Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy

allenr

Well, I couldn't take it anymore and decided to upgraded speakers in my 02 Bravada. I bought some Polk audio component speakers. Consisting of a 6 1/2" woofer and 1" tweeter with nice crossovers. Taking the interior door panels off was relatively easy using the instructions from a previous post. Much to my amazement I found a 6 1/2" paper woofer and small tweeter in a modular assembly. The hole that the assembly mounts in is about 7 1/2" big! I remove the original woofer from the modular assembly and mounted the new Polk speakers in their place. I then mounted the tweeter on the blank panels opposite the mirrors on each door. Connected all the wires and we are ready to go. The whole procedure not counting the break for lunch took an easy 90 minutes.

I guess you want to know how it sounds? I must say the sound imaging is quite improved and that dreaded base resonance is gone. One thing I noticed right away is a much smoother transition from base to midrange. The tweeters mounted high up on the door really add sparkle and depth to the music that was totally missing before. It makes me wonder why I waited so long to do it:) Even though I have the stock sound system it made a big improvement in listening to music in my truck.
The next step is to replace the back door speakers. I'll report on that after it's done, maybe next weekend. If anyone is sitting on the fence and thinking about upgrading his or her speakers I would say go for it.

Allen

tblazed

No problems here. Had my TB front windows tinted with the 35% stuff last Feb and is perfect- no side-effects from the glass guides or supports.

agenteleven

Good going, allenr!

Are the tweeters surface mounted or did you have to cut a hole?

xntrick

Allen, thanks for the info but I am assuming that you did not have the BOSE system (you refer to stock system in your post though I do not know if the Bravada has BOSE as stock). If you DO have the BOSE, you then felt that this upgrade was warranted? Just curious, regards.

dragonhead08

is your magnaflow exhaust a full cat back? and if so is it a TB specific model or custom made using a magnaflow muffler? And lastly how much was it? Thanx for the info:-D

saknstl

Like many of the other postings, I had many of the A/C problems on my 2002 Bravada (sometimes no A/C, usualy slow to cool, often weak A/C, never a high fan speed in the Auto mode, etc). The dealer just replaced the A/C Control Head and I am happy to report that for the last week the A/C comes on at startup with a high speed fan while in the auto mode. A/C performance is now great, even in our near 100 degree, high humidity St. Louis weather.

My dealer also said there is an upcoming TSB on the Fan Roar problem. I don't have all of the details, but he indicated there may be some "side effects" with the fix such as the A/C shutting off for a few seconds during hot weather if the vehicle is not moving. He also indicated that once the "Fix" was installed, you could not undo the fix. Sounds more like a work-around than a fix, but I guess we'll have to wait for more details. Has anyone else heard anything?

iexplore2000

Would you say that when you drop your temp all the way down to 60 degrees, your fan will automatically switch over to FULL & COMPLETE high speed? With mine, the fan will engage more into a med-high position as opposed to a FULL High position?

One way to ensure that, when operating at 60 degrees, push your fan button to override the auto mode. When you do this, the fan should show either at full speed or 2 notches below full speed?

Could you please report your findings as soon as possible? I am very curious because mine is scheduled to go in this week and I can maybe whine enough to get them to replace/reprogram that module to work a little better?

Thanks!

IExplore2000@aol.com

previousamigo

Did you see the twin turbo TrailBlazer with 400hp over at Motortrend.com? Not in production "yet".

allenr

The tweeters are surface mounted. I don't think there is enough clearance to flush mount the tweeters with out some metal cutting

I have the non-BOSE system in my Bravada

Allen

tblazer503

If you were asking about my magnaflow exhaust, sorry, but it is not a cat-back unit as I got this around November of '01 before they even had filters for it.. =oP It is a "custom" setup, although I would rather call it a hack job personally... sounds okay, but doesn't look as good as a cat-back and the sound isnt as full as I would like it to be. Overall, for $175 it wasn't a bad job, although I will be upgrading to some dual exhaust cat-backs eventually, as soon as the manufacturers start asking less than an arm and a leg for them($980??????) Overall, for the price it is a good bargain, but IMO, if you want it to look sharp, you either have to pay more than I did, or go with the Cat-backs. Performance gain is nice, but watch out when you go "straight through" like I did as I lost a ton of low-end torque from the loss of backpressure, and had to put a specialty tip on it to get it back. hope this helps...

lockcityssr

I also replaced the non-Bose with a 6 1/2 component set but I went with the Infinity Reference series. The difference in fidelity is amazing, the OE head unit puts out plenty of power. Along with much improved stereo imaging there is a huge improvement on the high end and vioce clarity. The bass is the least improved but it is tight. I have a 10" JL Audio sub in a sealed 1 cubic foot box that sits behind the back seats that put the finishing touch on the whole system by filling out all the base you'd ever want. The mirrors become useless from vibration when I crank it up! Total cost of the replacement speakers plus the sub w/amp was a reasonable $550, less than "factory upgrades" and 1,000% better sounding!

eazier

lockcityssr - when you installed your sub, did you use RCA cables, or did you hook up through your rear speakers? I didn't know if the headunit had any RCA outputs..
Thanks

mhenderson1

What are some the prices that you all have been getting on your Bravadas.

dragonhead08

Thanx for the quick response on the magnaflow. I agree that $900 is way too much for an exhaust. i guess they justify it because its all stainless steel. Heck my old HKS aluminized steel exhaust on my 89 integra lasted more then 10 years. and this was including all the scrapping over speed bumps and high angle driveway approaches. Actually I just sold it a few weeks ago and the piping was still good. all I had to do was replace the muffler because it has a hole from being scrapped on the concrete. This unit only cost $345.00 although it was 10 years ago. If some one could come out with an aluminized steel one for less then $500.00 I'd jump on it. I guess I'll wait and see what Gibson, magnaflow, and Streetscene come out with. I know Streetscene came out with a dual exhaust one, but I cant seem to get a price on it. I know Bassani has on out but its closer to $700.00 and its only a single exhaust.

mfullmer

I just checked on Cars Direct and they have them for $200.00 under factory invoice (BEFORE the $2,500.00 customer rebate).

This is a good way to find the prices because even when I purchased my Bravada in 5/01 they were much better than what the dealer was offering me but when I showed the dealer the quote, they gave it to me for that.

sildog

Anybody have concerns with headlamps burning out quickly? My TB is 11 months old and I have had to replace both head light bulbs (low beams). I always thought those things should last a few years at least!

blrmkr

allenr or lockcityssr -
Maybe the group would benefit if one of you two would send tlauro pictures and a description of your speaker upgrades.

allenr

I didn't think to take pictures of my install It's not that hard to remove the door panel, maybe I'll remove it and take some pic's

Allen

lockcityssr

The imputs for the sub do come off of the rear speakers, you just need to get a RCA converter box($20). It's very simple to wire and this makes fine tuning the bass easy. I did not take any pictures either. It's really a simple job, pry up the power window housing, disconnect the connecters, then remove two bolts...one down in the arm rest and the other under the window switches. Then the panel just pulls off with a good tug, start at the top near the mirror and work your way down. Try it, you be amazed at how easy it is to do.

tblazer503

May want to consider the mileage on the vehicle. Especially with the DRL's now, the bulbs will burn out faster because they are running all the time. From previous research, I believe that Halogens have an expected life ~2000hrs, Xenon should be about ~2500-3000 but cost more, and HID's are ~5000hours. You may be able to get GM to replace them, but doubtful unless you have a really helpful dealership. Hope this helps some.

tblazer503

Just go off the phone with Flex-a-Lite, and they are coming out with an application for Midsized trucks/SUV's with 28" radiators. Should fit the triplets well since they have a 27.5" core. ETA is in November, the CFM rating should be around 3500cfms or more. Dont know what kind of pricing anyone got with Tim's WAAG buy, but if enough people are interested, we can probably group buy through Summit(FAL doesn't deal directly with the consumer)...

dshepherd3

these are are covered for 36/36

scottc454

Are you talking a flex fan or an electric fan?
If it's a flex fan, forget it.

As for an electric fan, it might work but a lot of those CFM claims are bogus. The amperage that the fan draws is a better measure of it's capacity. 100cfm per amp is a good rule of thumb. There's a lot of junk out there, but I hear Spal makes really good electric fans.

Is the intent of this just to get around the roaring fan issue? You risk itroducing error into the system by switching to an electric fan. At least you know for sure that the existing fan can move some serious air if needed.

It's tough to beat a good old clutch fan.
I was watching some show on TV about some racing school where they used Mustangs. They claimed the cars were pretty close to stock, but one of the first mods they did was rip off the electric fan and put on an engine driven clutch fan.

saknstl

For IExplore200

The "High Speed" while in auto mode is one notch below the top fan speed. This is a significant improvement. Before the replacement of the A/C Control Head Module, the highest speed was three notches below top speed. Prior to the fix I relied on using the Recirculate button to get anything near adequate cooling. Now it will freeze you out in short order in the Auto mode without using the Recirculate button.

Good luck in your repair.

Saknstl

tblazer503

I personally don't know much about the electric vs. clutch fan argument, but I do know that removing the clutch fan should free up some HP, due to the rotational mass of the fan and clutch assembly going away. The only problem that I have heard with the electric fans is (1) the CFM may not be enough, and (2) amperage draw may be too much for the alternator depending on the accessories. Since the TB has a 150A alternator, don't think this is a problem. Not sure what kind of error codes would be introduced by removing the clutch assembly because if there is a trigger wire, cant this be used to trigger the electric fan?? Hmm, well, more more research to do I guess...

tblazer503

Just did the standard fluid checks on my TB and found that my Transmission fluid was a little low(just below the xxx mark on the dipstick) maybe this is why the torque converter feels a little weak at low idle... hmm.. well, I'll fill it and let you all know if it helps some. (never checked on delivery... drove a 5spd before this didnt think of it.. =oP)

tblazed

Forget the aftermarket cooling fan. According to the July '02 Tech Link article the fan speed signal is one of the sensor inputs to the computer. The fan speed is monitored by the computer by feedback from a Hall effect sensor built into the clutch [non-permissible content removed]'y that tells the computer what the fan speed is and whether it is working properly. If there is no fan rotation detected, a DTC error code PO495 will be set.

ficuss

something else the tech link article mentioned was that the fan speed is variable, depending on the need for cooling. The fan is not an on or off fan. Maximum fan speed is called on only if it is needed. I think another thing that occurs is the engine RPM's are limited if max fan is called for. This is what caused the reduced power feeling we are experiencing. This comes under engine damage control, similar to the RPM control of a cold engine as someone else alluded to "just like BMW". The problems I see in changing out the fan are not worth the risk of causing some other problem which G.M would distance itself from in a heart beat.
One problem I have with the explanation of the fan operation is that maximum fan speed is achieved only when engine RPM is at 2000 or higher. Now I don't know how the rest of your cars are, but mine is seldom at 2000 rpm when I am sitting in traffic and the engine is getting hot. So, if I were climbing a long hill and the engine was at 2000 rpm and began overheating, the fan would come on. If you are cruising at 65 mph and doing 1800 rpm you don't need the fan. But if you are stuck in traffic you won't be at 2000 rpm and you wont get fan function unless the engine is forced to go 2000 rpm. I don't know if the engineers have thought this one out.

Frank

mhenderson1

I am contemplating about purchasing a 2002 TB LTZ , or a Bravada with a few options like heated seats and sunroof. Can anyone tell me a good price to shoot for, or of a good price that they had gotten from a dealership.

sbindley

I put a Flexalite fan on my 99 supercharged Blazer project truck and it worked well, except for very hot days in traffic. The engine temps came up enough that I put the stock fan back on. It may have given me a couple of horses, but it was not worth the temp problems on hot days. Those in hot climates keep that in mind. Once I put the old clutch fan back on, the temps never got hot again

scottc454

ficuss, if you're in traffic and the fan fully locks up, it still will be able to move significant air, even at idle speed. It'd be almost imossible to overheat one of these if everything is working properly.

mlauricella

2002 LTZ, BOSE,6 disc changer, sunroof, heated seats, locking diff.

I believe msrp was like ~36,600

I Paid 32,700 with GM Suppliar. Supposed invoice was 32,900.

I was stupid though, I ordered the truck, but after the deal was done, I noticed I ended up paying ~600 for dealer advertising costs.

Oh well.

All numbers quoted are before any rebates.

momstruck1

I too have had it with the customer service department. Not only are they not understanding but they never get back to you. I have a 2002 trailblazer LT EXT. It has already been in for service and has to go back because all the work they did was for nothing . All the same problems are back.I was not smart after having a 2000 Venture with numerous problems I went back to Chevy again this is the last time . I lease this truck and all I can say is I am glad I didn't purchase it.I am glad I found this board because I see that I am not alone with the problems I am having .

baitisj

Jepping (and audiophiles):

Hey, sorry I haven't checked the board in a while. Anyway, I was the first customer to have my gasket installed at Thorson Motor Ctr; 3456 E Colorado Blvd here in Pasadena. They are courteous, professional, and I was very satisfied with their service. Much better than the "service" department in Alhambra.

If you are interested in chatting more about the Envoy, don't hesitate to drop me an email at baitisj at yahoo dot com if you want to know exactly who I talked to at Thorson -- I can look it up in my notes. Maybe we could get a little Los Angeles Triplets' owners club going down here... I've seen a few Envoys prowling around up here in Pas ; )

I'm currently looking at the "Base Speaker with Rear Seat Audio" document ID 744189 from the GM Tech database (back when we had access to the database, I snagged some interesting schematics). I've determined that a certain connecter C307, located beneath the lower console at the rear of the car, contains pins for right and left rear low audio signals AS WELL AS right and left rear speaker high-level audio signals. C307 connects the "radio-base" unit low level outputs to the rear seat audio/HVAC control module, and connects the high-level outputs of the rear seat audio/HVAC control module to the busses that eventually feed the RR and LR door speakers. C307 is considered an inline harness connector, and unfortunately I don't know what connector it is in GM's parts database. Tim, if you happen to read this post, and you feel extra helpful, maybe you could send me the "Inline Harness Connector End View" for C307 from GM's database... :-)

I hope to order proper mating connectors so that I can actually insert my own custom segment in-line, breaking C307 and mating with both male and female parts. I'm going to talk to Thorson's parts center, as they said that they could order any connector if I could find the part number for it (maybe tomorrow?) Hopefully, I can get clean line-level out of this junction, and we will have a very clean way of getting signal to an amplifier / subwoofer that does not require taking off the doors (I think routing the cable from the center console under the carpet would be optimal!)

Anyway, good luck, I didn't expect my post to be so heavy on the audio tech details, but I really hope that someone finds it useful.

Regards,
-Jeff

tblazer503

Got out my nifty little laser temp gun and checked the transmission lines running by the catalytic converter before and after. Found the cat to be running about 340deg or so. Transmission send line was about 210 and return was about 195 right at the sources. Found that the line temps went up only about 2 degrees after the cat. My lines run about 1" away from the cat so hopefully this helps to make some people feel a little better.

mhenderson1

Are you saying that you purchased the TB for around $30,000 (Invoice - $2500 rebate) plus tax tags and freight, or are you including TT&F. If they are selling it that low, maybe I should take a second look at the TB.

mhenderson1

You made a comment about being charged a $600 advertising tax. If you had noticed the charge earlier what would have been your solution to rid the charge? Would you have told the dealership to get rid of it all together, or would you have negotiated the charge to be given at a lower rate?

Also can you refuse to pay any dealer advertising costs?

jwinky

If you did get the supplier price, it is printed directly on the invoice of the vehicle you are purchasing. If you are being charged 600 in advertising, the dealer is charging you something they are not allowed to. The Supplier price on the invoice is what you pay -- the dealer can charge you no less and no more -- and advertising is a charge that is not allowed. I would ask to see an invoice for a similarly equipped vehicle, or, if you haven't picked yours up yet, don't close the deal until you see the invoice of the vehicle you purchased.

If everything is done, and you have already taken possession, call the GM supplier program number to ask about this.

The reason I know is because I bought my Envoy using the supplier discount.

JAW

2k_impala_ls

I mentioned to you about the closeness of the lines to the cat. One line was about an inch away and the other was touching the cat. I was able to get it about 1/2" away but I plan to try and get it atleast 1" away. I wonder how well that silver insulation really works.

smmiller

Anyone put the license housing gasket on a white car? What does it look like?

tblazed

After reading tblazer503's results (#7013) of temperature tests I feel better about that. Looking at my TB the trans lines go into the bottom of the radiator. That's where the coolest part of the coolant will be after it has entered the top of the radiator flowed through and before it reenters the engine. But in your case where the line was actually touching the cat converter, that certainly was no good.

Anyway, I remember going thru this with my old black-on-black '71 Chevelle with the 402 big block. I wanted to do "something" to get it to run cooler so 1st I tried the Flex-a-lite fan which I did not like, (didn't free up any appreciable power, made more noise and didn't cool as well as the stock clutch fan) then I thought to get the trans heat out of the radiator so I installed an external trans cooler. Seemed to work fine 'til one day going up a hill in 95° heat one of the added-on rubber hoses to the external cooler popped! Needless to say this left me stranded, made one hell of a mess with trans oil sprayed all over the engine, fenders, exhaust parts, etc., lucky it didn't catch on fire! So now I leave the cooling system up to the engineers that designed the vehicle.

tblazed

Seems like a couple of thousand posts back (!) someone (Maybe Tim- tlauro) ran a picture of a White TB or Envoy with the gasket installed.

I have a white TB and really didn't care for the "look". I made my own spacers out of white Teflon® insulation that keep the edges off the paint but are basically invisible unless you really get down and look close. I figured it highly unlikely that GM would come out with color-coordinated gaskets!

2k_impala_ls

I got the front & rear splash guards from the dealer. I put the rear splash guards on without removing the wheels and it took me about 1/2 hr each side. I ordered the running boards and the rear cargo tray. Does anyone know if the running boards are the same as the ones on the LT & LTZ. I noticed the mounting holes are under there. How hard were they to install? The dealer made it up to me because of the condition of the truck at delivery, after alittle complaining, I got all the parts for dealer cost which is 30% off the retail prices.
The running boards were list $429 and I paid $300.

previousamigo

I found a set of used fog lights (in good condition)for my LS from a test 2002 TB LT but the wiring and switch had already been taken out. Anyone know if I must use the factory wiring and switch or could a standard set of wires be used and puchase a different brand switch? Also, does the LT or the LTZ bumper mold around the fog lights or is there a separate bracket that connects the fog lights to the bumper?

dshepherd3

the bumper cover is different with fog lites, it will take some custom trimming and fitting with a non fog lite truck.

babyshoes

He where are these things built???

flyguy7

Had my fan clutch replace 10 days ago and I don't have the jet noise anymore. Temps are good and the fan has yet to engage and make the noise. Temps here are 90+. The dealer said they received a new clutch for it. Looks like they have a fix.

jurassic3k

Do you have a part number for that?

icojones

I banged up my TB LTZ bumper and brought it to the local dealer to have it fixed. I also had them install the license plate gasket and bolt on some mudguards I had purchased from GMpartsdirect.

Overall a great experience -- the gasket actually looks cool on a black car, the mudguards fit perfectly with factory installed running boards, and the dealer did a great job at a better price than I could get from an independent body shop.

For those of you in Westchester, I highly recomment Curry Chevrolet on Central Ave. in Scarsdale.

stever

We show that Trailblazers are built in Oklahoma City, OK and Moraine, OH.

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