of AWD wagons and their performance on slippery road conditions. A while back, C&D compared a bunch of wagons, including the OB, on a smooth concrete test track covered with water. If I recall, the OB did quite well -- and that was with the Active AWD system.
I can't wait for one of the car publications to to a comparison test between the Outback VDC, the VW 4-Motion wagon, the Audi A4 Avant Quattro, and the Volvo V70XC.
The Volvo may be a bit pricey compared to the others, but I still think it should be tossed in—especially if Subaru is serious about being considered a Near-Luxury vehicle. It also might be interesting to include the decidedly more expensive Audi A6 Avant and allroad too.
how little things like the lack of an ignition key light can be so frustrating. We don't have it on either of our Subes either, yet it's on my daughter's Prelude.
Hi Don, I'm also 1-month-old L.L.Bean owner. The only problem I have so far is ridicules auto climate control. It simply doesn't maintain the same temperature (its main function). As an example, it continuously blows cold A/C air when set to 85F and outside temp. is 35F.
I have had NO problems with the climate control system. All modes work well and the automatic program holds a setting. Of course, with the extrermely cold weather here in the Midwest, I must admit I wear a parka while driving. After the "inside temp" reaches the requested setting, I do unzip the jacket.
What with snow seeming to come every few days, I am reminded again why Subaru AWD is worth the premium we pay for such a system. Now, if I could only convince my local dealer to continue to hand wash my car when I stop by, I'll find a way to keep the white wagon looking great!
I'm not sure why you want C&D to compare those cars. The Subaru is doomed to finish last. C&D is predisposed to not like the car and equally predisposed to like everything that comes out of Germany. Plus it will be the least expensive among them so they'll have all the excuse they need. Now, if Autoweek ran a comparison, and if they left the high end luxos out of the mix, the story might be very different...
True, a comparison test between just the Outback VDC and the VW 4-Motion would be the more evenly matched, and probably would be more useful to customers considering a purchase.
Certainly there are few (if any) buyers cross-shopping a VDC with a MB 4-Matic. My point for including the high-end models, in a direct comparison, was to see how the Subaru & VW actually compare with them, in actual real-world driving situations.
As to what magazine does the comparison—I'm actually hoping we'll see several magazines do this kind of test, so we can get as many opinions, and points of view as possible.
I am planning on buying a 01 Outback Sedan soon. I test drove a 00 several times back in July. I loved the feel of the car on the testdrive, but wanted someone else's opinion that maybe owned one to see if they like it also. I currently have a 95 Legacy L, and love it to death. Thanks.
my son would like a 1996 outback-mainly because he does not like the hood air intake. does anyone have feedback on that model year-the pluses and negatives plus what a fair price would be. thank you, jim
Comments
Jeannette
Hey, I am single. I am in New England. I have a Subaru. I am actually just back on the market and my thinking was that the Subaru might make a statement about who I am and my values. If and when I get my next date, I hope she will be impressed when she gets into my luxuriously appointed vehicle with heated leather seats and pseudo wood trim and all the other features. So, I would not hold back on buying a Subaru because of any image issues. But, then again, what other answer would one expect when the question is asked of this forum?
-andyt.
And the last thing I want is for people to think I'm a snob.
The image I'd like to portray is that I'm practical, smart, adventurous, and fun. Big SUVs are for rich lazy snobs, if you ask me.
-juice
-I have a terrible time seeing at night, oncoming headlights blind me. Add wet roads and it's almost dangerous. In the Explorer I'm sitting above most of the lights of oncoming cars.
-We really need 6 passenger seating - my kids are old enough that often they each want to bring a friend along, especially on weekends to our camp. The Explorer is a manual trans also, thus only 5 passenger. Having to always negotiate who gets to bring a friend when we go somewhere is a pain.
-We also want light off road capability with AWD or 4WD, and we like manual transmissions
-We need at least the interior cargo capacity of the OB since we take our pets with us also, and still need to use a carrier up top to accomodate all the luggage plus fishing gear, etc. I absolutely refuse the drive a mini van.
So, my dream vehicle is probably the bigger Forester, but given the choices available today it would be something along the lines of the Durango, if only I could get the gas milage and have as much fun as in my OB!
Just a suggestion - you could lift a Forester's seat up a bit using spacers. Z3 owners have done this to lift the front about 1", so I imagine it could be done for the Forester also.
FWIW, there will be many new choices with 3 rows of seats. Check out the Suzuki XL7 for a smaller one, and the new Explorer should offer that option, too.
Our 18 month old is still a bit young to bring along guests, so I guess I'm not there yet!
-juice
you guys in the states never had it so good, for instance at the minute I drive a 1993 Honda Accord wagon auto, which I dearly love, but due to changing circumstances I hope to change for a late model outback around March 2001, back to the Honda it has 135 horsepower, no all wheel drive gets around 24mpg. city and 30mpg. highway on a Canadian gallon, gas at the minute here is averaging $3.60 a gallon and has been as high as $4,00, so if anybody is entitled to a good whinge about gas milage it is your poor neighbours to the north eh.
have agood day everybody.
Pat.
As you'll learn one day in the not too distant future, it's a lot easier to take two extra kids along than to have one brooding all weekend while the other enjoys smug superiority!
Also, any info/advice on driving a Legacy AWD wagon on a beach would be appreciated.
Thanks!
-Piglet
Jeannette: I'm sure by then Subaru will have a 7-seater that runs on tap water and flies.
Piglet: a CEL on a '93? That could be a bad O2 sensor. It could also be your cat. Find out before you buy.
The '93 isn't going to have the ground clearance for the beach, at least not soft sand.
I think the 2nd gen came out in '95, and the Outback model that same year. In '96 it got a lift and a bigger engine, so that may be the minimum for you to drive on a beach.
'97 they dropped the premium fuel requirement and got 10 more horses. If you can afford it at all, try to get a '97 or newer Outback. You may even have a tad left on the powertrain warranty.
-juice
Re the CEL on the '93. My '88 Mercury Tracer, now driven by my kids, has had its CEL light on and off at apparently random intervals since 1993 and it's had a new exhaust and cat since then. If the cat is not working right you'll probably fail emissions anyway. In my case I assume it's the O2 sensor, but we've all kind of got used to it now so I don't worry.
Brian
Cheers Pat.
Sorry for any confusion and inconvenience!
KarenS
Wagons host
Nikita.
1. Does it matter what kind of gas you put in? I think I can put in
regular but should I put in premium once in a while?
2. Can I get oil changes at a reputable garage instead of Subaru
dealership? Being a H4, I'm thinking that a regular garage might
have some problem with it.
The Passat's inside seems more roomy but I'm thinking that this might be because of the OB's dash. In the Passat the driver's dash is flush with the front passenger's dash but in the OB the driver's dash sticks out in front of the passenger's dash. Maybe that's why it seems more cramped inside.
But still you can't beat the price of 24k and an excellent AWD with a better reliablity record than the Passat. But I wonder how the 4 motion 5-speed auto in the Passat compares with the 4-speed AWD with viscous limited rear differential? Is the 4motion audi's equivalent of VDC?
For a base model w/ 10,000 miles, the dealer first number is 21,000 but then I got him to say that he would have to make 19,700 in order to make a bit of money. Does anyone have any info. that would give me an idea of what a good price is for a used w/ the miles i mentioned above?
Also, I am looking at an OB Ltd wagon w/ 26,000 miles, in perfect condition, any suggestions what a good price would be here?
Steve
Edmunds.com Town Hall co-host
Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories conferences
Anyway, to try my question for the sixth time, I think.
Does anyone know a simple check to confirm if the air con is working properly? It has been about 35 Celsius today (about 95F) and I am not keeping cool. I may have to fall in the pool to chill a bit, but even that is solar heated to 30C (about 86F).
Somehow, I think my son's hopes for a white Christmas may not come off.
Cheers
Graham
Here in Kenosha, WI, we're pretty much guaranteed a white Christmas. Yesterday, we received 5 inches of snow and could get an additional inch from lake effect snow this morning. This is in addition to the 14+ inches already on the ground from last weeks' snow. And the temps aren't expected to get out of the low 20's (-6 or so Celsius) this week through Christmas.
-brian/subearu
hutch7: The '01 Legacy/Outback (and the '00) is built on an all-new chassis and body structure. The rear suspension is all-new too. Although the previous generation was a solid car, the new ones are considerably more so. Also the engineers have taken another big bite out of the H4's famed NVH (Noise Vibration Harshness) quotient. OTOH the interior is still a Subie interior, meaning that the seat construction is probably going to be pretty much the same as the earlier model. So the answer to your question really depends on your definition of "comfort". If the seat simply doesn't suit you, the new car's seat may not either. My personal experience with '00 leather vs. cloth is that the leather has less pronounced side bolsters; for me that meant I liked them less, and chose to go with cloth seats. I wish the lumbar support were greater, and I've heard that from others too, but it is enough so that I do not exit the car with a backache even after the longest drives - and I've done some l-o-n-g drives. Also note that, depending on the model, Subie Legacy/OB's come with a 6-way power driver's seat, which I absolutely love because I'm forever making little adjustments ;-) If however your "comfort" level would be raised by having a quieter, smoother, more sophisticated feeling driving experience, the new models will certainly show an improvement. I'd suggest driving one.
Nikita: chill! The new format is pretty nice - when it works ;-) I've been playing around with the Subscription feature and it has promise. I'm also confident that they will work out the bugs. I've already seen several of them definitively squashed. I've been frustrated too, believe me! But, in my humble opinion, calling the hardworking Edmund's folks names is not the best way to vent it.
Graham: when I twisted wrenches there were two ways to gauge AC function. One involved gauges and hoses and open hoods (bonnets?), and the other involved simply stuffing a thermometer into the dash vent. The latter was always the final arbiter because it was after all what the customer experienced. The vent air should get down to around 40°F (4.5°C) but not much colder, else freezing problems begin to arise. Bear in mind that my experience is from the "bad" Freon days and may not be directly applicable to the "new" Freon systems. My opinion of the AC in my '00 Legacy is that it is not spectacular (dare I say "adequate"?). OTOH I can hardly feel any loss of engine oomph when it is running and I like that too.
Cheers,
-wdb
Thanks Pat.
-Dan
I think its time you had all the bugs worked out guys.
Cheers Pat.
Wait a second, I just had a thought. Be right back...
A-ha! Suspicions confirmed. I have a link to the old town hall topics and I just posted a message in the "Subaru Crew - Meet the Members II" topics, and guess what? It showed up. I don't see any new messages there besides mine, but they really should lock that place down.
-Dan
PS On an off-topic note, my Outback is still running great *<|:-)
As for the new one, I've been toying around with "Subscribe" and "Message Center" and I have to say that I might actually be able to get used to the new format. Check it out.
Cheers,
-wdb
1. Actuator in passenger door for power locks had to be replaced.
2. Dashboard temperature gauge had to be replaced.
I plan on driving this car for many yrs. to come. Great job on the engineering Subaru.
I recently replaced the tires with Michelin Radial +'s from Costco. These tires are awesome in all conditions (including snow). Anybody looking to replace tires, these are highly recommended....
Craig
Is this normal in new outbacks and will it improve with some running in or should I get it checked with the dealer?
Also, the dealer was offering extended warranty of 6 yrs 80000 miles bumper to bumper for $1450. Is this worth it?
Subsid
subsid, is your gearshift making a grinding noise when you shift, or is it just harder than you would like to push into the next gear - notchy, in other words? The difference is very important! As for the extended warranty, shop around if you think you really need one. I understand that there are some outfits that sell them for less than the ones Subaru dealers offer. I myself never purchase extended warranties - anymore, after having purchased a few and never using them.
Cheers,
-wdb
All in all, the LL Bean is one hell of a package and, in my opinion, a great buy!
Happy holidays to all.
Don
Interestingly, the sub-$30K LL Bean has the Security System standard. %-(
Also, as we've discussed many times before, add a 5EAT with Sport-Shift, and a 6-speed manual.
Adding all those features—at $32K—makes the bullet a lot easier to swallow.
It's really a shame that "sticker-shock" is the theme that seems to dominate the published reports. At least that's the general feeling I get. It tends to obscure all the positive facets of the vehicle. Subaru has only themselves to blame for this.
Bob
I read the C&D article and I agree -- sticker shock seems to be the prevailing theme. I think most of the reviewers had a hard time swallowing a +$30K Subaru. I wish the testers could have gotten beyond the price and tried out the VDC system, for example. What I'd love to see is a another comparison of AWD wagons and their performance on slippery road conditions. A while back, C&D compared a bunch of wagons, including the OB, on a smooth concrete test track covered with water. If I recall, the OB did quite well -- and that was with the Active AWD system.
Ken
The Volvo may be a bit pricey compared to the others, but I still think it should be tossed in—especially if Subaru is serious about being considered a Near-Luxury vehicle. It also might be interesting to include the decidedly more expensive Audi A6 Avant and allroad too.
This test is so natural, it's a no-brainer!
Bob
That way you can really measure, head-to-head, the low-end models against the high-priced benchmark vehicles.
Bob
Bob
I'm also 1-month-old L.L.Bean owner. The only problem I have so far is ridicules auto climate control. It simply doesn't maintain the same temperature (its main function). As an example, it continuously blows cold A/C air when set to 85F and outside temp. is 35F.
Is yours maintaining temperature okay?
Thanks,
Nikita.
I have had NO problems with the climate control system. All modes work well and the automatic program holds a setting. Of course, with the extrermely cold weather here in the Midwest, I must admit I wear a parka while driving. After the "inside temp" reaches the requested setting, I do unzip the jacket.
What with snow seeming to come every few days, I am reminded again why Subaru AWD is worth the premium we pay for such a system. Now, if I could only convince my local dealer to continue to hand wash my car when I stop by, I'll find a way to keep the white wagon looking great!
Enjoy your LL Bean model.
Don
Don
Regards,
-wdb
Certainly there are few (if any) buyers cross-shopping a VDC with a MB 4-Matic. My point for including the high-end models, in a direct comparison, was to see how the Subaru & VW actually compare with them, in actual real-world driving situations.
As to what magazine does the comparison—I'm actually hoping we'll see several magazines do this kind of test, so we can get as many opinions, and points of view as possible.
Bob
Mark