2005 and Earlier Chevrolet Impala

garyw

Picking out the SS portion of the story allow me to comment.

The SS and maybe even the '04 model as a whole will be a risky proposition if GM continues their pricing philosophy.

For example, the SS is likely going to sticker in the $32K range. Maybe even approaching $35K. This is ES300,Volvo and Z-territory just to name a few.

Argue if you will that we are talking different buyers but it certainly will limit the available market. Marketing-wise that pricing moves the Impala into a different economic buyer. This class of buyer has higher expectations and many many choices. Existing Impala owners, demographically speaking, will only be able to dream of owning an SS.

The 2003 LS w/sport package is over $29K and they sit on the dealers lots unsold. Just look at the supercharged Bonneville as an existing example. They fetch $35K and are nearly impossible to sell. Great car but not $35K worth.

GM should behave like it was do or die and employed the Infiniti/Lexus pricing model. My belief is that it would catapult GM's market share.

Screw discounting vehicles. Price the SS at $28,900, the LS at $24,900 and the base model at $19,900. The only options are choice of color (slight exaggeration).

Great cars do not succeed on merit alone. The SS will not be what the re-incarnated Z was to Nissan. Lines will not be forming a year in advance. Besides GM has yet to prove they can build great cars for the everyday buyer. C'mon $35-$40K for GTO that looks like an Accord coupe. Where is the heritage?

Are you listening Mr. Lutz.

pluto5

As long as people think imported cars are better we will continue to get great prices on Impala. Thanks NYT.

b4z

I was a huge fan of Diana Krall several years ago but have now found the tempo of her songs so ploddingly slow that I have to be in the right frame of mind to listen.
They are incredibly well recorded though and sound amazing on a good system.

Keb' Mo' is still one of my favorites after about 5 years. I haven't grown tired yet although his last album wasn't that great.

Sting's latest DVD "All this time" is a super recording. I think it is also available on CD.

atbear

OK, new speakers.... if you know what you're talking about.. what do you recommend?? Are the head unit and amp ok? I listen to rock music (Guns N Roses, 80s music, Classic Rock). So it should handle the crunch of a guitar and highs of the solos well. So new speakers.. what about amp and head unit? (I'd like to keep my head unit due to the features and I have CD AND Tape..)

b4z

I used to have a STYX Cd that was recorded live in '97. I used it to test proper electric guitar sounds in my cars.
In my Intrigue and to a lesser extent in my Impala the guitars on "Too much time on my Hands" had this huge chunky sound that really kicked.
That same song on my Mirage M-3's ($2500 in '92)at home didn't do anything spectacular.
This leads me to believe that GM is boosting the upper bass.
The old trick used to be to boost everything in the 80Hz range to give more kick to the kick drum.
I have had people tell me that both the head unit and the speakers are to blame.

A new head unit with provide a clearer sound(assuming better amps) and better radio performance.
I would imagine better speakers would provide more detail and a more "accurate" sound. With no emphasis on any group of frequencies which I believe is what GM is going for to impress the teenagers and people who just don't know any better.

johnclineii

So GM has been taking lessons from Mr. Bose?

gasoline

My 01 Impala has one if its rear disc scored with two deep lines. What could cause this since the car has only 10K miles? The other three are smooth and if it isn't covered under warranty would you guys replace it?

b4z

Dont you mean Dr. Bose? LOL.

probably more of a marketing genius than an acoustic one.

Who else do you know who can convince people that they need a $500 clock radio?

Or a $2000 home theater with little tiny speakers.
I can buy the same thing only better for $500 anywhere.

b4z

probably a small stone or rock it has happened to me many times.

b4z

Down 18% for GM though.

http://media.gm.com/news/releases/021201_sales.html

rbb2

Picked up a new 03 LS last week and wondered if there was a tray that is supposed sit in the arm rest storage bin. It was in the showroom so I wondered if they removed it so people wouldn't steal it and forgot to put it back in.

spider717

You mean the coin holder? There should be on in the arm rest.

rbb2

Perhaps that's what is missing. It looks as if something clips in there but I couldn't tell what. I didn't have anything in the arm rest.

b4z

The coinholder was Lutzed for 2003.

b4z

Evidently the plastic manifolds are fracturing and gas is backing into the manifold and catching on fire.

http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=5572&sid=173&n=156

charts2

The last couple months several posts on this board talk about this serious problem. The car connection report that you posted b4z indicates 1996 - 2000 models. Does that mean the 2001-2003, 3800 series II engine manifolds are different and do these model years not have this problem? b4z do you know? Does anyone out there have information regarding this. I am starting to get concerned, as I am sure many others are.

b4z

It says 1996 engines but I thought the thermoplastic intake was introduced in 1997.

atbear

The recall range is only for 1996-2000 model cars and does NOT include the Impalas. And, only 44 cars out of approximately 2,300,000 have had this occur for sure. Not really a large enough to be concerned about...

drivinisfun

"3800 V-8 engines"

Did anyone catch that?

LOL

johnclineii

Yeah, I did...and then I got my frame jumped when I posted that the 3800 is a 6!

I thought it was just me.

Go figure!

b4z

At least for me.
Went looking again yesterday and an identically optioned Impala like me '01 apparently doesn't exist anymore.
Found some LS's kind of like mine, but they had sunroofs and no side airbag.
MSRP was $27,345. Almost 2K more than my '01.
I would add the airbag for $350 the XM satellite radio another $300 or so and delete the spoiler $175 savings.
That would leave me with everything my '01 had plus the XM radio but not the Onstar which costs $600!!!
Chevy has clearly made a mistake with pricing.

atbear

You can say they made a mistake, and I can see where you're coming from. But, when they are selling all they can make, you can't really blame them for the price hike, can you? I mean it'd be nice to get a great price, but if they can sell em for that price, they will...

richz2

hello men and ladies , I'm back with a question and request. 1st has anyone tried to put, if they even fit, some 94-96 Impala wheels on the 2000-2002 Impala. 2nd does anyone have the five spoke wheel set for sale cheap, besides gmdirect. thanks richz2

garyw

The 96 wheels do not fit the current model because the 96 model was rear wheel drive.

The current wheels are on ebay all the time for about $400. There are also plenty of wheel companies selling the wheels online. Go to Yahoo ans search on OEM wheels. After that just try them all 'til you find what you want.

rbb2

Does anyone know if you can reprogram the steering wheel radio buttons. I'd rather be able to switch to cd or cassette instead of use the seek type that applies to RDS. Only a few radio stations even broadcast RDS so what use is that button?

bh0001

I'm with you on that one. I use every other button on the steering wheel controls except the "seek type", and I hate having to take my hand off the wheel to switch to CD. I don't understand why the "Mode" button doesn't cycle through the CD/Cassette as well as the radio.

charts2

If you shop around you can find decent prices on Impalas. Last week Chevy Dealer in Buffalo NY brand new base Impalas 12 available all colors. $15,999. Thats a good price...

b4z

Which proves my point. transaction prices are far below MSRP. often 5K less.
The public doesn't feel the car is worth what they are asking for it.
Not good for resale.
I don't read about any Honda Accords going for 5K less than MSRP.

charts2

The no good resale value on Impalas has a lot to do with the 50,000 fleet and 10,000 Impala police cars turned over every year......Its good for the used Impala purchaser but not for the new car owner who wants to turn his car over after a couple years.

I understand that the 2004 Malibu will offer a seperate model next year called the "CLASSIC" it will be the new fleet car from Chevrolet and allow the Impala to become a little higher class and not be available as a fleet car. That should help hold up resale values of the Impala down the road.

atbear

"Impala pricing: atbear by charts2 Dec 09, 2002 (03:55 pm)
If you shop around you can find decent prices on Impalas. Last week Chevy Dealer in Buffalo NY brand new base Impalas 12 available all colors. $15,999. Thats a good price... "

I know, man... I got a good deal! I was just rationalizing GM's reasoning.

johnclineii

Charts2: Ha! If you think the Classic Chevrolet (which is nothing more or less than the CURRENT Malibu, which is being replaced and will no longer be sold at retail--think Lumina in its last gasps) is going to stop the Impala fleet sales, I suspect you are going to find out otherwise. If fleet buyers want Impalas and NOT Malibus, then Chevy is going to sell them what they want. This is so particularly because there is more profit in selling an Impala, even as a fleet car, than there is in selling Malibus rebadged as Classic Chevrolets.

b4z

I think the font is too small.

And I don't like the verticalness of the posts.

What do you guys think?

charts2

This information is what I read that Chevrolet plans on doing. The light finally went on and GM realized that Accords and Camrys have a much higher retail value (used) because the fleet game is not their business in a big way. When accord and Camry sell 3-400,000 cars a year each a lot has to do with the high resale value down the road to the first time buyers. Its important to me to know the resale value of an Accord or Camry is 80% after 2 years then the 60% value of a 2 year old Impala. My understanding is that Chevrolet makes very little $$ on fleet sales, and also Police sales. The money they make is with the lucrative service contracts on these vehicles. Example if they sell a fleet of 20 Police Impalas they make very little, but if these 20 cars are contracted to come to the Chevrolet dealership every three or four weeks for major servicing thats where they mske their money.....Being designated as a fleet car cheapens the image of that vehicle. I own an Impala and I would rather see them use the Classic as their #1 fleet automobile....lets see what happens...

johnclineii

Why would the factory give a whit what the service department does or doesn't make on service contracts for fleet vehicles? The Impala was designed and engineered from day one to be a police vehicle. The Malibu, on the other hand, was designed to be a less expensive competitor to the Camry and Accord. Apples and oranges, if you ask me. As is Camry/Accord vs. Impala. The Impala is marketed as a larger car and does not fit in the class with the Malibu (or the Camry/Accord). May as well compare Camrys to Maximas. Makes almost as little sense.

pluto5

60% of MSRP on a two yr. old Impala isn't bad when you consider the dealer discounts, rebates and GM card earnings available. Besides who wants to buy for the next guy? IMO you will take a bath on most any popular sedan if you sell it after two years because its difficult for a private seller to get top dollar.

charts2

It doesn't much matter I guess what you or I both think about this. Two sales don't matter. Camry and Accord are #1 and #2 in sales year after year after year period.. They ain't cheap but they both outsell the Impala almost 3 to 1. The Impala will never be #1 in sales regardless of how good the incentives are. The American public is what determines what they want and what they consider to be the most desirable. Near 400,000 vehicles a year each ain't too shabby. EVERY American Automobile magazine puts Accord and Camry both at the top when comparing to other brands including the Impala. I read posts where they believe the magazines are biased. For what reason? What is their motive. Chevrolet spends millions of $$ running ads in all of these magazines...Motor trend give the Impala a "reccomended" but when they compare it to other cars in its class it is way down the list near the bottom of the reccomendeds. Last week in the Car Connection web sight they indicated that the average Impala owner is 54 years old, sure there are 20 year old Impala owners, but again most by far are over 50.. Very narrow age group to sell an automobile today. The average Impala owner makes less income then other car owners in its class according the results from the car connection. Impala is an average car for average people. When I look at the dash board and interior fabrics in my Impala and compare to many other cars in its class major improvements are needed...

charts2

I have read all the reports. I have followed this Impala since I first saw pictures by Brenda Priddy back in 1998. I have a nephew a police officer in our city of 550,000. I am a retired Captain from out fire department and know a lot of Police Officers through work. September our city took delivery of 20 Police Impalas out of a fleet of about 110 cars the rest are Crown Vics. My understanding is the department only purchased the Impalas because the Union expressed hightened concern of the Crown Vic exploding gas tanks. I have talked to several officers about the Impalas. Some say they are ok and many do not like them. They prefer the larger Interior of the Crown Vic to spend 12 hour shifts. The Crown Vics are a little peppier also. They do not like the Impalas when two officers ride together. Wearing guns and night sticks and a dozen pouches on their belts they feel confined. I was surprised by one major complaint. Often as you know they have to search individuals. With the Impalas they have to take them to the front of the car and spread the perpitrator on the front hood. The back end side of the Impala is too short and too high. the crown vic has a longer lower trunk.(interesting) individual searches can be done at either end. A few officers I know operate on our highways. Our provincial police have several Impalas. The officers I spoke with say that the Impala top speed is way too low for high persuits. 116 miles per hour compared to 127 I believe for the Crown Vics. When a Honda Civic can out run you not much thought was put into this part of the Impala for Police work. I was told that the next batch of cruisers for our city were to be Dodge Intrepids. It will be interesting.

johnclineii

Not that the Crown Vic is well suited to police work, either. And neither of those cars gets anywhere close to that top speed when equipped with a light bar and the heavy police equipment, not to mention the ... police officers!

Still, ain't it sad when a V-6 equipped Impala is only marginally slower than a V-8 Vic? The Vic is a very heavy car. I test drove one the last three times I have bought a car. Each time I WANTED to like a Vic, due to the size, the body on frame, the V-8 engine, the huge interior (which turns out not to be so huge at all, especially in the back seat), the reputation for durability. Each time after my test drive, as I got out of the 1998 Watts linked Vic, the Mercury Marauder, the Crown Vic Sport, I shook my head sadly at the sloppy steering, the jittery ride and the horrid brakes and muttered to myself, "What WAS I thinking." I marveled at just how uncomfortable that interior is. I was amazed that cops can drive those things well at all.

This time around, with 110,000 miles on the 2000 Impala LS that has served me so well, I would buy another in a heartbeat, but for several nagging, little things: the missing coin holder, the no-lights on the shifter, the missing light in the glove box, the higher price tag...all of which make me wonder: what changes have been made in the parts of the vehicle I can't readily see, say the engine, transmission and drive train?

I am most seriously looking at a Mazda6, of all things. I am impressed by the zoom-zoom, I admit it. But, Sirius satellite radio is not yet an option and the dash looks very difficult to take apart without damage. Mazda claims it is. So, I shall wait to see the Impala SS and the 2004 Pontiac Grand Prix due in just a few short months. I may even wait to see the Mazda6 hatch and wagon, which also has the advantage of not putting myself into buying the first year of production in reality. Or I just may be tempted by the new Maxima coming out in a few months. Had a 92SE and loved it.

If, as I suspect, I end up with a Mazda6 or another import, Mr. Lutz might want to realise that there are those of us who are NOT happy with the 'unnoticeable' little changes he is making. The BIG stuff like interiors improved overall? Hard to believe when little stuff gets "Lutzed."

Actions speak louder than words.

charts2

I have never taken out a Crown Vic too big a boat for me. But there must be something that makes this still the choice of Police Vehicles. I believe the old Caprices were their first choice but instead of improving on them they axed them like they have done with so many other models that could have been progressively updated. The Impala Police car was designed more suited for city use. "Actions speak louder then words" how right you are. The actions of the American public are the berometer of what they want. At this time the so called big three are still struggling to keep up with new and fresh inovations that the so called Japanese models offer. Foreign competetors learned from the mistakes of our own products........ 110,0000000000 miles 2000 Impala!!! do you ever get out of the car or do you just keep fillin' up tank and burn up the highway. Just think 12 more years in your Impala and you can watch your odometer spin over 999,999.9.- 000,000,.0. Drive it another few months put 0006,000 miles on it and yo could sell it as a low mileage Impala. Who would know? I had to say that (just kidding!!)

emtb

Our new supervisor/command car at work is a Chevrolet Impala Police model. Fully decked out with radios, computer terminal, lights (all inside, nothing external), etc. Whenever the boss goes on vacation or "out of town", I sometimes get to play in it. When compared to my personal Impala, a base 2002, it's a little nicer in the speed department. I like the overall drive and feel of the car. It's also smaller then the crown-vic which we used to have, which makes it a -heck- of a lot easier to do U-turns in on the highways. I -don't- like it's low clearance. I know I'm going to rip that stupid plastic guard under the front off when I cut through the median someday. I just know it.

[Deleted User]

I'm glad someone else sees the impact of the fleet sales. If it wasn't for fleet sales, Impala would move waaaaaaay down on the list. It's the main reason GM was having trouble keeping up with consumer demand for a little while. I think that shortage is now over.

atbear

The drivetrain has not changed at all in the Impala. Still 3800-4T65E. Some cars you should look at are the redesigned Grand Prix GXP(with a 285HP supercharged 3800), the new Grand Am due out with 275HP and AWD, the new GTO ($$$)... just a few suggestions... plus by 2006 the new models should be going to RWD..

andre1969

I have an old Car & Driver that tested a police version of the Impala when it first came out, and put it up against a Crown Vic police pursuit. IIRC, the Crown Vic did 0-60 in 8.8 seconds while the Impala did it in 9.2, or somewhere thereabouts.

Anybody know what the police-spec LT-1 Caprices from '94-96 would do 0-60 in? I have a Mopar police squad book that covers 1979 through 1989, that lists the Michigan State Police annual test results, as well as some CHP test results for various police cars available during those times. Believe it or not, the fastest police car they have listed is the 1979 Dodge Aspen/Plymouth Volare...0-60 in 8.7 seconds and 0-100 in something like 22.9. It was compared to a '79 Malibu that did 0-60 in 8.9, but didn't have as much upper end, taking something like 28 seconds to hit 100.

I think police cars are usually set up more for high-end performance, but at the expense of 0-60. That might explain why the '00 Impala took 9.2 seconds from 0-60, whereas the civvy version I've seen quoted anywhere from 7.3 to 8.2 seconds with the 3.8.

atbear

"I think police cars are usually set up more for high-end performance, but at the expense of 0-60. That might explain why the '00 Impala took 9.2 seconds from 0-60, whereas the civvy version I've seen quoted anywhere from 7.3 to 8.2 seconds with the 3.8."

It's all about the extra weight the cops carry around.

[Deleted User]

Maybe if they laid off the donuts...

andre1969

...I think that the Michigan State Police just test their cars with two cops on board, and no light bar. No extra equipment, except for the heavier-duty stuff that comes standard on police-spec cars.

Whenever Car & Driver or Motortrend or whoever tests cars, does anybody know how much weight the test equipment puts on? Would it be enough to equate to the weight of a second cop?

I do remember reading too that, in general, adding a second cop on the tests cuts the top speed by about 5 mph.

pluto5

I haven't seen any comments on the elimination of the lock cylinder on the passenger door of GM sedans.

A nice improvement IMO is that the Imp and LS lettering is now painted the body color...if they would only paint out the little mammal and grille chrome...

johnclineii

NOW painted body colour?

My 2000 has those items painted white, like the body of the car. But the Impala IS chrome, and I, for one, like it that way!

pluto5

Well, someone at GM didn't cause my 03 LS has Superior Blue Imp and LS lettering on the sides and rear. The five spoke wheels are a nice contrast since there's no other "chrome" visible on the sides save for the little mammal.

b4z

How do you like the Superior Blue Color?

I have the Navy blue and it is impossible to keep clean and shows every little scratch.

Do you have the grey interior or the neutral?