Saab 9-5 Sedan

redirector

I have a quote for a 2002 Saab 9-5 Arc for Invoice, less $4k dealer cash, which is part of a 2002 preview promotion running in december. This puts the price in the $33k range (below if black, above if painted metallic) before ttl. I have not seen any of the xenon-optioned 9-5's hit the dealer yet.

Ask your dealer about the $4k cash, and work out invoice pricing. They would like to sell, in part to help ensure they have enough volume to qualify for a JD Power mimimum level for consideration in their surveys.

I believe the $4k would also apply to a lease, that should drive down your payment.

And I agree, it is a really fine vehicle. I drove the 2002 and it is better, corners flatter, than the 2001 versions. Haven't driven the new upgraded Aero engine yet.

Also cross-shopping Volvos, and for this price I don't see anything in the Volvo lineup that can touch it.

bretfraz

Don't forget the true "national" competitor to the 9-5 is the Volvo S80. Not much different than comparing the Mustang to the Camaro.

Compare the S60 to the Acura TL or Audi A4.

msieve

Dealer faxed me $560/month for a 3 yr lease on a 2002 9-5 Linear today, includes tax, and that was with the $4000 dealer discount and $2200 startup. That's too much bucha for those wheels. Especially when local Minneapolis guys are selling 2001's for $24,000 with 15-20,000 miles on them and remainder of warranties. Is the ride THAT much better in the '02? WHERE ARE DEALERS SELLING/LEASING OFF INVOICE LIKE THAT? I'LL GO THERE AND DRIVE IT BACK. (I'm in Minnesota)
I've driven the A4 and the TL, the S60 is a better car in most respects for me, but they scrunched it up to compete with BMW, lost rear legroom, etc., Saab still gives you massive, flat cargo from the rear seats, all the stuff the 9000 gave me on my last lease.

bretfraz

Hell, last year I could have had an Aero for $550/mo for 3 yrs with $2000 down.

I wonder what all the details are (money factor, residual, cap cost).

mweinstein2

I was quoted a price of $507.91 for 3 year 15k lease with start up of $2000 + other fees so the total out of pocket is $3,756.41. They were pushing the $4000 savings discount but feel it is alot of money out of pocket. In July, they quoted me for an SE, $1000 down, $489 a month. I think there will be more deals in the New Year. None of the dealers is my area have the Xenon Lights.

chrism123

I will be picking up my 01 9-5 SE Wagon tomorrow. I had to go with the wagon (2 kids and 1 dog). For me anyway the lease deal was too good to pass up, $329/month for 3 yrs with $2k down. The car is new (only 3 miles on the odometer).

In general has everybody's experience with the 9-5 been positive. Is the V6 a good choice considering Saab is known for their 4-cyclinders. My car does come with the Onstar system and 1-year free premium service. Any opinions on this system.

Chris

wasabi911

that sounds like a great deal. can you give me the details; money factor, mi/yr, residual, etc?

where are you getting the car?

thanks

chrism123

Here is the data for my 01 9-5 SE Wagon (new) w/ Black (exterior) and Gray (interior):

MSRP $40520.
Cap Cost $30720.
M.F. .00099
Term 36 month
Resid. 0.46

Cash Down (adj Cap) $28721
Payment $329

Note: This is a 10k mile/yr lease. Wife only drives about 6k/yr.

Just came back from picking up our car. I have only put 30 miles on the car but so far I'm impressed. Nice sounding audio system. I believe we made a good choice.

Chris

wasabi911

Thanks Chris

Congrats on your new Saab.

chrism123

wasabi911, I thought it was a 3yr 10k mile/yr lease. Rather it is a 3yr 15k mile/yr. Small change but enough to mention.

Chris

bretfraz

You'll love the SE. Mine is a '00 sedan and the motor is terrific. The off-the-line torque feels right and the car excels at highway driving. That V6 will shoot you past anything on the road, no waiting for the turbo or the revs.

The car steers a little heavier than the 4 cyl models but nothing terrible. I keep an extra 2-3 PSI in the front tires to compensate.

Enjoy!!

msieve

Where did you get that lease deal? $329/month with 15k/year is unheard of here in Minnesota-----if there are any more of those '01's at your dealer I'll be there before the New Year to get one.
Enjoy.

chrism123

I live in New Hampshire. I bought my car from Gary Blake Saab in Exeter, NH. No haggling. Sales person was very professional. Simply stated it was the easiest sales process that I have been through. Highly recommend this dealership if you live in the area.

bretfraz, I agree with you statement that the V6 is terrific. While this is my wife's car I have been able to put 75 miles on it since Friday. However I will give it a truer test once the car has 300-500 miles on the odometer.

Chris

smu1976

I bought one of the early 1999 9-5's and being an Audio nut I knew something was not right with over 200 watts of power. Here is what you do!
At the same time you turn your unit on you push the "WB" button (this is the weather band). You want to adjust the "start volume" to the mid to higher twenties. This is the Harmon Amp Volume, not the volume when you turn on your stereo. The factory setting is at "9", or under one third. Most people (including the dealers) have no idea about this, so people complain about the stereo.
When you adjust it to the mid twenties "25" the volume will remain high for about 10 seconds, then it will go back down. Now your set, Merry Christmas. Just remember, start volume is amplifier volume, not the music starting volume. Enjoy this fine Harmon piece. I always adjust this in the 9-5 and 9-3 loaner, which are all set at number "9" from the factory. I leave this message about once a year, ENJOY.

dski

Well damn. That's the first explaination out of many that I've understood. LOL

I've tried this but always figured "Start Volume" was the volume the radio would be at when I start the car and 25 is not acceptable for that. Finally someone explained that - this is NOT the case. It was probably my inability to comprehend explainations in the past.

Thanks a million for that SMU - I just adjusted mine. If you would not have explained that the volume will go back down after 10 seconds I would never have made the adjustment. Of course I only have four months left on my lease.

Merry Christmas everyone.
Drew

chrism123

Just made the adjustment to my system and it certainly did make a difference. Thanks again for the Christmas present.

Chris

smu1976

I only have about 7 months left on my lease also.
I know I am not going to keep the car, for I have had too many Saabs and don't care to own one that does not have a bumper to bumper warranty. Are you going to get another Saab, or lease something else in the 30-40K class? There is a few more competitors out there than in 99 when we got ours.
I am thinking about an Auto Aero (if the lease agreements are close to what they are giving now).
But then there are the new Mercedes, Jag, Infiniti I35, to consider. Your thoughts?

ffb13

i have not posted here for a long time and i see that drew and dski are still posting.
my 2000 aero only has 34,000 trouble free miles on it (knock on wood )mostly high speed driving.
the car is still great at 110 to 125 mph--just great.and fun......
i have noticed that the postings now have more to do with financing than problem areas......other than the fuel tank----a good omen.......(knock on wood ,again ).
mr aero is now averaging 30 mpg at about 78 to 80 mph steady----used to be 24 to 26 mpg. tire press. at 40 psi all around.
also,my dealer in ct. charges 699 for the 30k service vs. 300 in vermont.
brakes all around pads only 800 in ct.-----440 in vt.---still expensive and up there with bmw and mb.
but the car is a lot of fun

dski

Steve... I really don't know what we're going to do. She wants a third row seat ie. mini van but I hate them and she does NOT like driving larger vehicles but it could happen.

I'm leaning towards 9-5 wagon but not liking the sticker prices I'm seeing on the new Saabs. As much as I enjoy the Saab - $40K is way too much. The Aero is not an option for us right now. I don't want to pay the price or have low mileage poor wet traction tires. Also, I think the real benefit of the Aero is mainly with a 5 speed. The automatic Aero doesn't excel enough over the regular 9-5 to be worth the price difference but that's just my opinion. With a significan't price concession that might change my mind.

I may look into cars in a lower price range. Nissan has some nice '02 cars as do several others. If Saab gets me a great deal, I'll probably go that route again though.

ffb.... dski is drew. Glad to see your still happy with your 9-5 too. BTW 40psi sounds much too high. Are you sure that is correct? Do you have the low profiles? I had a tire dealer who insisted the tire pressure should be at the MAX printed on the tire. He was Dead Wrong. He had me bouncing all over the road in my SUV. I corrected it and all was fine. Other dealers confirmed my belief that you should use a similar psi listed on the door plate of the vehicle not the tire. The tire lists max allowable for the tire design and allows for lower psi depending on the individual vehicle.

The Ford Exporer controversy confused everybody on this issue it seems. That was the one tire dealers claim to using the highest psi. I said no - the Ford thing was involving psi more around 22-23 which is way too low. Most vehicles using lower pressures are listing 27 to 35. My Montero actually lists 28 but I use 30 - 32 to balance tire wear and ride.

Happy New Year everyone!
Drew

bretfraz

The Michelin Energy MXV4 Plus' on my SE have a max pressure of 51psi. I run 39 in the fronts and 37 in the rears. But 40 is not excessive IMO.

Don't know what the 17" tires have as a max press but I do know one needs to use a lot of pressure in those, more than usual.

dski

Well I'm no expert. It just seems to me that 40psi wouldn't maximize handling and comfort. Definately not comfort anyway.

The door plate says around 32 - 37 (I believe) according to load. I'll stick with that.

drew

redirector

Drew, you should be able to find a new Aero for under $40k, there is a 9-5 Preview promotion that is giving the dealers $4k for vehicles sold before Jan 2. That is off whatever price you negotiate. On Arc's, it is possible to get a car close to invoice, then subtract the $4k, so we're talking $34k or less for an Arc. Aeros, with less supply, will likely not be discounted as heavily, but in any case the $4k should help bring down acquisition costs substantially.

Also, the 02's have a new 5sp Automatic, and the Aero's specifically, with this new Auto, can handle the full 250hp and full torque of the engine just like the manual. That's good news for 02. Good luck.

dski

There's no way I'll do anything before next week. My lease is up at the end of April. Even if I get an incentive on one now, I'm not prepaired for it by next week.

My 9-5SE was in the neighborhood of $31K. I'm not really sure I want to venture into the mid 30's. The 250hp for the Aero Automatic is Great news though. They had to do something considering you can get a 240hp Nissan under 30K.

Drew

mghurle

Well, it is odd to see people still in here since I bought my 9-5 in 1999... and stopped posting afterward!

Anyway... I'm back in the market for another 9-5 again, but unfortunately; not by choice. The resale values here in St. Louis suck. I am really amazed at how little this car is holding its own against even a Saturn! This is forcing me to either take a loss on another make, or stay with the Swedes.

This week I've looked at the A4, I35, TL, Avalon, Millenia, ES300, E240, and even a Bravada! Needless to say, the news from the non-Saab dealers weren't too good.

The question is whether leasing would solve this problem? I don't want to be stuck in 3 years like this again.

On another note, our local Saab dealer (West-County) has 3 new 9-5's in CLOTH INTERIOR!!! This is the no-cost item (deleting the leather) in the Linear. Won't this hurt resale in the long-run? There is -no- reduction in price for the cloth interior off the MSRP.

Comments, please?

smu1976

I have owned two Saabs, a 86 900 SPG, and a 92 9000 Griffen (one of 400) which stickered over 42 grand in l992. I will be working a few years longer. The 92 Saab was worth only 5-6K with only 40K miles. Saab did give me a great trade in on the 9-5 and I will only lease Saabs from now on. I love the cars, they are a little different, they do have a little more maintinance then comparable Japan models, but you don't see one on every corner. They are good strong, safe cars, that are not common. I get an car allowance that covers the lease, so this makes it different for me. Everyone is different, but three years is enough for me in a car. Drew, I agree with you though, the market in the 30-40K range is tighter. The new Aero/Auto is tempting for me though.

Your best time to buy a Saab is in early fall (Sept/Oct/Nov), they will always be trying to push last years models with some of the best lease rates and discounts in the industry.

I am in St. Louis also, MGHURLE, don't be afraid to shop on the Internet, EBAY, Kansas City, Chicago for a good lease. This board will give you some good dealers nationwide, and you can have the car shipped easy with the savings.

West County Motors, and Mid American are always pretty close to each other, but both of them aren't going to bend over to give anyone a deal, plus they are somewhat "stuffy" at West County Motors. West County Service department is very good though. Happy motoring.

bretfraz

A lack of leather in a car like this will kill you at resale time. There may be no financial benefit for having leather but I can almost guarantee a financial detriment if you have cloth.

Only advantage I can see for cloth is if you'll keep your car for years and years. On a 10 year old car it doesn't matter much.

redirector

Today I ended my search and bought a 2002 9-5 3.0t Arc. Black/tan. Ended up with a good combination of invoice pricing, dealer cash, trade allowance, and at-cost accessories. I am adding the wood wheel, wood shifter, door pulls, flaps, and the cd changer. Oh, and at my cost, I am swapping out the 2002 wood dash for the 2001, so it will all blend together. That dash wasn't cheap, $700 "their cost" was the quote.

The Saab dealership in Austin made the sale today, Glenn Gray closed the deal and was quite fair and committed to the process. There was a hiccup on the actual quoted trade vs what I ended up receiving, but we compromised with the use of the Holdback and some accessories and "stayed above the fray" in terms of emotion and tacky tactics.

Bottom line, I'm happy to drive home in my new Saab, can't wait for the extra wood interior amenities, and they certainly got a good deal on my 01 MB SLK 320 roadster. They will make money. All the same, it would have been hard for me to wait to find a qualified buyer for significantly above the trade+sales tax allowance in this economy, esp in winter.

godeacs

why would you unload a 2001 MB so fast?

redirector

good question. lifestyle change, now need vehicles that both my wife and I can (and are willing to) drive, with more capacity, an auto tranny, safe, room for more than one other person. Roadster was a personal car for me, had great fun and loved it for a year. Sorry to see it go. Great driver, will be happy to go back to MB in the future based on this vehicle and on the experience I had with the dealer.

ffb13

the 40 psi is about right.
i always inflate my tires for best handling and feel. the 17 inchers in my aero feel best at 40 or so.
plus this helps protect the side walls of these tires when running into or over pot holes,curbs,etc...

re:auto vs.manual---most of my cars are manual--50/50-----
the saab aero is better in auto,specially with the power button that holds the revs high.
and,even on a track most racers today if not all are auto---there is no way a manual can beat the quck shifting action of the new autos- when used as up / down with the paddles-------------

and just drive the new ferraris --best of them ---or porsche triptronics.
also,
the new aero seats appear to be better than the previous ones. but so far tthe best seats out there are in the audi S8.

jaynich

I am relatively cheap, and am convinced that the way to go on a Saab is to buy one that someone else has depreciated (due to the car's rapid depreciation) I can buy (in upstate NY) a 99 9-5 S lease turn-in with 40-45k miles for $17.5-18.9 depending on extras. I will buy only cars that have been serviced by dealers with records. I plan to purchase the 100k warranty for $1500 to $2000 (with a $200 deductable). I consider this Tranny and A/C insurance.

I appreciate any and all advise/opinions on this strategy. I think the 99 9-5 beats a new Accord or Camry hands down.

Jay

My goal will be to drive it till it drops.

bretfraz

Buy them used or lease them new. It's the only financially sensible thing to do with SAAB's until their resale values begin to stabilize.

The 9-5 is so far superior to those crackerbox Asian cars that there is almost no comparison. Just on crash integrity alone the 9-5 is the only choice.

You'll need to do some shopping and find one that was maintained to perfection - beyond factory recommendations. One that's been babied by someone who loved it. Those are the cars that last forever.

mstssc

Jay, your strategy is correct I think provided you find the right car. There is good value here.

Also, the Saab 9.5 is at least one if not two classes above both the Accord or Camry and I would put it up there with the BMW5, A6 and C-class maybe even E class Mercs. Try finding one of these other cars for 20K, 99 model year!

acrafton

I have both a Saab 9-5 Wagon and a MB E320 and while I love both cars, the Saab is NOT in the same class as the MB E320. Fit and finish, luxury, technology, safety features, etc. are not comparable in the two vehicles. The Saab and the C class are more in the same class . . .

Adam

smu1976

Though a nice ride, the Saab is not at all in the same class as the "E" class. "C" yes, "E" no way.
Don't kid yourselfs guys, we all would like to think so, but their not. We are in the mid 30's class, MB "E" is close to the mid "50's". These are real world prices, not MSRP. Fit, finish, ride, tightness after 100K, its a another world with the E Class.

smu1976

Just checked edmunds, those options will kill you on the MB. Invoice MSRP TMV®
Regional Base Price $45,059 $48,450 $47,494
Color Adjustment - - $0
Optional Equipment $4,920 $7,725 $7,574
Destination Charge $645 $645 $645
Total $50,624 $56,820 $55,713
I just picked about half of them, maybe you can get 5K off @ 55K? I'll stick with the Sweedes', driving an MB is too stuffy if you in sales, not good for business. Saab and Volvo's are good enough!

mstssc

Okay, I give. Maybe not the E class and maybe not the 5 series but certainly 3 series, C class and definately better than any toyota, honda or acura similarily priced. Of course, I may be able to get both a Saab wagon and sedan for an E class .

mstssc

You are right about the sales bit. I am a consultant and if my client seen me pull up in a benz he would be reviewing my rates. No such response with the Saab. No one knows what it is.

linearbaron

I have a new 2002 9-5 linear and love it. I just got the snows 205/55/16 and I noticed that my speedometer and odometer are about 2% off - the odo shows me having driven 100 miles when I have only gone 98. Is this normal? Does anyone else have this problem? By the way thanks for the Harmon Kardon radio amp setting advice.

bretfraz

Note the message on the church sign. I believe every word of this:

http://www.saabnet.com/tsn/photo/0201.jpg

nferr

You can get a great bargain on used Saabs due to the low resale. In November I leased a 1998 Saab 900SE turbo convertible with 48,000 miles for $166 a month. Total out of pocket including 1'st payment, all fees, etc. was $800. Its a 24 month lease with 24,000 miles. The car is immaculate, and I had them put on brand new tires. The cd changer wasn't working properly so I went to Saab and had a new changer installed under warranty. The dealer had 8 1998 convertibles and they all leased in one weekend. The only sad thing is I don't think I'll ever find another deal like this one when the lease expires.

mstssc

That sounds pretty good. Just think what new car you would be driving for that budget. Probably a Neon or Sunfire. Trouble is you may not be able to keep the mileage within limits. I am having that trouble with mileage on my 9.5 - just like to drive it.

nferr

Yes I'm driving the Saab quite a bit. I usually commute om my motorcycle in the warmer months so hopefully I can keep the miles low, but my wife will probably want to use the convertible at that time, so who knows? But even at 20 cents a mile a few thousand extra won't be that bad.

mghurle

After hand-wringing over a new car for the past few weeks, Saab has finally lost. All of this because of the very poor resale values.

My 9.5 SE won't even get a phone call for being in the paper for $16,900. This was after putting on a new set of Pirelli's (ouch.) The wholesale (auction) values have 9.5's going for $12,100, so the dealers are no help in getting rid of this.

I shake my head when I realize how much I've lost in trade equity by not buying a TL back in 99. Oh well, que sera, sera.

So for those who are going to buy a Saab, (and don't plan to keep it very long), don't do it... lease it. I wish that I had!

mstssc

Yes, in the short term its not good, but look at how much more fun you had for three years not going with the TL . You also have to be careful with the leasing of Saabs and compare all numbers. When I picked up mine it was short listed with the IS300. Both at about $47k cdn. IS300 residual at $27k cdn, Saab residual at $21k cdn. However, interest rates differences offered made the payment about the same (Saab was 1.9%, Lexus was 6.9%). Cost to me over three years isthe same. If I don't keep the Saab I lose no more money than Lexus. If I like the Saab and buy, it costs me $6k less to buy out. I know the other option of buy out and resell is there and probably more sucessful with Lexus but I don't like the hassle of selling used or trading in if I don't have to.

rwinston2

I bought my saab 9-5 SE in Feb. 2000 and it came with three years of free service (oil changes, etc.), so the dealer said. I had my car serviced at 10,000 miles, but I did not have my saab serviced at 20,000 miles (I used jiffy lube instead), and I brought my car in with 26,500 miles. The saab dealer performed an oil change and tire rotation, and proceeded to charge me $160.00 for the service. When I told the Service head, Austin, that my saab had three years of free service, he stated that the service only applies if you take your car in within 1,000 miles of 10,000/20,000/30,000. So goes three years of free oil changes which are recommended by saab every 5,000 miles. When I bought the car, I was told that all oil changes were covered every 5,000 miles. When I told the service dealer that, even under Saab's failure to disclose that Saab was only covering oil changes every 10,000 miles, Saab still owed me the 20,000 mile service, he stated that the rules do not work that way.

The dealer was Brown Saab in Charlottesville, VA. I feel quite scammed as I was told when I purchased the car that these things were covered. That is an expensive $160 "oil and lube job" lesson that I had to learn and I hope that others can see how this dealer operates before they make the same mistake.
R. Winston.

godeacs

did you get it in writing? I doubt it because oil changes are NOT part of the "free service", only 10K/20K/30K services. Perhaps you misunderstood what was "free" maybe....or did the Saab dealer give you free oil changes at 5K and 15K miles (you did not mention)? If so, you have a case but I suspect that did not happen....looks like the "fine print" got you, sorry to say....

bretfraz

Sounds more like you weren't clear as to what the factory-paid service entailed. One person told you oil changes every 5K, another said every 10K. One thing does seem clear - the factory service does not apply any ol' time you want. It's not like you have this trump card up your sleeve you can whip out whenever you feel like it. IMO, it is incumbent upon you to make sure you understand what is and is not offered by Saab, not incumbent upon Saab to make sure you are clear on service policies. If you had questions, why not just call the dealer and ask?

Sorry, but I think blaming the dealer is wrong of you. This amounts to nothing more than a lack of understanding of factory service policy. For you to name the dealer and service manager is an uncalled for cheapshot.

rwinston2

that I had not used my 20,000 mile service, and the dealer was telling me that if you do not use it, it is gone after 21,000 miles. That was hardly represented to me when I bought the car during the "3 years of free service" promotion. It seems strange that Saab would offer 3 years of free service, and the truth is that it includes 3- $25 jiffy lube services. And no, I did not get any free 5,000 mile services in the past, nor did the dealer give me a loaner when they took my car for the entire day.
To claim that I made a "cheap shot" by mentioning facts that occurred shows a slight bias that sounds like it comes from a fellow service technician at another saab dealer. These are the facts, and if they help others from making the same "misunderstanding," then that can hopefully only benefit this group. Cheers.

godeacs

you didn't service our car at 20K miles like the manufacturer/dealer recommended. So you wait until 26K and stroll on in....hard to believe you spent that much money on a fine car and NOT maintain it according to manufacturer standards esp when the service is FREE!

I sincerely doubt anyone else would make the same "misunderstanding". Like bretfaz says, blaming the dealer for YOUR lack of understanding is wrong.