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Comments
I have been looking at the recent discussions and prices on the A6 and they seem extremely reasonable. My one question is that there is a 1000 dollar option for premium leather seats. I have been seeing this on the new A4 Cabriolet as well. What is the difference between the premium leather and normal leather the car comes standard with? Is it really worth a grand more for it? Any suggestions would be great. Thanks.
Many thanks for some real numbers. I'd love a fax as well to 901-272-1717, if you're feeling generous. I heard that adaptive suspension and the 4.2 won't be available until January or February. Does anybody else have anything about those 2 issues ?
Prodoze
To really get "apples to apples," I suggest you add $500 sport seats to the 3.2 you configured, since the 4.2's sport package includes them. This would bring your 3.2's total to $48,200, or $5,100 less than your 4.2's total of $53,300. To each total, of course, you'd then need to add the $720 delivery charge to be really complete.
Per the price sheets I sent you, it seems that neither a DVD-based NAV system or BOSE audio system are standard on either model. That is, the $1,500 DVD NAV system is an option on both models, and so is the BOSE system: on the 3.2, it's part of the $3,000 premium package; and, on the 4.2, it's part of a $1,300 BOSE option that also includes a satellite radio.
As we both speculated a few weeks ago, it looks like the additional
MSRP for the V8 engine is about $5K. To see if it's worth that to get
a car that's about 1 second faster, maybe has a few more extra finer items inside and is a bit more "exclusive," perhaps we'll both have to test both cars, preferably one right after the other.
Let's keep the dialog going.
Bob
I'm about to fax you the two sheets. Let me know that you've gotten them.
Auditor (Bob)
Well, at least from the standpoint of highway range, my understanding is that the AWD versions will have 21.1 gal. tanks.
- Ray
Hoping for EPA 25 highway for the 4.2L V8 . . .
Was there an option to lease the car? I am interested in leasing and your configuration is quite close to what you have ordered. Audi is running a lease special on 04 Model and I am trying to decide if the difference is worth it. I came across of one in Germany and clearly like the looks of 2005 much much better
Per discussions I have had with others I am engaging with 3 dealers, keeping all in the loop on what others are offering. Also trying to leverage the need to make room for 05's and the fact that it is end of month. Basic stuff, but every little bit helps.
I have not yet been to see the dealer- I hope to work a little more out of them in person- but seem happy with the price now
If you are considering an 04', I'm certain you could get a much cheaper payment because of incentives to get the 04's out the door and perhaps more favorable leasing rates. To me, it was worth it to pay more for the 05'.
In terms of a lease, I have not discussed or considered lease versus buy. I thought I'd evaluate that at decision time. I have a sense, though, that initially they may offer pretty good lease rates to help drive demand. My guess is that there will not be a big difference in the cost of money for a lease and a purchase although I might be missing someehing here. I generally lease because I tend to change cars every three years or so...I drive 20K miles/year. One could always compare Audi lease rates to local banks and leasing companies.
Jim
Just curious. I drive roughly the same # of miles / year - and have not been able to make lease $$ #s work for me.
Thanks,
- Ray
Trading cars at least every 3 years, on average . . .
I myself also drive 20k 22k miles per year. leasing has never been that attractive because of the overages in miles. I also am curious if you pay for more up front.
Also, what is your justification on buying vs leasing. I realize there is an initial investment to buy in advance to keep the payment down but you get that back when you sell the car. On the lease however, you put money down you will never get back and usually pay a high payment per month.
What are your thoughts?
I lease an '01 A6 2.8. My total payment is $429/month, 15k miles. Expires November of this year.
The original deal was $399/month for 36 months with 12k and I negotiated the extra 3k up front. Something about a barge accident and the dealership needing to liquidate their supply. I actually was going to buy, but that seemed like such a good deal (also, no $ up front as an Audi loyalty).
Well....I now drive over that 15k. 30 miles each way to work, about 400 total per week. I'm looking slightly north of 20k. Now.....
I have had some poor experiences with Audi's after that magical 50k. I also don't like to hang onto cars (exception, my Land Cruiser) much longer than 3-4 years. I WANT to lease, but fear that the leasing figures might be through the roof. If it's going to be close on a monthly basis (with the difference being I have to shell out several k for my down payment) I would purchase- or look at another vehicle.
Thoughts/sugggestions?
I'm a sales professional for Audi in SoCal. Leasing vs. financing is an interesting topic. Bottom line is that you pay the same. Believe it or not, when you add your drive-off, any cash down, lease payments and residual, you come up with about the same amount as you do when you add your down payment and all your finance payments. The benefits of each are these:
If you like to get into a new car before your loan is paid off, a lease may be more beneficial to you. After, say, three years of a finance (unless you paid a big chunk down), you are just about breaking even on your investment, but you made higher payments every month than you would have on a lease. Purchasing makes sense if you want to keep that car for a long time. And don't forget, you may "own" the car at the end of a finance, but before it is up, the bank owns it, and after, you only own the depreciated retail value.
On a lease, if you make a down payment, it will lower your monthly payment. It is not lost money! If you know that you want to get out of that car in X months, then lease it for that term. Make a good judgement on the miles needed and keep the car in good shape. You will pay less each month vs. a finance, and at the end you just give it back. No resale hassle, and, as I said, lower payments during the lease. But if you decide it was a good car and you want to keep it, you can even negotiate with the bank to buy it at less than the agreed residual.
What does all that have to do with the new A6? Not much. But we have one 4.2 available for testdriving on August 10 and 11. You need to RSVP and we will reserve a 20-minute slot for you, like for all other customers. Email me at arno1 at sbcglobal dot net to set you up.
Very interesting.
Is the going to be a US spec vehicle?
Is this a AofA program - that other dealers might be participating in?
(Meaning, is it worth contacting my dealers here in the Atlanta area?)
- Ray
Sadly, NOT going to be anywhere close to so cal on those dates . . .
Thanks for the leasing vs. buying info. I am up in northern California so I don't think I would make any plans for a test drive with you down there.
However, when it comes down to buying the vehicle, where ever the best deal is is where I will go. So. cal is more competitive but I still need to hop onto a southwest flight but the Hwy1 drive back would be nice.
Thanks
What worries me about the new A6 is that in several magazine reviews so far they're mentioning that the car has a downright awful ride for a luxury "saloon". I'm having somewhat of a hard time believe this. Not sure if the European-spec cars will be different from what we'll get here, as most of the tests so far (even the Automobile Mag comparo) were Euro A6s.
I personally think Audi ruined the interior of the new A6 compared to the old. It just "looks" far to busy, which is funny because the A8's (same design) isn't busy (looking or funtionality wise) at all.
Both the E-Class and 5-Series will probably both experience a clear sales drop once all these other cars get to the market. The Infiniti M45 is my bet for the next star in the middle-weight class. For all the hype around the RL it looks too much like an Accord. The GS seems to be more of the same, but it is too early to really know. The STS and M35/45 are the ones with the most to gain, imo.
M
The 2004 SLine looked ideal on paper, but when I test drove it I was dissappointed in the handling. It was not crisp or responsive IMHO, so much so I could not see myself buying one.
Regarding the new 2005, it will all be in the handling in my opinion, which I haven't tried yet as we could not test drive the displayed model. We don't like the front grill, and although we can't recall details because so many others were swarming over the car, overall our (my wife and I) recollection is that it is a significant improvement on the inside, with very nice outside styling other than the grill.
It is hard to make overall comparisons, I think, as the decision matrix on these cars is huge. And, what may be a show-stopper for me is a non-issue to someone else, like my wife for instance, and visa-versa.
John
I very much believe that Audi offers a better car for the money short term over mercedes and BMW. The fit and finish interior is great.
I have a Biturbo 2.7 allroad with 6speed and love this car. I have owned Mercedes for many years and owned them as well as leased them. They held their value, but they are not the great cars they used to be. I never would own a biturbo car, and leased this one.
I have leased many many times and so long as you hit your target milage your doing just fine. I had a ML 320 and with a change is driving habits we really blew it. I had to cut a check for 4k to get out at lease end, but if I had bought it, and was selling it at the same time, It WOULD HAVE BEEN THE SAME NET-NET EFFECT! That helped. We drove the hell out of it, and paid the price either way.
This new a6 model talked about here is just great. I deliberatly will get the new model in two years. I enjoy the 03' build quality on the allroad and got it after a few years on the market to get the bugs out and price down. I expect the new platform to do well and might have some bugs, but thats the small price to get the latest and greatest. I think Audi's sloped pricing is interesting. It gives them no reason to discount, and when prices do go up, then can negotiate back down and nobody gets feelings hurt.
Mercedes and the Infiniti's interiors are jewell like in appearence and small touches like over use of chrome and over detailing gives it a fine delicate appearence. E-classes have become a favorite of succesful women. Nothing wrong, but when it was time to get my new E-class last year I bugged out at the last minute. Something about the delicate nature of the interior bothered me. I loved the old heavy feel of mercedes and my favorite was the 89' 420SEL. I replaced it with e430 sport and just never loved the car. It was fast, but little fun. If not fun, and not the heavy vault like feel, I see no reason to have a mercedes. The allroad is not as fast, but the quattro and 6sp are better for handling. The build quality in the engine compartment cannot compare to mercedess, but the interioir is quieter and more comfortable. The high tech look is subjective, you either like it or not. The conservitive mercedes dash was always fine with me. I have grown to like the cherry red audi look, but not blown away by it either. Headliner on the allroad is first rate. not fuzzy like in the E-class. allroad was $43k, 2001 new was $53k!
I did not mean to turn this into a comparison, but I am quite fond of the Audi. I just read that Audis in north america have a 70% Male ownership of whom buys the cars. 60% elsewhere.
When I read that it I thought it interesting but no surprise. It might not have a "Hemi", but they know their market and don't want to move away from it with the new A6. I am dissapointed it might not have a 6sd, and am not sure If I will get the 3.2 or 4.2. I also read this car is dialed in as more luxury than sport.
I will consider and look at the 5 bmw for sport, and the audi for obvious reasons. The new transmission sounds great for an Auto.
I have 2 years to consider, and also need to see what they do to the a6 avent and if they will continue an allroad.
Thanks,
Ron
thanks
Six Cars: Acura RL, Audi A6, BMW 530i, Infiniti M45, Lexus GS, Mercedes E320
(best to worst)
Exterior Styling: E320, RL, A6, GS, M45, 530i
Interior Styling: RL, GS, M45, E320, A6, 530i
Value: RL, A6, GS, M45, E320, 530i
Quality: GS, RL, M45, A6, 530i, E320
Fun To Drive: 530i, E320, RL, M45, GS, A6
Base on those criteria, the order of finish would be: RL, GS, E320, M45, A6, 530i.
Just my opinion. Let the debate begin.
The E-Class remains my favorite in this field. I liked the 1998-2004 A6 more than I did the 1996-2002 E during some of those years, like when the 2000 A6 4.2 came out. However this new A6 doesn't do it for me compared to the new E-Class.
M
The current (operative word) incentives are set to expire, just like the ones before them did. There almost certainly will be new incentives -- even if they knew the details why would they share them now? They probably wouldn't and AoA probably keeps tight lips about "next month's" incentives until it becomes next month, if you get my drift.
And, the incentive from AoA is critical to the dealer -- if the MSRP is $46+K and the asking price is $40+K, you can bet that is due to AoA not the dealer's own ability to price that low.
So although there may be a better deal next Tuesday, there is only the "known" deal available for the dealer to quote. And, if you wait there is at least a chance that the new deal will not be as good as the current deal (even though this seems unlikely).
So, if you were AoA, wouldn't you keep your dealers in the dark? I mean, c'mon -- if they dropped the price another thou and they sold out in August, what would they do in September and October, the new cars will hardly be plentiful before December.
I am bias toward German cars.
The Mercedes C-S-and E class all look too similar and build quality is down.
The new BMW is growing on me, but I must drive it to really determine it. BMW has kept up its standard while Benz has fallen. My trusted mechanic of many years has told me that Mercedes and Volvo have problems early on that he never ever used to see, and thinks only BMW is not lowering the quality. He does not work on Audis.
The e-class has never been fun to drive, that belonging to BMW.
We never have had one out of warranty. There are reasons that this makes sense for us: #1 we like to have "current" technology; #2 European cars -- practically speaking ALL cars -- are breathtakingly expensive to repair out of warranty; and, #3 we usually lease for about 3 years and "early out" (by 3 to 9 months (based on loyalty deals du jour).
All mecanical things break. My biggest problem with cars is their tires. The UHP and Max Performance tires that come on these Sporty Sedans don't last very long. I basically think every mile beyond 15,000 is a gift from Audi or Goodyear. Our Audis have had some niggling problems -- not having any other car brand since 1988 (our 1 BMW), I am probably NOT the best person to evaluate "reliability." Generally speaking, I want my cars to be more reliable.
Generally speaking, our Audis have had -- in our opinions -- few problems. My 2000 and 2001 Audi A6 4.2's went through in total combined (including the factory originals) 9 sets of brake rotors and pads. My 33,000 mile old allroad is on its first set, my wife's A4's and TT's and 100's and 5000's were in this respect flawless. The 2004's are probably THE most well screwed together Audis ever and the SLine A6 (too bad it can't be had in manual transmission guise) is probably right now, the biggest bargain PERIOD in this class.
The fact that the new for '05 A6 will -- from a chassis dynamics perspective -- blow the current A6's away, is really not material price-wise, since the new A6's will not be heavily discounted and incentivized (is that a word?). Moreover, you can get an AUDI extended warranty to 100,000 miles which will protect you from catastrophic expenses (of course there still is that tire issue, but that may be a personal problem of mine.)
If I had a 2000 or 2001 Audi product, the lure of the deep unhealable discounts on this fine A6 Sline would certainly tempt me -- big time.
Fear not the rumors pertaining to reliability -- the car is a blast to drive, to my eyes does NOT look dated and can be had with all the toys to keep it "fresh" for some years to come.
This, to repeat, may be one of the last big bargains for a few years.
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Anecdote: super majority of Audis are leased for equal to or less than 42 months.
Anecdote: repeat % of Audi lease-holders re-leasing Audis has risen in recent years.
Audi is praised by the major car magazines, makes "lists," wins or places in the top three of multi-car comparo's time and again.
Is lauded for having "the best interiors" and world class fit and finish.
Has 100% maintenance and warranty protection for 50,000 miles or 4 years and can have "Audi sponsored" Platinum warranty extension to 100,000 miles for "a mere pittance."
Is, according to Consumer's Report and this that and the other customer initial satisfaction lists, NOT even in the top 50% -- yet Audi sales are, globally, on a tear (and the 50,000 mile Audi advantage is hardly a global feature).
Possible conclusion -- although ample evidences of Audis somewhat less than stellar reliability are hardly secret -- the car's performance and "driving experience" trump "the weakest link." Put another way, given that 39 months is the most popular lease term for an Audi and given that this financially shields most owners from any $ burden of maintaining them, Audi owner/drivers become repeat Audi owner/drivers because the "driving pleasure" obscures the reliability issue so many (non-Audi drivers) go on about.
Having said all of this, I fundamentally am in agreement with sapparo's points. And, Audi's "pretty interiors" have been in part one of the causes for their global sales records (even with a recession here and in Europe nagging them, even with the "all new" A6 and A3, 2005.5 A4, S8, RS4 and A8/SWB not even out yet.)
Audi is on a tear 'cause, practically speaking the reliability issue is a non-starter (obviously on this side of the Atlantic with the Audi Advantage and apparently elsewhere as evidenced by their record sales figures.)
The new RL is very advanced with its AWD system, and that in part is why it is still on my (Mr. Audi-loyalty Poster Child, 2004) shopping list. But, for all its technical cleverness, the Acura system is, fundamentally, an FWD biased system which, FWIW, is the type that is derided for being a "performance poser." Audi gets a "hall pass" as its Torsen system is, for the time being, at least, a 50-50 (neutral) system. But even Audi has revealed its intentions to become AWD with an RWD bias in the next iteration of quattro. So, don't hang your hat for too long on the technical superiority of Acura's AWD (SH-AWD system). I, for one, think it is a pretty neat system, but the Acura, thus far is unproven and is unlikely to become thought of as a sport-lux car (as is the Audi), rather, it will probably win its customers over by being lux-sport.
Despite previous comments, I suspect that many will be drawn to these brands based on style, performance, luxury and "value" (reliability, I contend will be an also-ran criteria). And, those that are drawn to one brand or another will have certain criteria dominate others.
At this juncture I think the RL will be a high value luxury vehicle with some sporting characteristics and SH-AWD. The Audi will almost certainly focus first on the sport side of the equation, then the luxury side.
Of course, this is, as usual, just my opinion.
The dealership is, as others above have been saying, getting 10 cars (all 3.2 AWD's)in Nov and then reportedly won't be getting any more until Feb! The 1st 10 cars are factory preconfigured with Conv, Prem, Cold, nav, XM sat, 17" wheels, advanced key, and parktronic (?not sure of their thinking).
The latest prices were exactly as stated in earlier posts, so it seems the numbers are firm. I was a little frustrated that it would take until at least Feb to special order a car, given that it is touted as being released in "fall" of this year. But I was very impressed with the car's appearance and drive. Very fun yet luxurious. Definitely a car to consider...
Nice description, I wondered why the 39 month lease so attractive over a 36 month lease etc?
I as you, have decided to do the 2005.5 A4 if it is outfitted properly as my next purchase over the A6. Load it up and it will be a bargain, faster than the A6 and enough room for work. And for the first time I am going to lease.
Also, what is the loyalty Audi lease I keep hearing about?
Thanks
Audi Loyalty has gone so far as to forgive UP TO 12 months of a lease, waive one month's up front payment and the sec dep. Sometimes there is a "cash bonus" which is used as dollars off of the new car.
There probably is a conquest bonus too, but this, since I have had 27 Audis never comes up.
Now, with respect to the A4 vs A6, you are correct, the A4 for 2005.5 looks like about 85% of an A6 for about 80% of the price (plus zippier performance and better economy).
But, I reserve the right to test drive the A6, A4, RL and yes even the Chryco 300C AWD and/or SRT-8.
Said it before, it will be tough NOT to stick with Audi, since despite the moaning and hand-wringing about reliability (often from folks who never even owned one, let alone dozens), Audi and its cars have been "berry berry good to my wife and me!"
Once again, just my opinion though.
And, once again, I do wish my cars [Audis] were more reliable. Yet, having said that, the issues I have had with them have been, as they say, mostly "nits."
The MMI is very intuitive. To set a destination, you begin turning the dial to select the characters in the street name. The computer begins narrowing down the choices with each letter you pick until the only remaining choice is the one you want. I think it will be very easy to use, especially with experience. It seems as intuitive as using the mouse on a computer IMO.
Good watching!
http://www2.autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=3205&ca- tegoryId=8