Pontiac Vibe

montanafan

How about....Driver puts seat back the most so the two person side is the Passenger side?

isellpotiac

This is a high revving engine and most people will take awhile to get used to it. The engine will limit itself when cold and you ideally should shift in the 5000 RPM range. I have driven one and this thing can be downright nasty. For an import buyer that is accustomed to shifting around 3000 rpm it will feel different. The shift pattern is small with short throws. I don't think the GT is for just anybody.

vonnyvonce

Anyone know if the Vibe has a timing chain or belt and stainless steel exhaust system

isellpotiac

no mention of stainless steel exhaust. The tip is stainless steel.

Tup

Yes, it's a timing chain and yes, it is a stainless steel exhaust....apparently all toyotas after 1995 or 96 have stainless steel exhausts.

As for the antenna....I think it's fairly easy to unscrew so that might be the best option for the carrying things up there.

dindak

RE: 6-speed:: I think it's a Getrag so it should be good. I've driven many Getrag 5-speeds which have been just fine.

Tup : I hop it's not too easy to unscrew or it will be "gone in 60 seconds" so to speak.

Tup

Yes, it's a timing chain and yes, it is a stainless steel exhaust....apparently all toyotas after 1995 or 96 have stainless steel exhausts.

As for the antenna....I think it's fairly easy to unscrew so that might be the best option for the carrying things up there.

scott31

I've driven both the Vibe GT and Matrix XRS 6-speed. They both shifted great. Had the same feel (as I expected since they are the same powertrain)

pdrumans1

Thanks for the information. I had just heard both good and bad about the Celica Shift feel and I believe the transmission is a carry over from there as well as the engine.

canswim

just wondering if there will be the same problems with the GT as they were having with the celica 6 speed transmissions. remember hearing alot of people complaining about that..

duke35

I think I might have figured it out.
They claim that 8-foot lumber can fit in the car. Perhaps it needs to be on an angle to get in, so by putting the larger split in the right, the lumber might fit in with the hatch closed.
I will bring my measuring tape next time, to test my theory.
In any case it is a bugger that might distract me from a Vibe for a Vue.

sully67

1. Is the GT worth it ? 2. Is the Nav system a GPS system as well ? 3. Has anyone driven both the GT and the Base w/5 speed manual ? I have a 1993 Geo Prism Lsi that was built in the same plant that the Vibe is built. It has a 1.8L engine that is very fast and runs great. I sat in the GT but didn't have time to take a test drive. I did get to shift the gears and 1st to 2nd felt a little clunky. What am I giving up if I go with the base ? I know it has less horse power and a 5 speed but something tells me that I'm going to be impressed with that if it is any thing like my Prism. Am I losing any thing on the exterior or interior with the base model ?

sully67

Any idea where they stick that 6 CD changer if you go with the Nav system ?

scott31

No, the GT is not worth it. You can get a similarily equipped Matrix XRS for $2000 less. Now, is the GT worth it over the lower model (or is the XRS worth it over the XR model). In my opinion, yes. If memory serves, when I added all the features that I wanted to both the Matrix XR and XRS, there was about a $1000 price difference. For that difference you get the better engine, an extra gear, and 4 wheel disc brakes. If you aren't a lead foot-gotta have power driver like I am, then the XR model would be fine.

The Nav system is a complete GPS system. It knows exactly where you are, and how to get you to where you want to go. I ordered the system on my Matrix. The 6 disc changer is placed under the front passenger seat, but strangely, you load it from the rear of the seat.

dindak

Get a base Vibe and skip the GT. It's not worth the extra money IMO. I would also skip the NAV system unless you travel a lot as it's an expensive toy.

The best value IMO is a base with power package and aluminum wheels. I would get ABS also as it could help you avoid an accident.

ecarmack

I finally drove a 5 speed today. It seemed to have better pickup than the automatic I had previously tried (unfortunately, the salesman was very large).

My main dislike was the reduced leg room, due to having to sit closer to the dash to reach the steering wheel and shifter. Pertaining to the moonroof, unlike the new Altima, I did not notice any wind noise coming from it. Also, this car had Continental tires on it. Previously, I had only seen Good Year.

The manager thought there would be incentives coming in the next month, since most dealers now have several in stock. We will see if that happens as early as he predicts. I do not think the loaded Vibes are moving off the lots. Maybe most Pontiac buyers are not looking for a $19k to $20k 130 hp four cylinder. ?? It seems like everyone on the Matrix board is either buying one or placing an order. Has anyone on this board purchased a Vibe yet?

dindak

Incentives? I doubt it. The local dealer has still not received one and I don't think it's the only one. I wish they wouldn't advertise a car not all dealers have yet. Apparently on the other side of the city they have had them for over a week?

ecarmack

I doubt it too, but as cheap as money is right now, maybe GMAC will at least kick in some low interest rates.

Are you replacing your Intrigue? That would be quite a change.

dscsayers

I just ordered a Vibe GT last week. Then this weekend I saw some pics of the Vibe GTR. Does anyone know anything about this model... Are they releasing it??? If so, does anyone know when? I can still put a stop on my order, but I can't find the info I need about the new model?

shadowsurfer

Here is the latest review from New York Times (March 10, 2002). So far most of the reviewers I read prefer the look of the Vibe over the Matrix.

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/03/10/automobiles/10AUTO.html

Tup

As other reviewers have noted, on initial glance, the Vibe is more pleasing, however, the Matrix looks seem to grow on you. I have had nothing but good comments about our black Matrix with tinting. Perhaps the naysayers are too polite here. The Toyota dealer has sold several Matrixes while the first Vibe to arrive at the Pontiac dealer has been sitting there for 3 weeks(base silver vibe with Auto and power package $23KCanadian). He could have generated orders with it though.

I think the best looking combination would be the front end of the Matrix with the rear end of the vibe....but with Matrix taillights. I guess the good thing is that people who have GM points can buy a Vibe and people who hate the GM dealer can buy a Toyota.

johnclineii

And with GM's pricing, unless you have GM points, you might want to consider the Matrix. Comparably equipped (to the extent possible), it appears to me that the Matrix is always less expensive, sometimes greatly so. And resale is apt to be a heck of a lot better, too. OTOH, in many areas the after-sales service is MUCH better at GM than at Toyota, as is the sales experience.

You pays your money and you takes your chances!

golfboy

As far as I know the Vibe GT-R was only a show car at the SEMA show this past year. I doubt GM is planning on sending this setup to production. It was meant to show the kind of aftermarket tuning that is possible with the GT.

hpulley4

Forbes in Waterloo got a Vibe in on Friday and I test-drove it today. They just have one so far, a red 5-speed with power package and alloy wheels. Very nice! The 1.8L engine has plenty of power around town (especially after driving my Geo Metro to the dealer) and on the freeway but is also quiet except when pressed and should get good mileage; the shifter is nice and all the gears are easy to find; the CD/radio sounds quite good; etc. The clutch took a bit of getting used to (wow, I stalled it at first, how embarassing) but after a few starts, it was fine and I never stalled it again. I don't know if it would have enough power with an automatic but with the 5-speed it felt fairly strong. The cruise-control stalk is on the wheel and turns with it, which is a bit weird, nowhere near as convenient as my Saturn's steering-wheel buttons; and the vanity mirrors are cheap-looking but that's about the order of my complaints at least from what I noticed during the test drive. It looks better in person than in pictures and the cladding really looks fine (looks awful in some pics). I'm impressed. Not as cheap as an Aerio but a big step up from it in refinement and well worth it, IMO.

dindak

ecarmack : No, not replacing the Intrigue. We have a leased Cavalier that we took over from a friend and it's up in early summer. I got a coupon from the Toronto Auto show that gives me 1% off the lease/finance rate of any 02/03 GM car so I have that at least. The VUE is at 5.9% for lease or finance so I expect the Vibe to be the same.

johnclineii : Resale has everything to do with supply and demand. If supply of the Vibe is smaller and demand is higher, GM dealers may not have to discount as much as they usually do. I hope that's not the case. The lady I'm dealing with said there was room to move on price.

montanafan

I do not know how closely the Canadian incentives follow the States, but in the States GM is running a lease pull ahead program for leases ending May 1st to Sept 30th. It wavies remaing payments if you buy or lease a 2002 or 2003 car by April 30th. There is also a Lease Loyalty Bonus to current lease customers who buy or lease a 2002 or 2003 by April 30th. It is $750 if you stay with the same brand or $500 if switching brands (Chev to Pont). The lease rates here in the Northeast are 6.5% for the Vibe, with no special finance rates. Not sure if "taking over" a lease would effect your case if these programs are also in Canada. Good luck.

dscsayers

I asked about the GTR, and I think that it's unfortunate that it seemingly is not going into production. But does anbody know about the future availibilty of aftermarket parts for the Vibe. I love it the way it is but I also love toying with my toys and this just looks like great oppourtunity to have some fun?

dindak

Finally, the local dealer called me as they got a shipment of 3 Vibes in this afternoon. I will definitely try and get a test and a good look in this week.

-----------

montanafan : Right now, GM Canada is only letting people with April-June leases out early. I called GMAC last week. Doesn't matter as we will likely order so it may take a couple of months anyway.

shadowsurfer

Dindak,

Which Dealer location is it ? Mississauga, Oakville or Burlington ?

Good luck on your test drive.

dscsayers

I have seen them a two MIssissauga dealerships... they're around.

Tup

I think the problem with the Vibe will be the sheer number of Pontiac dealers around. Every tiny little town has a Pontiac dealer and with the low production numbers, it's going to be hard to get much in the way of volume to all the dealers....that might affect how they negotiate. It might be better to deal now before the dealers start to realize this.

ecarmack

Currently, you can't get the low financing on 2003 models.

davmyrnis

Test drove a FWD automatic yesterday. Went on the highway and back streets, plus some time on a very bumpy old parking lot. It handled well.

I am a 58 year old so lots of power is not paramount but I do like to have enough passing and merging power. I was satisfied with that.

some observations:

Visibility out the rear window is a little obstructed, but I can get used to that.

The steering wheel has very little adjustable distance.

Felt a little cramped in the seat between the door and centre console, and I am skinny guy. Not a major problem.

I would say at this point that if my test drive on the AWD is nearly as good as the FWD, I will probably buy. I like the idea that this is more a Toyota in a Pontiac skin. This means reliability. For and old guy that is all I can ask.

Thanks for such an informative forum. Keep it coming. We can all learn something here.

scott31

I'm in the DC area, and I was able to get a Matrix XR 5-speed for $1100 less than a similarly equipped Vibe....

GM is really screwing Pontiac dealers with Vibe pricing.

dindak

scott : Quite the opposite I think. GM knows they probably have a big hit here and with limited numbers the higher MSRP gives the dealers more profit potential (what the market will bear). If the car is not as hot as they think, the usual 7-10% mark-up is available for discounting.

shadowsurfer : Kerr Pontiac in Oakville. Not a big dealer so probably near the end of the first deliveries.

leafguy2727

As a Matrix XR owner I curious, as you mentioned you like the Toyota reliability, did you test drive a Matrix? Is it the looks that you don't like?

Thanks

autoteen

I've been reading up on the ToyotaMatrix/PontiacVibe for awhile now, and today i finally got to sit in one.. WOW, it was nice... good feeling shifter, very 'cozy', very roomy back, losta room in the rear... felt much bigger than the similarly sized Protege5 my friend has...

I only have a learners, so i cant test drive it
I wanna go in the 180HP manual, but they only had that one in the showroom, and my dad hasnt driven a manual in awhile..hope he remembers

BUt yeah.. i really prefer the look of the VIBE more than the matrix.. the matrix is more.. lumpy, the vibe is edgy and sleek.. nice...

davidj8

Oops, I did not mention in my post that it was a Vibe I test drove.

I have no preference with the appearance, they both have their own unique appeal. I happen to have $2300.00 in GM VISA earnings so I am obviously leaning towards the VIBE.

In reality they are both Toyotas in performance and reliability.

Enjoy your Matrix.

Cheers.

dindak

In terms of performance, I think I'd rather have the GM 2.2 140 HP Ecotec matted to a nice GM auto transmission. Just as reliabile. The Toyota drive train is good though.

scott31

No, the profit for a Matrix sold at MSRP is about 18%.

The profit for a Vibe sold at MSRP is less than half that.

GM is REALLY screwing the dealers. The price I got on a Matrix XRS 6-speed was almost invoice for a Vibe GT

dindak

18%, ya right!!!!!

LOL

Dream on.

Tup

The dealer actually showed me his invoice costs. The profit(at MSRP) was around $1200 for a base, $1400 for a Base with B package, 1500 for an XR. That's around 7.5-8% by my calculation. That doesn't include the 2-3% holdback. Also, that's Canadian pricing.

Here in Canada, the base vibe with power package and alloy wheels is around the same price as a Matrix XR(and optioned very much the same). However, the AWD vibe and Vibe GT are much more expensive than a comparable Matrix.

petl

I have also seen the dealer cost. I can assure you that the profit margin on the Matrix is nowhere near 18%. It is approx. 7 to 8% in Canada. I doubt that it would be much higher in the States.

davmyrnis

From the information I have. The Profit margin in Canada on a Vibe AWD is 10.15%. Do not know about the Matrix.

I am reasonably certain my source is correct.

montanafan

From Edmunds: 2003 Vibe AWD MSRP $20,100, Invoice $18,830, AD Charges(2%) $390.80 leaves $879.20 or about 4.4%.

scott31

Have no idea what the prices are in Canada, but if you check the Edmunds pricing for the Matrix XRS 6-speed in the US, but the time you factor in holdback and such, it's an approx 17% profit (sorry, hit the 8 when I meant to hit the 7 for the previous post).

dindak

I suspect there is no hold back for Toyota dealers or it's included in those invoice numbers. There is NO WAY the dealers are making 18% on $18K cars. I guarantee it!

edchen

scott31 is correct if you believe the information from Edmunds. However, the profit margins(difference between msrp and invoice excluding destination) are exceedingly high for the Matrix compared to other Toyota products. And on the other hand the Vibe profit margins are exceedingly low compared to other Pontiac products.
This may be good news for me since dealers should be more willing to accept GMS if they make so little money anyway.
BTW, my recent GM Card statement included a flyer for the Vibe. *sigh* Just what I need. More demand.

zircon2

I looked at 2 vibes tonight - they looked sharp. I will not move on one until GM drops the prices on the GT. They cannot afford to let these things sit on the lots like the Azteks (they are still selling very poorly). It is remarkable if the invoice price is as high as reported as GM will really be limiting dealer movement on price. If initial sales numbers are not good, they are going to put big incentives on this car.

Drove a Chev TrailBlazer in Florida last week. Crude suspension (the front end creeked when the wheel was turned sharply), and low end grunt was hard to modulate. However, on the highway it was remarkable - 2300 RPM at 80mph with pretty decent gas mileage. It was a really nice engine. Despite its size, however, my wife's new CR-V had more leg room in the back seat - according to my son. Also weird - the front end had a lot of paint chipped and flaked off. The truck had 16000 miles, and it was a rental vehicle (and probably beaten up), but this does not seem like the type of problem one wants to see on a pretty new vehicle.

In both Florida and D.C. 2 weeks ago, I saw a remarkable demonstration of patriotism: about 20-30% of vehicles have flags, bumber stickers etc on them regarding American spirit. I think that is a really inspiring response to terrorism. Good job for our American friends.

magnetophone

Unfortunately I think the whole putting american flags on cars thing is sort of a cheap feel-good attempt.

Truly analyzing why we were bombed is another story..