Ford Crown Victoria and Mercury Grand Marquis

jsylvester

Just started to be offered, though only on the LX model initially. I believe you also have to buy the LX Comfort package to be able to get this one.

I suspect it will be offered on the Base model eventually, maybe not this model year.

iusecad

interior: http://www.wieck.com/public/*2PV_020865

exterior: http://www.wieck.com/public/*2PV_020910

thekozman1

Andrew, I have a 1999 CV and it appears that my steering wheel/seat are not perfectly allinged. It really is not a big deal. Once your driving you really do not notice it. I would not let it hinder your purchasing decision. I drive allot w/ my job and have rented Crown Vics on many occasions and that is what directly pursuaded me to purchase this vehicle. Now that I have put over 1500 on it in the last two weeks I am definately happy about the purchase. I would reccomend renting one for a weekend from Hertz if you think it will bother you.

andrew47

Thanks a lot. That's a great idea. So simple, and yet it didn't even occur to me to rent one and try it out for a few days. Very smart. I guess I could also ask a few cops in the area what they think of it, too.

andrew47

First of all, I want to say that this discussion group has been quite informative. I have gotten some important info and good advice. I would like to pursue the issue of the seat/steering wheel alignment a bit further, if possible, and ask if this problem exists with '98 models. thekozman1 informed me that his '99 does have this problem. Does the '98 also? Thanks again!

slinger31

This vibration can be detected with the car in Park by simply increasing the RPM slowly until the tremor begins. Also easily felt at speeds
of 30MPH thru 85MPH or at any speed when RPM'S and speed match. This imbalance did not exist before the 2001 4.6. Johnbono, I have also owned GM'S before this and none had this problem. Go try some.

rea98d

Is they flywheel balanced right? Motor mounts solid? Do all the cars do this ?!?!
Whatsit mean when speed and RPM's match? Bout the lowest RPM's I've ever actually had the car moving under in my 4.6 T-Bird is about 1,500. If I could get 1500 MPH, aside from burning off the paint and hitting Mach 2, I'd have the world land speed record!

sbrown8243

I have a '96 Crown Vic (4.6L) (93K miles)and have enjoyed it, except for the fact that in recent years, it seems to have begun using oil. Last Thursday, I was stopped at a traffic light when a pick up at high speed struck me in the rear and then tried to flee the scene. I had to "chase" him a few blocks before the panicked teenager stopped and got out of his car apologizing. As we waited on the police to arrive, I began to notice a "clacking" noise in the engine and discovered that the oil pressure indicator had "bottomed-out". I took it to a nearby garage and they put a manual gauge and sure enough there was no pressure and the oil seemed to be 1-2 quarts low, but not visibly leaking any oil.

I took it to the dealership and they seem to say that this is a high performance engine that requires emaculate care and that running it (particularly under stress) when it's even a little low on oil could cause such a pressure failure. I will admit that I don't check the oil but about every 2 weeks or so, but it's hard for me to believe that this is also not somehow related to hard rear impact the vehicle took, considering that everything seemed to start at the moment of the collision. If there is any chance that this oil pressure failure can be accident related, I'd like to know it so that I can include it in my collision insurance claim against the other party. Does anybody know of a collision causing such a failure?

SB

anglertype1

Pertaining to the Grand Marquis,many at this site talk about the highway gas mileage they get.However,90 percent of my driving is city/town/surburban,non-highway. The surrounding area between towns is such that you can drive at 35 to 40 miles per hour with no stops or lights for 2 or 3 miles. Then you hit the main squares of these towns and you must stop at three or four sets of lights. Then another 2 or 3 miles of uninterrupted stretch at 35 to 40 miles per hour,etc. etc.I would like to hear from owners of 2001 Grand Marquis as to how many miles per gallon they are getting with this type of city/town/suburban,non-highway driving? Unsure as to buy new Grand Marquis or Lesabre? Thanks.

johnbono

sbrown8243:

The 4.6 is not all that much of a performance engine. As long as you do regular oil changes with 5w30 oil, you should be OK. The accident might have caused it. Since the accident, have you noticed any change in how much oil the engine is burning? That would be the real proof.

anglertype1:

The EPA numbers for the Crown Vic and Grand Marquis are basically a fiction. On a standard CV/GM, highway MPG will be about 25, and city MPG will be about 17. How you drive the car will have a serious effect on gas mileage. Where the vic and the marquis save money is on *maintenance*. The car stands up to the sort of abuse that in a LeSabre would wind up leaving parts strewn all over the road.

rea98d

Your car has a problem common to 4.6's with that mileage. All that stuff your dealer told you about it being a high-performance engine needing high maintainence is bovine scatology (abbreviated BS). The valve guides in a 4.6 engine are made out of too soft a metal and at 80,000 to 100,000 miles, they begine using about a quart of oil every thousand miles (at least that's the rate mine burns it). If you watch carefully, you'll notice other warning signs when your low on oil you may have overlooked. When decelerating or cornering, your oil guage will drop down to zero for about 2 seconds, and then pop back up. I havent heard of these momentary lapses in oil pressure doing serious damage to the engine, but it's still not a good situation. Also, if you get the clattering noise you described on startup for about a second, you need to do two things...1, quit using Fram filters, and 2, add about 2 quarts of oil. It's not collision related, otherwise the 1-2 quarts low would have been on the ground under the car where it was hit, most likely along with the rest of the oil in the engine. I think noticing the oil problems at the time of the collision was just a coincidence. If your engine was damaged by a hard rear impact, youd be looking at significant damage to the rear differential and transmission as well, as the shock would have to travel through these parts to get to the engine.
Unfortunately, the only cure for this problem is a 3-angle valve job, which any machine shop can do but it's expensive. The best thing to do is to watch that dipstick like a hawk and keep pouring oil down the crankcase.

tpken

Having read the various posts here about the 4.6 and its oil use, the plastic intake manifold, etc., it appears to me that the 5.0 in my old 1990 GM must be better for the long haul than this newer supposedly more advanced engine. I've got 145K on the old boat (actually been using it to haul one actually) and I add one qt of oil between oil changes which are about every 4K highway miles. The beast runs strong and steady - easily making 900 mile round trips to PA from here in Maine. I average 22-24 mpg at 75 mph depending on summer vs snow tires. Around town I get closer to 17 in the winter - but it warms up and idles a bit then too. Can't complain about repairs - I've had my share but the car is in good shape mechanically. Body is showing wear - sagging driver's door, surface rust along driver side body molding, etc.

Ford made a winner with this car and it has served me well. Sounds like the newer ones may not have the long-term reliability and longevity that the old flying bricks had. By the way - I drive a 2000 Bonneville SE now and the GM will be given to a friend soon that can use a dependable second car - no apprehension about turning it over to a good friend - can't always say that about an 11 year old 145K miler.

Best to all

Ken

frmob

My 1994 CV never had any trouble until about 94000 miles. Then I began the "chase the oil problem" routine. We replaced the rear seal, had multiple leaks. Finally the leaks were fixed and then the engine began using oil. At first it was about a quart every thousand miles. We have progressed to up to every 300-600 miles. i keep a case of oil in my hefty trunk. My joke has been I add gas when I check the oil. In researching all of this I have found out that I can only buy a rebuilt engine for about $4500 from Ford - they won't sell a new one. Used on
Also, this engine apparently has this trouble. One mechanic asked me to look at the tailpipe of CVs on the road. Darn if I don't see black smoke coming out of about a third. It's a shame because I had liked this car.
We need a new car (read used) and the new CVs ride makes me car sick. We are now looking at a Buick LeSabre or Toyota Avalon. I wish there were such a thing as an attractively styled practical car.

sbrown8243

Anglertype1, johnbono, rea98d, tpken, frmob:

Thanks for the input on the loss of oil pressure in my '96 CV 4.6 following an accident. Even though it may not be technically accident related, I can take some comfort in the fact that the problem is not necessarily due to "abuse" on my part, as one dealer rep. seemed to say. I'm gonna put a used engine in it, get a few more miles, unload it, and get something else. caveat emptor !!!

SBrown8243

ron35

Anglertype1 - I have a 2001 GM which now has a little over 1000 miles. My last mpg check this past Sunday when I filled up was 20 mpg; this was for a mixture of city/highway driving. The week before on a pure highway trip I got 27.5 mpg. My past experience, if it holds true would be that these numbers should get even better as it breaks in more. I do admit that I am a fairly conservative driver so I'm sure this helps.

Ron35

rea98d

I'm gonna go with Tpken on this one...If it were me, I'd get a good 302 (5.0) when it came time to swap engines. From what I've read, it's a more durable engine. Best of luck.

tpken

I highly recommend that you consider a 2000 Bonneville SE like mine if you are in the 16K price range and are not bound to RWD. I paid that for mine in January - a former rental that is in excellent condition with 18K miles on it. It has plenty of power, gets 30 mpg on trips, has a cavernous trunk, plenty of room inside and is equipped with buckets, console and floor shifter which I really wanted. The 3800 series 2 V-6 is one of GM's workhorses and the tranny slick and smooth. This car (and the similar but more conservative LeSabre) are terrific used car values in the mid teens for a 1 year old freshly styled car. Consider the Impala too for a few thousand less but read the forum here and be aware of suspension issues there.

Best wishes to you in your car search.

Ken

dayton2

slinger31
Please let me know if you get any satisfaction on fixing your 2001 GM. I too am pursuing this with Ford and my dealer in New Jersey, since I don't think it is something I should accept as normal. I can't believe no one else notices this. Maybe we are the only ones with this problem. I don't think so.
I previously had a 93 CV which I loved. It started burning oil around 85000 miles. That's why I traded.

sured

I own a 94 Grand Marquis with 40,000 trouble free miles on it. The only problem to date is the front power drivers seat seems to shift slightly off the track when cornering. The noise can be heard and the "clunk" is rather annoying.
Has anyone else experienced this problem ?
Can anyone offer a solution on how to repair it ?
It is literally driving me crazy !!!!!!

slinger31

dayton2
I have filed a complaint with the Dispute Settlement Board thru Ford Motor and my hearing is set for April 19th. My Dealer's service department told me that they have NO FIX, and that the other 4.6 engines in 2001 GM or TC have the same problem. I was offered a $5000 allowance to trade for anything on the lot and that Ford would buy back my car at market value. This offer was made at 2000 miles. I do not want another 2001 GM with the same problem so I have opted to try my luck with the DSB as I want my purchase price refunded. Ford has a serious problem and the fix down the road will be lot's of money for them. Will post the results after April 19th hearing.

Hacksaw

The valve stem seals can be a problem on 4.6 engines, and I'm not sure how far they've come in fixing it on the new models (post 1997). I know that my 98 CV is fine and it's got about 85,000 miles, so I'm hoping they've got better seals in there now.

Even so, you certainly don't need to buy a $4500 rebuit engine unless there's something else terribly wrong. Replacing the seals should run under $600 (and I'm thinking in the $400-500 range off the top of my head); and anything more than that someone is taking you for a ride or they don't know how to do the job (which does not require removal of the heads).

andrew47

Hi Hacksaw. I'm glad to hear you have a '98 CV. I am seriously cosidering buying one myself. Could you tell me about the steering wheel/seat alignment? Is it a problem for you, or did this start in 2000? Also, whatever your experience with this car has been, I would greatly appeciate learning from it. Thanks!

mrf

Jumping in here: my personal opinion is the steering wheel/seat alignment problem is on the CV LX and the GM LS...both of which have different seats with a well defined 'butt pocket'
that the base models do not. I did not find these seats to be overaly comfortable, and, if I recall, the 'butt pocket' was not aligned with the wheel well.

Anyway, I have a GM GS, the seats don't have a well defined 'butt pocket' and I haven't noticed the problem others have noticed.

In case anyone is interested, 2000 GM GS w/ handling performance package, 22k - trouble free.
Will probably need new rubber soon though.

Does anybody know the brand and model number of any good aftermarket shocks that would tighten up the ride motions, i.e. Bilstien, etc?

Thanks

kinley

johnbono

HD bilsteins HD are the best choice. I have heard that edelbrock and monroe shocks are good as well, but Bilsteins are pretty well accepted as the best choice. Don't KYBs. They stink for the vic.

andrew47

Is it true that the chasis is the same for the CV and the Lincoln Town Car? (I guess that would be TC, right?) If so, I would feel kind a kind of added sense of luxury, if only in my mind. Thanks again.

mrf

Yup, the Town Car is the same vehicle, essentially, although the body is of a newer design...and the wheelbase may be longer (it definitely is on the 'L' version)... In any case, the mechanicals are the same.... but then there's that 15k price difference and depreciation like a
piano falling off a skyscraper... but given the choice between that and the Cadillac DeVille that now looks like what the Chevy Impala should have (the same team that wrought upon the world the Asstek?).... and rear wheel drive vs. front.....

end of rant.

Thanks folks for the shock recommendations. I will lokk into that when I look for new tires, proabably during the summer.

sleazyrider

Every week or so, I check Edmunds' CV/GM and TownCar boards looking for news on whether Ford is doing something constructive about the plastic intake manifold. Instead, more problems show up: vibration, offset seats...

We want to thank Edmunds and its board users for providing problem information that would be extremely difficult to get any other way...

although a CV, GM or TownCar is what we'd much prefer, we won't buy it with headaches like these. Arrghhhh!!

:Dave and Krystyna

occupant1

I was making a delivery to a high-end restaurant in Dallas and I noticed a letter posted to the bulletin board on my way out. Lo and behold...it was an official letter from Ford Motor Company discussing one of the restaurant's '98 Town Car sedans. I don't know about other campaigns but this letter states that the manifold will be replaced for 7 years and UNLIMITED miles for fleet models of the CV and TC. 1996-2001 police, 1998-2001 taxi, and 1998-2001 TC livery/limo models are covered under the campaign and I kick myself for not writing down the nunber. The letter said you do not need to have the letter to get the work done, so at least those of you with the police package, taxi package, livery package, or limousines can get a fix, those of you with civilian models maybe there is a separate campaign for you. That or Ford only cares about their fleet sales.

andrew47

I'm getting a little freaked by all this talk of the problematic plastic intake manifold. Could someone explicitly outline the possible problems assiciated with this apparent flaw? Also, do all Fords -- particularly the Lincoln Continental -- have the same manifold. Thanks.

rea98d

I'm sure anyone here could go on & on about this topic, but it's been covered to death in this topic, the Lincoln Town Car topic, and the 90's Thunderbirds Topic over in Coupes, convertables, and Sportcars forum. Just do a little digging, and if you can't find it, I'll try to remember all the models that had this engine.

frmob

I would replace the engine in this car with a used one if my transmission wasn't giving a little shimmy every now and then. Also, now my car has 130,000 and I think that is far enough with the bad engine and possibly transmission. The transmission shop replaced the fluid with a synthetic and said I didn't have shavings in the pan but.... Thanks for the re for the Bonneville. My mechanic has recommended the 3.8 V6 in that car. At this moment in time we are looking at the Impala, Buck Park Avenue or still the Avalon. After reading the Impala site I think I will take a bye there, though. I would need the 2000 to get into my price range and then I wouldn't have the warranty. If they fix the 4.6 in the Ford ( I have been advised they are re designing as we speak) I would go back. Also, since I am so sensitive to motion sickness the independent (ride like a boat on the rough seas) wheel suspension on the ewer models would need adjustment.
Sorry So Long

rea98d

Quick question...Did the mechanic replace the fluid in the torque converter when he changed the transmission fluid. If not, you didn't solve anything, and need to have the fluid changed again, and this time insist the guy change out the fluid in the TC

amorales

California Highway Patrol sure likes these vehicles, they stand up under heavy abuse, quick enough to catch and
follow most cars. Room for suspects, dogs, shot guns and
laptop computers. Nice exhaust sound on heavy acceleration. Wait 'till new Mercury Marauder 300 HP 4.6
comes out. Maybe Ford will offer a souped up Crown VIC.

wkohler

Popular Mechanics has a very interesting article regarding "police package" Crown Vics for those folks interested in ordering such a vehicle. Bottom line: except for a "raised" suspension, all Crown Vics produced are about the same.

johnbono

The CVPI has a couple of other differences to a regular CV. The PI has an engine oil cooler, a tranny cooler and a power steering cooler. PIs also have an optional limited slip diff, and the ride height makes a big difference when doing things like jumping curbs etc. While there are a lot of cars that are faster than a CVPI, not very many can stay in the fight as long as a PI. The cars just don't overheat, and they can handle obstacles almost as well as some 4*4s.

sergeis

I have noticed another thing PI's have and I don't - those funny lights on top which flash in tact with music those cars make. Looks real cool. And this wall between front and rear seet is great to keep kids noise down.

speedracer3

My wife got a Grand Marquis as a rental while our Toyota Sienna was being fixed. It is confortble, has a strong engine and has a very nice (albeit boring) ride. It is not easy to maneuver and huge, it barely fits in our garage.

kinley

iusecad

how about a '99 F-350 Crew Cab long box? that'll dwarf a Vic/Gm...

kinley

iusecad

actually you can hit your head on the ceiling!

quick question: has anyone priced how much the suspension from an interceptor would cost to put on a civilian Vic with no P&H package?

dwight53

does pi pkg "raise" the car?? By how much? How eles can you raise the car?? Would like 2001 GM up 1-2 more inches.

myrona

I have owned my GM 2000 for one year and I am very happy with it except for a very annoying rattle/vibration in the dash panel when driving on a moderately rough highway. It is worse when the car and the weather are cold. If I pull down on the steering wheel or move the seat forward and press my knees firmly against the lower dash, under the steering column, the noise stops. Twice I have had the dealer try to correct the problem but it continues. Any help is greatly appreciated.

komives

Own a 99 Grand Marquis from new. Has 4.6 engine with 25600 miles. Since the last oil change 2300 miles ago it has used a quart of oil. It did not use any oil between changes previously. I use 5W30 Pennzoil with a Motorcraft filter. Also after a long highway trip last week, I started it up the next morning and blue smoke came out of the tailpipe. After the engine warmed up no smoke was seen. Dealer says up to two quarts of oiul can be used between changes (3000) miles. I have never had another car use this much oil with such low mileage. The oil was changed every 3-4K miles since new. What's up?

stnel

I pulled up your profile to see if you were in any Ford forums to ask you this question. In regards to Ford engines, do you know of any web pages that would show engine materials; e.g. block, cylinder heads, etc. I've looked everywhere on Ford web page and can't find specifics. I emailed Ford and haven't gotten an answer. If I go to Ford dealership and ask to see an engine, I don't know enough about engines to know what I'm looking at--would rather see something on paper. Thank you for any help.

427435

On the CV and Marquis, check the air filter box and see if you have dust on what is supposed to be the clean side of the box. When my Marquis started using oil, I checked the box and could write my name in the dust where there should be none.

Ford wouldn't do anything---they told me anything over 1000 miles per quart is acceptable!!!

The air filter box is a very poor design and just does not compress the filter tight enough on the tab side---which also is where the fan blast hits it.

I wrapped some tape around the loops the tabs go in to increase the squeeze on the filter but it was too late---an engine that got 6000+ miles to the quart now gets 2000 or less. This occurred abruptly at about 35000 miles.

What kind of oil consumption do some of the rest of you get with the 4.6 in the CV and Marquis?

wkohler

I just found this chat site and have been reading the old posts. I see lots of complaints about plastic intake manifolds on the 4.6. Just checked the one on my 93 Marquis and it is aluminum. Those people with problems that are past warranty or beyond whatever Ford is willing to do may want to check some junk yards. Ford started using the 4.6 in Town cars in 1991 and the CV and Marquis in 1992. My car was built in late 1992 and I suspect there should be at least 3 years of cars (old enough to be at least some of them in junk yards) that might be good sources for good old-fashioned aluminum intake manifolds.

I don't know about sensor, fuel injector rail, throttle body hook-ups etc.---you're on your own there.

427435

The 93 Marquis I have has the optional trailer towing package on it that was rated for 5000 lbs. It works great towing a 3500 lb. boat and trailer. Car has run great for over 165,000 miles with no real problems except the oil consumption getting screwed up due to the cheap-a_ _ air cleaner box.

I wouldn't mind replacing it with a new CV or Marquis but the towing package was dropped in 1997 when Ford redesigned the rear suspension for "better handling and control".

Does anyone know why? Is the new suspension not heavy enough to tow with? Or does Ford just expect people to buy a truck which are more profitable then these cars? It's totally ridiculous that Ford's wimpy front wheel drive mini-van with a dinky V6 is rated to tow 3500 lbs. but a heavier rear-drive CV or Marquis with a V8 is only rated to tow 2000 lbs. This doesn't even change when the performance/handling package is ordered either---even though there's a deeper axle ratio included.

Every thing that is needed to provide a 3500-5000 lb. towing option has to be on the assembly line these cars go down as its the same line that the police cars are built on.

Hope Ford wakes up on this one before I have to replace my Marquis. Right now I would be buying a 2WD Toyota Tundra to get the combination of towing, a V8, and a comfortable ride.

kinley

We also tow a 3500 lb boat& trailer. Our tow car is a 94 Towncar Touring Signature. It did not come with the "Tow Package", but a 10,000 lb transmission cooler was added and a Class III hitch welded. The temp has never overheated, the transmission oil was changed and the car has over 91,000 on it. The later models of Lincoln have a 2,000 lb tow limit, but I would still risk towing 3500 lbs equipped as above rather than fork over too much $ for a Navigator or Expedition.