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Comments
I wish you happiness with your new MB, but we will be buying the true champion.
"The new 2003 Mercedes Benz E-Class also offers their customers the new Panoramic roof, its just marvelous darling!" We don't need useless technology to enjoy driving Jaguars! Nothing is gained there.
It seems there are a couple of trolls here, and ones who enjoy looking their rose colored glasses at that! Anyway, enjoy the MB (if you ever get one). I will still take the S over the E any day for the reasons already stated.
-- clockmeister
My parents just bought their 2003 S-Type 3.0 last Saturday. After reading the owner's manual, the S-Type will be available with Adaptive Cruise Control (ACC) similar to Mercedes-Benz Distronic. There is a blank button on the dash (between the trunk and fuel filler release) that would otherwise activate it. By the way, ACC has been available on European XKs since 1999. So you can't really make fun of the E-Class for having it...
Is the Mercedes E-Class technically superior to the S-Type? Yes! The E-Class surpasses even the S-Class in that regard (except for ABC). I can't see how you can refute that.
But so what if the E-Class is technically superior? That's in no way putting down the S-Type. The new suspension makes for a great ride, and the advanced (!) 6-speed auto is almost transparent. But mostly, the S-Type is beautiful...it's posh and unmistakably British. And isn't that why you bought it?
Todd
P.S. I'll read the manual again to find out more about ACC.
I saw in the owner's manual that power folding side mirrors are optional (not in the US). Does anyone know where to get part numbers for current Jag models? Maybe they could be retrofitted...
Later,
Todd
Jaguar gives free shedualed maintenance on all of its models for 4-years/50,000 miles.
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I still say that while the new E-Class may have a "technologically superior" trunk-lid, that's about all that it has over the new 2003 S-TYPE in terms of being more technologically advanced. The S-TYPE is not in any way behind the times in technology - especially technology that has to do with delivering great handling and performance, and a smooth ride - things that a driver really cares about, not gimmicky items like a motorized trunk-lid. I'll take CATS over a "Distronic" cruise control system any day.
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whatup-
Sorry, you posted while I was typing so I initially missed your message. I'll search around and see if I can find out about the mirrors.
Keyrow: When shopping with my parents, I heard $1500 discounts on 2003 S-Types. But I think they would do even better than that. That was Bergen Jaguar in Paramus, NJ.
jagboyxtype: Thanks for looking into the mirrors for me. But back to the E for one second...what about its SBC braking and Airmatic DC suspension, amongst other things? But I do agree that Distronic and ACC are unecessary...
I just want to clarify...I think the S-Type is a great car. It's not that the S-Type is behind its time, but the E seems to be ahead of the pack in terms of technology. And I'm sorry you guys now have a Mercedes fan on your hands...I drive my mom's old C220. But I'm just a car nut otherwise...
Also, is there an easy-entry feature for the 2003 S-Type? I thought when you set the wheel adjustment to AUTO, the easy-entry feature is activated. It's doesn't seem to be working in our new S. Any help?
Otherwise, our Jag has two minor problems from delivery. The auto-up feature on the passanger-side window is not working, and there's a wiring harness sticking out from under the driver's seat. Oh yeah, the car is slightly out of alignment. Is that part of the dealer-prep?
Thanks,
Todd
Todd
Tood, Where do you get these silly leapers from?
I'm a born and raised American! What do I care if the car is British built! I bought it because it was and still is the most Elegant & Beautiful Mid-Size Luxury sedan in the entire universe. But can I not admire other fine automobiles such as Mercedes, Ferrari, Maserati or Audi witout being indicted for teason?
There is no reason to accuse folks of being less than sincere in their postings because they have a different point of view than you do.
So let's relax and enjoy the view... er, conversation, okay?
Pat
Sedans Host
Let us live in Peace and Harmony with our individual decisions. Chilling with a nice glass of Simi Cabernet.
"But back to the E for one second...what about its SBC braking and Airmatic DC suspension, amongst other things? But I do agree that Distronic and ACC are unecessary..."
Mercedes-Benz is using an "Airmatic" system for their suspension which uses a gas to balance out the car, etc. Lincoln and Cadillac have had air-suspensions for years though, and GMC now has it as an option on the Envoy and its variants. It is supposed to be very smooth. Countering this, Jaguar uses a Computer Active Technology Suspension (CATS) on the S-TYPE that senses what kinds of road the car is on and then adjusts the suspension to handle that road with the best composure, etc. It also tightens up when taking corners hard and making other performance maneuvers to keep the car from swaying at all and to keep the car as balanced as possible. It has received high praise from the press, and Jaguar has also continually been making improvements upon the system, I believe version IV is now being used on the 2003 S-TYPE. We have it on our 2000 S, and it works well. If you must have an air suspension though, the new XJ-Series will have this feature and it may be given to future S-TYPEs as an option or on ones without the Sport Suspension Package.
SBC braking actually seems like a good system that makes the cars stop in very short distances. I'm not sure I would really like to have just electrical wires between me and the brakes though. I'd hate to have an electrical failure and find that my brakes do not work at all. This is more advanced than what Jaguar, and any other cars have on them, but more advanced doesn't always mean better. So far it does seem like a good system though, but I want to see its record over time before I totally back it. Jaguar uses vented front and solid rear ABS disc brakes on their cars. Excellent braking distances have always been a hallmark of Jaguars, and it should be as they were the first to research, develop, and introduce Anti-Lock Brakes to cars when they used them on D-TYPEs at Le Mans - and won five times. Currently, they also use electronic brake distribution systems to equalize and distribute braking power to the brakes that would be most beneficial in stopping the car in the shortest distance.
Distronic is nothing new, as I said before, big-rig trucks have had those cruise-control systems for many years. I do not see how much better this system is over a conventional cruise-control system, as it is still the driver's responsibility to actually drive the car, and even if someone were to cut in front of a car with Distronic, the system can only apply a maximum of 25% of the car's braking power, so if the car that cuts in and slows, the Mercedes is doomed just like any other conventional cruise-control car.
I'm not trying to knock the E-Class, it is a very advanced and nice car, but I feel that much of its "advanced technology" will not really be used in real driving situations, and all of it is optional on the car, where as the S-TYPE comes standard with much of its advanced technology with an $8,000-lower starting price as well. Jaguar has been very serious about keeping its range of cars up to date with the latest and best proven technology, and the S-TYPE is no exception. And can the Mercedes say "BOOT OPEN" when you open the luggage compartment? - Nope :-)
The neutral position on the steering wheel is off slightly to the right...no more than 5 degrees off-center. The car gradually pulls to the right when the wheel is in the correct straight position. But the car doesn't vibrate at high speeds though...it has been driven consistently between 70 and 80 MPH.
"...it's posh and unmistakably British."
Sorry, I spent last semester in South Kensington, London...I've been anglicized...
Todd
Yes you COULD convert the car, but you would need:
Power folding mirror assemblies ($300+++ each I am sure)
Wiring Harness ($200+)
Switches...etc...
I.E. they are a cool toy, but you'd also have to order the parts from mainland europe (LHD car).
Bill
Thanks for the mirror information, but do you have any specific prices and part numbers? I'm sure it's not going to happen, but they would be nice to have...our garage has large shelving, so folding the mirrors helps get by. But then again, we could just fold them manually...
Does anyone know how much a rear seat cover for a 2003 S-Type would cost?
Thanks
http://www.arden.de
Bill
Bill
IGNORE HIM!
1) Dad's '97 XJ6. 81K miles. Bought it at the auction in Sept 00 with 48K on it.
mechanical Repairs to date: 1 power steering hose, 1 switch (Sport/Normal switch for tranny mode.. actually the trim piece holding it in broke). About $300 in nearly 2 years.
That's it. Needed new Pirellis and brakes when we bought it, will need Pirellis again, and just got second set of pads.
2) My '95 Vanden Plas. Bought new. 141K miles. Costs? $1,185 since it went out of warranty on repairs. (Couple hoses, tilt motor for steering column, a P/S hose, 1 can of R134a, 1 cupholder, and an oxygen sensor at 135K.
Bill
Anyone else have any thoughts along these lines ?
Of course buyers would pay a couple hundred more dollars for a nicer interior, but carmakers no longer build to a standard, but to a predetermined cost. It's a shame, but at least they're getting much better at it.
The trim doesn't bother me that much, but there are some minor changes I would suggest.
(1) The outside temperature display: Why does is it displayed only when the climate control is on? And why not show it in the trip computer?
(2) Radio display: Again, why isn't this included in the trip computer?
Todd
Now we are also complaining about the black plastic on the center console around the climate control and radio?! Well, the XJ (2003 and the previous generation as well) and the XK and the X-TYPE all have the same kind of black plastic there, and it isn't as if the plastic breaks easily or does not function properly or that it even looks bad. People in Crown Victorias are being killed when their gas tanks explode in rear end collisions, and people in Lexuses are plagued with engine sludge and transmission problems that could become dangerous on the road, and people in BMWs have brake system recalls where the brake pedal does not work and airbag recalls where hitting bumps on the road deploys the airbags, and people in Mercedes-Benzes are plagued with quality problems that rival Jaguars of old, and you are all looking around in your beautiful S-TYPEs and finding that you dislike the wee bit of plastic on the center console and that the radio does not have a secondary display in the trip computer! Not only that, but none of those other cars or any of the S-TYPE's competators have an interior or an exterior that are even half as nice as the S-TYPE's, yet you are still complaining?! Ahhhhh! Come on people, just enjoy your cars. You are driving JAG-U-ARs here. :-) :-) :-)
Since this is my once-in-a-lifetime car purchase I want that perfection so I have already contacted Arden to upgrade mine. It's just that the purchase experience would have been nicer if Jaguar had already provided this option.
My parents drive the S-Type, so it really doesn't affect me much anyway, but I think these minor changes would make driving it more enjoyable. I like always having the outside temp. displayed (i.e. on a Benz) and not having to glance down at the radio when it could just be displayed right in front of me. Yeah, these things are minor, but they don't detract from the car. I know the S-Type is an excellent car, but I can still suggest some improvements. No car is perfect, no matter how beautiful it may be.
Oh yeah, how much is a rear seat cover for the 2003 S-Type? Is it bundled with front covers too?
Later,
Todd
Folks, we are here to talk about the vehicles. We are not here to snipe at each other.
Pat
Sedans Host