The article says that production of the I-4 will start in 1-st quarter of 2003, i.e. less than 2 years. No decision yet on I-5 production date. All these engines are planned for trucks only.
I just don't understand GM. I know they have access to information and stats that I don't but at the same time, the ultimate decision maker should be the consumer.
What I mean is this: The Vortec line needed to be revamped. BUT, are truck owners--even of foreign makes-- that concerned about refinement? Perhaps it's just not having the inside track but it would make more sense to me to get the sedan market screwed down tighter first rather than refining truck engines. Maybe they're doing it because of the boon in SUVs. Since they haven't commited officially to rear-wheel drive it wouldn't make sense to announce an in-line for front-wheel drive. b4z has stated the problems that would arise in doing that.
Perhpas because the SUV segment is so hot and gas prices are so high, GM is using their trucks to demonstrate its commitment to engineering excellence. High performance engines WITHOUT the low fuel economy. Give it the old "one-two" punch and provide an equally competent engine (in-line or V) for their car lines. I can't say I'm too confident about that after seeing how much money they spent on the 3.5 just to can it for a smaller displacement or larger displacement (3.7L) based on the "It cost a lot to make" argument. As if any twin-cam is cheap.
And I don't see why GM couldn't eventually adapt it's engines to work in both cars and trucks. Nissan and Toyota have done just that with their 3.0L engines in their SUVs. The difference, though, is that the engine was originally used in a car before the truck. In GM's case, it would be the other way around.
Since the GM bar is stock on the Buick Regal, I doubt they would void your warranty unless whatever went wrong was directly attributable to your mod. Besides that, if you were really paranoid, you could remove it before bringing it in for service. Or just get the rear one until you pass the warranty period. I installed an aftermarket alarm and stereo system/amplifier on my car and never got questioned about it when my car was under warranty.
About the sway bars, I wouldn't think too hard about changing the Intrigue's. The stock Intrigue ones aren't too different from the aftermarket ones available for the GP's and Regal's. Those cars come with much thinner sway bars from the factory. Use the money saved to sink into good tires when the time comes.
I have a new 2001 Intrigue GLS with a little over 4K on it. I have read previous posts on here of owners getting +30 mpg from their Intrigues - can anyone tell me at what mileage did you begin to see those kind of figures? At most, I am getting 21-22 mpg, and that is with mostly (+75%) highway commuting.
Looks like all the major kinks are out now. From what the article said and what current folks with '01s are saying here, getting a new Intrigue sounds like a sure thing. My '98 is still going strong. Will have an 80,000 mile report probably in a month or two.
You're doing 75% highway commuting. How much of the remaining 25% is "real" city driving (inner city, stop every 50ft, race to the next light, sitting at traffic lights with foot on the brake, etc.) or "suburban" driving?
If it's the former, your car's working just fine. I was commuting 100 miles round trip every single workday and was getting low 20's (very low 20's). But the reason was because on the way home almost every day traffic would slow and I'd crawl.
I've got the 3.8L that's notorious for getting close to 30 on the highway. That didn't happen in the above mentioned commute. Now my commute is 40 miles round trip with mostly local highway driving (50mph limts, etc.) and my last fill-up got me 20 m/gal exactly.
and still as impressed with my base Intrigue as the day I bought it.......I've been back to the dealer a total of 5 times (oil/filter only, now @ 33,000 miles). The car is nice and tight, no squeaks or rattles, on cruise control between Mpls/Chicago @ 75mph I've gotten as high as 31 MPG. General mix of commute driving, wintertime about 25mpg, summer 26-27. The engine is way too tempting to tromp on it however, at which point I've gotten as little as 21 mpg. I stopped at Lupient Olds (Mpls) the other day to pick up some touch-up paint and noticed they had 7 Intrigues marked "sold" in the prep area.
I would like to hear more about your Intrigue "formersuver1". I also live in the Twin Cities ([non-permissible content removed] Rapids to Eden Prairie and back is my commute). I also take trips to Chicago periodically, as I grew up in Joliet (gotta visit the parents from time to time).
Do you have the 3.8 or 3.5 engine? How do you like Lupient for service? I have a story to tell you about them (non-service related) - I bought my Intrigue from Ryan Olds in Brooklyn Park because of it...
Two of us on this board (oscarz and myself) have upgraded the receiver to a Pioneer 4100H receiver. I belive oscarz has a GL which would give him 6 speakers; I have a base with 4 speakers. Both of us swear by it. Even though the sound is fairly crappy from the stock receiver, don't plan on changing the speakers until AFTER you get the receiver in stalled.
The Pioneer 4100H is only 45 watts but rememeber, your speakers aren't designed to give you much more than that. Think about it: the Bose system in the '01 Aurora is only 100 watts. So a standard system in an Intrigue isn't going to be anywhere close.
What that means is that 45 watts is more than sufficient to drive the speakers. Everyone who has been in my car swears I got a whole new system, from receiver to amp to speakers. The sound is clean, crisp, doesn't get distorted even at high volumes and you can hear every cymbal and feel the bass even when very low.
Unless you're really into sound systems, I HIGHLY recommend the Pioneer 4100H. Save the money and pass on the speakers. Put it towards some new CDs.
Did I mention it comes with a remote control, alarm, detachable face, 15 FM presets, display of the title of the CD playing...?
I thought I'd add my two cents here and let you know what I've seen on my 2000 GLS.
My average here in SoCal is 25 mpg. This is both in town and my 100 to 300 mile per day drives. On long trips, however, I've seen between 29 and 30.9 mpg! This car is not a PCS system so the mileage may be a bit better than those of you that are running PCS. On the above mentioned trips I run between 75 and 85 mph. An occasional burst to 100 is required because...just because.
HotRod magazine has a very in-depth article on the new Vortec 4.2 I-6 in their June issue. GM's logic on the inline vs. vee is that with an in-line OHC engine, you only have one cylinder head instead of two; i.e. economics were the driving force (big suprise, huh?). BTW, my 99 GL 3.5 averages 24 to 25 mpg (44,000 miles) in rural/interstate rush hour driving. Since it is a 99 3.5, it has the 3.29 axle. We have never gotten better than 27 mpg, but we have never taken an extended highway trip in the car either.
I haven't been doing over 80 in mine... But it does seem like there are a lot of slow people in my way when I'm driving my Intrigue! I still have the Mazda Protege which I drive on weekends, but I don't feel comfortable going over 70 in that... in which case, I'm just toodling along in the right hand lane, wondering why everybody else is in such a hurry...
So, this has demonstrated to me that my driving style is influenced by what I'm piloting.
What I really don't get is when I'm following a Legend, or a Q45, or a fancy Benz in the far left lane, and the guy is just chugging along. C'mon... move! If you're gonna own a performance car, use the dang thing, or get over!
That annoys me too.. I was stuck behind a firehawk today and it was going just about 10km/hr above the speed limit in the left lane, not much traffic. Go atleast 120km/hr, preferably 130km/hr or move over! Don't give me a dirty look when I have to pass you on the right because you won't move over.
krlesch : After doing the conversion from liters/kms to US gallons/miles, I generally get between 27 and 29 mpg on the highway. It's always a little less in the winter and little better in the spring/summer/fall.
My 2000 Intrigue is a GLS and has PCS with the 3.29 final gear ratio. My driving is mostly city driving in Milwaukee, WI where winter temps can be below zero Milwaukee area also has reformuatle gas only which reduces gas mileage by 4 to 8%. My gas mileage over 13,500 miles has been 21.7mpg. MISSING 1415'S POSTS!!!!
Had my 99 in yesterday for oil change and power steering examination. I've never really been impressed with my steering assist but it's gotten worse. At slow speeds I can feel it groan intermittently when turning and the steering is a bit heavy. Fluid was ok. They acknowledged my complaint and are familiar with this problem.
Paperwork says, "no fix from GM at this time". This phrase has gotten OLD. I have only 13K on it. Same scenario with the suspension clunking. I guess when I hit 37K they will magically be able to fix everything.
Tomorrow may be my last day as an intriguer. I have told the chevy dealership to hold the blue impala for me.
Drove the car extensively today and it drives and rides quite well. Its handling is not in the same league as the intrigue but it is not floaty. It doesn't corner as well either.
Seems to be a lot of car for the money. It has noticeably stronger brakes than the intrigue and does not creak or rattle.
If they can't get the dirt off of the front seat i will go with the sandrift metallic. I am a little ambivalent about the blue due to it higher maintenance to keep it looking shiny.
I will let you guys know what transpires tomorrow.
After getting my starting problem fixed, any negative feelings towards my car have disappeared. Sure it could be a bit quieter road-noise wise from the rear of the car, and it makes a few interior trim clicks when going over poor roads and construction, but otherwise I'm really enjoying my 99, the way it handles, accelerates etc... Now if it would only stop raining for more than a day at a time here I could wash it.
i test drove 4 intrigues this month. The first one a GLX the door doesn't seem to fit well; the second one a GX seems ok; the third one seems to be lacking power going uphill; the fourth one which is a dedicated company demo with 2k on it drove the best. Only one dealership knows about the full page Intrigue ads that was running in the local newspaper. None seems very eager to sell the car at discount ($50-350 off the advertised GL speical @ $26,900 cdn)
Ouch!! Got a really ugly scratch on my 2000 Black GLS. Its on the left passenger door. Tried clear coat compound, but no luck. It went right throught the clearcoat (that blue/white color!) Darn!! Anyone have any experience w/ paint touch ups on blakc Olds?? What should I do???!!! It may not be bigm but its ugly!!
Magazine July issue reported on the long term one year use of a 2000 intrigue, miles driven - 18,880. Problem and repair cost - Zero. Average MPG - 22.
Sat in a Chrysler Concorde today. Since i am tall i can't do the foot in the floorboard and then sit down in the seat thing like most normal size people. I have to sit down in the seat then swing my legs under the steering wheel. This usually forces me to move my upper body to the right and put my forearm or elbow on the console.
Well, I get into the Concorde and put my arm on the console and it practically breaks in two! I am so used to the support i get from the rigid console in the intrigue that i practically fell into the darn thing.
My knee was about a half inch from the stereo volume control. The intrigue has way more room that the Chrysler big cars.
one2one would be interested in that info if he is still thinking of replacing his intrigue.
I can go on and on about all of the things i like about my intrigue. But, I think it is time for a change. There are many things that the intrigue does better than the impala. However i am looking forward to the ownership experience.
With all of the incentives that GM is giving me i feel that i would be foolish not to take them. The total is slightly over $7000. If i don't like the car i am sure that GM will come up with another program to buy my loyalty. I take excellent care of my cars so i don't think i will get killed on resale with the impala. I can't say that about the intrigue.
Had a little fun with my bronze mist beauty today. Lets just say its above 55 mph passing power never ceases to amaze me, and leave it at that.
Great engine great transmission Best looking of the wbody cars great interior great visibility good gas mileage great front seat room good factory tunes good handling
I'll leave the not so good things to a later post.
> I have to sit down in the seat then swing my legs under the steering wheel.
Hmm, I'd forgotten there was any other way to get into a car!
Seriously, I've gotten into the habit of putting my hand on the seat when getting in/out of the car, for fear of maybe breaking the center console. Or making it weak, and creating squeaks and rattles.
I think the Intrigue is a very good tall person's car in terms of seating comfort. But I sometimes wish GM had been less generous with the sun shade band across the top of the windshield. This probably doesn't bother most people-- but I notice *everything* in the windshield that can affect my view of traffic... and when you're tall, you have to look through the shade band for highway signs and traffic lights, (and even the horizon, when driving uphill.)
In that vein, I finally "fixed" my left-edge windshield distortion, by taping a 3 inch piece of cardboard over it. (It annoys me less than the distortion does!)
I have to get into cars the same way. I tried the Concord. B4z, how were you able to get into it? I was so tight that I couldn't even get the door closed I was actually waiting for the salesperson to bring out an LHS. I decided to sit in the Concord while I was waiting.
The Intrigue is the most comfortable car (that doesn't cost $50,000) that I have been in. In fact, the only cars that I can get into comfortably are GM's mid-side cars. The next best is the Grand Prix but it feels like the seat is too low even after adjusting. The Impala comes up next.
While I'm not a loyalist to any manufacturer (except my recent conversion to Olds before it's demise) I don't think I'd look seriously at any other manufacturers until model changes happen in two to three years. My Intrigue has been so inexpensive to maintain because of the long life coolant, transmission fluid and oil monitor that I really don't want to look at anything non-GM. And I'm about 80 miles away from 79,000 miles.
PS: Enjoying my brand new '01 Impala LS....the General brought back my '00 Impala LS...the 2001 is much, much better than the 2000, including the pwerful sounding stereo. I love GM!
Slightly over $2000 off MSRP. $1000 Olds loyalty bonus. $1000 dealer cashback. $500 GMAC rebate for early termination of olds lease if i buy a GM car. The remaining payments on the lease were $2900. If i had done early termination i would have had to pay them $2450.
The way i am looking at it is, $4500 off the price of the car. Plus the $2450 I would have had to pay if i was going to early teminate the lease. Which is what i was going to do May 21 before the dealer told me about the remaining lease payment waiver. It is about $7000 saved vs. MSRP.
I was reading that GM will allow people to get out of leases with no penalty starting tomorrow if they buy a new GM car/truck. Guess they want to push sales a bit.
Also see GM sales were up in May vs down for Ford/DC. Nice to see GM doing a little better for once!
I'm a new Intrigue owner, having bought a used 2000 GX (former Avis car) last month. Love the car so far, especially the engine.
Have made only 1 highway trip so far and at 70 mph, the engine speed was almost 3000 rpm. I thought that seemed high. Is it about right?
What makes me wonder is that I don't see any difference in rpms up to 60 with the trans in 3 or D. It seems to me the overdrive should kick in at 50 or so and the revs should be lower in D than 3.
AFAIK, the Intrigue does not have a "lock out" for overdrive. But you're driving in 3rd gear.
I have noticed that my Intrigue doesn't want to stay in the "1" gear-- the shifter will pop into "2" very easily. (But, I don't actually care about this. I'm not planning to use my car to pull stumps... and "2" is low enough for slippery or rough roads.) I'm mentioning that simply because your transaxle may be fine, but you might have a shifter which has difficulty on the other extreme... it slips into "3" instead of staying in "D".
One tank with 3/4 highway, 1/4 city averaged 22.5. I'm consistently getting 21+ around town so I was expecting mid- to upper 20s on the highway. Guess it's time for a trip to the dealer. Thank goodness I still have the factory warranty left.
means personal communication system, which is same as On-star, according to this rep. refered by Auto-by-tel. The product knowledge is next to none with all these chevrolet sales rep i spoke to.
It goes well, thanks for asking. Still trying to get used to the differences of some of the controls. I was telling 1415 about the steering. It is really heavy feeling at low speeds. The car rides much better than the intrigue, is quieter and does not have any creaks. It feels more solid and substantial. it doesn't have quite the sporty feeling of the intrigue. The backseat is noticeably bigger and the seatback on the front seat is much more comfortable than the intrigue's. the navy blue with neutral is a good color combo. will post more about it later. Things have been kind of slow on this board you guys need to keep things going. I will be checking in about once a day though. Send 1415 an email, he would be happy to hear from you.
Comments
http://www.caranddriver.com/xp/Caranddriver/dai/may/20010524_dai_gmengines.xml
The article says that production of the I-4 will start in 1-st quarter of 2003, i.e. less than 2 years. No decision yet on I-5 production date. All these engines are planned for trucks only.
I just don't understand GM. I know they have access to information and stats that I don't but at the same time, the ultimate decision maker should be the consumer.
What I mean is this: The Vortec line needed to be revamped. BUT, are truck owners--even of foreign makes-- that concerned about refinement? Perhaps it's just not having the inside track but it would make more sense to me to get the sedan market screwed down tighter first rather than refining truck engines. Maybe they're doing it because of the boon in SUVs. Since they haven't commited officially to rear-wheel drive it wouldn't make sense to announce an in-line for front-wheel drive. b4z has stated the problems that would arise in doing that.
Perhpas because the SUV segment is so hot and gas prices are so high, GM is using their trucks to demonstrate its commitment to engineering excellence. High performance engines WITHOUT the low fuel economy. Give it the old "one-two" punch and provide an equally competent engine (in-line or V) for their car lines. I can't say I'm too confident about that after seeing how much money they spent on the 3.5 just to can it for a smaller displacement or larger displacement (3.7L) based on the "It cost a lot to make" argument. As if any twin-cam is cheap.
And I don't see why GM couldn't eventually adapt it's engines to work in both cars and trucks. Nissan and Toyota have done just that with their 3.0L engines in their SUVs. The difference, though, is that the engine was originally used in a car before the truck. In GM's case, it would be the other way around.
About the sway bars, I wouldn't think too hard about changing the Intrigue's. The stock Intrigue ones aren't too different from the aftermarket ones available for the GP's and Regal's. Those cars come with much thinner sway bars from the factory. Use the money saved to sink into good tires when the time comes.
-Thanks-
If it's the former, your car's working just fine. I was commuting 100 miles round trip every single workday and was getting low 20's (very low 20's). But the reason was because on the way home almost every day traffic would slow and I'd crawl.
I've got the 3.8L that's notorious for getting close to 30 on the highway. That didn't happen in the above mentioned commute. Now my commute is 40 miles round trip with mostly local highway driving (50mph limts, etc.) and my last fill-up got me 20 m/gal exactly.
So don't panic. She's probably normal.
Do you have the 3.8 or 3.5 engine?
How do you like Lupient for service? I have a story to tell you about them (non-service related) - I bought my Intrigue from Ryan Olds in Brooklyn Park because of it...
Any other people with stereo upgrade experience?
Two of us on this board (oscarz and myself) have upgraded the receiver to a Pioneer 4100H receiver. I belive oscarz has a GL which would give him 6 speakers; I have a base with 4 speakers. Both of us swear by it. Even though the sound is fairly crappy from the stock receiver, don't plan on changing the speakers until AFTER you get the receiver in stalled.
The Pioneer 4100H is only 45 watts but rememeber, your speakers aren't designed to give you much more than that. Think about it: the Bose system in the '01 Aurora is only 100 watts. So a standard system in an Intrigue isn't going to be anywhere close.
What that means is that 45 watts is more than sufficient to drive the speakers. Everyone who has been in my car swears I got a whole new system, from receiver to amp to speakers. The sound is clean, crisp, doesn't get distorted even at high volumes and you can hear every cymbal and feel the bass even when very low.
Unless you're really into sound systems, I HIGHLY recommend the Pioneer 4100H. Save the money and pass on the speakers. Put it towards some new CDs.
Did I mention it comes with a remote control, alarm, detachable face, 15 FM presets, display of the title of the CD playing...?
My average here in SoCal is 25 mpg. This is both in town and my 100 to 300 mile per day drives. On long trips, however, I've seen between 29 and 30.9 mpg! This car is not a PCS system so the mileage may be a bit better than those of you that are running PCS. On the above mentioned trips I run between 75 and 85 mph. An occasional burst to 100 is required because...just because.
BTW, my 99 GL 3.5 averages 24 to 25 mpg (44,000 miles) in rural/interstate rush hour driving. Since it is a 99 3.5, it has the 3.29 axle. We have never gotten better than 27 mpg, but we have never taken an extended highway trip in the car either.
So, this has demonstrated to me that my driving style is influenced by what I'm piloting.
What I really don't get is when I'm following a Legend, or a Q45, or a fancy Benz in the far left lane, and the guy is just chugging along. C'mon... move! If you're gonna own a performance car, use the dang thing, or get over!
teo : Good article. I concur with the findings!
Better get back to studying...
Paperwork says, "no fix from GM at this time". This phrase has gotten OLD. I have only 13K on it. Same scenario with the suspension clunking.
I guess when I hit 37K they will magically be able to fix everything.
Drove the car extensively today and it drives and rides quite well. Its handling is not in the same league as the intrigue but it is not floaty. It doesn't corner as well either.
Seems to be a lot of car for the money. It has noticeably stronger brakes than the intrigue and does not creak or rattle.
If they can't get the dirt off of the front seat i will go with the sandrift metallic. I am a little ambivalent about the blue due to it higher maintenance to keep it looking shiny.
I will let you guys know what transpires tomorrow.
Well, I get into the Concorde and put my arm on the console and it practically breaks in two! I am so used to the support i get from the rigid console in the intrigue that i practically fell into the darn thing.
My knee was about a half inch from the stereo volume control. The intrigue has way more room that the Chrysler big cars.
one2one would be interested in that info if he is still thinking of replacing his intrigue.
With all of the incentives that GM is giving me i feel that i would be foolish not to take them. The total is slightly over $7000. If i don't like the car i am sure that GM will come up with another program to buy my loyalty. I take excellent care of my cars so i don't think i will get killed on resale with the impala. I can't say that about the intrigue.
Had a little fun with my bronze mist beauty today.
Lets just say its above 55 mph passing power never ceases to amaze me, and leave it at that.
Great engine
great transmission
Best looking of the wbody cars
great interior
great visibility
good gas mileage
great front seat room
good factory tunes
good handling
I'll leave the not so good things to a later post.
Hmm, I'd forgotten there was any other way to get into a car!
Seriously, I've gotten into the habit of putting my hand on the seat when getting in/out of the car, for fear of maybe breaking the center console. Or making it weak, and creating squeaks and rattles.
I think the Intrigue is a very good tall person's car in terms of seating comfort. But I sometimes wish GM had been less generous with the sun shade band across the top of the windshield. This probably doesn't bother most people-- but I notice *everything* in the windshield that can affect my view of traffic... and when you're tall, you have to look through the shade band for highway signs and traffic lights, (and even the horizon, when driving uphill.)
In that vein, I finally "fixed" my left-edge windshield distortion, by taping a 3 inch piece of cardboard over it. (It annoys me less than the distortion does!)
The tinted window doesn't bother me. In fact i didn't even notice it until you mentioned it several months ago. I notice everything too.
The intrigue is easily the best tall persons car out there. For front seat passengers at least.
But I didn't want a car that says "I care more about crash worthiness than performance!" :-)
The Intrigue is the most comfortable car (that doesn't cost $50,000) that I have been in. In fact, the only cars that I can get into comfortably are GM's mid-side cars. The next best is the Grand Prix but it feels like the seat is too low even after adjusting. The Impala comes up next.
While I'm not a loyalist to any manufacturer (except my recent conversion to Olds before it's demise) I don't think I'd look seriously at any other manufacturers until model changes happen in two to three years. My Intrigue has been so inexpensive to maintain because of the long life coolant, transmission fluid and oil monitor that I really don't want to look at anything non-GM. And I'm about 80 miles away from 79,000 miles.
You were very missed in this forum!
PS: Enjoying my brand new '01 Impala LS....the General brought back my '00 Impala LS...the 2001 is much, much better than the 2000, including the pwerful sounding stereo. I love GM!
The way i am looking at it is, $4500 off the price of the car. Plus the $2450 I would have had to pay if i was going to early teminate the lease. Which is what i was going to do May 21 before the dealer told me about the remaining lease payment waiver. It is about $7000 saved vs. MSRP.
Also see GM sales were up in May vs down for Ford/DC. Nice to see GM doing a little better for once!
More on my purchase when i have a little more time. Gotta go.
Have made only 1 highway trip so far and at 70 mph, the engine speed was almost 3000 rpm. I thought that seemed high. Is it about right?
What makes me wonder is that I don't see any difference in rpms up to 60 with the trans in 3 or D. It seems to me the overdrive should kick in at 50 or so and the revs should be lower in D than 3.
Thanks.
I have noticed that my Intrigue doesn't want to stay in the "1" gear-- the shifter will pop into "2" very easily. (But, I don't actually care about this. I'm not planning to use my car to pull stumps... and "2" is low enough for slippery or rough roads.) I'm mentioning that simply because your transaxle may be fine, but you might have a shifter which has difficulty on the other extreme... it slips into "3" instead of staying in "D".
Still trying to get used to the differences of some of the controls. I was telling 1415 about the steering. It is really heavy feeling at low speeds.
The car rides much better than the intrigue, is quieter and does not have any creaks. It feels more solid and substantial.
it doesn't have quite the sporty feeling of the intrigue.
The backseat is noticeably bigger and the seatback on the front seat is much more comfortable than the intrigue's.
the navy blue with neutral is a good color combo.
will post more about it later.
Things have been kind of slow on this board you guys need to keep things going.
I will be checking in about once a day though.
Send 1415 an email, he would be happy to hear from you.