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Pontiac Grand Prix - 2000-2005
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Comments
I think it has to be up to the individual whether the increase from 200 to 245 horsepower and the nice torque increase is worth the extra initial investment and the extra 20 cents per gallon for gas.
I have a 2000 GT sedan. I probably would have
gone with the GTP, but I was making an even trade between my 1999 Grand Cherokee with 33K miles and a new Grand Prix. A GT was as far as I could go without spending money on the trade (I DID have to pay tax and license, but I had GM Card rebate money and a refunded extended warranty on the Jeep to cover these costs).
The GT has plenty enough power to be fun to drive, and I'm not sorry that got the GT, but those GTP's are wicked! I don't think there's supposed to be any significant difference in gas mileage with the supercharger either, so it really boils down to the premium gas vs regular gas issue. If the extra power is worth the cost of the gas to you, then I would recommend that you go with the GTP.
Either way, you will be getting a great looking, sporty car that, as you said, gives you a lot for your money.
My GT has not been back to the dealer for even a tiny adjustment or anything except oil changes, and I'm up to 18.5K miles on it.
tsjay
I carry a pocket calculator and check my mileage manually every time I fill up (and I ALWAYS fill up when I get gas- I don't just stop for $5.00 worth of gas). It is sort of a hobby, I guess.
Sometimes the read-out on the car's onboard gas mileage computer is very close to the manually calculated value, and sometimes it's off by a couple miles to the gallon. I haven't paid that much attention to whether it's biased to the high side or to the low side, or if it averages the same as the manual calculations over several tanks.
Any city driving at all pulls down my mileage considerably. When I have had my very best gas mileage checks, like 30.0 to 31.5, it has been literally 100% highway miles while I was traveling between Illinois and Kentucky.
Cold starts, idling, and stop-and-go driving absolutely destroy gas mileage.
tsjay
For 2-car family, 2-4 changes per year (the syntetic oil allowing longer intervals) the savings are $32 to $64 per year. Clearly pays with a WalMart nearby. Probably does not pay, though, if the most close WalMart is in 35-40 minutes driving, one way.
Anyway, as much as I love my 2000 Grand Prix GT sedan, I have an obsession for a new Jeep Wrangler Sport, or for at least a low mileage used one of equal value to my Grand Prix.
I live in western Kentucky, so if anyone out there lives in this general vicinity and is interested in buying my car or trading a Wrangler Sport (not interested in an "SE" model) with a 5-speed transmission, please look up my email address in my profile and contact me.
tsjay
Has anyone out there heard anything about this, or has anyone installed an aftermarket stereo in a late model GP?
Anyway - call Crutchfield and talk to them. They are very helpfull. The problem with GM's is the steering wheel controls. Yes there is also a theft lock which will freeze the radio when you pull it out - but you are getting rid of it, so who cares. There shouldn't be any other issues.
But they do have some audio systems that will work with the steering wheel controls.
wka - get the GTP. It's well worth it. There is something special about having that badge. Remember some insurance companies charge more for it though. The sedan costs less to insure vs the coupe.
I never even thought I would be able to salvage use of the steering wheel controls with aftermarket. I should check into that, too.
Anybody else have any experience?
Anyway, there are many to choose from at Crutchfields. However, only one can work with the steering wheel controls. That's Sony. They sell an adaptor that will allow those controls to work. I purchased one with the adaptor and it is much, much better. I did not replace speakers at this point as the stock seem to be fine. Mind you, I was not interested in the "bouncing down the road with bass", but I can't hear my cell phone ring and the sound is clear.
I can't remember the exact model I purchased, but it is the Xplode series with four channel amp capability. The stereo was $179 and the adaptor for steering wheel controls was $100.
Crutchfields is great. They send you the harness, antenna jumper and step by step instructions for your specific car. Lastly, not to be stereotypical, but I am a female and installed this myself! Good luck!
In my 99 Chevy Silverado, to clear the reminder light, you turn the key on and off a few times and it cleared. Tried that figuring Pontiac is a GM product, but it didn't work.
Who has the book and knows how to clear? Thanks.
MEPSMan123,
I'll check my manual tonight and post an answer for you tomorrow.
The bottom line, though, is it still isn't that great. I had a 2000 MC SS(3800 V6) and was getting just under 28 with the same driving habits, etc. Any more thoughts?
I don't believe you ever said whether or not you use synthetic oil. I firmly believe that after a "break-in period" with full synthetic oil, you will see about a mile to a mile-and-a-half per gallon improvement in your gas mileage.
I have personally seen this work for me.
Also, you stated that you drive 75 to 80 mph. Try slowing down to maybe 71 or 72 mph. The 75 isn't too bad, probably, but the 80 is definitely hurting your gas mileage. Wind resistance, Bro. They say about 75% or 80% of your horsepower is used to fight wind resistance at highway speeds, and wind resistance goes up exponentially with speed.
If you try slowing down, even if you don't switch to synthetic oil, let us know how it turns out. If you do BOTH, I can guarantee that you will see a nice improvement.
tsjay
Just tell me to mind my own business, if you want to.
tsjay
Car was comfortable for 4. Quiet. I even like to sit in the rear seat. CD stereo pretty good. Not audiophile stuff but decent.
Power galore for grades and passing. Moved into the left lane at 70 mph and some one tried to close on my six. Just poked the pedal and was doing 90. The boogey didn't try to follow.
One of the other drivers added that it was great for these long road trips because the car is so stable and responsive that it was less tiring to drive. The Michelin X-ones I put on not long ago are a plus because they sharpen up the steering response over the OEM Goodyear LSs.
Half way through the trip the 'service engine soon' came on. It went away immediately when I filled up with med grade gas but came back 3/4 through that tank. Then went away half way into the next tank. Anyone have any ideas?
I used to get 28-30 on my GTP in straight hiway driving. As soon as I got off the interstate, it would drop like a stone.
My DIC was consistently .5 MPG or .5 gallons off.
Come on GM, build it.
Grand Prix's must be awfully good cars,huh? Mine sure is! (But I still want a new Jeep Wrangler Sport.)
tsjay
I've not tried synthetic as the oil was changed when I purchased the car(it was a demo), so, when I get it done, I'll give it a shot. As far as slowing down.....well, I'll try. Hard to do in this car. I had a 2000 MC SS, bought it right off the truck. It was (finally) bought back in October because of the engine cradle issue. Just didn't feel safe and they couldn't correct it and they didn't want to sell me another(not that I wanted another lemon!). So there 'ya go!!
So you are of the female persuasion? You can still be my "buddy", but the "Bro" has to go, right?
Thanks for explaining about the MC SS. Now, which car do you like better? If the MC hadn't had the major problem, in other words, would you have preferred it or the Granp Prix?
Is it really only a difference in appearance? Aren't they built on the same chasis? How much different was the interior?
I don't know about why the MC was getting better gas mileage, but I do firmly believe you could improve the Grand Prix's gas mileage by switching to full synthetic oil. It seems to make sense that if friction is reduced so that you get better mileage, your engine life would be extended also.
I use Mobil 1 oil, but there are other brands of full synthetic oil that may be just as good.
Catch you later, "Buddy."
tsjay
I think because of the profile of your car, you may mistake them as looking like they are low on air. This gives the GP it's aggressive, low to the ground look. If they check out with a tire guage, don't worry about it.
It's a tough call between the MC and GP. I just loved the MC so much. I really liked the "different" look. Rather unique. I have grown into the GP though. I had to find something similiar, so the GP it was. To be honest, I feel like the GP has better accelaration, both off the line and when passing.
Oh yea, part of the deal with this car was a "bra". I don't really have to be that "cool", but I had one on the MC(LeBra)and with all my highway driving, it really helps with chipped paint. I finally got it from GM(much, much better quality) and, with help from the hubby, put it on a few days ago. All I can say is...sharp!. Really gives the front end an all new look. Chat with 'ya soon!
Many months ago, there was a comparison in Automobile magazine. They compared three tires - Michelin XGT V4, GY Eagle RS-A, and some other tire. Michelin was a better performer overall, but RS-A did much better on wet surfaces, especially in braking on wet.
All modern tires have a tendency to look like they are a bit low on air.
Any one can offer a direct RS-A to Michelin comparo?
I got to the dealership and the car looked gorgeous from the outside. I went in and talked with the sales guy who was very cool (best car salesman I ever dealt with). He quoted me a price of 18K for a new 2001 Grand Prix SE. I was very happy so far and I couldn't wait to do the test drive. He let me take the test drive alone. I got in the car, all fired up about the possibility of purchasing one, and it was all down hill from there.
The upholstery on the seats was hideous. The seat was hard and uncomfortable. The control panel was a vertical rectangle of jumbled buttons. Not spread out and logically (and tastefully) done like in a Honda or Toyota. The interior felt cheap to me. I started driving the car. I was very impressed with the power of the engine and the handling and pickup. Trying to simulate real driving conditions, I went to hit the brakes hard (as if I was in traffic) and the car didn't stop on a dime. My old Camry had better brakes than these!! Then at a stoplight, I went to take off, and the engine actually hesitated for a millisecond. I was so disappointed. I decided then and there, it was a no go.
I'm not one of those people who blindly bash American cars. I really did go in there with an open mind, hopeful that a Grand Prix was for me.
It wasn't.
I wish I could say otherwise. I wish I could say that I loved the Grand Prix and would be picking one up. I'm not saying that it is, but if this car is indicative of all cars the American car companies are rolling out, then the commentary that the American car companies have caught up to their Japanese counterparts is a myth.
I'll be going to the Honda dealership to be picking out a new Accord LX today.
Same as yourself, for the past 12 years I have owned nothing but Honda/Acura products (I also happened to own a 1989 Accord LX 5-speed carburated 2.0L engine)and while their cars are good in later years the quality and consistency in reliability has been slipping. This year I went for my first GM product a brand new 2000 Chevy Impala LS equipped with the 3800 Series II Engine. After 10,700 trouble free miles, I haven't looked back to Honda or any other Japanese products for that matter. I really got tired of Hondas...the same old with a different body shell and may be a bit bigger. The Grand prix is better enjoyed and a much better value on GT or GTP trims. The SE is better left off for car rental fleets.
Not only does is not have the better engine, it has smaller tires (15" vs 16"), better suspension, etc. I own a 2000 GTP, and can tell you the vehicle has fantastic brakes. I don't know for sure if the SE has the same, or has smaller ones.
You are also missing out on options such as the HUD which is not present on the SE.
I can't comment on the cloth seats, because I only sat in leather. The seats are hard, but I like them that way. I'm not looking for the best luxury. Plus I don't think you get the 6 way power seats in the SE either.
As far as the rest of the interior is concerned, with the GT/GTP you get steering wheel controls, so I never have to reach over execpt to turn stuff on.
Could the switch gear and some of the buttons be of better quality? Yses. Could the interior use some better quality materials / fitting - yes.
But ask any GT or especially GTP owner, they will overlook that in favor of the total package. (looks, handling, power, style, features). I don't think you can ask the same of an SE owner. Honestly I think POntiac should drop the model.
Try testing a GTP for kicks and see if your opinion changes.
_KEvin_
Whether you buy one or not, at least test drive a GT (or a GTP). I own a GT myself, and I am very happy with it. I haven't driven an SE model, but there must be a huge difference, based on your negative comments about the SE.
tsjay
Also you claim that you are not biased but then you rattle off a whole paragraph how the Grand Prix's interior basically sucked and how much better it was in a [bland] Toyota.
I find Grand Prix's interior to be ergonomically well executed and well laid out.
BTW - GTP's brakes are way better then SE's.
Did not drive Grand Prix, but know the Pontiac controls from driving a rented GrandAm. They are looking somewhat untasty and industrial, too big and imposing, when you just sit in the car the first time. But, unexpectedly, the controls turn very convenient when driving, especially driving/turning fast. Even before accustomed to the car.
This is like the big-button phones, designed first for handicapped. Turned to be convenient to healhy people too, especially when the hands and brains are busy.
As to the SE trim, I believe the 3.1l engine is barely adequate for this car. I like the 3.1l engine in my Malibu, but Malibu is a car of lesser class, than GP. Though, even with the 3.1, Grand Prix (and Malibu) have much better acceleration, than Honda Accord / Toyota Camry with 4 cylinders. For about the same price.
I have a buddy who has a GTP and he has the leather seats, which he says makes a big difference in the look of the interior. I also just thought the control panel was a bit crowded together. The car just wasn't for me, what can I say?
I really did go in with an open mind. I was heavily leaning toward buying the car, before I went in there for the test drive. It's one of the sharpest looking cars out there. I'm glad that I checked it out.
I went and bought a 2001 Honda Accord LX 5 speed last night. Conservative, yeah. Is it me, yeah. No regrets.
Being a car enthusiast, I will continue reading the posts. And you guys are right, you hardly read anything negative about the Grand Prix'. Want to read negative, go to the Ford Taurus and Windstar sites. Ouch.
As for the flat look, I know that the modern radials do tend to look like that. However, the numerous rice rockets I see with even lower aspects than my 205/55 seem to look just fine. Despite having the correct pressure, mine still look a bit flattish, especially in the front, since it is probably quite front heavy,
BTW, I actually have a Sunfire GT, not a GP, but I just wanted to get your feedbacks on the tires since they are the same model. Sure, sizes are different, but they should be basically the same.
As for X-One vs. RS-A, I don't know. I would say that it may be hard to compare them, since they are in a bit of a different league. However, the X-One looks to be an excellent touring tire
Hard to say definitely, the GM data sales I saw does not provide break-up by model trim, only by model. Though, the Buick Century, a tween of SE, sells very well. Twice better than Regal LS and GS combined - basically the same cars as GT and GTP. And about as well as all trims of GP sedans and coupe combined, including SE.
On the other hand, the Olds Intrigue, a nice and powerful car which is not offered in a smaller-engine trim, does not sell well.
http://media.gm.com/corpcom/00news/g001101b.htm
redesign the older cars and continue producing them with 3100. Even while there is not so much difference between the 3100 and 3400 engines.
By the way, GrandAm/Alero is not available with
3100. Either 4 cylinders, or 3400 v-6.
But now I have impression, that my new Buick accelerates from stop even faster. Only more smooth - did not feel the low-end acceleration at first.
Any case, I believe the Grand Prix does not need to be floored. Would accelerate beautiful even half-way through, at 3600-4000 rpm.
I have a tween car, the Buick Regal geezermobil. Need watching speedometer when passing. Otherwise it jumps to 95 mph in few seconds, and does not matter if I drive uphill. Even while I do not use the power shift mode.
I work near an auto plant, they take the vehicles to a parking lot near a train loading spot. It is about a 2 mile drive and they get about 10 punks to drive them there. You can tell because they have shrink wrap on the hood and let me tell you, they do not respect the break in policy. It is a street race for them.
I wont disclose the make/model but many of you probably have one.
I drive fast and pass often. Though, would not engage in passing, if it requires flooring. Just yesterday drove to next exit and returned, instead of passing, too fast or too close, a group of vehicles clogging access to my exit. Even while passing them was not so difficult technically.
Other numbers are telling other things. For example, the 0-30 time is much better measure of power in city traffic, while 30-60 used to tell how easy is to merge into highway traffic. 30-70 would be a better measure with the current highway speeds.
0-60 does not tell much by itself, just combines the two above numbers.
Most modern engines, including the Cadillac V-8 and Intrigue 3.5l V-6, as well as Camry and Accord V-6, shine at higher rpm, but are so-so in city. Older GM engines, like 3100 in GP SE, provide very good acceleration from full stop, but mediocre one at higher speed. The same, but to lesser extent, is true with the venerable 3800 in GP GT: it provides excellent low-rev acceleration, but only good one at higher speed.
To highway warriors I would recommend Intrigue, while GT, Buick, Impala or Monte-Carlo better fit the city / mixed driving.
According to your profile, you have a Cadillac. Never drove one: the car requres higher incomes. But, according to Edmunds, Regal GS, with 88% of the weight of DeVille DTS, have only 80% of its power.
The above numbers suggest that Regal must be slower than DeVille. Though, the specs demonstrates the opposite: the Buick makes 0-60 in 6.7 seconds, vs. 7.3 seconds for the Caddy. I see the only explanation: a better low-end torque for with the old-technology 3800 engine. I.e., most probably, GS easily wins 0-30.