Volkswagen Passat 2005 and earlier

markcincinnati

. . .there is more stuff done at a maintenance interval (typically) than is listed in the manual. I am not defending or at least not meaning to, but when you ask for the XXXXX service interval, the work sheet shows the stuff they do, which is generally (typically) several items, rarely, if ever, just an oil+filter change.

I remember the "old days" when every little do dad was listed -- perhaps with Audi, since everything, and I do mean everything is free, they only list the big stuff. Maybe the same folks who write the Audi manuals write the VW manuals though.

Since you have already had the oil change just go back and ask what would have been done that wasn't and, unless it is totally bovine scatology, let them do it and then go to another dealer from this point forward.

EVERYTIME I read this stuff here on the VW board, it just sickens me -- I would gladly pay some small premium (built into the MSRP) to have no hassle maintenance and service (like on the Audi products). I mean, literally, I drive by the Audi store and pull in and ask to have my tires filled up and the wiper blades replaced and an all wheel alignment -- and, ya know what? They do it, they wash the car and if you choose they loan you a car for the day -- I said if YOU choose.

Conversely, on Saturday morning if I'm feeling lazy, I pull in and they wash and hand dry it -- for free (although I usually tip the guy who actually does the work).

The minimal amount of maintenance my turbo charged V6 Audi takes in 50,000 miles is what -- $500 to $1000 at full retail. Heck just to have folks stop complaining about crappy dealer experiences, you would think that VW would offer this as an OPTION?!?

I feel for you. I love the cars, I want one of them -- I just can't play these games.

307web

Every maintenance item required to maintain warranty coverage has to be listed in the owners manual.

jrct9454

I observed on another VW board that it is almost ludicrous to hear VW talking about "moving upscale" with the truly pathetic performance of so much of the North American dealer body. These guys, taken as a group [there are always wonderful exceptions - I can even name a few], vary from the merely uninformed to the seriously incompetent, and everything in between. The really good ones stand out because they appear to be such exceptions.

Fact: most dealers push "preventative mtc. schedules" that have very little to do with the required PM as listed by the manufacturer, and everything to do with the service dept as a profit center. Caveat emptor.

markcincinnati

If this is the case, what is the issue then with the "stamp" indicating the service was performed? The service was an oil change, therefore, if the service manual indicated an oil change but called it the 15,000 mile check up what's the diff?

I looked at my 30,000 mile service interval, which is an oil+ filter change (for a 2003 Audi 2.7T allroad).

Here is what the service ticket afterwards said:

OIL+filer (Mobil1 0-40W customer will pay diff)

Replaced wiper blades, blades were SMEERING (not my spelling)

Door hinges lubricated

Brakes wear inspected

Tires inflated (37 front, 35 rear)

Windshield washer refill

Road test

Wash and vacuum

Dealer supplied Rental unit (2004 A6 stock # 1234455)

Total cost $23, oil upcharge, everything else N/C

Call customer when finished.

====

This, hardly qualifies as warranty work, it just seems like "normal course of biz" stuff.

The VW dealer who refuses to stamp the book would be motivated to be this way because. . .?

rickrover

I had a 2000 Passat that came with full maintenance for 30 or 40k miles (I don't remember). I think VW dropped the free maintenance in 2001. I had the Passat for 2 years and around 35k miles and never had a single problem with it.

I traded that Passat for a late 2001 BMW X5 that has full maintenance for 50k miles. I also have a 2003 Jetta wagon. We typically have a BMW and VW in the garage.

Long story short the BMW dealer never stamps the maintenance book, does provide a loaner and always acts like they are doing you a huge favor by talking to you. BMW's recommended oil change interval is 15,000 miles! I get mine changed every 5k miles. Luckily I've never had a problem with the X5 so my exposure to this dealer is limited.

My VW dealer is fantastic, great service department - way better than the BMW dealer.

markcincinnati

This was GREAT to read! Thanks for "the other side!"

taft4

When I took delivery on a new Subaru Forester 18 months ago I thought its ride, compared to the demonstrater I had driven, was inordinately harsh. One of the participants on the Forester board suggested that I check my tire pressures because cars shipped in from overseas usually had over inflated tires, for a reason I have forgotten. Even though the dealer had extolled his pre-delivery inspections, I checked the tires and found the suggestion was true.

Anyway, I picked up our new Passat GLX yesterday and remembered that suggestion. Although the sellers, both the Subaru dealer 18 months ago, and the VW dealer yesterday, told me of all the servicing they did to my cars before they were delivered to me, I thought I should check my newest acquisition too. We live in a condo with underground parking which has a consistent temperature of 65, so I parked the car overnight and checked the tires this morning.

I found all four tires had a PSI reading of 53 whereas the car sticker said the fronts should be 36 and the rears, 44. I of course deflated them to those levels. I thought that maybe this is information other new vehicle purchasers might find useful.

I hope my new dealer, who is exclusively representing VW, will have good service along the way when I need it. In researching prices it appeared that VW does not have a rebate program currently in effect, nevertheless I am satisfied with the price I paid. My GLX with OnStar had an MSRP of $31,430 and they sold it to me for $27,439. (before taxes and doc. fees). In addition the trade-in value of the Subaru was right where I expected it to be.

bjbird2

taft4, Did you use the same tire gauge each time? If so, you might want to make sure it's correct.

moda

Buying new 2004 Passat and deciding between GLX or GLS? FWD or 4 motion? I currently own a '97 Passat w/V6 engine. I appreciate any suggestions

307web

Do you have any reason to believe that you need AWD? You have had your current Passat for awhile. You should know whether or not you need the 4motion in your next car.

moda

Drove the 4-motion and it has a nice balanced ride. I heard it has slower pick up than FWD? I live on the east coast and get tons of snow. Thought this might be a better option? Also trying to decide between the GLS/GLX.

tyresmoker

I do not know if it a factory to dealer or consumer, but there is a $3k incentive that was just introduced this week on the Passat.

markcincinnati

The tire pressure recommendations on the VW models, such as the Passat, mirror the suggestions from Audi, too on their A4's for example.

I have found, over the years, greater success in the following areas can be obtainted by inflating the front tires +2 pounds over the rears:

1. handling (which includes braking)
2. tire wear
3. ride (less effect than in #1 and #2, however).

The handling in improved due to the fact that these cars ARE Front Heavy -- when stopping or slowing while cornering, there is a "load shift;" a couple of pounds extra in the fronts slightly diminishes understeer and improves the braking. The slightly higher pressure in the front also helps with tread wear, too. Rotate your tires and don't forget to re-adjust when rotating.

The ride is ever so slightly tightened -- less mushy. This, of the three, is the most subjective in my experience.

BTW, this advice came from folks on this site and others -- but, and here's the surprise -- it also came from my service manager at my VW/Audi dealer.

Try it, you might like it.

And, when the tires are shot, plus zero sizing (which simply means using the same wheel going to the next arithmetically larger tire width and the next lower profile -- e.g., car comes with 205 x 55 tires, plus zero to 225 x 50 -- on the OEM wheel) will also improve handling and overall drivability.

moda

I am a consumer. Have not heard about the 3K. Which model do you suggest?

meandean

You are right on with regards to zero plus sizing. I did that with my 2000 GLS (Bought Continental Conti contact Extremes) in 205-55 size (OEM was 195-65)and the car handles immeasurably better (tires are also V rated). Only had one problem -- as my car originally had wheel covers, the new tires were wide enough that the flex in the front caused me to lose the wheel covers on the front tires!!!

Had to buy alloys (was thinking about that anyway) and the car now rides and looks much better.

meandean

I just picked up a 2004 GLX (also have a 2000 GLS). I drove the 4 Motion and felt that it was awfully sluggish -- also was told that the loss on mpg was a bit much. So I went with the FWD.

The GLX is a much smoother engine -- only 190 horses so it isn't a rocket, but it has nice acceleration and the car just seems to ride more solidly. I do miss the better mileage from my turbo (I average about 29 mpg, have been getting about 23.5 with the 6 cylinder).

moda

Thanks-I am thinking about forgetting the 4-motion and going with FWD. I am use to a V6 engine so I hesitate going to a GLS. I have been reading about some of the VW GLX problems, down shift problem? Have you noticed this at all? I have been ready to purchase the VW Passat, but based on some of the problems noted I am comparing it to the Audi A4. Although, I have always owned and loved VW's.

bjbird2

I bought the 4 cylinder 1.8t for a number off reasons.
1. Better gas mileage. Up to 32mpg on the highway, 27 around town.
2. Better weight distribution with the lighter 4 cylinder engine up front, and obviously, a lighter car.
3. The 1.8t can be "chipped" for performance, and it will actually outperform the V6. There are a wide variety of aftermarket chips to re-program the 1.8t.
4. I like the sound of the turbo.

 Mine is FWD, and I've never been stuck in the snow. The 7" ground clearance on the Passat helps a lot.

moda

Very helpful. I have heard the term "chipped," but I don't have a clear understanding, and need to research.

sross

I've had a lot of experience with the 1.8T engine and 4wd, both in the A4 and the newer Passat 1.8T 4 motion, both automatic, in Denver. I've found the engine to be great--more than enough power even at altitude. Plenty of passing power on the steep rise from Golden to Genessee on I70. For power, you definitely don't need the V6.
The only downside is that there is some (manageable) turbo lag when you first get moving from a stop. Not a big problem at all, just takes a little getting used to when your car surges with power after about a second.
I was originally concerned about using the automatic, but it works great for me; the car isn't anemic at all (unlike my 1996 4-cyl Honda Accord auto--just horrible trying to accelerate from a stop at altitude).
I'm sure the 2wd with ESP would be just fine for pretty much any kind of driving, particularly if you don't go to the mountains much. It will save you some gas money. But the 4motion is a good deal, very solid, and there have been a couple of times when I've appreciated its sure-footedness in the mountain snow.

venus537

the passat V6 will still have better driveability and have a smoothness/refinement that the 1.8t can't match.

if you're accustomed to V6s for other reasons other than than acceleration than "chipping" the 1.8t won't be the answer. and you don't have to worry about your warranty being effected.

venus537

so when did VW discontinue the GLS V6 model?

i'm a little irritated by this. why should you have to be forced to buy the top model in order to have the V6.

anybody else pissed off by this?

bjbird2

"the passat V6 will still have better driveability and have a smoothness/refinement that the 1.8t can't match".

The only difference I can see is the very slight turbo lag with the 1.8t, which after driving for a while I don't consider an issue. The other difference is the sound of the turbo which I like, and at highway speed, the noise level is about the same. So in what way does the V6 have "better driveability and have a smoothness/refinement"?
I think the weight distribution on the 1.8t gives it better driveability and handling.
According to my dealer, chipping does not void the warranty unless it can be proven that it was directly responsible for a problem. Different dealers may interpret it differently.

venus537

i think your definition of "very slight turbo lag" is different than mine (with automatic anyway).

i hope VW is able to improve upon this with the next jetta (and passat too) because i'm looking forward to this car very much. maybe the rumored 6 speed automatic will help. increasing the displacement to 2.0l should help too.

meandean

Have not noticed this problem..but I only have 1600 miles on the new GLX. Have, on rare occasion had a slight bump with the GLS when stopping.

I checked out the A4 and find that I fit better in the Passat (I'm 6'2"). I must say that the A4 struck me as more of a driver's car -- but given the deal I got on my GLX I couldn't reasonably pass up the Passat.

tyresmoker

Makes the Passat a whole different driving experience. The car is much quieter regardless of how you are driving it, either off the line or an extended highway cruise. The 4-cyl is just plain noisy. As a result, to the driver or an asture passenger, the car does not feel that solid due to the intrusion of this noise. (read: sounds cheap)
My buddy just replaced his wifes passat with a A4 1.8t..he says "it sounds like the same sewing machine under the hood".
For what it is worth, when we had our V6 Passat (5-speed) it delivered fuel mileage like the numbers quoted above.

markcincinnati

The 1.8T engine has, standard, 170HP (some claim it is really more, but that is another story). The 1.8T engine, can be, from the AUDI factory, set up to 225HP (as it is on the TT). The breadth of the 1.8T engine, with some electronic and hardware modifcations is such that this "little engine that could" can be cranked up "easily" to 350HP. How is this possible you may ask?

Well, the straight and easy answer is but one word: BREATHING.

The 1.8T engine (but really any engine) will crank out more HP and torque (which is what really counts here in the USA, since torque is important more than HP from a dead stop) if it can get more fuel and air forced into its chambers before detonation.

This 1.8T engine has several things that can be done to it -- some of them are thousands of dollars, some are hundreds and some are tens of dollars.

The biggest bang for the buck is to replace the little computer than controls the "boost" of the standard turbo impeller. This is not a technical explanation and this is not the place for it, but basically a super charger and a turbo charger are "blowing" devices (hence the term "blown engine" -- when it does not mean destroyed engine). The 1.8T uses a passive blower to increase the amount of air and fuel that are crammed into the cylinders.

A computer chip tells the turbo charger "how much" to blow, bascially.

Now, there ARE limits to what the stock turbo can be told to do -- but, typically, manufacturers do not put their turbos out to their customers set on "maximum blow." Well, clever computer programmers have figured out what the maximum blow a given sized turbo can produce and -- for a fee -- they will make your stock turbo blow hard, harder, hardest. At the maximum or as some claim, optimum, the only way to improve the breathing is to increase the turbo's physical size.

This is far more expensive that just changing the computer program.

Here is an example of what can be done to the 1.8T engine -- WITHOUT changing the blower (the turbo) itself.

The stock 1.8T puts out 170HP -- and 166 pound feet of torque. For $500 or $600 it can be "reprogrammed" to crank out at least 195HP -- and 230 pound feet of torque (I said AT LEAST -- each chip programmer will make his/her various tweaks which can alter these figures somewhat up or down a couple of percentage points).

The stock non-turbo 2.8 V6 in the Passat (and ONLY available with a Tiptronic transmission) only generates 190HP.

Things such as final drive ratios, marketing decisions, gear ratios of the individual gears in the manual vs the automatic, all come into play. But here is the bottom line:

A maxed-out (options) 1.8T Passat w/4MOTION + 5spd manual with a "mild" chip program change will "blow the doors off" of a similarly equipped Passat with the 2.8 engine. The doors will be blown off in performance, gas milage and PRICE.

For the money, nothing even comes close to an AWD VW Passat 1.8T 5spd manual trasmission with a mild chip upgrade.

Add plus 1 wheels and tires and VW sport springs, rear spoiler and ground effects -- and, if you've got another $800, replacement fuel injectors (which, when matched with the chip upgrade, just means MORE fuel+air get to the engine) -- and you can crank the HP up to 205 and the torque up to 237 pound feet.

Such a VW Passat will rival the W8 Passat's accelerative times and will equal (some would argue better) its handling prowess.

Here is what you COULD get:

Interior : Leather Seating Surfaces
Exterior : Metallic Pain
Engine : 1.8L I-4 DOHC SMPI
Transmission : 5-Speed Manual
Tires : P195/65R15 H AS
Wheels : 7J x 15" Alloy
Fully Reclining Front Bucket Seats
Leather Seating Surfaces
Radio : Premium V AM/FM w/Single CD/Cassette Player
Leather Package w/Wood
Electronic Stabilization Program (ESP)
Volkswagen Telematics by OnStar

Total MSRP $28,599 (before discount)

Add: $1,400 for Chip programming and new fuel injectors
Add: $1,200 for Plus 1 Wheels and Tires (alloys and UHP tires)
Add: $1,000 for High Performance Springs/thicker rear Anti-sway bar.
Add: $ 400 for rear deck spoiler

Estimate 6% discount from list price making the selling price, plus high performance upgrades = $30,883. Figure $420/mo for 36 - 39 months, variably based on money factor and assuming $0 cap cost reduction or cash up front.

Now, of course, this is about the same as the R32 -- which would be nowhere near as big, as capable (with 3 passengers) or as comfortable.

If you are looking for THE VW bargain for a Higher Performance Family hauler -- look no further than a new Passat as outlined above.

Drive it like you live.

Chipping = more power, more performance and most folks say, more fun.

P.S. I chipped my wife's 2000 180HP Audi TT quattro -- the results were "awe inspiring!"

moda

Wow!! Great information-not sure if I understand it all as my automotive experience is basic city and highway driving, but I appreciate the info. Sounds like you are really recommending the 1.8 with chipping vs. the V6. I don't know how to drive a standard so it would have to be an automatic.

Would a mechanic do the chipping or the dealership? (please excuse my ignorance)
Thanks-

oceana142

The Passat GL 1.8T with an automatic has entered my radar as there are some great deals with this vehicle. However, I am concerned because premium gas is recommended in the brochure.

The dealer says not to worry about this. Will the car run well on 87 octane? I will use the car for commuting and an occassional highway trip. Thank you.

tyresmoker

five hundred bucks a month (include taxes etc)to rent a souped up Passat? Why? The view from the steering wheel is the same every time an STi is messing with ya...for that same kinda loot, a nice lease on a respectable 3 series would meet or exceed the performance goals that you outlined.

markcincinnati

I say this with "all the love" -- do not get the 1.8T 4motion with the Automatic -- the combination of the higher final drive ratio, the inherent loss of power in an automatic transmission plus the fact that the 1.8T is turbo charged, would make you an unhappy camper in the long run. If you must have an auto, just go with a Passat GLX 4Motion (V6) -- you will still have a fine car and overall, I believe you will find the car more to your liking.

And, with no disrespect and just a bid of prodding: Learn to drive the stick, before you make up your mind. I have known, literally, no one, who prefers an auto over a stick, once they "get the knack!"

Now, I have heard some folks suggest that they live in an urban setting and that somehow that makes a stick less pleasurable to drive -- tell that to someone in London, Paris, Berlin, Munich or Vienna -- to say nothing of Rome or Florence.

In my extremely biased opinion -- full disclosure -- learning to drive a stick is one of those "top 10 things" that you should master; then, if you decide against the stick, you have my blessing (which, I'm oh so sure, is what you wanted. . . .)

The most serious thing I can say is that the performance, control, safety and fun differences between a stick and an automatic are NOT subtle. The stick is a winner!

markcincinnati

Yes it needs premium gas. It is a false economy to run it on less than Premium as the electronic will try hard to prevent preignition (PING).

In plain English -- the 1.8T is a high performance engine even in 170HP tune. The use of regular fuel will be more expensive than the use of premium fuel. The torque, too, will be more plentiful with premium fuel.

Now, if you don't use Premium fuel, you can find out if there will be any "issues" that will, other than the extra gas you will use, cost you any out of pocket monies.

For example, if the fuel injectors "dirty up" in a shorter period of time (miles) will this be consiered "normal maintenance" to have them cleaned, will it be considered a warranty item to have them cleaned and/or replaced, etc.

markcincinnati

I took a wild guess, based on what I have seen, about the monthly lease payment.

I came about it, perhaps all wrong -- but if the car was $30,000 and the 36 month residual was 50%, well here is roughly what I did:

$15,000/36 = $416.00 -- then I said to myself, the residual is the % of the before Cap cost reduction number, then I said to myself, what is published as effective money factors these days (interest)? Something between 0% and 3% seems to be all the rage.

If my residual percentage is correct, and who knows, maybe after 3 years it is 55%, or maybe it is 45%? -- the number I came up with is "in spirit, at least" in the right ballpark.

My comments were not intended to compare the Passat with some other vehicle. If "you" are favorably inclined toward the Passat for whatever personal or business reason you may have, my suggestions are mechanically, electonically and financially within reason.

If "you" prefer X or Y to the Passat (either for objective or subjective reasons) so be it.

I happen to believe that the Passat 1.8T 4Motion stick, with a few tweaks is a pretty sweet car and with the tweaks outlined gets the driver/owner what I would term an Audi A5 (if such a thing were made).

To each his/her own.

P.S. I have been test driving both C class and 3 series Mercedes and BMW's recently -- the prices, based on MSRP, are not the same -- and the lease prices to even come close to these kind of numbers are for, stipped versions, 39 to 42 months and generally with a serious (several thousand dollar) down payment. My example, above, assumed $0 out of pocket, a low discount off list and some "informed" guesses regarding money factors and residuals on closed - end leases.

beef

We have an 03 GL sedan and an 04 GLS 4motion wagon, both 1.8T manuals. I switched from 93 octane to 87 octane after 5k miles on the 03, and there was no effect on gas mileage. Effect on performance is hard to judge without objective testing, but I couldn't detect any difference in acceleration. So I've been feeding the 04 87 octane from the beginning.

I was a bit nervous at first because the manual for the 03 said to use 91 octane, but the manual for the 04 says 87 octane is OK for the 5 speed. They continue to recommend 91 octane for the automatic though.

Bottom line...I know this isn't what you were asking but I think the 1.8T and the 5 speed is a much better combination, both performance and gas cost-wise. I would tend to think 87 is ok for an automatic though.

PS if your engine pings with 87 then obviously thats a really bad idea. But I'ver never personally heard a ping. Basically I can't tell any difference.

markcincinnati

If this has been your experience, I would have to say "the proof is in the pudding."

Now, my dealer service manager has cautioned me against running this engine (in an Audi) with such fuel, saying the long-term effects are more gas will be required and more frequent maintenance (fuel injectors) will also be required.

I have not challenged the warranty issue (all maintenance and repairs are included with the Audi so equipped) so I honestly cannot comment on this.

However, therefore, notwithstanding, I assume fuel injectors can be cleaned and that if it is somehow determined that their need to be cleaned (or repaired or replaced) is due to the use of fuel that is "not to specifications, as outlined by the mfg." that their [the dealer's] reaction would be to disallow the cost of the labor or the replacement part caused by the use of fuel that does not conform to specifications.

Taken to the extreme,what if improper oil or anti-freeze (not to mfg specifications) were to be used by owner/drivers -- ultimately, if the design really does require X fluids and/or fuels, and if @ Y miles, the bucks go from your hands to the dealers, one has to wonder if my service manager's words "it is a false economy" will not somehow come back to haunt.

Here in River City, premium fuel is generally 10 to 20 cents more than plain old regular. Let's assume an average of 15 cents and 15 gallons a week: ~ 800 gallons per year x .15 = $120 or $10 per month.

How much is a fuel injector? How much is a spark plug? How much are other "wear and tear" components? If these maintenance items need to be replaced or cleaned or repaired earlier due to less expensive fuel, there certainly must be a calculation that can be constructed to determine the opportunity cost of lower octane fuel.

Finally, my service manager, who, as far as I know has no interest in a gas station or oil company, says "87 octane when run in these engines produces less power and the metering systems and electronics attempts to compenstate for this lower power by retarding the spark and other electo/mechanical remedies that essentially uses more fuel in an attemtp to compensate."

Oh BTW, I have no interest in any gas company or gas station, although I probably do own a mutual fund that has some holdings in at least one oil company.

Put the fuel in the car that you want -- but remember that the car was designed for certain capacities and characteristics with respect to the greases, oils, fuels, filters and other fluids it uses. Check with a dealer service technician -- get a second opinion, that is.

I just can't imagine that the milage and power and wear and dirt accumulation with regular would be the same as with premium, unless we, for all these years, have been fed an elaborate falsehood.

tyresmoker

If the car is spec'd to run on premium, and you bought it knowing this...who is the fool? It is part of the package. If you knew it is a requirement and did not want to ante up or you knew it would be an issue...why did you buy it?...think about it..you spent or will spend by the time your note is paid off $30k on the car, but you argue, scream and kick not to pay an extra $.15 per gallon for the gas the car is supposed to have to run optimally.
I had, until recently a '00 V6 Passat. It took the good stuff. That is the way it was designed. It was a consideration when we bought it, but the good outweighed the bad.
Mark, as far as your points with the Passat, i do sorta agree. Our experience with the above mentioned Passat was bittersweet at best. As a result, the thought of slightly modifying one, having it break (which it will) and have to deal with VW service, makes me slightly ill.

onlysurfer

It's amazing to see people discussing so avidly about which grade fuel the car needs, at times, while consuming junk food in super size quantity. Remember, human body is designed to consume natural vegetables, not the GM, “conventional” or hormone induced products. In America, there is market for everything! So if you are buying cheap food and expensive gas then think again! Just put any gas (as long as it is not diesel) in the car and drive!

markcincinnati

I found your comments, strangely, relevant and interesting, but if the car is said, by the mfg, to require premium fuel, I would NOT chinzt out and use a lesser fuel -- the phrase penny wise and pound foolish springs to mind.

Now, however, I have heard -- can't prove it -- that the V8 (4.2) is able to "safely" run mid grade -- the 2.8V6 and the turbos, however, are generally tuned for premium.

=====

On the chipping issue -- this is hotly debated here and elsewhere. Some dealers seem chip friendly (mod friendly, really). The VW store near me has "customized" VW's on the lot, all the time. But, here is what appears to be customized: spoilers, wheels, tires, exhaust systems, sound systems, ground effects, paint, seats apparently. None of the aftermarket goodies the dealer puts on the odd Jetta or Passat EVER mentions a computer chip.

However, my Audi dealer did chip my wife's 1.8T TT back in 2000 -- and this same dealer did upgrade the springs and sway bars on my Audi A8 and more recently my Audi allroad.

Personally, I would have no problem with chipping (to stage one) a Passat 1.8T to 195HP and 230 pound feet of torque. If your comfort level will not permit such a mod, I would, of course, avoid it.

Yet, having driven the Passat with the auto and the manual with the 1.8T, I would have to go with the manual since the acceleration from a full stop is so much improved with it. Frankly I thought the 1.8T with the auto in the Passat was, gulp, a slug. The character of the car was transformed just by going to row your own.

Just my opinion, no offense.

moda

Ok...VW GLX Passat FWD. I originally thought 4motion would be good, but sounds like there have been problems. Mark, there is no way I can drive a standard, though I do appreciate your suggestions. My best friend drives one in VA and loves it. I live in an urban area-I also think I would be too scared to start driving a standard now.

markcincinnati

To clarify, I meant to suggest a Passat GLX 2.8L V6 w/4motion if you were going to go with the Tiptronic. AWD based on where I think you live would be a godsend during times of "weather."

And, despite my strong personal opinions, may I suggest that you at least take both the 1.8T 4Motion and the 2.8L 4motion (both with tiptronics) on two long, identical, test drives back to back?

Who knows, you may find the 1.8T 4Motion Tiptronic equipped Passat is just fine and dandy for your needs.

My willingness to spout my opinion does not alter the fact that, generally, a lot of what is written here (by me and others) has to do with the subjective part of cars (VW Passats in this case). Rarely are the thoughts expressed here strictly factual (objective) -- although even when "just the facts" are cited, what often follows is the writer's interpretation of what they mean (to him or her).

The 0 -60mph times are factual and they are, as I recall, easily obtained right here on the Internet and probably on Edmunds.com -- but, even such facts should not necessarily deter you from taking a car that has "caught your eye" for a test drive (even if it is less quick than you could ever see yourself enjoying).

The truth of the matter, is that, TO ME, the 1.8T feels much stronger than "it has a right" to feel. If it feels right to you, well, nothing anyone says here or else where should deter you from reaching your own conclusion.

Besides, there is MORE to car ownership that 0 - 60 accelerative times; there are also ride quality, handling, comfort, gas milage, etc, etc, etc, to consider.

My ideal Passat, where price matters, would be the 2.8L V6 4Motion with a 5 or 6spd manual -- none is available in the US. Where price does not matter it would be a Passat W8 with sport package and manual transmission (6spd manual).

Test drives: hoooooooooo!!!!!

600kgolfgt

Don't take chances. The only VW Engine that doesn't require premium fuel is the 2.0 Liter 8-valve, and obviously the TDIs. Turbocharged engines and engines with very high compression ratios (10:1 and above) require premium fuel.

I owned a 1987 VW Golf GT for 16 years and 624,000 miles using premium fuel 95% of the time. The first year I owned the car, I made the mistake of using regular fuel and the difference in performance was definitely felt, as well as an increase in engine knocks. I went back to premium, and have been using it ever since. I now own a 1997 Jetta Trek (chipped engine) and a 2003 Wolfsburg Jetta 1.8T, and I use nothing but premium. My wife has a 2003 Passat GLS 1.8T and she uses premium fuel after years of driving a car which required regular - and she managed to adjust to using premium fuel. If anyone has issues with premium fuel, then they shouldn't buy the vehicle in the first place.

If you want to go cheap - you'll definitely get what you pay for.

meandean

My 2000 GLS had rear brakes and rotors replaced at 60K -- no problem with that as I felt that 60K was reasonable mileage before replacement. Just had my 70 K service and was told that my rear brakes only had 50% left and fronts 60%! (BTW, front brakes are original -- bought car new).

Problem is this -- How can I show 50% wear on the rear in just 10K of use given that BOTH the primary and secondary drivers are the same AND the car's usage is the same? Something smells.

1) Did VW have a major change in the composition of pads between 2000 and 2004?

2) Do I have any recourse if I need pads/rotors in 20 K (or in about 1/3 the time of my last repair?) -- as everything else is the same, must be the parts that are substandard. Is there a service guru to call?

3) Are there any other replacement pads/rotors that anyone can recommend that give long life without major screeching (BTW, my OEM pads/rotors were quiet AND long lasting)?

Your wisdom, suggestions, etc. are greatfully appreciated.

tyresmoker

Sounds to me like your e-brake is either adjusted wrong or there is something sitting in the well under the ebrake handle. To replace rears before the fronts is VERY rare as the car relys heavily on the fronts to stop etc. The fact that you are halfway through the second set of shoes tells me either you have a good pitchman behind the desk at your dealer or there is an adjustment needed.

altair4

You wrote:

"To replace rears before the fronts is VERY rare as the car relys heavily on the fronts to stop etc."

I'm on quite a few Passat forums. It's not uncommon on Passats to replace the rears first. Some speculate that the rear pads are small, others talk about a difference in brake bias. I have seen it discussed many times elsewhere, and maybe here, too.

But I would be concerned about the increased rate of wear on the rears now versus the OEM pads.

tyresmoker

Based on Deans statements, replacing only the rears at 60k, and the fronts not needing replacement tells me that there is something else going on there that is far more fundamental than a posters speculation about bias and undersized pads.
I owned the same car, while i only had it for 41k, the brake wear was as i would expect it to be, not showing abnormal wear on the rears.

fish8

I hope this is not getting too personal, but for those who have leased their Passats what is your monthly payment. I know there are several variables to be considered when calculating a payment, but I am just curious. I have about 12 more months on my Jetta lease and have contacted several VW Dealers to see what it would take to get into a Passat. The car that has been priced out is a '04 Passat GLS 1.8t, automatic. The monthly payment is $285.00 + tax w/ $1487 down (1st month payment, security deposit, etc....). I am still waiting on another dealers numbers.

Thanks in advance!!

onlysurfer

I'm paying $270 per month with a total $6000 due at lease inception for a GLX V6 4Motion. Payments include MA state sales tax which is 5%. Hope this helps.

markcincinnati

. . .when shopping for cars over the weekend, the VW dealer was "seriously" discounting the cap cost of the new Passats (~ 11% off sticker); moreover, the money factor (a.k.a., interest by another name) was down a point, too, to an effective 2.9%.

IMHO, I would advise NEVER to put any money down on a lease -- however, VW does have a half and half lease that allows the build up of equity -- THAT particular instrument MIGHT justify some cap cost reduction contribution by you.

Putting money down on a lease, buys "lower payments" this is true -- but at the current implied interest rates (money factor) and the probability of ROI for your money from other sources being at least as good, putting money down on a leased car that you do not intend to acquire (as in an open-ended lease vs a closed-ended lease) is anti-frugal.

The attractiveness of a lower payment, I understand -- however, having the money to put down in cash up front, and NOT putting it down ultimately is the lower cost course of action.

If you want to put money down, it is a free country -- but think of it this way: over withholding "taxes" from your paycheck in order to get a large refund (conceptually a related activity to putting money down on a lease), is even worse than putting money under your mattress, why? You don't have access to the money until you file the return and you have provided an interest free loan to the government (at least if the money was under your mattress you could get in IMMEDIATELY).

The idea should be to pay in real-time for the use of the automobile (the lease payments over X months paid in a timely fashion) just as the idea should be to neither owe tax nor be due a refund annually. We want to (or we should, in any case) pay only when it is due, not more, not less -- this applies to non-equity building events (car lease payments, dwelling rent payments and income taxes).

Currently the car dealers -- especially VW dealers -- are "dealin' and dealin' big" -- VW had a poor sales quarter in 2004, the 2005's are in the pipeline and interest rates are "soon" to rise -- if you really need a new car or even if you just want one, now is a "stimulative" time to look for both good discounts and attractive lease money factors. Never say never, but the word on the street is that money is at a 45 year low and the Fed is likely to push it to merely a 40 year low in the upcoming months.

If you can do this for business, and you are a small buisness owner, there are also some incredible once in a lifetime tax incentives to "do it now, too!"

And if the GVW is 6,000 pounds or more, JACKPOT!

Touareg V8 anyone?

Oh Oh Oh almost forgot -- they're practically giving away Passat W8's -- only $11 down and $11 a month and if you don't have the $11 -- we'll LOAN IT TO YOU!!!!

rayainsw

"they're practically giving away Passat W8's -- only $11 down and $11 a month and if you don't have the $11 -- we'll LOAN IT TO YOU!!!!
" - Mark

Now, if they'd been doing THAT a few months ago . . . And I'd still been planning a potential back 'up north' . . .
- Ray
Acknowledging the attraction of AWD where there is typically more snow, etc. than here in north Georgia . . .

moda

I am ready to purchase a Passat over the next 2+ weeks, and appreciate any feedback on the following questions-

1) During this month of May does anyone recommend a good day, time to make an offer?

2) What is the price of an extended warranty? (above the standard one included)and is this usually used as a bargaining tool?

3) I know the destination fee for my area, but how do you calculate taxes? based on your state? after options? Are there any other fees I should be aware of?

4) I haven't seen any additional deals other than the spring sale, and I think this is just for leasing?

I have a few more questons, but I will stick with these for now-
Thanks