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Oldsmobile Aurora

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Comments

  • fdionfdion Posts: 59
    Hi, I'm just dropping by the board. It's been a busy week. Or has it been more? Anyway, to answer your question, no, I haven't logged a startup sequence. I was more busy trying to figure out what the different parameters were. Wish there was a Tech2 that I could borrow. Did you know you can reprogram the steering firmness thru obdII? Actually, any dealer can set the steering to one of 3 settings, but with proper tools, one could reprogram the whole curve (speed vs steering adjust).

    As for the initial sequence, I dont think it's misfiring to bring the catalytic converter up to temperature, but I could be wrong. I always understood that a very lean condition created more heat in the converter. I know the air pump (fitted at least on the 2K1+) is used to that effect. Did Aurora5000 record some misfiring on a plain scan tool?

    Francois
  • HenryHenry Posts: 1,106
    The magnasteer is not adjustable on the Classic (at least not 95 and 96). It is adjustable on the Y2K Auroras.
  • Anyone know of an aftermarket hood or hood scoops that will fit on the classic?
  • HenryHenry Posts: 1,106
    Your aROARa is your Aurora. Howevr, I don't think the Classic needs any help in the looks department. If you look on Zinc's Aurora page, there is a picture of an Aurora with a computer generated hood scoop. YOu may want to take a look at it before you add one to your aROARa.

    IMHO, Henri
  • I saw an ad in todays NorthWest Arkansas paper for a 99 aurora in mint condition with less than 4k miles. Must sell to settle an estate. Email me if anyone is interested and I'll get you the number. Listed 19k or best offer.
  • My 99 classic has developed an annoying vibration in the sunroof shade. I can touch it and it stops for a while then starts right back up. Its very noticeable. Anybody got a cure for this one?
  • rjs200240rjs200240 Posts: 1,277
    Well, if you are interested about the new Northstar there is a release on it. It's been redesigned for RWD/AWD so it won't show up in the Seville for a while. The addition of variable valve timing, an electronic throttle, and a 10.5:1 compression ratio and it only yeilds 315hp at a much higher 6400 rpms. I'm guessing it must have a much fuller curve in the rest of the range, or else this is part of the new GM philosophy of under-promising and over-delivering. It seems like 330hp or so would be better since that's a 10% increase.
  • I have looked over the specs. I am guessing that the engine is putting out 310+ horsepower at 6000 RPMs. Engine weight is 415 lbs. I think that the 3800 must weigh about that much or more (it's cast iron). There are a bunch of pictures on wieck photo. The SRX and XLR both get 5 speed automatics with tap up/down shift controls. At least the 4 wheel drive SRX gets a 3.23:1 axle ratio, while the XLR gets 2.92:1 if I read things right.
  • In Reply To:_________________________________________________________

    My 99 classic has developed an annoying vibration in the sunroof shade. I can touch it and it stops for a while then starts right back up. Its very noticeable. Anybody got a cure for this one?

    _____________________________________________________________________

    Now is the vibration noticeable when it opens or close? Because that would mean that it will eventually stop opening or closing all the way. That's what happened to my 1999 Aurora. Took it to the dealer and they did a complete tune-up on it.
  • anthonyef:

    To each his own, but it sounds very grainy to me.
  • rjs200240rjs200240 Posts: 1,277
    Yeah, I forgot about wieck. Man, I checked it out. They must have about 100 pictures of various parts of the new Northstar. I wish they'd done that for the previous ones. That intake manifold looks pretty familiar, as do the coil packs with the boots dangling. Did you look at the press kit that was on that GM release? Man, those sure have a lot of information. I wish we were allowed to read them for other things. I'd really love to see the Aurora press kit. It sort of pisses me off that they have so much info that they won't release to the public. I mean, if someone is really interested (and they'd have to be to find GM's media site and then read the press kit) then what's wrong with giving them the info they want?

    Hood scoops/ducts don't tend to be made for any specific cars. I've never seen an aftermarket or high-rise hood for an Aurora. However, scoops or ducts can be integrated into the hood by a competent body-shop. As far as what will fit where, you and the shop will have to determine that yourself. I think we'd all be curious to see after pictures...
  • rjs200240rjs200240 Posts: 1,277
    This article is about Cadillac's powertrain development history. It's like 14 pages, but they get to the Northstar by page 8. There is a significant amount of info about the original Northstar and the 2000 redesign. They even mention adding another hydraulic mount in 1998, which happened for the Aurora too.
  • I think that the media online and press kits online are relativly new. They have been putting out this stuff for new products (like the inline 4.2 liter 6). The intake manifold is the same as for the old engine - but now the throttle is electronically controled. This is because the exhaust valve timing is adjusted to control emissions instead of the egr valve (which is gone).
  • rjs200240rjs200240 Posts: 1,277
    Hey Matrix, we haven't heard from you in a while.

    That Aurora has an interesting color blue. It looks pretty nice. Wish I could say the same about the wheels. They are a bit much. The ad says they are extra cost. What the heck does he do if you don't want them? Do you get it on four spares or something? You never know on Ebay. I wonder if he removed the walnut trim and replaced it with oak or if he was just guessing at the material? I got a chuckle out of the angle of the front seatbacks, though.

    I imagine that he will take a bath on selling it. It seems like when you modify a car it lowers the value relative to an unmodified car even if you've put way more money into it or made some part of it nicer.
  • Most of our classic Auroras are low-key in color, so the candy blue E-Bay car is certainly striking and, for me, very attractive. Unlike rjs200400 I also like the wheels, but I agree completely that the seller's chances of getting a good price and THEN adding $2000 for the wheels are pretty small. I'm betting the car without the special wheels won't pass $7000, especially with 90K on the odometer.
  • I answered your question, (which is one of the most common questions on this board and should get its own thread) in the mod.'s thread where you also posted the question.
  • HenryHenry Posts: 1,106
    A friendly suggestion for all who care. I would suggest that all of the Auroarians take the time to get the printout on their car. I got mine from the dealer at no charge. With my shop time it should have been no charge.

    I do not know how long GM keeps cars in their database, so if you plan to keep your car, you might want to get the printout now.

    Henri
  • Henry

    What type of print out is it? Is it similar to the old "build sheet" that used to be under rear seats? Are there still build sheets in cars? I found mine in my '53 Olds there (although someone torn). I saved my window sticker. How does this differ?

    53Rocket
  • rjs200240rjs200240 Posts: 1,277
    There are still build sheets on cars. Plus, the dealer can usually look it up based on the VIN. What format they print it in might depend on the dealer. I imagine they could just give you a list of the codes or maybe make it look like a window sticker. The build sheet is in the trunk under the spare tire cover. If you also have the window sticker, then you've really got it nailed down. Any relevant option will show up on the window sticker.
  • HenryHenry Posts: 1,106
    DITTO
  • RJS, Henry

    Thanks
  • The Candy Blue E-Bay Aurora (1995, 90K) -- see posting 3508 -- failed to get any offers above $5700, and didn't meet the seller's reserve price. Of course, with the special wheels at an additional non-negotiable $2000, it's not logical that anyone would bid much higher. Obviously bidders prefer a useful trunk to one presumably filled with power sources for a tricked up audio system. Nice toy, though!
  • HenryHenry Posts: 1,106
    I have noticed that a lot of Auroras on ebay never get to the reserve price.
  • fdionfdion Posts: 59
    I read this paper. Interesting stuff. Cadillac has some guts tough to put anything pre 1992 as related to the northstar in their own history. They do make a quick mention of GM powertrain engineers.

    The history of this engine starts out as the Oldsmobile Quad4. Then in 1988 Olds made a few Quad 8 to see how this engine could be made at a competitive cost. Feuling Injection systems of california who had consulted on the turbo quad 4 is enthused by the idea and works on his own version, hoping to sell it back to Oldsmobile. Marketing gets involved and the quad8 name is dropped at some point, yet the engine continues to be fine tuned.

    Aluminium casting gets approved at some point, using dry sleeve inserts, less expensive to manufacture than silicon plus this would allow for different engine capacity with just a change of sleeve, keeping the stroke at 84mm (note: initially the stroke using quad 4 parts had to be 85mm, I dont know how/why it became 84mm). Potential bores ranged from 81.5 to 93mm. This would keep piston speeds within range, but obviously the 93mm version with a greater piston mass would require a lower rpm (hence the reason IRL 3.5L aurora can rev higher than the 4L). This engine was picked up in 4.6L form by Cadillac in 92 to include in the upcoming 93 Allante.

    Dry sleeves that have been used during the history of this engine: 81.5mm (3.5L), 87mm (4.0L), 89.5 (4.2L - as used in caddy show cars starting in 99) and 93mm (4.6L).

    So, in short, the northstar is an overbored oldsmobile aurora v8.

    Francois
  • rjs200240rjs200240 Posts: 1,277
    Thank you!! I've been searching for that info on and off. I emailed Feuling to get some history from them, but I couldn't get a reply. I too was convinced Olds was the impetus behind developing the Aurora/Northstar as they were pushing OHC engines with the Quad 4's. Plus, they wanted an engine for Indy. I've seen about the Quad 8 back in 1988. Cadillac didn't really seem to be doing anything with engines. The highest output Olds Quad 4 put out almost as much power as Caddy's V8's did at the time.

    Also, for those who didn't know, Olds had the Aurora V8, and the car, in mind well before 1994. The Aurora V8 broke a bunch of endurance records back in 1992, well before the car debuted.

    I appreciate your posting this info Francois. If you have any more, please feel free to post it or email me at [email protected] I'm quite interested in the history of the Aurora V8, and I bet others here are too.

    P.S. I thought the 3.5L IRL Aurora had a shorter stroke with the same sized pistons? The reduced stroke would also increase revs because the same mass has to accelerate less (less distance to travel for each rotation). But I'm going from memory so maybe I got it wrong.

    Also, I've noticed Cadillac press releases and history stuff had carefully not talked about the early Northstar except to mention it debuting in the Allante, sort of implying they developed it but avoiding actualy saying it. However, this release does mention Caddy developing it. I too noticed that. I guess no one minds kicking Olds when it's down.
  • fdionfdion Posts: 59
    RJS - You are right that the 3.5L IRL had a shorter stroke. I was also going from memory :)

    At any rate more piston mass means lower max rpm, but I had forgotten that both 3.5 and 4.0 engines differ from production engines in conrod lenghts and crankshaft stroke. Both use a 93mm bore and shorter strokes (I believe these would be 73.5mm for the 4L and 64.5!! for the 3.5L).

    Now what is really interesting is that the LX5 (the street going 3.5L found in the intrigue and aurora v6, a V6 obviously, while the 3.5L IRL is a v8, which you know, I'm just mentioning this for other potential readers) uses an 89.5 bore, a size that had been identified early on as a potential one by olds engineer to make a 4.2L V8. So again, another Cadillac "innovation" that is really Oldsmobile. The 3.5L V6 is also pure Oldsmobile.

    It gets better. Remember the OSV Intrigue? Supercharged 3.5L V6 with pistons for the application. Once these became available on the shelves at GM, Cadillac comes up with a 4.2L supercharged v8. Coincidence? I think not.

    Last thing, the LX5 has a 92mm stroke. We are but a crankshaft away of a stroker kit for the aurora v8.

    Using the original aurora v8 pistons and the v6 conrod and this (as of yet) imaginary crankshaft, we would get roughly a 4.4L engine. With a V6 conrod and piston (altough we'd loose a bit in compression) that would make a 4.63L engine. Now for the final twist of imagination, imagine a 93mm bore (like the indy engines or the caddy) and this imaginary crank, v6 conrod and caddy northstar pistons, we'd get a 5L engine. Having said that, all these imaginary engines would have a lower max rpm and more loss due to the larger angle between the conrod and cylinder wall when the crank is horizontal.

    To conclude, if the caddy 4.6 can sustain 6400 rpm before shifting, there should be no reason that the aurora 4L couldn't go to 7000, assuming the transaxle and heads can take it.

    Francois
  • fdionfdion Posts: 59
    RJS said:
    >The Aurora V8 broke a bunch of
    >endurance records back in 1992

    Indeed with the Aerotech Aurora. They also raced in 91 or maybe 92 that same aurora v8 in some "cutlass" tube frame chassis.

    Francois
  • The E-Bay saga continues - the candy blue Aurora has been relisted, this time with the special wheels and tires included in the winning bid. The actual sale will depend on what the seller's reserve price is, but the car should get close to $7500. Still a nice toy. If I didn't already have one I would certainly be in the running.
  • I do remember that the magazines were talking about the northstar engine long before 1992, perhaps in the late eighties even. Powertrain developed the engines - perhaps for Oldsmobile. The quad 4 would certainly be a starting point for developing a V8 over head cam engine.

    Many people think that the Aurora started out as a Cadillac show car and was in developement as the next STS initially.
  • HenryHenry Posts: 1,106
    The Caddie Aurora did not look a lot like our Classics. I bought the Caddie stuff from a guy on ebay. The car does look a lot different and was a rear wheel drive car if memory serves.
  • The Aurora showcar was just that, a showcar. I am not sure what Oldsmobile/GM was thinking when they introduced the Aurora in 1994, along with the Buick Riviera. Obviously the Riviera was a Riviera, but what exactly was the Aurora supposed to be? From my point of view, it replaced both the Toronado and the Oldsmobile Turing Sedan. Calling it a Toronado would have been a bad idea, but creating a whole new model/line of cars was a poorly thought out plan too. The basic body design/platform was intended to become the full size platform for Pontiac/Buick/Oldsmobile/Cadillac and so creating a new line of cars from the Aurora was confusing to the average Oldsmobile buyer.
  • Olds was showing a 4 OHC 455 V8 in the early '70s. The size is obviously much larger than the Quad 4, but the concept was there.
  • And Buick had a show car with an overhead cam 3800 too. Show stuff is show stuff.
  • i'm currently looking into purchasing a 1995 Olds Aroura and i was wondering if theres anything i should be concerned with before i buy that you people may be able to point out.
    The car has 93k on it, the dealer only had it for two weeks hes kinda like a 4 car dealer so he dosn't know much im taking the car to my mechanic on Monday the 9/16/2002 for him to look over the guys asking 6000 for it so let me know what you all think car seems to be in overall good shape..JC
  • All I can tell you is that the first 95 Classic Aurora where know for having bugs, by the time the 1999 Aurora's came out the bugs were all out.
  • HenryHenry Posts: 1,106
    TOO MUCH MONEY for the car. I would say not more than $4,250 for the car. And you need to see the service history on the car. If you are frendly with a GM dealer, have him put n the vin number and do an inqury on the car's service history. I would also check to see if the front air deflector is still there. Also check the rear window seal to see if the metal is showing through the black gasket. I would also take the car out and punch it at entering the highway and don't come out of WOT until you hit about 90mph, then curuse awhile to see if the "service engine soon" light comes on.
    You may also want to check the build date to see that it is after July 94.
    I own a 95 Aurora.
  • garnesgarnes Posts: 950
    Without looking anything up, 6k does sound a little high too. Henry is right.

    You can also just call Olds with the VIN and they will give you the history. When I got my 98 with only 13,000 miles, I still did it and found that it had a light changed - that's it.

    Don't forget Car Fax either. It's a great resource.
  • garnes, did you call an olds dealer for the history or olds home office. i need to get a vehicle history on my 97. i don't have a dealer anywhere close by.
  • garnesgarnes Posts: 950
    I think I called 1-800-255-6537. That's the "Oldsmobile" number. I may have been transferred once - I really can't remember. Let us know if that number ends up getting you what you want.
  • According to Edmunds used car price guide - available online right here - a 95 Aurora has a retail value of $7000+.
  • HenryHenry Posts: 1,106
    I have seen the 95's advertised for $4,995 in the newspaper before negotiation. Edmunds does not take into account the REAL market for the Classic being very soft.

    I stick by my value of under $5,000. But in America, you are free to pay as much for something that you want. How about those popcorn and canfy prices at the movies?

    At $7,000 I got to wonder what value Edmunds is putting on the "STUFF" the Seller put in the trunk of the car.

    Hmm, does anyone else hear Eric Clapton?
  • The trade in value is below $5000 and a private sale would probably run somewhere around $5000. A dealer could advertise a no_trade_price of $5000. A local used car dealer here had a new cadillac that he imported from Canada, which he advertized at $45000, but the trade in price was $57000 when I took my 98 Aurora in to trade. So, an advertized price is meaningless.
  • garnesgarnes Posts: 950
    Stuff in the paper or Ebay or whatever means nothing. Even a scratched up car will look good in a picture as long as it has been washed. there are a lot of cars for a seemingly good price that when you actually see them - they are, well, lived in and ratty. Sure everything works and there is no major damage, but the wood trim is hazy from being scratched up so much and so is the paint. The leather isn't torn or stained, but it's dirty and heavily creased and worn because it was never cared for (most leather isn't). You have to see the car. I would happily pay another 1k to 2k for a truly "excellent" car cared for by "Felix".
  • The so called Blue Book price takes that into account - and the prices are for "good" cars.
  • I've owned my red, stock 97 Autobahn Aurora for almost 4 years, having purchased it as an end-of-lease car with 15,000 miles on it (some geezer that drove only 7,500 miles per year in its first two years). I now have 76,000 miles on my car.

    Overall, I have been very pleased with my Aurora. The paint and finish have held up well, the car is parked in my garage at night. The interior is spotless and still looks new after I do a normal cleanup. (It's good that I like the car, running comps is a shocking exercise - the value of these cars is falling like a brick from a 10 story building - I'm stuck with this baby for awhile!)

    Like others in this group, I have been required to visit my local car repair shop on a number of occasions. The air conditioner and water pump have been replaced (under warranty), at 55,000 miles I had to replace the plugs and wires, clean the throttle body etc. Since then, the car has run very well with no problems except that now, at 70,000 plus miles my fuel gauge does not work. Or I should say that it works for the first one third of the tank, then it rapidly drops down to zero, the warning message appears and then the gauge soars to full. Very strange behavior....

    All other gauges appear to work normally. Any thoughts or help would be appreciated.

    Thanks.

    Mark
  • loveolds:
    My '97 experienced the same problem at about 60 000 miles. According to this discussion and to my local Olds parts man, this is a common occurence. The cause seems to be the sender in the tank. I have not replaced mine yet; I depend on the DIC "fuel used" display to keep me out of trouble. I plan to replace both the gauge sender and the fuel pump soon -- to avoid challenging Henry for his record of worst place to suffer a fuel pump failure -- in the Holland Tunnel.

    AC Delco replacement for the sender is about $100. The fuel pump is about $400 (which may include the sender, but I have not been able to verify that).
  • rjs200240rjs200240 Posts: 1,277
    Doesn't anybody there review them? Look at the standard Aurora site. Theres no V6 for 2003, right? And the webpage says its the new 2003 model, so its not like it has last years info. Look at the photo album. They obviously redid it because there are new picts. But there is still one with 16" wheels. But that isn't the worst. Go click on the powertrain for it. Look at that picture: Twin Cam V6... Yeah, thats whats in there. Then go to optional features and click on the comfort package. What the heck is that picture?

    image

    It sure as hell isn't in an Aurora. And what is that hanging off on the bottom right? Electrical tape? Geez... It's no wonder Olds doesn't sell any Auroras. They don't advertise it at all, and if by some chance you do actually hear of the car and try to find out about it, you'll be turned off by it's V6 and electrical tape interior...
  • I own a 2001 3.5 Aurora with that's been driven about 17K.

    Periodically I hear the sound of what seems to be a small motor coming from the rear or the trunk area of the car. I never know when it will come on and when it does it seems to run about 10 or 15 seconds and then shuts down. I can't for the life of me figure out what this could be.

    Has anyone else had a similar experience?
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